IRC log of swhack on 2002-03-19

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:00:16 [sbp]
neat
00:00:34 [rm]
sbp.define("u script")
00:00:42 [tomc]
why t=p=1?
00:00:52 [tomc]
Oh
00:00:54 [rm]
fast dual assignment
00:01:06 [tomc]
yes, I didn't see the while condition
00:01:25 [tomc]
* tomc is probably up too late
00:01:29 [rm]
heh
00:02:59 [sbp]
u scripts are my little utility scripts, that I kinda namespaced out of the standard unix binaries path
00:03:19 [rm]
cool
00:03:19 [sbp]
so, when I come up with a new script, e.g. blargh, I just put it in my utilities dir
00:03:28 [sbp]
and then I can run it with `u blargh`
00:03:44 [sbp]
e.g.
00:03:44 [sbp]
$ u timenow
00:03:44 [sbp]
20020319-000502
00:04:00 [sbp]
which is useful for spewing output
00:04:13 [sbp]
dosomething > output`u timenow`.txt
00:04:22 [Morbus]
nooOO! 20 more emails!
00:04:23 [sbp]
I have a few utility scripts...
00:04:38 [AaronSw]
Hmm: http://www.alpiri.com/
00:05:07 [Morbus]
who's that supposed to be?
00:05:22 [sbp]
"Alpiri is building software for Semantic Web Services." - http://web.archive.org/web/20020204140021/http://www.alpiri.com/index.html
00:05:26 [sbp]
who: Guha, AFAIK
00:05:58 [deltab]
I have a readable version of that two-liner, if anyone's interested
00:06:07 [sbp]
please, deltab!
00:06:34 [deltab]
it's 18 lines :-)
00:06:44 [sbp]
send it to www-archive, perhaps?
00:07:38 [Morbus]
so, is www-archive just a place to spurt crap? it has no topic?
00:07:43 [sbp]
yep
00:07:48 [Morbus]
ooOoh ;)
00:08:26 [sbp]
it's the SMTP-to-HTTP counterpart of #swhack's IRC-to-HTTP functionality, I suppose :-)
00:08:40 [deltab]
with a bit of compression and no copy of the original:
00:08:41 [deltab]
import sys
00:08:41 [deltab]
text = open(sys.argv[1])
00:08:41 [deltab]
pad = open(sys.argv[2])
00:08:41 [deltab]
while 1:
00:08:41 [deltab]
t = text.read(1)
00:08:43 [deltab]
if not t: break
00:08:45 [deltab]
p = pad.read(1)
00:08:47 [deltab]
if not p: break
00:08:49 [deltab]
sys.stdout.write(chr(ord(t) ^ ord(p)))
00:10:33 [sbp]
'tworks
00:10:54 [AaronSw]
</phone>
00:11:11 [rm]
that was one hell of a phone call, asw!
00:11:13 [rm]
wb
00:13:54 [Morbus]
no more email!
00:13:55 [Morbus]
whoo!
00:14:01 [Morbus]
i shall close the program quickly so it may not sneak up on me!
00:14:03 [rm]
congrats
00:14:08 [Morbus]
no! its checking again!
00:14:15 [Morbus]
oh phew.
00:14:17 [rm]
alt.email.die.die.die
00:14:18 [Morbus]
just ML stuff.
00:14:29 [Morbus]
mmkay.
00:14:31 [Morbus]
now what? <G>
00:14:37 [Morbus]
usenet!
00:14:40 [Morbus]
wheeee!
00:14:41 [rm]
new backend for amp
00:14:46 [rm]
lol
00:14:52 [Morbus]
hehe, no time for amph.
00:14:55 [Morbus]
i've got deadlines.
00:14:59 [rm]
heh
00:15:14 [Morbus]
paying deadlines, rather ;)
00:15:34 [AaronSw]
B:|A Logging System for Python
00:15:34 [AaronSw]
Home
00:15:39 [chumpster]
titled item B
00:15:49 [sbp]
Home?
00:16:24 [rm]
* rm hangs head: aaronsw did not like rm's title
00:16:42 [AaronSw]
You screwed up a perfectly good title, young man!
00:17:10 [rm]
'tis destiny
00:17:34 [AaronSw]
you could just add the utilities dir to your path, instead of the odd u thing
00:18:41 [sbp]
er... of course, but then I might conflict with som othe rprogram
00:18:45 [AaronSw]
<rm> that was one hell of a phone call, asw!
00:18:45 [AaronSw]
Yeah, RobbB phone calls tend to be long.
00:20:06 [Morbus]
i haven't gotten a response on my decepticon article.
00:20:11 [tomc]
then call them all 2002.infomesh.*
00:20:11 [Morbus]
sniff.
00:20:32 [tomc]
or whatever :)
00:21:50 [Morbus]
is there any way to get the snak button thing to show on the bootom of the screen?
00:22:32 [Morbus]
yeah, you were right about the popup in ooutliner, red
00:27:38 [rm]
m: cool
00:29:10 [sbp]
how did "cool" come to be used as a synonym for "good"? that's just bizarre
00:29:28 [rm]
blame the '60's
00:29:55 [sbp]
*blame*? the 60's? me??? :-)
00:29:57 [rm]
when being cool was (IMO) an expression of stoicism
00:30:15 [rm]
the cool cats were the ones who never got ruffled
00:30:18 [rm]
;-)
00:30:28 [sbp]
that was the 50's...
00:30:36 [sbp]
the change in "nice" is even more bizarre
00:30:45 [rm]
yeah whatever
00:30:53 [rm]
i wasn't alive in either decade
00:30:58 [sbp]
heh, heh
00:31:00 [rm]
so what do i know
00:32:09 [sbp]
Hmm... Davy Graham is an awesome guitarist
00:32:20 [rm]
never heard of him
00:32:38 [sbp]
really?
00:32:43 [sbp]
.google "Davy Graham"
00:32:44 [xena]
"Davy Graham": http://www.geocities.com/davygraham
00:33:16 [rm]
cool
00:36:59 [AaronSw]
Fascinatng: http://www.philipglass.com/glassengine/
00:37:40 [AaronSw]
@ http://www.philipglass.com/glassengine/
00:37:48 [chumpster]
C: http://www.philipglass.com/glassengine/ from AaronSw
00:37:55 [AaronSw]
C:|The IBM Glass Engine
00:37:57 [chumpster]
titled item C
00:38:27 [AaronSw]
C::A database of Philip Glass' work, presented in a novel new format for browsing the different axes (density, velocity, date, title)
00:38:28 [chumpster]
commented item C
00:39:18 [rm]
very cool
00:39:38 [rm]
Gives a whole new meaning to "playing the glasses"
00:40:12 [sbp]
heh, heh
00:40:19 [sbp]
add the comment!
00:40:25 [rm]
C::Gives a whole new meaning to "playing the glasses"
00:40:26 [chumpster]
commented item C
00:40:32 [sbp]
:-)
00:40:47 [rm]
:-)
00:41:04 [Morbus]
:-)
00:41:20 [rm]
:-)^2
00:41:23 [rm]
ha!
00:41:53 [Morbus]
:-)8
00:41:53 [Morbus]
and i don't even have to flip the eight around.
00:41:59 [Morbus]
it works perfectly as the infinity halo ;)
00:42:08 [AaronSw]
C::The bounds-adjustment system is an ingenious way of finding relationships -- it'd be cool to use such a system in scientific experiments -- much easier that visualizing n-dimensional graphs.
00:42:08 [chumpster]
commented item C
00:42:09 [rm]
argh! foiled again!
00:42:55 [rm]
hm: bounds-ajustment in RDF exploration
00:43:00 [rm]
adjustment
00:46:39 [tomc]
tomc has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:49:51 [sbp]
oh, I just remembered something
00:50:14 [Morbus]
no, i already dropped your underwear in the mail.
00:50:20 [rm]
lol
00:50:27 [sbp]
ah, thanks
00:50:50 [sbp]
wow, that was almost very embarrasing
00:51:30 [Morbus]
goddamn, this next apache article i'm working on will NOT die.
00:51:50 [rm]
heh
00:53:30 [tomc]
tomc (~lambda@modem-3121.python.dialup.pol.co.uk) has joined #swhack
00:53:35 [Morbus]
its 3200 words, and i'm not even half done.
00:53:37 [rm]
wwb tomc
00:53:41 [rm]
ouch
00:53:47 [tomc]
tty
00:54:01 [AaronSw]
llol
00:54:27 [Morbus]
who are you laughing at?
00:54:29 [tomc]
* tomc was talking about teletypes, of course
00:54:36 [Morbus]
oh. nevermind.
00:54:42 [Morbus]
i get it.
00:54:47 [tomc]
Does Python have an equivalent of lisp's listp?
00:54:58 [rm]
hah!
00:55:02 [rm]
a use for...
00:55:02 [tomc]
a function to check if it's argument's a list or not
00:55:16 [AaronSw]
type(foo) is list
00:55:20 [rm]
damn, finding uri
00:55:22 [AaronSw]
will return a boolean
00:55:22 [tomc]
aha
00:55:29 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw is away: dinner
00:55:35 [tomc]
OK, thankyou :O)
00:56:01 [rm]
tomc: http://www.redmonk.net/1065
00:56:03 [rm]
;-)
00:58:12 [tomc]
hehe damn well write it then :-)
00:58:19 [rm]
heh
00:58:22 [rm]
werkin on it
00:58:35 [rm]
slow going, what with paying work and all
00:58:37 [rm]
:-)
00:58:59 [tomc]
Oh, I can imagine...
00:59:16 [tomc]
you're thinking ahead of humanity there, though.
00:59:27 [rm]
?
00:59:29 [sbp]
rm: interesting
00:59:43 [tomc]
I mean it's a good idea :-)
00:59:43 [rm]
damn those SATs ;-)
00:59:44 [sbp]
* sbp doesn't know how he missed that posting
01:00:11 [rm]
http://www.redmonk.net/categories/semanticweb
01:00:50 [tomc]
>>> type(list)
01:00:51 [tomc]
<type 'list'>
01:00:52 [tomc]
>>> type(list) is list
01:00:53 [tomc]
0
01:01:03 [tomc]
* tomc is confuzzled
01:01:09 [rm]
type(list) is a 'type' object
01:01:24 [tomc]
yes
01:01:24 [rm]
not a list class object
01:01:28 [tomc]
type.list?
01:01:30 [rm]
"is list"
01:01:39 [rm]
means "is the list class"
01:01:50 [rm]
what are you trying to do?
01:01:52 [tomc]
yes, understood
01:02:11 [tomc]
well I want to compare it to a type object that's 'list'
01:02:11 [sbp]
>>> import types
01:02:11 [sbp]
>>> type([]) is types.ListType
01:02:11 [sbp]
1
01:02:11 [sbp]
>>>
01:02:20 [tomc]
aha
01:02:22 [rm]
ahhh
01:02:24 [tomc]
like that
01:02:28 [sbp]
or, even easier...
01:02:28 [rm]
tada!
01:02:44 [sbp]
>>> listThing = []
01:02:44 [sbp]
>>> type(listThing) is type([])
01:02:44 [sbp]
1
01:02:44 [sbp]
>>>
01:02:54 [tomc]
Aha!
01:02:56 [rm]
ah - no import
01:03:05 [tomc]
* tomc is amazed at genius
01:03:07 [rm]
(python trade war)
01:03:12 [sbp]
heh, heh
01:03:46 [sbp]
I just read these things on the back of cereal boxes; don't be too impressed
01:03:56 [rm]
i want that cereal
01:04:03 [rm]
mine all have inrgedients and puzzles
01:04:17 [sbp]
:-)
01:05:02 [tomc]
*hmm* mine tells me I'm healthier after I've eaten it...
01:05:25 [tomc]
or I have a better life or something
01:05:29 [sbp]
heh, heh
01:05:42 [sbp]
yours can speak? it must have something quite odd in it
01:06:04 [tomc]
yes, I eat children
01:06:22 [rm]
aaron! run!!!
01:06:25 [rm]
lol
01:08:34 [tomc]
I got a magazine/newsletter about glasses today. Oh the fun.
01:09:24 [rm]
i can't get rid of a stupid JDJ subscription i got
01:09:50 [tomc]
It has a little bit about choosing colours of glasses, based on your skin colour
01:10:00 [tomc]
but it assumes you're white
01:10:06 [rm]
lol
01:10:08 [rm]
typical
01:10:13 [tomc]
and all the pictures depict caucasian people
01:10:29 [tomc]
so I thought I'd write a letter of complaint >:)
01:11:02 [rm]
go get 'em
01:11:11 [tomc]
also the font is smallish, which is stupid since it's for visually impaired people
01:11:40 [tomc]
heh, I'm white and I can read it fine, but complaining's fun.
01:11:50 [rm]
sure
01:12:28 [tomc]
though I will have to spend 35(GBP/100) or something on a stamp... *sigh*
01:13:14 [sbp]
it's worth it, though, surely? :-)
01:13:46 [tomc]
Yes. I can champion accessability for one brief moment.
01:14:03 [tomc]
and maybe even spell it correctly.
01:14:35 [tomc]
Having more than one vowel in a language is cruel.
01:14:58 [rm]
wut du yu mun?
01:15:31 [tomc]
uhhhhhhhhh thu swuut smull uf succuss
01:15:58 [sbp]
do you mean one character, or one sound?
01:16:01 [tomc]
not that succuss actually smulls, if one's to be literal about such matters.
01:16:32 [sbp]
we could have STAR for English. That'd be neat
01:16:55 [sbp]
in fact, perhaps STAR is English, in some respects
01:16:58 [tomc]
one character... otherwise spellig would get even more difficult
01:17:00 [rm]
you mean we don't? (cf. UN*X)
01:17:28 [tomc]
sbp.define(STAR) # :o)
01:17:29 [sbp]
that's not star... well, it could be
01:17:40 [sbp]
it's a programming language that Larry Wall came up with
01:17:46 [tomc]
Aha
01:17:54 [rm]
silly, that's perl
01:18:01 [tomc]
hehe
01:18:03 [rm]
and it basically IS english ;-)
01:18:08 [tomc]
before his #1 hit?
01:18:13 [rm]
only written phonetically
01:18:19 [rm]
:-D
01:18:32 [tomc]
heh :)
01:18:51 [Morbus]
heh, heh.
01:18:56 [tomc]
good language
01:19:18 [sbp]
after his number one hit, AFAIK
01:19:36 [sbp]
Perl was nearly perfect... but AWK still floored it on some things
01:19:47 [sbp]
so Larry came up with STAR
01:20:09 [tomc]
I see
01:20:30 [rm]
sounds like the stuff of legend... "Perl was nearly perfect... but AWK still floored it on some things"
01:20:43 [rm]
you're just a druid wannabe aren't you sbp?
01:20:44 [tomc]
:o) it is
01:20:55 [sbp]
well, it is the stuff of legend! it's computing heritage
01:21:10 [sbp]
these will all be myths in 1000 years time
01:21:33 [sbp]
people will be like, "History of computing. Larry Wall invented the computer in 2020, and named it Perl."
01:21:43 [Morbus]
sbp, can you hit my :80/~morbus/
01:21:51 [rm]
internet.time.gregorianYears(1000)
01:21:54 [rm]
>>> 5
01:22:01 [Morbus]
and use "guest" and then your email?
01:22:12 [tomc]
* tomc thought that already
01:22:40 [sbp]
it's moving, sloooowly...
01:23:05 [Morbus]
yeah, my modem retrained.
01:24:00 [sbp]
Mmmkay, now what?
01:24:19 [tomc]
* tomc finds it difficult to make google tell him about sbp's fict^H^H^H^Hlegendary language STAR
01:24:27 [Morbus]
if you auth'd fine, that was all.
01:24:27 [Morbus]
i'll probably bug you in a sec.
01:24:36 [Morbus]
just testing stuff for the article.
01:25:21 [sbp]
cool
01:25:25 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw is back
01:25:28 [sbp]
wb
01:25:41 [Morbus]
sbp, hit it again
01:25:42 [tomc]
* tomc waves
01:25:49 [rm]
* rm waves
01:26:14 [sbp]
* sbp does so
01:26:24 [sbp]
O.K., it loaded
01:26:30 [Morbus]
hrm.
01:26:52 [Morbus]
and you're entering your email?
01:26:52 [Morbus]
hmm. it's supposed to be logging.
01:27:03 [sbp]
I just pressed refresh
01:28:08 [AaronSw]
>>> type(listThing) is list
01:28:10 [AaronSw]
1
01:28:24 [AaronSw]
in python 2.2 only, i think
01:28:38 [tomc]
hmm
01:28:54 [sbp]
ah, you're right
01:30:22 [tomc]
I think I'll sleep. 'Night all...
01:30:24 [AaronSw]
type(list) is a metatype
01:30:29 [rm]
'nite
01:30:42 [AaronSw]
and the type(type(list))... well, you don't wanna go there
01:30:42 [tomc]
* tomc bears that in mind..
01:31:05 [tomc]
*hmm*
01:31:21 [AaronSw]
hmm, type(type(list)) is also a metatype
01:31:35 [rm]
heh
01:31:35 [tomc]
<type 'type'>
01:31:43 [AaronSw]
yes
01:31:51 [rm]
notice we all went therte
01:31:53 [rm]
there
01:31:55 [rm]
;-)
01:32:03 [tomc]
and of course the type of that is 'type' too
01:32:12 [tomc]
heh, pillow calls
01:32:20 [tomc]
tomc has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:33:10 [sbp]
what's a slot wrapper?
01:33:34 [AaronSw]
it wraps a slot, i bet
01:33:41 [sbp]
aha!
01:34:12 [rm]
"we care a slot!"
01:34:45 [AaronSw]
/work rm to the bone
01:35:01 [sbp]
odd:-
01:35:02 [sbp]
>>> list.__new__(list)
01:35:02 [sbp]
[]
01:35:22 [AaronSw]
what were you expecting?
01:35:47 [sbp]
I was expecting it to return a frog. Hmm... perhaps it's not so odd
01:36:14 [AaronSw]
list()
01:36:20 [AaronSw]
types are like classes now
01:36:36 [sbp]
types are types now
01:36:56 [AaronSw]
altho interesting, they're still types and functions too
01:37:32 [sbp]
which is a bit confusing...
01:37:47 [AaronSw]
Yes...
01:37:55 [AaronSw]
int; int(); int('5')
01:39:48 [sbp]
so, what do you think of the N3 design alternatives?
01:39:59 [AaronSw]
Mmm, "Serra Pelada" is good.
01:40:10 [AaronSw]
alternatives: haven't looked at them really...
01:40:31 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw looks
01:41:21 [rm]
sbp: uri?
01:42:08 [rm]
http://www.w3.org/DesignIssues/N3Alternatives.html /
01:42:08 [rm]
?
01:42:16 [AaronSw]
yep
01:43:29 [sbp]
couple of example of the new syntax...
01:43:31 [sbp]
[[[
01:43:33 [sbp]
x.boss.home.email :p :q .
01:43:35 [sbp]
[ is :email of [ is :home of [ is :boss of :x ] ] ] :p :q .
01:43:37 [sbp]
:x :boss [ :home [ :email [ :p :q ] ] ] .
01:43:39 [sbp]
01:43:41 [sbp]
x.uncle^boss.home.email
01:43:43 [sbp]
[ is :email of [ is :home of [ :boss [ is :uncle of :x ] ] ] ] .
01:43:45 [sbp]
:x :uncle [ is :boss of [ :home [ :email [] ] ] ] .
01:43:47 [sbp]
]]]
01:43:49 [sbp]
it's shorter :-)
01:44:05 [rm]
having never studied logic, the blending of english and mathematical notations rampant in discussions of the semantic web sometimes gives me a headache
01:44:07 [sbp]
in fact, I guess the top would be x.boss.home.email.p q .
01:44:20 [sbp]
it's fun! :-)
01:44:26 [rm]
p(x,y) ~= p (is x of y)
01:44:39 [rm]
TRAMP!
01:45:59 [Morbus]
Morbus has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
01:46:04 [sbp]
erm...
01:46:31 [rm]
sorry TRAMP referred to <sbp> x.boss.home.email :p :q .
01:46:49 [sbp]
Ex p(x, y) ~= [ is :p of :x ]
01:46:58 [sbp]
yeah, it is TRAMPish
01:47:03 [sbp]
TRAMPy?
01:47:17 [AaronSw]
Hm, ^ is a little confusing. I think just spelling it out is better.
01:47:21 [rm]
like i said - i get sonfused
01:47:28 [rm]
argh
01:47:31 [rm]
confused
01:47:43 [sbp]
yeah, it was difficult to translate the ^ over... if you have mixed paths, it gets a bit confusing
01:47:43 [rm]
homer: why i laughing?
01:47:49 [sbp]
heh, heh
01:49:03 [sbp]
the %/$ thing is quite confusing
01:49:09 [sbp]
% isn't even introduced, is it?
01:49:30 [sbp]
ah, no, it is
01:49:36 [deltab]
yes, he says 'of' looks like % when he writes it on the balckboard
01:49:44 [wmf]
wmf (wesf@cs242733-11.austin.rr.com) has joined #swhack
01:49:48 [wmf]
swhack!
01:49:49 [rm]
wmf!
01:49:49 [sbp]
yeah, just got it :-)
01:49:52 [rm]
* rm waves
01:49:52 [sbp]
hi wmf
01:50:05 [rm]
n3 is becoming perl
01:50:12 [wmf]
noooo
01:50:27 [sbp]
really? it was becoming Python not so long ago
01:50:37 [rm]
rm's rule: with sufficient passing of time, all languages become perl
01:50:41 [sbp]
what with N3Script an' all... :-)
01:50:45 [sbp]
heh, heh
01:51:00 [sbp]
oh no! and with interpolation being added to Python (probably)
01:51:07 [sbp]
we must resist
01:51:14 [rm]
interpolation?
01:51:22 [rm]
$$foo
01:51:23 [rm]
!!
01:51:56 [rm]
when i was starting out, this was how i started many cgis
01:51:58 [rm]
:
01:52:03 [rm]
while $@ {
01:52:03 [sbp]
>>> x = 'abc'
01:52:03 [sbp]
>>> $'blargh $x blargh'
01:52:04 [sbp]
'blargh abc blargh'
01:52:17 [rm]
$$_ = $_
01:52:20 [rm]
}
01:52:33 [rm]
hehhe
01:52:58 [rm]
scary
01:53:30 [rm]
morbus would know how scary that is
01:53:50 [sbp]
* sbp is grepping Perl tutorials as we speak
01:54:00 [rm]
heehe
01:54:08 [rm]
trying to figure that out?
01:54:15 [rm]
it's easy
01:54:25 [rm]
$@ is the default incoming params
01:54:33 [rm]
kinda like argv
01:54:36 [rm]
but anonymous
01:54:49 [rm]
$_ is the anonym ous input to loops and such
01:55:19 [rm]
oh wait
01:55:23 [rm]
oh shit
01:55:25 [rm]
i screwed it up
01:55:27 [AaronSw]
Perl is so wacky...
01:55:39 [AaronSw]
hey wmf, like philip glass?
01:55:57 [sbp]
I though @ARGV was for the arguments?
01:56:03 [sbp]
s/though/thought/
01:56:03 [wmf]
AaronSw: I haven't heard his music
01:56:08 [rm]
it;s a long story
01:56:16 [rm]
i don't have any of my old code here
01:56:19 [rm]
so i've gotten confused
01:56:20 [AaronSw]
ah, now's the perfect time: http://philipglass.com/glassengine/
01:56:30 [AaronSw]
IBM's got this awesome thingy
01:56:57 [rm]
i think @_ is where perl's cgi module puts all the form params
01:57:18 [rm]
and it's where perl puts the input to a loop when it's expecting an aray
01:57:35 [rm]
er,
01:57:58 [rm]
$@ and @_ are the anonymous array and scalar variables
01:58:04 [wmf]
not only do we have eBuisness and autonomic computing, but now we make "awesome thingies"? wow
01:58:19 [sbp]
rm: Hmm... I second Aaron's "Perl is so wacky..."
01:58:26 [rm]
while ("a","b") {
01:58:33 [rm]
print $_;
01:58:34 [rm]
}
01:58:37 [rm]
"a"
01:58:39 [rm]
"b"
01:58:45 [AaronSw]
wmf, yeah, i'm not sure how to describe it. i guess it's a multi-axis filtering system.
01:58:58 [rm]
anyway, enough of that
01:59:09 [rm]
i've been trying to purge it from my brain
01:59:47 [wmf]
good idea
01:59:55 [wmf]
I've been clean for 5 years or so
01:59:59 [rm]
lol
02:00:03 [rm]
yueah, about that for me
02:00:09 [rm]
i dabbled about a year ago
02:00:20 [rm]
but got straight right efterword
02:00:30 [rm]
* rm leaves to go play quake
02:00:35 [rm]
rm has quit ("cya")
02:00:50 [wmf]
at least I can say that when I did Perl, it was for the money
02:02:36 [AaronSw]
hm, "anthem -- part 1" is good too.
02:03:25 [wmf]
AaronSw: have you heard of Something Corporate?
02:03:31 [AaronSw]
nope
02:03:56 [wmf]
sarcastic teen pop; you might get a laugh out of it
02:06:45 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw gets out his WMP
02:08:04 [wmf]
WiMP
02:08:08 [AaronSw]
yep
02:08:12 [AaronSw]
3 hour pieces are cool.
02:09:54 [wmf]
all right, I mentioned NetApp on HTP; JDarcy should be responding any minute now...
02:11:22 [sbp]
Hmm... the [dot] suggestion in N3Alternatives is probably the best - but I'm not even sure that adding that is worthwhile. Then again, I don't do huge graph traversals often in N3
02:11:29 [sbp]
if I did, I'd be begging for the [dot]!
02:12:56 [AaronSw]
Yeah, I don't think any of it is worth it...
02:13:21 [sbp]
oh... except for lists. But nodes in the list all have first/rest, so I don't think that you can express them in [dot] chains. Plus, N3 already has (), which is good enough
02:16:01 [sbp]
at least you could get nodes: MyList.rest.rest.rest.rest.rest.first
02:17:38 [sbp]
not as good as (:MyList "5") list:slice ?x .
02:19:39 [sbp]
Ah! We should split EARL up ino model and vocabulary
02:23:13 [sbp]
ugh: that's not as smooth a distinction as I would have liked...
02:27:02 [oierw]
oierw has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:37:12 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw is away: biography
02:39:13 [sbp]
biography?
02:40:30 [sbp]
* sbp tries to arrange a meeting time for ERT
02:40:39 [sbp]
we're all so spread out across the globe, it seems
02:40:59 [sbp]
Hmm... actually, 5 of us are in western europe
02:41:07 [sbp]
conflicting schedules
02:48:53 [tansaku_sftwre_fcked]
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03:30:32 [rm_]
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03:31:26 [rm_]
hello again
03:31:33 [sbp]
Hi there, rm
03:32:59 [rm_]
rm_ is now known as rm
03:33:02 [rm]
hey
03:50:00 [rm]
rm has quit (Remote closed the connection)
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03:51:42 [sbp]
cool: I usually get chumpster and logger
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rm_ is now known as rm
03:52:24 [sbp]
wb
03:52:31 [rm]
stupid moz crapped out on me
03:53:23 [rm]
thx
03:59:32 [oierw]
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04:03:40 [hazmat]
anyone played around with jxta?
04:15:06 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw waves
04:15:16 [AaronSw]
AaronSw has quit ("Reconnecting to server - dircproxy 1.0.3")
04:15:17 [AaronSw]
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04:19:45 [hazmat]
hi AaronSw
04:19:49 [AaronSw]
hi
04:19:57 [AaronSw]
sorry, 've not used jxta
04:20:04 [hazmat]
i've been reading through the jxta docs, it looks pretty interesting.
04:20:18 [hazmat]
if only there were a python lib ;)
04:20:25 [sbp]
.google jxta
04:20:43 [AaronSw]
jxta.org
04:21:02 [sbp]
<xena> http://www.jxta.org/
04:21:16 [wmf]
a shame about the unreliable messaging, though
04:21:29 [hazmat]
www.jxta.org
04:21:29 [xena]
jxta: http://www.jxta.org/&e=747
04:21:32 [hazmat]
* hazmat is faster than a speeding xena ;)
04:21:39 [rm]
hehe
04:21:39 [sbp]
heh, heh
04:26:20 [rm]
.google escargot
04:26:21 [xena]
escargot: http://www.adoptanescargot.com
04:27:23 [sbp]
is that what I think it is?
04:27:29 [sbp]
"Adopt a Snail"?
04:27:32 [rm]
scoff! "adopt an escargot"? is nothign sacred?
04:27:42 [sbp]
and you wanted to eat the poor buggers
04:27:56 [rm]
yes, they're wonderful!
04:28:47 [rm]
oy, those crazy french
04:29:10 [sbp]
heh, heh
04:34:49 [rm]
rm has quit ()
04:35:26 [AaronSw]
sbp, got any unit tests for query.py?
04:35:26 [AaronSw]
or tests in general, really
04:35:26 [AaronSw]
Hm, the eep tests should work...
04:35:31 [AaronSw]
or not...
04:37:33 [sbp]
just convert eep.parse into ntriples.parse
04:37:44 [AaronSw]
right, but your [0] thing doesn't work...
04:38:04 [AaronSw]
easy to fix...
04:39:24 [sbp]
.toList()[0] or whatever
04:39:37 [AaronSw]
right
04:40:52 [AaronSw]
hm, tquery isn't working
04:41:40 [walloper]
<lilo> Hi all. Please be aware that we've reduced the maximum nick limit to 16 characters....we're in the process of cutting over, and you may want to make a special effort to avoid longer nicks until the cutover is complete. Thanks.
04:41:54 [AaronSw]
ugh, ripoff
04:45:13 [AaronSw]
cool, looks like it's all working now.
04:45:13 [sbp]
argh, what happened to pyxie.org?
04:45:27 [sbp]
16 chars? Pff :-)
04:46:54 [xena]
xena has quit ()
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Galahad (xena@mewtwo.espnow.com) has joined #swhack
04:49:40 [sbp]
phew...
04:49:41 [sbp]
>>> if len('sbp') > 16: print 'You must change your nick!'
04:49:41 [sbp]
else: print 'Hmm... you\'re O.K.'
04:49:41 [sbp]
Hmm... you're O.K.
04:49:41 [sbp]
>>>
04:55:36 [AaronSw]
Heh.
04:56:14 [AaronSw]
What is query.py doing? the r query works every three times, the t query works every fourth.
04:56:40 [AaronSw]
oh, it my stupid random number generator again
04:56:50 [AaronSw]
-> #semplesh
04:58:26 [sbp]
* sbp has written the first half of YA article
04:58:34 [sbp]
and this one's quite good, this time!
04:58:41 [sbp]
although it doesn't go anywhere. Pff
04:58:48 [AaronSw]
YA?
04:58:53 [sbp]
yet another
04:59:38 [sbp]
you can read it if you want
05:00:09 [AaronSw]
how?
05:00:09 [sbp]
actually, would you? JIC it's another waste of time
05:00:25 [sbp]
by going to the OLMed URI :-)
05:02:31 [walloper]
<lilo> Hi all. In just a moment we're going to reach a milestone in OPN growth, if a bit of a sad one. brin.openprojects.net, a low-pentium-class machine, is being retired from the net after a number of years of service. Thanks to Cameron Andrews for providing an excellent server for Brisbane, AU for several years.
05:04:51 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw reads
05:07:30 [AaronSw]
I'm left wondering what the point is.
05:07:39 [sbp]
yeah, me too
05:07:58 [sbp]
it was driving towards a point at one stage, but I forgot what it was
05:08:22 [AaronSw]
Hm.
05:08:50 [AaronSw]
I'm sort of odd, I guess. I usually don't write things down until I've finished polishing them in my head.
05:09:03 [sbp]
I'm quite the opposite, I think
05:09:30 [sbp]
then again, you did spew the old "triples mesh" idea to www-archive
05:10:33 [AaronSw]
I wrote that on the way to the train station -- it was quite polished when I typed it out.
05:11:35 [sbp]
Hmm...
05:13:04 [sbp]
I guess the problem with this article is that it has a general set of ideas, but no actual problem to solve. It's a hammer without a nail
05:13:16 [sbp]
* sbp goes down to the local hardware shop
05:13:46 [sbp]
well, the problem to solve in information management
05:14:20 [sbp]
but unless you have a particular information management task, there's not much to do. And then you have the layering discussion: the more use cases you have, the more general you have to go...
05:14:34 [sbp]
climbing up the layers
05:15:58 [sbp]
you should donate vorpal to OPN!
05:16:15 [AaronSw]
Heh.
05:16:28 [AaronSw]
my bandwidth provider would kill me...
05:16:55 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw solves the bad RUID problem. The solution was: "let the real cryptographers handle this"
05:19:04 [sbp]
er...
05:19:22 [sbp]
Hmm... the Notation3 formatting in /Notation3 is quite odd
05:19:28 [sbp]
i.e.
05:19:28 [sbp]
[[[
05:19:28 [sbp]
@prefix dc:
05:19:28 [sbp]
<http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/>. @prefix :
05:19:29 [sbp]
<http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/>. [ :givenname "Ora"; surname
05:19:29 [sbp]
"Lasilla" ] is dc:creator of [ a :Book ; dc:title "Moby Dick" ].
05:19:31 [sbp]
05:19:33 [sbp]
]]]
05:19:48 [AaronSw]
you mean the line breaks and such?
05:20:07 [sbp]
well, and the is x of, and lack of space before a period
05:20:13 [sbp]
I guess I'd draft it as...
05:20:20 [sbp]
[[[
05:20:20 [sbp]
@prefix dc: <http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/> .
05:20:20 [sbp]
@prefix : <http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/> .
05:20:20 [sbp]
[ a :Book; dc:title "Moby Dick";
05:20:20 [sbp]
dc:creator [ :givenname "Ora"; :surname "Lasilla" ] ] .
05:20:20 [sbp]
]]]
05:20:33 [sbp]
where'd my Notation3 style-guide go? :-)
05:20:39 [sbp]
.google Notation3 "Style Guide"
05:20:40 [Galahad]
Notation3 "Style Guide": http://infomesh.net/2001/12/n3style
05:20:43 [AaronSw]
Sort of a weird example to bein with. Ora didn't writ emoby dick!
05:20:59 [sbp]
heh, I think it's the traditional "this is false" statement
05:21:20 [Galahad]
Galahad is now known as xena
05:22:50 [sbp]
heh, heh: """These style rules are a simple snapshot; they are constantly evolving. This means that you shouldn't feel that these are strict rules, so don't take them too seriously (in as much as anyone could ever take a Notation3 style guide seriously)."""
05:23:07 [sbp]
I should add
05:23:18 [sbp]
* start directives and new triples on their own lines!
05:23:29 [sbp]
* add a space before the period
05:23:44 [sbp]
* don't use is x of if you can help it
05:24:08 [sbp]
Hmm... and one that I missed in my redrafting
05:24:13 [sbp]
* put the default prefix at the top
05:25:04 [sbp]
* declare type constraints first, then labelling, then subclassing and domain/range, then documentation, then anything else
05:26:00 [sbp]
actually, examples for and against each of the points would be nice too
05:26:04 [AaronSw]
Hm, do we have anything that tests equality of two store?
05:26:05 [sbp]
but it's just an N3 style guide!
05:26:13 [sbp]
equality: I don't think so
05:26:31 [sbp]
did you see TimBL's diff DesignIssue?
05:26:35 [AaronSw]
yep.
05:27:52 [GabeW]
GabeW (~gwachob@12-236-237-100.client.attbi.com) has joined #swhack
05:30:57 [AaronSw]
Cool, Stallman's coming to Cambridge: http://www.fipr.org/stallman.html
05:40:03 [sbp]
"going to Cambridge", perhaps? :-)
05:52:05 [sbp]
Gotta run
06:19:06 [wmf]
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10:41:09 [sbp]
* sbp waves
12:22:15 [sbp]
Patrick Stickler's writing style is so much like mine it's uncanny
12:27:26 [sbp]
BWT, I decided exactly what the purpose of that article should be, and it's an enourmous task
12:27:41 [sbp]
it's working towards being a 50-part series of articles :-)
12:28:04 [sbp]
* sbp wonders what this BWT acronym that he keeps coming up with is
12:31:43 [sbp]
wow, this article is nuts
12:34:55 [sbp]
s/nuts/a bizarre mind-boggling silly incredible mistake/
12:39:16 [sbp]
wow, Ka-Ping Yee shares my disdain for XPointer. Neat
14:04:35 [BenSw]
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BenSw (~yoda@12-249-96-16.client.attbi.com) has joined #swhack
14:06:37 [hazmat]
hazmat (~ender@adsl-66-123-57-58.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net) has joined #swhack
14:07:48 [sbp]
Hi Ben
14:08:02 [sbp]
er... wb, rather. and that's just netsplit rejoining
14:18:43 [sbp]
right, that's it
14:31:37 [sbp]
* sbp goes ahead and does it
14:38:30 [sbp]
no, really, I'm doing it
14:42:01 [sbp]
it's really slowing down my computer, but I'm still going ahead with it
14:51:34 [sbp]
it's tedious and fun, but it's being done!
14:55:36 [sbp]
I'm doing it with heuristics
15:07:41 [sbp]
and even whilst I'm doing it...
15:07:42 [sbp]
my mouse seems to be having some type of spasm
15:08:23 [sbp]
but that won't stop me from accomplishing the task!
15:08:57 [Morbus]
Morbus (~Morbus@s107.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack
15:11:05 [sbp]
I'm still doing it
15:11:31 [Morbus]
AaronSw, you remember how to enable ident on os x?
15:11:35 [Morbus]
i need to get into efnet.
15:19:46 [sbp]
I think I've done it enough for now
15:19:56 [sbp]
I did March
15:21:44 [sbp]
here we go: http://infomesh.net/2002/swhackquot/
15:22:29 [rm_]
rm_ (~chatzilla@ip68-2-102-26.ph.ph.cox.net) has joined #swhack
15:23:12 [sbp]
hey rm
15:23:29 [Morbus]
rm, you know how to enable ident under os x?
15:24:10 [sbp]
.google enable ident under os x
15:24:11 [xena]
enable ident under os x: http://www.ircle.com/carbonreadme.shtml
15:24:11 [rm_]
hm.
15:24:16 [sbp]
Morbus, it's a client thing, surely?
15:24:22 [sbp]
what IRC client are you using?
15:24:23 [Morbus]
justt found something.
15:24:47 [sbp]
rm: you just missed the grand unveiling of the swhack-quot-a-thon: http://infomesh.net/2002/swhackquot/
15:24:47 [Morbus]
http://xspot.randomwalks.com/?p=/archive/2002_03_01_xspot_archive.php#75007496
15:25:20 [rm_]
i tried to install (what i thought was a jabber client) and it was really a server, and it enabled ident as part of it's install
15:25:25 [rm_]
weird
15:25:30 [rm_]
sbp: looking
15:25:51 [sbp]
heh, you'll recognize the one at the top :-)
15:25:59 [Morbus]
heh, you used that MorbusIff one? heh.
15:26:10 [sbp]
yeah, it's classic
15:26:25 [sbp]
I guess you have to have been spread about over OPN, though...
15:26:55 [rm_]
hehe
15:27:09 [rm_]
awesome. i made the cut! cooooool
15:27:42 [sbp]
yep. twice!
15:28:47 [Morbus]
hmmm.
15:28:48 [sbp]
I mainly searched for quotes that I remembered, and "lol" strings. rm, you're like me in that we say "lol" a lot more than we cause it. oh well
15:28:49 [AaronSw]
Morbus, there's an ident server with snak
15:28:51 [Morbus]
turned on efnet.
15:28:58 [sbp]
argh!
15:28:59 [walloper]
<lilo> "Your item has arrived at the AUSTIN, TX 78710 processing center at 2:16 am on March 19, 2002. Status is updated every evening. Please check again later.
15:29:00 [sbp]
people
15:29:00 [Morbus]
AaronSw, yeah, i deleted the damn thing cos i tought i didn't need it.
15:29:01 [Morbus]
heheh.
15:29:09 [walloper]
<lilo> Here is what happened earlier:
15:29:15 [sbp]
WTF?
15:29:15 [walloper]
<lilo> ENROUTE, March 18, 2002, 6:04 pm
15:29:22 [rm_]
"i just want to thank my producer, AaronSW, my director, sbp, and my key lackey, Morbus! You love me, you really love me!"
15:29:27 [walloper]
<lilo> ACCEPTANCE, March 18, 2002, 12:44 pm, HOUSTON, TX 77035"
15:29:41 [sbp]
heh, heh, heh
15:30:56 [AaronSw]
heh, it's funny because talli was the one who wrote the "zope?????????" email
15:31:35 [sbp]
heh, cool
15:31:45 [Morbus]
pff.
15:31:53 [Morbus]
this crap in snak just does the same thing i did with the terminal
15:32:30 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw is away: breakfast, bone-breaking
15:32:41 [Morbus]
is anyone on efnet right now?
15:33:06 [walloper]
<lilo> (progress of the Articles of Incorporation for the non-profit :)
15:33:59 [walloper]
<lilo> This is a WALLOPS message for the Open Projects Network. These messages contain non-critical comments and announcements and detailed server admin information. To turn them off, turn off user mode 'w'. On most clients: '/mode <yournick> -w'. Thanks.
15:36:53 [rm_]
hm
15:37:54 [rm_]
w-all-ops?
15:38:25 [sbp]
.google IRC wallops
15:38:26 [xena]
IRC wallops: http://www.the-project.org/history.html
15:40:23 [rm_]
thx
15:40:33 [sbp]
np
15:43:55 [sbp]
.time
15:43:55 [xena]
2002/03/19 15:45:22.7478 Universal
15:45:50 [sbp]
.time
15:45:50 [xena]
2002/03/19 15:47:18.1614 Universal
15:45:59 [sbp]
1:56... not bad
15:46:32 [Morbus]
Morbus has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
15:49:01 [oierw]
that page doesn't help with what a wallops message is
15:50:45 [AaronSw]
they're status and non-essential messages from the ircops
15:51:10 [rm_]
ah
15:51:18 [rm_]
helloeirw
15:51:22 [rm_]
i love saying that
15:51:29 [rm_]
i'm too clever for my own good
15:51:35 [AaronSw]
it works better if you spell it right
15:51:40 [AaronSw]
helloierw
15:51:41 [rm_]
oy
15:51:45 [rm_]
indeed
15:52:42 [oierw]
yes
15:52:48 [oierw]
i hear the beep when it's spelt correctly
15:53:13 [rm_]
heh
15:53:14 [rm_]
cool
15:53:26 [rm_]
sbp: what's a d9?
16:02:45 [oierw]
oierw is now known as oierw|school
16:14:23 [rm_]
i don't think that's a d9, sbp
16:14:56 [sbp]
.google d9
16:14:58 [xena]
d9: http://www.d9.com
16:15:16 [rm_]
lol
16:15:25 [rm_]
it has it's own domain!?
16:16:02 [sbp]
I have precisely no idea what you're going on about... sorry an' all that :-)
16:18:09 [AaronSw]
it's a nine-sided die, duh
16:18:09 [rm_]
d9 chord - was in that tab you told me about last night
16:18:17 [rm_]
D9
16:18:21 [rm_]
perhaps i should say
16:18:21 [sbp]
ah!
16:18:41 [sbp]
it's like a 7th, but it has a 9th (root note plus two semi-tones) too
16:18:55 [rm_]
ok, you're speaking greek
16:19:09 [rm_]
i have no idea what roots and semi-tones are
16:19:15 [sbp]
try babel.altavista.com :-)
16:19:47 [rm_]
any plunking i do on the guitar i've pretty much hacked together on my own with the internet and a chord book
16:19:50 [rm_]
;-)
16:19:53 [sbp]
actually, I guess "steps" would have been a better word
16:20:10 [sbp]
the root note of D9 is, appropriately enough, D
16:20:33 [sbp]
so the 9th is up... er 2 steps, actually. Dunno where I got semi-tones from
16:20:37 [sbp]
for D, it's F#
16:21:44 [rm_]
how is the
16:21:52 [rm_]
9th up *2* steps?
16:22:17 [rm_]
(i have zero music theory to fall back on)
16:23:18 [sbp]
sorry, I got a bit confuzzled myself
16:23:32 [sbp]
the 9th is up four half steps, or two whole steps
16:23:35 [AaronSw]
Hm, Roy's webpage is pretty good too.
16:23:39 [sbp]
i.e. four frets on the guitar
16:23:52 [rm_]
right
16:24:13 [rm_]
steps i get, but not how they're numbered
16:24:20 [rm_]
(7,6,9,etc)
16:25:36 [sbp]
try http://www.musicalport.com/chords/9ths.htm
16:26:15 [sbp]
only explains 9th, though... argh. Hang on
16:27:17 [sbp]
ah: http://users.chariot.net.au/~gmarts/chords.htm
16:28:49 [rm_]
hm.
16:29:27 [rm_]
i'm reading words like triad and fifths, and wondering if there isn't some cool visual way to depict this stuff, on a circle perhaps...
16:30:10 [sbp]
yeah. Just about every place I've seen that tries to explain music theory does it in some "novel" way, and inevitably screws it up
16:32:00 [rm_]
heh
16:32:14 [rm_]
well, that page you just pointed to is pretty good
16:32:31 [rm_]
although the animated arrowa have *got* to go
16:33:05 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw updates http://google.blogspace.com/
16:35:04 [rm_]
cool
16:36:22 [rm_]
rm_ is now known as _rm
16:36:33 [_rm]
now i'm not exportable ;-)
16:37:24 [AaronSw]
what was wrong with redmonk?
16:40:05 [_rm]
i like the shorter version
16:40:07 [_rm]
;-)
16:40:13 [_rm]
_rm is now known as redmonk
16:40:20 [AaronSw]
well, register something...
16:40:21 [redmonk]
but to make aaron happy...
16:40:22 [redmonk]
;-)
16:40:29 [AaronSw]
:-)
16:40:33 [redmonk]
how?
16:40:36 [AaronSw]
*** RM is ~pj@66.58.175.99 (Debian User)
16:40:42 [AaronSw]
type /ns register redmonk password
16:40:43 [redmonk]
yeah
16:40:46 [AaronSw]
where password is your password
16:41:01 [AaronSw]
err, just /ns register password
16:41:21 [redmonk]
doh
16:41:36 [redmonk]
oh well
16:41:38 [AaronSw]
/ns set password newpass
16:41:39 [sbp]
you didn't?
16:41:59 [AaronSw]
*** redmonk is an identified user
16:42:11 [AaronSw]
heh.
16:45:51 [AaronSw]
if /ns doesn't work, you can use /msg nickserv
16:46:49 [redmonk]
well, i've off to work
16:46:52 [redmonk]
er, i'm
16:47:03 [redmonk]
laters
16:47:07 [AaronSw]
ta
16:47:08 [sbp]
c'ya
16:47:13 [redmonk]
redmonk has quit ("ta ta")
16:47:26 [sbp]
* sbp is glad he's not on a machine that can accidentally send rather than paste
16:47:36 [sbp]
zing!
16:47:42 [AaronSw]
shuddup you...
16:47:45 [sbp]
heh, heh, heh
16:48:07 [sbp]
seriously, I think I did that a couple of times in the past... so I got it to queue outgoing messages
16:48:19 [sbp]
now I have to confirm messages if I want them sent straightawy
16:48:55 [sbp]
which saves a bit of embarrasment. Now I just have to concentrate on not being a jerk
16:49:22 [sbp]
and learn how to spell embarrassment
17:00:49 [AaronSw]
I need to reorganize my website again...
17:02:09 [AaronSw]
anybody up for google yiddish?
17:03:03 [AaronSw]
gasp! borkborkbork is only 94% done!
17:05:46 [AaronSw]
http://www.google.com/intl/xx-piglatin/
17:09:49 [sbp]
igpay-atinlay?
17:10:28 [AaronSw]
yep
17:16:40 [GabeW]
GabeW (~Gabe@12-236-237-100.client.attbi.com) has joined #swhack
17:19:13 [AaronSw]
Google knows where I live: http://www.google.com/search?q=swartz+highland+park+il&pb=f
17:20:33 [sbp]
neat. and just enough ambiguity in there :-)
17:20:47 [AaronSw]
yeah, two of me and two of my grandparents
17:21:01 [AaronSw]
well, two of my father, really
17:21:35 [sbp]
neat
17:21:52 [AaronSw]
err, dunno who that walter guy is. one of my grandparents
17:30:47 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw tries to think of things he's done...
17:32:08 [redmonk]
redmonk (~steve@63.149.73.20) has joined #swhack
17:32:18 [sbp]
wb Mr. Monk
17:32:19 [redmonk]
hey boys and girls
17:32:28 [redmonk]
thank you thank you
17:32:46 [sbp]
you are very welcome indeed
17:33:19 [redmonk]
hm. the nickserv is telling me my pwd is incorrect
17:33:42 [sbp]
try "password" :-)
17:34:06 [redmonk]
nope
17:34:17 [sbp]
odd. are you already logged in?
17:34:21 [sbp]
Hmm... can't be
17:34:37 [sbp]
are you sure you didn't typo the original password?
17:34:40 [redmonk]
no, nickserv told me the nick was owned by someone else (me i assume)
17:34:43 [redmonk]
no ;-)
17:34:53 [sbp]
oh, right...
17:35:01 [sbp]
do /ns IDENTIFY password
17:35:20 [sbp]
with your password in place of "password"
17:35:21 [redmonk]
oh
17:35:24 [redmonk]
cool
17:35:27 [redmonk]
that worked
17:35:32 [sbp]
ta da
17:35:35 [redmonk]
:-)
17:36:04 [sbp]
now I can at least certify that you are the same redmonk as I was talking to this morning
17:36:11 [redmonk]
lol
17:36:12 [redmonk]
yeah
17:36:17 [redmonk]
now irc needs pgp
17:36:18 [sbp]
unless someone nicked your password and is impersonating you
17:36:27 [sbp]
wait for the plesg
17:36:33 [redmonk]
the plesg?
17:36:35 [sbp]
or the plhes
17:36:39 [sbp]
oh, feckit
17:36:42 [redmonk]
lol
17:36:49 [sbp]
plesh! plesh, damnit, plesh
17:37:05 [sbp]
it's really difficult to type quickly!
17:37:17 [sbp]
plesh, plesh, plesh, plesh, plesh, plesh... I've got it
17:37:22 [AaronSw]
why do you think therea re so may timbl typos?
17:37:31 [sbp]
heh, heh
17:37:35 [redmonk]
yeah
17:37:37 [redmonk]
n/k
17:37:48 [redmonk]
hehee
17:37:55 [redmonk]
j/k == just kidding
17:38:00 [redmonk]
!k = no kidding
17:38:05 [redmonk]
!k
17:38:09 [redmonk]
heehee
17:38:12 [sbp]
!k?
17:38:26 [redmonk]
can you tell i've just gotten my first cuppa coffee?
17:40:39 [redmonk]
check out the caffeine shot!
17:40:55 [BenSw]
* BenSw is away: I'm busy
17:41:11 [sbp]
* sbp didn't even know that he was here
17:41:41 [BenSw]
heh, just seeing if my connection was still up, when i knocked out the cord by accident
17:42:14 [AaronSw]
wow...
17:43:48 [sbp]
eek
17:44:32 [redmonk]
* redmonk hopes his code does not look like that after a few cups...
17:44:40 [AaronSw]
[OLM] http://www.cannabis.net/weblife.html
17:44:43 [AaronSw]
@ http://www.cannabis.net/weblife.html
17:44:54 [chumpster]
D: http://www.cannabis.net/weblife.html from AaronSw
17:45:02 [AaronSw]
D:|The Effects of Drugs on a Web-Based Lifestyle
17:45:03 [chumpster]
titled item D
17:45:59 [redmonk]
D::I hope my code doesn't look like that after a few cups of coffee...
17:46:00 [chumpster]
commented item D
17:48:02 [sbp]
ugh... I can pull better entropy out of my arse than your RUID randomizing code
17:48:23 [redmonk]
hehehe
17:48:32 [Morbus]
Morbus (~morbus@morbus.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack
17:48:43 [sbp]
* sbp is quite impressed with that
17:48:44 [sbp]
cf. <achiles> i can pull better entropy out my ass than xmms uses to randomize a playlist with
17:48:50 [redmonk]
* redmonk waves
17:49:01 [sbp]
don't wave! you'll just encourage him
17:49:07 [AaronSw]
I fixed my RUID code last night! Oops. I guess I didn't check it in.
17:49:12 [redmonk]
* redmonk "pick me! pick me!"
17:50:45 [redmonk]
3 my brain
17:51:12 [BenSw]
freeciv
17:51:17 [BenSw]
whoops
17:51:23 [redmonk]
* redmonk meditates... calmness...
17:51:35 [sbp]
* sbp imagines rm running round in small circles, giggling the tune to Stand, and occasionally flapping his arms
17:51:50 [redmonk]
* redmonk stands in the place where he works...
17:51:57 [sbp]
heh!
17:52:09 [redmonk]
* redmonk faces north...
17:52:15 [sbp]
now face... argh, you beat me to it
17:52:48 [sbp]
* sbp wonders whether or not he should do something useful today
17:52:59 [redmonk]
finish infer
17:53:12 [sbp]
ah - yes - I can go and watch The Simpsons
17:53:19 [sbp]
infer is finished!
17:53:25 [sbp]
well... not ported
17:53:26 [redmonk]
oh. cool!
17:53:28 [redmonk]
ah
17:53:31 [redmonk]
ha!
17:53:38 [sbp]
heh, heh. sorry to get your hopes up... :-)
17:53:54 [sbp]
actually, I should work on that
17:53:56 [redmonk]
* redmonk builds effigy of sbp...
17:54:00 [sbp]
lol
17:54:03 [redmonk]
* redmonk lights match...
17:54:11 [sbp]
but The Simpsons are far more interesting at the moment
17:54:14 [sbp]
I'll do it!
17:54:18 [sbp]
Gotta run
18:28:19 [GabeW]
GabeW has quit ("Client Exiting")
18:29:19 [redmonk]
@ http://www.nullgel.com/projects.html
18:29:27 [chumpster]
E: n u l l g e l from redmonk
18:30:02 [redmonk]
E:|LEGO motion tracking robot
18:30:03 [chumpster]
titled item E
18:30:17 [redmonk]
E::The best quote: "the most important thing I've learned is that the physical world is still not perfect. Bummer."
18:30:19 [chumpster]
commented item E
18:30:52 [sbp]
heh
18:31:04 [redmonk]
E::Nate is a LEGO freak and robotics nut. He wrote the algorithms himself for this project and provides source code and pics.
18:31:06 [chumpster]
commented item E
18:37:18 [redmonk]
how was the simpsons, sbp
18:38:05 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw gets out the effigy again
18:38:19 [redmonk]
* redmonk lights match
18:38:24 [sbp]
good, thanks. it was the Australian one
18:38:31 [AaronSw]
so, how's the porting coming?
18:38:37 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw waves effigy meancingly
18:38:37 [sbp]
hey, if you take that attitude, you can do it yer bloody selves
18:38:49 [redmonk]
* redmonk drops match after burnt finger... lights another
18:38:53 [sbp]
heh
18:39:05 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw watches lego robot track burning match
18:39:16 [redmonk]
ow ow ow ow ow
18:39:26 [redmonk]
<tien> bzzzzt bzzz bzzzt
18:39:46 [redmonk]
(tien's the lego bot)
18:39:55 [sbp]
male or female?
18:40:32 [redmonk]
lego
18:40:36 [redmonk]
;-)
18:41:00 [redmonk]
knowing Nate, it's named after one of the dragonballz characters
18:41:11 [redmonk]
er, dragonball Z
18:44:43 [sbp]
argh, my internet-draft expired (ESL)
18:44:58 [redmonk]
sbp.define('ESL')
18:45:11 [redmonk]
.google. internet draft ESL
18:45:23 [AaronSw]
no .google.
18:45:26 [AaronSw]
just .google
18:45:27 [redmonk]
.google internet draft ESL
18:45:27 [sbp]
.google ESL uri scheme
18:45:27 [xena]
internet draft ESL: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-palmer-esl-uri-00.txt
18:45:29 [xena]
ESL uri scheme: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-palmer-esl-uri-00.txt&e=922
18:45:40 [AaronSw]
looks fine to me
18:45:44 [redmonk]
whoa
18:45:51 [redmonk]
what was that second trick xena did?
18:46:01 [redmonk]
oh i see
18:46:05 [sbp]
"Expires: March 1, 2002"
18:46:06 [AaronSw]
Heh, I love these URIs: <esl:SHA1:iQA%2FAwUBO51bkD6DK6KYhyiEEQJLqwCfSv%2FiAHvC1REXEkOGEWf9pAB
18:46:06 [AaronSw]
yCRwAni92%0D%0ABxgCJqNL4fvrLRlGFK5szDXf%0D%0A%3DckCE:someName>
18:46:07 [redmonk]
missed sbp's query
18:46:16 [sbp]
heh, neat aren't they? :-)
18:46:31 [AaronSw]
if you don't remind them, maybe they won't take them down
18:46:36 [sbp]
problem is, they almost certainly use some odd PGP system
18:46:45 [sbp]
yeah, hopefully
18:47:02 [sbp]
I should register it as an informal URN
18:47:12 [sbp]
because it's useful, but not that useful
18:48:18 [redmonk]
python esl_internet_draft.py
18:48:34 [redmonk]
>>> ERROR: use of 'esl' vairable before defining
18:48:57 [sbp]
argh!
18:49:04 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw imports sbp's public key
18:50:21 [redmonk]
neither that nor http://purl.org/net/esl define what 'esl' stands for
18:50:27 [redmonk]
.acronym ESL
18:50:30 [xena]
ESL: English as a Second Language, East Side LAN (Phoenix/Mesa/Chandler Arizona LAN Organization), Electronic Shelf Label, Electronic Systems Laboratory, Electrostatic Levitator (NASA Marshall Space Flight Center), Emergency Service Level (FAA), Emergency Staffing Level, Emitter Signal Library, End-User Subscription Licensing, Energy Systems Laboratory, Enterprise Software Licensing, Equipment
18:50:30 [xena]
and Supply List, Equivalent Series Inductance (electronic component leads), Equivalent Series Inductance (L is Inductance), Equivalent Single-Layer, Expected Service Life
18:50:56 [AaronSw]
the signature validates
18:50:57 [sbp]
Aaron: I wouldn't bother, since I've probably lost the private key :-)
18:51:18 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw mumbles "idiot" ;)
18:51:21 [sbp]
esl: actually, I've forgotten what it stands for. Might not have too for anything
18:51:40 [sbp]
well, I have a lot of test keys floating about. it's not like I use them
18:51:40 [AaronSw]
I recall it being something silly like that
18:51:54 [sbp]
s/too/stood/
18:51:55 [AaronSw]
I've never switched PGP keys once.
18:52:20 [redmonk]
heh
18:52:30 [sbp]
well aren't you the plucky on
18:52:34 [sbp]
e, sir
18:53:01 [sbp]
PGP reduces anonymity!
18:53:12 [redmonk]
oy.
18:53:13 [sbp]
and the more you use a key, the worse it gets
18:53:29 [sbp]
change your keys, people! before the government get you
18:53:38 [AaronSw]
Heh.
18:53:54 [AaronSw]
the idea is to create a lot of psuedonyms, who all sign each other's keys :)
18:54:00 [sbp]
heh!
18:54:09 [sbp]
A. Ron Swartz
18:54:12 [AaronSw]
lol
18:54:30 [redmonk]
S. Tev` Ivy
18:54:40 [AaronSw]
A. Ron Swartz is the leader of Cryptingtology.
18:54:45 [sbp]
none of these compares to tav's options, though
18:54:46 [redmonk]
lol
18:54:48 [sbp]
heh, heh
18:55:10 [sbp]
that really could be Aaron's alter-ego
18:55:24 [redmonk]
no kidding
18:55:25 [AaronSw]
tav introduced a coding personality the other day: Ethan Kaplan. We're not sure if he's a real person or not.
18:55:38 [sbp]
.google "Ethan Kaplan"
18:55:39 [xena]
"Ethan Kaplan": http://www.murmurs.com
18:55:40 [redmonk]
'coding personality'?
18:55:42 [sbp]
.google "Ethan Kaplan" tav
18:55:43 [xena]
no results found.
18:55:51 [sbp]
.google "Ethan Kaplan" Ain Al-Milkeen
18:55:51 [xena]
no results found.
18:56:08 [redmonk]
heehe
18:56:09 [redmonk]
REM site
18:56:20 [sbp]
wow
18:56:33 [sbp]
that's quite bizarr
18:56:42 [sbp]
in that I didn't suspect that rm would be in on the conspriacy
18:57:06 [AaronSw]
ah, it is tav.
18:57:10 [sbp]
Gotta run
18:57:22 [AaronSw]
Or someone using his internet connection
18:57:59 [redmonk]
tav' is Ethan Kaplan?
18:58:05 [redmonk]
http://www.murmurs.com/contact.php
18:58:11 [redmonk]
what a coincidence
18:58:21 [redmonk]
webmaster of mumurs.com
18:58:24 [redmonk]
is EK
19:00:06 [AaronSw]
I don't think he's that Ethan Kaplan...
19:00:55 [redmonk]
yeah i figured, it was just funny
19:07:33 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw uploads http://www.aaronsw.com/about - comments appreciated, as usual.
19:09:01 [redmonk]
* redmonk feels very very small reading asw's about page
19:09:31 [redmonk]
* redmonk got a mention!
19:09:47 [redmonk]
* redmonk is validated, all is right with world
19:10:03 [redmonk]
;-)
19:11:33 [Morbus]
Morbus has quit ("http://www.disobey.com/")
19:12:23 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw feels very very small reading Ka-Ping's resume
19:12:38 [AaronSw]
http://web.lfw.org/ping/resume.html
19:16:01 [redmonk]
!k
19:16:03 [redmonk]
oww
19:16:05 [redmonk]
wow
19:34:49 [eikeon]
got a mention too... cool :)
19:34:57 [AaronSw]
:-)
19:45:17 [tansaku_sftwre_fcked]
tansaku_sftwre_fcked has quit (Killed (kurland.openprojects.net (tansaku_sftwre_fcked <- tansaku_sftwre_f[zelazny.openprojects.net])))
19:58:28 [redmonk]
sooo... for lack of stimulating conversation elsewhere... what's up here?
20:02:23 [redmonk]
@ http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/business/27731_retina18.shtml
20:02:30 [chumpster]
F: Eyesight of the future is here from redmonk
20:02:49 [redmonk]
F::Move over Terminator, Borg
20:02:50 [chumpster]
commented item F
20:03:18 [redmonk]
F::Laser projects image on retina
20:03:19 [chumpster]
commented item F
20:03:25 [redmonk]
F::"And once you get there, you realize what a great ride it was and it was all worth it."
20:03:29 [chumpster]
commented item F
20:03:32 [redmonk]
F::hehe
20:03:34 [chumpster]
commented item F
20:03:49 [redmonk]
F::[via /.]
20:03:51 [chumpster]
commented item F
20:14:35 [tomc]
tomc (~lambda@modem-1260.porcupine.dialup.pol.co.uk) has joined #swhack
20:17:13 [redmonk]
hi tomc
20:17:16 [redmonk]
* redmonk waves
20:17:55 [tomc]
* tomc waves
20:34:55 [thc]
thc (~lambda@modem-1741.porcupine.dialup.pol.co.uk) has joined #swhack
20:45:45 [tomc]
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20:46:58 [Morbus]
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20:49:01 [redmonk]
hi morbid, er, morbus
20:49:04 [redmonk]
;-)
20:49:10 [Morbus]
hey there, dreadmonk.
20:49:15 [Morbus]
no wait, that name is far too cool ;)
20:49:48 [thc]
thc is now known as tomc
20:50:39 [redmonk]
Married Geek Male seeks simple python-based weblog tool for local-only blogging; web-interface desired. sql users need not apply
20:51:21 [redmonk]
re dreadmonk: that is cool. may have to use that from time2time
20:55:12 [walloper]
<lilo> OPN articles of incorporation picked up by delivery service for Texas Secretary of State's office: "Your item was delivered at 9:30 am on March 19, 2002 in AUSTIN, TX 78711"
20:55:24 [walloper]
<lilo> This is kind of exciting. :)
20:56:56 [walloper]
<lilo> (we're in the process of setting up a non-profit corporation to run OPN and do some related (and more general) advocacy....registering the corporation is step 1)
20:57:15 [AaronSw]
the question is: why texas?
20:59:48 [redmonk]
nevermind the blog tool request
20:59:53 [redmonk]
found blosxom
21:00:04 [redmonk]
perl but you can't tell
21:00:06 [redmonk]
;-)
21:07:28 [Morbus]
heh, heh.
21:07:30 [Morbus]
blosxom is decent.
21:07:39 [sbp]
that's weird... I just got 175 mails in two hours
21:07:56 [Morbus]
yeah, i put your underwear up for sale on ebay
21:08:01 [sbp]
:-)
21:10:26 [redmonk]
now if i could just get OO to export to html in a way that did not SUCK
21:22:50 [Morbus]
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21:24:13 [AaronSw]
yeah, script died and had to be restarted twice
21:24:45 [sbp]
ah
21:24:55 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw tells gerald about script...
21:25:01 [AaronSw]
<gerald> hah! I knew it! That's why I have always advocated that lists be subscribable by those who can view its archives.
21:28:45 [sbp]
who's "Daniel Brickly" in http://www.aaronsw.com/about ?
21:29:00 [AaronSw]
danbri's evil twin
21:29:28 [AaronSw]
fixed
21:29:44 [sbp]
heh
21:34:02 [sbp]
ah, some kind site mirrored it: http://www.watersprings.org/pub/id/draft-palmer-esl-uri-00.txt
21:36:08 [AaronSw]
.google iQA%2FAwUBO51bkD6DK6KYhyiEEQJLqwCfSv%2FiAHvC1REXEkOGEWf9pAB
21:36:09 [xena]
no results found.
21:36:12 [AaronSw]
hmm
21:36:31 [AaronSw]
.google iQA/AwUBO51bkD6DK6KYhyiEEQJLqwCfSv/iAHvC1REXEkOGEWf9pAByCRwAni92
21:36:32 [xena]
iQA/AwUBO51bkD6DK6KYhyiEEQJLqwCfSv/iAHvC1REXEkOGEWf9pAByCRwAni92: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-palmer-esl-uri-00.txt
21:36:53 [sbp]
aah
21:41:00 [AaronSw]
--
21:41:18 [AaronSw]
Largest Number of Driving Test Failures
21:41:21 [AaronSw]
By April 1970 Mrs. Miriam Hargrave had failed her test thirty-nine times. In the eight preceding years she had received two hundred and twelve driving lessons at a cost of L300. She set the new record while driving triumphantly through a set of red traffic lights in Wakefield, Yorkshire. Disappointingly, she passed at the fortieth attempt (3 August 1970) but eight years later she showed some of her old magic when she was reported as saying that she still
21:41:22 [AaronSw]
-- Stephen Pile, "The Book of Heroic Failures"
21:41:22 [AaronSw]
--
21:44:02 [sbp]
she still what?
21:44:07 [sbp]
I think it got cut off
21:44:07 [AaronSw]
she still didn't like doing right-hand turns.
21:44:13 [sbp]
heh, cool
21:44:30 [sbp]
keep going left; you'll get there eventually
21:46:24 [AaronSw]
yep
21:47:24 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw fights the elements, temperature, allergies and radiators
21:47:33 [AaronSw]
not to mention colds
21:50:13 [sbp]
* sbp knows the feeling
21:50:26 [sbp]
When you're swapping from place to place... outside, in, outside in...
21:52:25 [sbp]
Gotta run
21:58:00 [Morbus]
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22:02:35 [AaronSw]
UPS truck... brb
22:23:55 [redmonk]
hey aaron - we got the spiders to #5 on daypop!
22:24:05 [redmonk]
http://www.daypop.com/top.htm
22:24:06 [AaronSw]
whoo!
22:24:24 [redmonk]
and i know it's ours b/c of the link text
22:24:33 [redmonk]
"The Effects Of Cannabis On A Web-Based Lifestyle"
22:24:41 [Morbus]
heh, heh
22:25:06 [redmonk]
hey morbus - what's the right regex for auto-paragraphs in html?
22:25:19 [redmonk]
s/\\n\\n/\\n<p></p.\\n/g ?
22:25:27 [redmonk]
s/\\n\\n/\\n<p></p>\\n/g ?
22:25:35 [Morbus]
you don't need double \\ on the n.
22:26:07 [Morbus]
i think i've done s/\n\n/</p>\n<p>/g
22:26:12 [redmonk]
oh
22:26:46 [redmonk]
cool
22:27:18 [Morbus]
heh: http://mysite.freeserve.com/Stickman/images/4-picture3.jpg
22:36:16 [redmonk]
heh
22:36:19 [redmonk]
that's rich
22:39:38 [GabeW]
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22:55:19 [tomc]
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22:55:26 [sbp]
.http://www.isi.edu/in-notes/iana/assignments/media-types/media-types
22:55:30 [xena]
MEDIA TYPES (last updated 2001 October 16) [RFC2045,RFC2046] specifies that Content Types, Content Subtypes, Character Sets, Access Types, and conversion values for MIME mail will be assigned and listed by the IANA. Content Types and Subtypes -------------------------- Type Subtype Description Reference ---- ------- ----------- --------- text plain [RFC2646,RFC2046] richtext [RFC2045,RFC2046]
22:55:31 [xena]
enriched [RFC1896] tab-separated-values [Paul Lindner] html [RFC2854] sgml [RFC1874] vnd.latex-z [Lubos] vnd.fmi.flexstor [Hurtta] uri-list [RFC2483] vnd.abc [Allen] rfc822-headers [RFC1892] vnd.in3d.3dml [Powers] prs.lines.tag [Lines] vnd.in3d.spot [Powers] css [RFC2318] xml [RFC3023] xml-external-parsed-entity [RFC3023] rtf [Lindner] directory [RFC2425] calendar [RFC2445] vnd.wap.wml [Stark]
22:55:31 [xena]
.. a very large amount of text.
22:55:54 [sbp]
odd
22:56:07 [sbp]
it refuses to load from here
23:07:20 [sbp]
is it the ftp.isi.edu or the www.isi.edu address that is taken as canonical for the media type URIs?
23:07:53 [deltab]
www.iana.org now, I think
23:08:18 [sbp]
really? argh
23:10:31 [sbp]
.http://www.iana.org/assignments/media-types/text/html
23:10:33 [xena]
404 Not Found Not Found The requested URL /assignments/media-types/text/html was not found on this server. Apache/1.3.22 Server at www.iana.org Port 80
23:10:42 [sbp]
they don't organize them as well as isi.edu
23:11:59 [Morbus]
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23:12:15 [sbp]
aha: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2002Jan/0088
23:14:07 [tansaku]
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23:18:58 [Morbus]
hey, have you ever done relational db design?
23:19:28 [redmonk]
who?
23:19:44 [Morbus]
ant one :)
23:19:48 [Morbus]
y
23:19:58 [redmonk]
only a bit
23:20:19 [redmonk]
when absolutely necessary
23:22:24 [redmonk]
ah
23:25:45 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw has done RDB design
23:26:14 [AaronSw]
the design is sorta fun, sql writing is painful, tho
23:26:26 [redmonk]
hance EOF
23:26:29 [redmonk]
er
23:26:30 [redmonk]
hence
23:26:32 [redmonk]
EOF
23:26:33 [redmonk]
hehe
23:27:05 [redmonk]
.google enterprise objects framework
23:27:06 [xena]
enterprise objects framework: http://developer.apple.com/techpubs/java/WebObjectsandJava/EnterpriseObjects/EnterpriseObjects.html
23:27:45 [AaronSw]
ugh, EOF writing is 20x more painful than SQL!!
23:27:57 [AaronSw]
and their generated code sucks
23:28:18 [redmonk]
heh
23:28:27 [AaronSw]
actually, maybe their GUI wasn't so bad...
23:28:44 [redmonk]
the gui is awesome, if buggy.
23:28:57 [redmonk]
using the apis though is pretty cool
23:29:05 [redmonk]
i'd take it over sql any day
23:29:19 [redmonk]
esp. since the same api covers a crapload of databases
23:29:31 [redmonk]
even when each one uses different sql
23:29:37 [redmonk]
you can even do cross-databse relationships
23:30:05 [redmonk]
but i'
23:30:11 [redmonk]
ll lay off the evengelism
23:45:34 [Morbus]
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23:55:34 [walloper]
<lilo> Problems with a European hub, rerouting.