00:01:09 * jillzilla looks for a way to test this code. argh. 00:02:08 * rik sits and peers 00:02:36 * sbp finds a toy mouse for rik to bat 00:03:44 * rik bats sbp's toes 00:05:59 la la la 00:06:02 * Ash yawns 00:06:09 * Ash kills stupid workstations 00:06:17 i hate windows. 00:06:21 sooooo much. 00:06:24 Die. PLZ. 00:06:41 All right. I now have some time to devote to the ripping question. 00:07:47 the ripping question! 00:07:50 uh 00:07:51 ripping? 00:07:57 ? 00:08:00 ripping 00:08:24 heh, that wrapped so humourously in mIRC 00:08:28 like how to go about ripping this. 00:08:30 I hope you're not discussing that thing that happens during an icky labor/birth process.. 00:08:36 Oh, that sort of ripping. 00:08:43 * Ash is in pregnancy land 00:08:44 Ash: nooooo. 00:08:51 * jillzilla shudders. 00:08:59 jillzilla: a friend of ours had to have 20 stitches 00:09:27 A friend of mine couldn't have vaginal sex for at least two years. 00:09:35 woah 00:09:38 that's bad. 00:09:42 very bad. 00:09:42 That's really bad. 00:09:46 way bad. 00:09:48 why on earth did they let that happen? 00:09:53 * Ash shoots doctors 00:09:55 and I haven't seen her in a while, so I don't know if she can now. 00:09:56 shockingly ba... oh, it's over 00:10:07 I don't know how it came about. 00:10:27 can I ask a RESTful question here? 00:10:35 I'm kind of worried about this time, since we're going to try to do vaginal delivery. 00:10:44 C-sections are so nice in some ways. 00:11:00 * syn|ack blinks at the conversation he just stepped into... 00:11:13 Hi all. Rejuvenated channel: #debug .... a channel for debugging issues .... gdb, electric fence, valgrind; interpreted and compiled languages .... debugging issues and support .... come by and play if it seems interesting :) 00:11:21 hmm...i'll ask again later 00:11:24 :) 00:11:27 no, no, ask now! 00:12:04 i don't want to detract from the current topic 00:12:10 it's over... 00:12:18 ask, damnit! 00:12:18 I killed it just like that? 00:12:31 ok, let me outline the scenario 00:12:51 i have a resource that displays a whole list of packages, possibley 100 or so 00:13:01 GET http://somehost.org/packages 00:13:30 what i would like to do is have it so that clients can query the list of packages using a regex filter 00:13:40 i can't come up with a good way to represent the resource 00:14:01 why not just tack the thing on as a GET query variable? 00:14:05 GET http://somehost.org/packages?name_like= 00:14:08 yeah 00:14:12 hehee 00:14:17 i'm not sure if that still looks RESTful though 00:14:20 syn|ack, I think you need to use GRABS 00:14:26 of course it's RESTful 00:14:27 to me that looks RPC'ish 00:14:33 no, it's a URI 00:14:33 ash, grabs? 00:14:47 ehhehe 00:14:54 sorry syn|ack, old jokes die hard 00:14:55 just because it has a "?" in it shouldn't make a difference 00:14:56 heh 00:14:57 sbp: yeah you are correct - I just thought it was more like asking for an operation, as opposed to a resource 00:15:23 nope, you're still requesting a representation of the resource identified by the URI http://somehost.org/packages?name_like=xyz 00:15:25 do you think my query example describes the resource well enough...or? 00:15:33 yep, it's fine 00:15:41 ok - thank you for you help. 00:15:44 what's more, you can create HTML form interfaces for it, etc. 00:15:46 np 00:15:53 you're saying "packages that match ...", not "run the procedure ..." 00:16:10 deltab: yes - that is true 00:16:27 I'm quite new to REST so I guess still trying to come to gripes with what/how it really looks 00:16:38 although note Al Gilman's comments about service restrictions (or whatever his term for it is) 00:16:49 hehe, coming to gripes 00:16:51 .google site:lists.w3.org Al Gilman Google www-talk service 00:16:53 site:lists.w3.org Al Gilman Google www-talk service: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2002Mar/0066.html 00:17:24 deltab: woops :P grips even 00:17:51 "I've not used winxp yet, but some day I'll come to gripe at it" 00:18:18 sbp: I'm looking at it 00:18:31 it's probably the wrong one, since it's at www-archive 00:18:50 I can't check since something's borked my connection 00:19:21 the thread is SALV vs VoiceXML ? 00:19:24 err SALT 00:19:47 .google site:lists.w3.org Al Gilman Google www-talk -"www-archive" service 00:19:48 site:lists.w3.org Al Gilman Google www-talk -"www-archive" service: no match found 00:19:58 .google site:lists.w3.org Al Gilman Google uri -"www-archive" service 00:19:59 site:lists.w3.org Al Gilman Google uri -"www-archive" service: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/uri/2001May/0010.html 00:20:19 oh, that's the thread 00:20:41 that looks closer to what I need - thanks. 00:20:49 * sbp uses xena as an HTTP proxy... 00:22:43 hmmm...my example is doing it on the fly 00:22:58 not sure what Aaron means... 00:23:07 "he search engine has persistently bound that URL 00:23:07 to the resource for my search results." 00:23:12 s/he/The/ 00:23:24 I read that as "passionately bound." Good heavens. 00:23:35 I was about to get Very Interested in the semantic web... 00:23:37 hehehe 00:24:29 hmm...looks it is my lack of understanding of what a resource is 00:24:38 "You seem to have 00:24:38 fallen to the resource/binding/entity confusion again." 00:24:41 that is me.. 00:25:00 "A URI is bound to a resource (hopefully for all time). The resource 00:25:02 identifies a conceptual mapping to an entity (a set of bits, a thing 00:25:02 (person, book, etc.), etc.). 00:25:02 " 00:27:26 right. whoever said that was on the ball 00:27:34 probably Aaron, from the grammar 00:27:44 yes it was aaron 00:27:52 * sbp ^5's himself 00:28:02 but i don't get it - think i need to read up on what a 'resource' is some 00:28:10 .google RFC 2396 00:28:13 RFC 2396: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2396.txt 00:28:18 i did picture it persistent 00:28:39 but of course to me, generated on the fly does not mean persistent, whereas Aaron is saying it does 00:29:13 ahh 00:29:31 says it can be abstract 00:29:33 right. well, you must be careful not to confuse the fragility of the mechanism used to create and deliver the representation with the persistence of the resource 00:29:46 it's always abstract, forSome abstract 00:30:28 * syn|ack is thinking 00:30:32 actually, that's bad terminology on my behalf 00:30:45 I was thinking of these words:- 00:30:46 [[[ 00:30:46 Nothing is directly identifiable using an "http" URI. HTTP only 00:30:47 provides an indirect interface to resources, even for simple things 00:30:51 like files. The notion that we can arbitrarily restrict the nature 00:30:51 of what is behind the interface to some preconceived idea of an 00:30:51 implementation is simply, and provably, incorrect. 00:30:54 ]]] - RoyF 00:31:13 - http://www.w3.org/2002/02/mid/97473384-531B-11D6-B8E2-000393753936@apache.org 00:31:33 ok, that makes some sense in helping me understand 00:33:26 <\B0MB3RS\> \B0MB3RS\ is now known as redak 00:43:15 wmf (~wmf@cs666868-69.austin.rr.com) has joined #swhack 00:43:31 swhack! 00:50:01 Hi wmf 00:50:09 Hmm... I didn't know about `python -U` 00:50:10 argh, this machine keeps crashing 00:50:12 edd thinks its hardware problems 00:50:14 it crashes whenever i move it 00:50:24 I think it's edd's stop energy beam 00:50:28 heh, heh 00:50:53 AaronSw-HI-US: bummer 00:51:03 you ought to get a signed copy of that 00:51:08 so I see Dave is inventing new URI schemes today 00:51:22 the cad! will he stoop any lower? 00:51:45 sbp: My python references include the -u option for unbuffered stdout and stderr, but not -U. What'sitdo? 00:51:51 * sbp realises that there's a little bit of hyprocrisy there 00:52:00 -U : Unicode literals: treats '...' literals like u'...' 00:52:26 Aha! My reference is from python1.5, which would explain why it doesn't know about that. 00:53:00 wmf: source, please? 00:53:09 scripting news 00:53:15 permalink? 00:53:41 it's like the second item; you don't need a permalink! 00:54:07 a) my HTTP connection is borked b) for the logs 00:54:18 I can't reach scripting.com at all 00:54:34 although yahoo.com does seem to be back. wacky stuff 00:54:51 http://frontier.userland.com/stories/storyReader$10108 00:55:01 many thanks 00:55:06 (can't reach that either... argh!) 00:56:19 stuff won't work in lynx either, so I know it's not just IE being difficult 00:58:13 lol, wmf 00:58:17 that's pretty amusing. 00:58:25 I thought Instant Messaging was so passe. 00:58:29 (According to uncle Dave) 00:58:44 Instant messaging is sucks! INSTANT OUTLINING 4 LYFE!!!1 00:59:49 Grmgprmgpmpgmh 01:00:57 so, uh, I actually have a technical point instead of just random griping, which is that I think the protocol should be on the left of the : and what are the // for again? 01:01:07 sbp: did you try rebooting? 01:01:24 the // is so that you can have relative URI-refs to your scheme 01:01:52 sbp: I don't understand; can you give an example? 01:02:26 for example, some corporation has a mirrored FTP and HTTP site at two domains 01:02:51 you can have href="//blargh.org/myPage" in a document at example.org and it'll work across FTP and HTTP, supposedly 01:03:18 but you could just use /myPage for that 01:03:24 huh? 01:04:04 if you want to link to something on the same site with the same protocol, you can use a URL that starts with a / 01:04:06 not at example.org 01:04:26 it's not on the same site. try re-reading 01:04:44 I am dumb; sorry 01:04:45 I get it now 01:04:48 cool 01:05:12 wmf, I think random griping is pretty technical 01:05:14 hehe 01:05:22 yeah, but you're Ash 01:05:32 Especially if you've been dissing IM like forever, and all of a sudden are now saying it's great 01:05:34 * Ash laughs 01:05:48 But what else is new. 01:05:54 Besides my wife locking herself out of the house. 01:05:55 * Ash dies 01:05:59 back in a few 01:06:07 * wmf points at Ash and snickers 01:06:14 heh, heh 01:06:51 * Ash shoots wmf 01:09:53 Jill: yep, I rebooted, but it didn't fix it 01:11:43 Hmmm. 01:11:47 Did you contact your isp? 01:11:48 Hmm... I should have said "mirrored across protocols" 01:12:06 there's not much point yet - I'll presume that it's a temporary problem for now 01:12:32 it's pretty odd since it's so inconsistent 01:12:51 * jillzilla finds out her poetry-going event for tonight is off. 01:12:54 Oops. 01:22:02 redak is now known as \B0MB3RZ\ 01:22:55 if I were to update the FAQ, it'd probably have a section on nick changes... 01:26:07 "but I'm seeking for concealment, all along the lonesome plain" 01:48:56 Noen has quit (Killed (NickServ (Nickname Enforcement))) 02:18:48 davb (dave@alb-24-58-162-46.nycap.rr.com) has joined #swhack 02:42:28 <\B0MB3RZ\> \B0MB3RZ\ has left #swhack 02:52:34 OK, well it seems a little more stable now 02:52:44 I took out one of the ram simms 02:53:12 heh, it's 1969 02:55:44 Rohit thought that the NDA was for PR reasons. 02:55:56 "Come pay $1500 and find the *secret*!" 03:02:57 you know stuff is going to leak, because Apple can't punish it 03:17:36 Sheesh. 03:17:38 this is insane 03:17:48 Well, I gave it a good thwap and it's back for now 03:19:46 davb has quit ("Client Exiting") 03:19:58 maybe you've been hit by the Quartz Extreme Death Ray 03:20:16 Heh heh 03:20:32 I think it's Edd's stop energy beam 03:20:45 * AaronSw-HI-US looks for photo 03:21:49 ah: http://monkeyfist.com/pix/BAZ/stopedd.jpg 03:23:03 looks dangerous 03:23:39 .wn horsepond 03:23:45 horsepond defined as: 03:23:46 - n : a pond for watering horses 03:24:12 what a word! 03:37:26 oops out of batteries 03:37:26 laters 03:54:36 * Ash returns 03:55:05 3 Did you guys hear about the new dual 3GHz G5 powermac at wwdc? 03:55:10 whoops 03:57:27 hehe 03:57:54 lol @ that url 04:07:28 wow, can you say "intertwingled"? I just read an article that referenced a fairly obscure tale that I read some eight years ago 04:08:32 INTERTWINGLE 04:10:36 you forgot the D 04:14:06 No, I didn't. 04:14:09 I'm censoring you! 04:14:10 MUAHAHAHA 04:30:18 Gotta run 05:31:03 wmf has quit ("[BX] Get your free warez from ftp://127.0.0.1!") 05:46:29 redmonk (~steve@ip68-2-102-26.ph.ph.cox.net) has joined #swhack 05:46:56 yo yo yo 05:47:33 * jillium waves wearily on her way to the sack. 05:47:35 zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz 05:56:01 tansaku_xf has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06:06:10 redmonk has quit ("cya") 06:34:28 s|a (~synack@210-86-93-92.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) has joined #swhack 06:34:40 hi folks 07:34:55 Services restart test, please bear with us. 07:38:06 Test successful....expect the occasional restart while we're debugging for the next day or so. Thanks much. 10:11:20 .google URI RFC 10:11:22 URI RFC: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2396.txt 10:11:59 or http://www.rfc.net/ 10:12:46 rik: sorry - that was lazy of me... 10:13:05 rfc.net have a reasonale search engine on it, last i checked. 10:14:38 how are you these days anyhow rik? 10:14:52 not too bad 10:15:29 how are you? 10:24:27 * s|a makes it his life long goal 10:25:07 * s|a thinks you have prolly seen that more then once though... 10:25:45 ahhh, right you are, appendix B 10:39:17 s|a has quit ("[x]chat") 12:51:37 Morbus (~morbus@morbus.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 12:51:44 hey morb. 12:52:47 hey there 12:53:00 how goes it? 12:53:37 eh. just got to work. 12:53:39 in and out. 12:53:47 ah. 12:55:16 I've been reaqding Adam Curry's blog, and for the life of me, I can't figure out how he got so damn rich. being a DJ and MTV veejay cant be THAT profitable. 12:57:04 heh, heh. 12:57:19 I tried to find a copy of Have you Seen my Baby, but had no luck. 12:57:35 * Morbus sighs. 12:57:39 story of my life! ;) 12:57:46 actually, I didn't find any song fro teh Moby album. 12:57:55 I think I'm going to have to buy a copy. 12:58:11 i have all the songs but that one. 13:13:27 * rik fluffles Morbus 13:14:10 tansaku_xf (~sam@n145-198.tokyu-net.catv.ne.jp) has joined #swhack 13:35:54 * Morbus squeals. 13:36:25 like a pig? 13:37:44 oh yes. 13:38:06 hehe 13:41:59 sheesh. no spam for me, but spamassassin seems to eat resources. 13:42:10 i'm worried about throwing it on the real machine. 13:42:14 must do more testssss, my precious. 13:43:23 spamd! 13:43:27 that's what i'm using. 13:43:44 i used spamassassin the day before, and spamd yesterday. 13:43:44 oh. 13:44:54 Morbus: so the next option should be to roll your own ;) 13:45:03 heh, heh. 13:45:05 wheee! 13:45:17 or at least shift it off the server and to my client machine ;) 13:45:34 but that covers my mail only - i really want something for the thousand other emails we run. 13:45:47 spamcop is all well and good, but its not catching everything, of course. 13:46:03 Morbus: something dns based should be nice 13:46:24 dns stuff i'm finding causes too many fositives and complaints for us. 13:46:31 i'd rather have a scoring system. 13:46:43 i was using my own procmail filters for a while, with scoring, etc, but maintaining them just got out of hand. 13:47:04 does spamd work well? 13:47:22 pixel: i've run it for two days and seen a 100% reduction in spam. 13:47:29 AWESOME. 13:47:39 Morbus: just stick an X-RBL header in there - just about as good as scoring 13:47:42 pixel: and no false positives :) 13:47:47 how about it's resources? 13:47:53 hmm? 13:48:04 does spamd suck down the memory/processor? 13:48:21 what process does it use to detect a spam? 13:48:25 well, my mrtg has been showing much higher activity over night since I added it. 13:48:34 i've procmailing it through the spamd daemon. 13:48:41 using the spamc command line util, as per the instructions. 13:49:05 oh. I actually meant how does it know what is spam or not? 13:49:27 ah. there's a list of rules on the spamassassin.org site. 13:49:32 then, for each spam, it'll tag why: 13:49:42 [[[ 13:49:43 SPAM: Content analysis details: (6.3 hits, 5 required) 13:49:43 SPAM: Hit! (2.7 points) Subject contains lots of white space 13:49:43 SPAM: Hit! (1.3 points) 'Received:' has 'may be forged' warning 13:49:44 SPAM: Hit! (0.5 points) Subject has an exclamation mark 13:49:44 SPAM: Hit! (1.8 points) No MX records for the From: domain 13:49:45 ]]] 13:49:58 hahahah 13:50:00 scroing starts off at 5 - anything over is spam. 13:50:09 this one had 6.3 hits, and was indeed spam. 13:50:13 I like "DETECTED A WHOLE LINE OF SHOUTING" 13:50:17 that's great :) 13:50:17 i've seen some with a score of 27 ;) 13:50:20 yeah, exactly :) 13:50:28 I've had a 240-something... 13:50:34 had a virus attached, amongst other things. 13:50:52 wow. that thing does a very nice job. 13:51:04 * rik nodnod 13:51:12 I'm using it for the whole company here 13:51:13 yah, pixel, i'd heartily agree. 13:51:30 if it can't be used serverside due to resources, i'm definitely doing it on my home box 13:51:45 rik: are you using vipul's, as well? 13:51:58 spamassassin checks razor. 13:52:11 only if you have it installed. 13:52:17 right? 13:52:40 i do have it installed, since i was already using it in my behemoth of a spamassassin/procmail replacement, with web based filtering rules editor 13:52:52 I'm looking through the rules list on the website. this thing is awesome. I'm gonna have to get this thing running. 13:53:28 * Morbus nods./ 13:53:34 * Morbus nods faster. 13:53:38 * Morbus nods faster still! 13:53:42 go, man, go! 13:53:53 * rik gets ready to catch Morbus's head, in case it falls off. 13:54:22 intersting. "Contains a PGP-signed message" get -2.095 points. 13:54:27 [[[ 13:54:28 SPAM: Content analysis details: (5.1 hits, 5 required) 13:54:30 SPAM: Hit! (-0.0 points) To: contains similar domains at least 10 times 13:54:30 SPAM: Hit! (2.4 points) To: contains similar usernames at least 10 times 13:54:30 SPAM: Hit! (0.6 points) From: does not include a real name 13:54:30 SPAM: Hit! (2.1 points) BODY: FONT Size +2 and up or 3 and up 13:54:30 ]]] 13:54:32 wonder how they decided how many points each item is. 13:54:43 pixel: its computer determined. 13:54:51 there's a readme about the process in the distribution. 13:55:04 once again, damn cool. 13:55:07 and also you can edit the scores. 14:13:06 ooOh. MacPerl 5.8 developer release this weekend, per chance. 14:19:44 Manual restart of services in process. 14:19:57 they restart things alot here. 14:22:18 yeah, this is a patchy irc 14:23:51 ick - openCOBOL ... sounds like a horrorstory ;) 14:25:31 heh, heh. 14:25:36 openCABAL? 14:26:02 heh 14:30:24 Looks like I may have found the problem. Solving it should be interesting, but well.... :) 14:30:44 (Problem with services) 15:00:44 * rik works out how to add another user to the spamassassin whitelist. 15:01:04 * sbp waves 15:01:41 heyho. 15:10:11 well, my connection seems to be better today 15:16:11 bonus. 15:16:16 * rik decides to actually do some work. 15:17:09 woah! 15:17:23 steady on now rik, there's no need to go *too* nuts 15:17:54 heh 15:18:10 * rik is up to "configuring postfix" in his section on mail. 15:21:56 * sbp reads some of Bacon's essays 15:42:38 heh! Poe was going to use a parrot instead of a raven... he must be kidding 15:42:51 openCOBOL! 15:42:53 sweet 15:42:56 """Here, then, immediately arose the idea of a non-reasoning creature capable of speech, and very naturally, a parrot, in the first instance, suggested itself, but was superseded forthwith by a Raven as equally capable of speech, and infinitely more in keeping with the intended tone.""" - http://essayists.8m.com/philosophyofcomposition.html 15:43:21 Quoth the parrot: "nevermore". 15:43:39 "Sqwak!" 15:43:46 dude 15:43:47