IRC log of swhack on 2002-03-18

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:00:25 [deltab]
http://www.fourmilab.ch/webtools/demoroniser/
00:00:33 [AaronSw]
:-)
00:01:11 [AaronSw]
The type people yell at me for using ditto marks, and the Web people yell at me for using smart quotes. It's hopeless.
00:02:57 [AaronSw]
"I often quote myself. It adds spice to my conversation." - George Bernard Shaw, via Robin Williams
00:07:00 [AaronSw]
Ooh, special characters for prime marks! Hm, where are they on Mac OS X?
00:09:11 [sbp]
“How about this?” :-)
00:09:42 [sbp]
comes out as: “How about this?”
00:09:53 [sbp]
a bit verbose, I'll grant you that
00:10:13 [AaronSw]
That looks sorta like ,,How about this?% on my machine
00:10:22 [AaronSw]
here's a single one: ´
00:11:05 [sbp]
like ",,How about this?%": perhaps you need a better machine :-)
00:11:14 [AaronSw]
I think you do. :)
00:11:49 [AaronSw]
Apparently on windows they're Alt-1062 and Alt-1078
00:12:23 [sbp]
&6
00:12:42 [sbp]
that's an ampersand and a six to me
00:12:48 [AaronSw]
same here
00:13:01 [sbp]
the entities that I used before are correct, so I'm sure that the problem is your end
00:13:13 [sbp]
try switching fonts, perhaps?
00:13:32 [sbp]
OTOH, perhaps the problem is with my font
00:13:45 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw thinks about how to get it into his browser
00:13:52 [sbp]
but cycling it doesn't give any problems
00:14:14 [AaronSw]
I get smart quotes in my browser.
00:14:42 [AaronSw]
I'm still looking for prime marks, though.
00:15:05 [AaronSw]
³How about this?²
00:15:47 [sbp]
superscript-3How about this?superscript-2
00:16:27 [AaronSw]
Heh.
00:16:42 [AaronSw]
That's characters for you./
00:20:34 [sbp]
yeah...
00:20:50 [sbp]
>>> u"³How about this?²"
00:20:50 [sbp]
u'\xb3How about this?\xb2'
00:21:47 [AaronSw]
Hey, it printed right this time.
00:21:53 [AaronSw]
or were you just quoting me?
00:22:02 [sbp]
just quoting you
00:22:10 [AaronSw]
ah.
00:22:10 [sbp]
I get cycling errors here:-
00:22:10 [sbp]
>>> u"“How about this?”"
00:22:10 [sbp]
u'\x93How about this?\x94'
00:22:10 [sbp]
>>> u"“How about this?”"
00:22:10 [sbp]
UnicodeError: ASCII encoding error: ordinal not in range(128)
00:22:23 [AaronSw]
I get that too
00:22:44 [AaronSw]
>>> print '\xb3How about this?\xb2'
00:22:44 [AaronSw]
?How about this??
00:22:52 [AaronSw]
yeahŠ
00:23:06 [sbp]
it's annoying, because it seems that all of the various things that I'm using handle characters differently
00:24:49 [AaronSw]
Heh, Robin is complaing about people who pronounce forte as "fortay".
00:25:07 [sbp]
Robin?
00:25:26 [AaronSw]
Robin Williams, she's the author of this type book I'm reading.
00:26:05 [sbp]
ah
00:26:09 [AaronSw]
en: ­ em: ‹ hyphen: -
00:26:15 [sbp]
try "print '\x93How about this?\x94'"
00:26:44 [AaronSw]
>>> print '\x93How about this?\x94'
00:26:44 [AaronSw]
?How about this??
00:26:51 [deltab]
don't use \x93 and \x94
00:26:51 [AaronSw]
that's ?How about this??
00:27:00 [sbp]
I just get question marks :-)
00:27:04 [AaronSw]
me too
00:27:39 [sbp]
from you, that is... proper quotes through Python
00:29:24 [AaronSw]
Oh, odd.
00:29:50 [deltab]
not really
00:30:37 [AaronSw]
I guess it's because iTerminal isn't very i18n savvy.
00:30:54 [sbp]
sbp has changed the topic to: Swhack: a place with character (we just can't decide which one)
00:30:58 [deltab]
it's also not a Microsoft app
00:31:18 [AaronSw]
AaronSw has changed the topic to: A place with character (we just can't decide which one)
00:31:32 [AaronSw]
Swhack Style Guide: Assume "Swhack:" or "Swhack Weblog:" before the topic
00:31:40 [AaronSw]
(becuase that's how it is on the website)
00:32:01 [deltab]
and on irc it's #swhack before the topic
00:32:23 [sbp]
Pff
00:32:39 [deltab]
@ http://www.fourmilab.ch/webtools/demoroniser/
00:32:44 [chumpster]
A: demoroniser - correct moronic and gratuitously incompatible Microsoft HTML from deltab
00:32:51 [sbp]
who reads the topics/weblog anyway?
00:32:51 [deltab]
haha
00:32:56 [AaronSw]
heh, bad deltab!
00:33:21 [AaronSw]
Julian Bond, that's who
00:33:54 [sbp]
.google "Julian Bond"
00:33:55 [xena]
"Julian Bond": http://www.voidstar.com
00:34:05 [sbp]
oh, right
00:34:11 [sbp]
sorry Julian
00:34:46 [AaronSw]
<jhendler> conclusion of recent "zapthink" report: Financial Services Sector to spend $8.3 Billion (US) on XML and Web Services by 2005
00:34:46 [AaronSw]
<AaronSw> Are they called zapthink because they get zapped if they actually try to think?
00:34:56 [AaronSw]
standard practice for analyst quote mills, I hear
00:35:50 [sbp]
you offed that!
00:36:36 [sbp]
Oh, foreign spam makes me laugh: "We are apologizing to the inconvenience arisen from this letter to you."
00:36:53 [sbp]
apologize to me, not the inconvenience!
00:37:13 [AaronSw]
Heh.
00:37:20 [AaronSw]
Well I'm de-offing it here.
00:37:46 [AaronSw]
Those inconveniences are always taking over, bossing people around.
00:39:22 [AaronSw]
Robin: "[Swash R]emember, swash characters are like cheescake‹it's easy to overdose."
00:40:50 [sbp]
yeah... and they're both rather cheesy
00:43:31 [AaronSw]
The End of ASCII
00:44:06 [sbp]
;Rît´I/!8å…'"D‰ùÂ`ßa.ªZtOim\fµÞÏÓy²rq%¦ÀtlFFo l\`À…Ý™ª‘A5“_¥ƒjÖ‹¡???
00:44:14 [AaronSw]
whoa, that made my client beep
00:44:19 [sbp]
heh, cool
00:44:51 [AaronSw]
A: Why the beep?
00:44:51 [AaronSw]
C: We've found that odd typography characters is often the sign of a lunatic.
00:45:00 [sbp]
heh, heh, heh
00:45:06 [sbp]
* sbp just excerpted the source of a .tar.gz opened with Wordpad
00:45:31 [AaronSw]
Aha.
00:46:25 [AaronSw]
I'm quickly becoming a typography obsessif.
00:46:34 [sbp]
s/typography characters/characters/
00:46:36 [AaronSw]
But not as much as Joe Clark. ;)
00:46:40 [deltab]
flashing gobbledegook on my screen
00:47:06 [sbp]
makes deltab something something
00:48:12 [demona]
demona (~chatzilla@24.247.121.252.kzo.mi.chartermi.net) has joined #swhack
00:48:20 [AaronSw]
Þnd the þunking student.
00:48:41 [sbp]
what?
00:48:56 [AaronSw]
find the flunking student. [with ligatures]
00:49:19 [sbp]
what?
00:49:22 [AaronSw]
ž think ž žs the perfect character for tav
00:49:52 [sbp]
I heard that as "thnd the thunking student"
00:50:28 [AaronSw]
why?
00:50:48 [sbp]
s/thnd/Thnd/
00:51:10 [sbp]
because you used the Þorn character
00:51:35 [AaronSw]
Silly Microsoft again.
00:51:40 [AaronSw]
I use the fi ligature.
00:51:54 [AaronSw]
^d
00:52:05 [sbp]
weird. And the (presumably "I" character) came out as Z with a v on it
00:52:21 [AaronSw]
Heh. It was a dotless I.
00:52:29 [AaronSw]
well, a dotless i.
00:52:55 [sbp]
we should use Unicode codepoints instead
00:52:59 [sbp]
well, you should
00:53:08 [deltab]
cyrillic small letter tshe, I think
00:53:33 [deltab]
hrm, that's no dotless i
00:54:51 [AaronSw]
IRC i18n has a ways to go, I think.
00:55:21 [sbp]
(Z with caron)
00:55:30 [sbp]
agreed
00:55:42 [sbp]
but you can't go wrong with codepoints
00:56:03 [sbp]
can youU+003F
00:59:18 [wmf]
wmf (wesf@cs242733-11.austin.rr.com) has joined #swhack
00:59:25 [wmf]
swhack!
00:59:32 [sbp]
Hi wmf
00:59:46 [AaronSw]
wmf!
00:59:50 [AaronSw]
Moving?
01:00:09 [wmf]
yep
01:01:17 [wmf]
kinda stressful
01:01:30 [AaronSw]
I bet. Your lease is up?
01:01:36 [wmf]
yeah
01:02:36 [sbp]
ooh: U+203D
01:03:16 [AaronSw]
INTERROBANG?
01:03:29 [wmf]
we're also starting a new project at work tomorrow
01:03:41 [AaronSw]
something interesting?
01:03:48 [AaronSw]
aha! prime is U+2032
01:04:13 [AaronSw]
HTPÅå - argh that doesn't work in here
01:04:27 [sbp]
nor here
01:04:33 [AaronSw]
Sorry, gotta run...
01:04:35 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw is away: dinner
01:04:39 [sbp]
c'ya
01:04:48 [wmf]
hah, you expect to use Unicode in IRC?
01:04:57 [sbp]
what a neat character, though. More about it at http://www.interrobang-mks.com/
01:05:04 [sbp]
heh, well that's what we've been discussing
01:05:22 [wmf]
you have no chance to use unicode, make your time
01:05:39 [sbp]
Aaron's reading this typography book, and what with deltab and I being pedantic-obsessives when it comes to this sort of thing...
01:05:39 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw has a few more seconds...
01:05:49 [AaronSw]
so you don't know where you're moving to yet, wmf? cutting it close...
01:05:50 [wmf]
besides, it's not called HTP' any more
01:05:59 [AaronSw]
Oh?
01:06:07 [AaronSw]
Heh, I didn't notice that.
01:06:13 [AaronSw]
.wn bis
01:06:44 [wmf]
you might need an Italian dictionary
01:07:31 [wmf]
at least SXSW is over, so I won't totally explode
01:07:45 [AaronSw]
Hm, Google Translate doesn't know what it means.
01:07:54 [sbp]
encore
01:08:11 [AaronSw]
Heh.
01:08:13 [wmf]
literally, "again" or "a second time"
01:08:13 [AaronSw]
now i'm really gone
01:08:18 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw is away: dinner
01:08:30 [sbp]
* sbp just happened to have an Italian dictionary sitting on a shelf
01:09:33 [wmf]
dear mom, I'm dating an acress...
01:11:42 [sbp]
* sbp checks out HTP bis => Jefferson Center
01:13:25 [sbp]
Hmm... "known as the area's high-technology corridor" - http://www.jeffersoncenter.com/location.html
01:13:43 [wmf]
that's true
01:33:55 [walloper]
<lilo> This is a WALLOPS message for the Open Projects Network. These messages contain non-critical comments and announcements and detailed server admin information. To turn them off, turn off user mode 'w'. On most clients: '/mode <yournick> -w'. Thanks. Hi all. The latest maintenance release of dancer-ircd, fixing a nice list of miscellaneous bugs, is up on the testnet (port 9001 on your favorite server here)....please thrash it :) thanks :)
01:34:29 [wmf]
geez, do we need to hear the wallops twice?
01:35:52 [sbp]
once for you, once for the logs... :-)
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01:43:51 [AaronSw]
That was fun.
01:44:13 [wmf]
tick tock, it don't stop
01:44:17 [AaronSw]
I like Wes' web services story.
01:44:29 [wmf]
which one?
01:44:37 [AaronSw]
About the microphones.
01:44:47 [wmf]
oh. I like it, too
01:45:04 [wmf]
just trying to put things in perspective
01:46:45 [wmf]
oddly enough, there are standards for pro audio
01:50:16 [AaronSw]
hah, standards
02:23:36 [eikeon]
eikeon (~eikeon@jungle.ne.client2.attbi.com) has joined #swhack
02:23:41 [AaronSw]
eikeon!
02:23:45 [eikeon]
Hi there.
02:24:07 [eikeon]
Just reading your web page :)
02:24:07 [AaronSw]
how's it going?
02:24:31 [AaronSw]
Heh, cool.
02:24:36 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw checks out redfoot...
02:24:48 [AaronSw]
We were thinking of having an RDF API Phone BOF, are you interested?
02:25:06 [AaronSw]
discussing progammatic interfaces, as well as networking ones
02:25:33 [eikeon]
Yeah, sounds interesting.
02:26:14 [eikeon]
Have not done anything on Redfoot for far too long now...
02:26:49 [eikeon]
have been working on what I am going to do for a day job.
02:27:01 [AaronSw]
What's that?
02:27:25 [AaronSw]
bioinformatics?
02:27:38 [AaronSw]
Was the Redfoot networking protocol ever documented/implemented?
02:27:42 [demona]
demona has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:27:45 [eikeon]
As in... I have not had a day job for a while now :)
02:28:01 [AaronSw]
Ah, not alone, unfortunately.
02:29:06 [eikeon]
No, we never really got going on the Redfoot networking protocol
02:30:23 [eikeon]
Is this a publicly archived room?
02:30:32 [AaronSw]
Yes.
02:43:02 [sbp]
[sound of another article going down the crapper]
02:43:26 [sbp]
I keep writing articles and borking them, lately. I must have written about 5 things that just haven't worked out
02:47:12 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw is away: watching "Small Time Crooks"
02:47:54 [sbp]
* sbp is away: chatting on #swhack
02:47:58 [sbp]
so, anyway...
02:48:39 [sbp]
actually, I'm gonna work a bit more on my most recent thing. Perhaps there's some salvagable stuff
02:51:16 [rm_]
rm_ (~chatzilla@ip68-2-102-26.ph.ph.cox.net) has joined #swhack
02:51:29 [rm_]
rm_ is now known as rm
02:51:33 [rm]
hi all
02:51:37 [rm]
hi wmf
02:51:38 [sbp]
hey there rm!
02:51:40 [rm]
aaron
02:51:44 [rm]
hey sbp
02:51:48 [rm]
wazzup
02:51:58 [rm]
saw you were looking for me yesterday....
02:51:59 [sbp]
just trying to salvage stuff from an article
02:52:02 [sbp]
I was?
02:52:09 [rm]
i thought
02:52:17 [rm]
maybe it was in my head
02:52:19 [sbp]
Perhaps I was. Dunno what for, though :-)
02:52:20 [rm]
that happens
02:52:23 [sbp]
heh, heh
02:52:27 [rm]
he
02:52:28 [rm]
h
02:52:30 [sbp]
over-active imagination, perhaps
02:52:43 [sbp]
Aaron just wandered off to watch "Small Time Crooks", BTW
02:53:02 [rm]
cool
02:53:15 [rm]
so what's this new parka thing?
02:53:21 [rm]
somme new rdf engine?
02:53:37 [sbp]
it's something that Jim Hendler et al. had been working on for years. it's a kinda-RDF engine, yeah
02:53:55 [rm]
whois jim hendler?
02:53:57 [sbp]
well, it stores binary relationships, and allows you to query them quickly. it's fast
02:54:18 [sbp]
Jim Hendler: of the University of Maryland, ex-DAML project manager, and WebONT WG chair
02:54:26 [rm]
ah
02:57:40 [rm]
aaon get any further with his merge?
02:57:43 [rm]
er, aaron
02:58:09 [wmf]
hey rm
02:58:49 [sbp]
I don't think so
02:58:51 [rm]
hwy wmf
02:58:55 [rm]
er, hey
02:58:59 [rm]
no-typing fool
02:59:15 [rm]
supwes
02:59:33 [wmf]
apartment-shopping stress
02:59:44 [wmf]
hey, new design. nice
02:59:50 [rm]
oh no fun
02:59:56 [rm]
what new design?
03:00:00 [rm]
oh, on rm>
03:00:03 [wmf]
yeah
03:00:04 [rm]
redmonk?
03:00:06 [rm]
yeah
03:00:07 [rm]
all css
03:00:11 [rm]
thanks
03:00:22 [rm]
it's still only the front page though
03:00:24 [rm]
:-}(
03:00:27 [rm]
:-(
03:01:34 [wmf]
I think I'll add a buch of sites to my bookmarks
03:02:02 [rm]
cool
03:02:36 [rm]
(donkey on Shrek: "pick me! pick me!")
03:02:54 [rm]
sbp: where do you find guitar tabs?
03:03:01 [rm]
WMGGW
03:04:02 [sbp]
usually OLGA, or one of its interfaces
03:04:07 [sbp]
.google OLGA tabs
03:04:08 [xena]
OLGA tabs: http://www.olga.net
03:04:53 [rm]
cooool
03:04:55 [rm]
thx
03:08:05 [sbp]
np
03:10:33 [rm]
mmmm
03:10:39 [rm]
http://www.olga.net/dynamic/browse.php?local=main/r/rem
03:10:45 [rm]
w00t!
03:13:41 [sbp]
heh, heh
03:17:03 [rm]
love that rem
03:17:05 [rm]
hehe
03:17:45 [rm]
even before "the web", i was downloading lyrics and tabs from an email responder that someone on r.m.r
03:17:51 [rm]
set up
03:19:13 [rm]
ah, those were the days
03:20:14 [rm]
that was... '92
03:20:36 [rm]
god. i've been on the net for 10 years
03:20:40 [rm]
this year
03:20:46 [rm]
what a geezer
03:24:03 [sbp]
heh!
03:30:50 [rm]
;-)
03:33:01 [rm]
i should blog some of the latest on #semplesh...
03:33:10 [rm]
anything interesting happen lately?
03:33:58 [sbp]
Hmm...
03:34:00 [sbp]
No :-)
03:34:38 [rm]
didn't think so ;-)
03:35:02 [rm]
although aaron did get the rdfapi worked on
03:35:36 [sbp]
yep
03:37:32 [rm]
hm, what day was that?
03:38:04 [sbp]
Friday
03:50:53 [rm]
sbp: canonical Eep URI?
03:59:03 [sbp]
http://infomesh.net/2002/eep/
04:02:55 [sbp]
Homer: Professional athletes... always want more
04:07:58 [rm]
so what are you up to sean
04:09:55 [sbp]
listening to Zep, fiding RegExp stuff, chatting to people...
04:10:29 [rm]
cool
04:20:41 [rm]
i was going o move anno over to infogami but i'm going to wait until aaron has eep merged too, i think
04:21:15 [sbp]
yep, good idea
04:21:17 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw returns
04:21:30 [sbp]
although he might ask me to do the merging. Aaron, who do you want to do it?
04:21:47 [AaronSw]
Well, you know the code better than I.
04:22:07 [sbp]
but you know infogami better than I :-)
04:22:13 [sbp]
it's np, I'll port it
04:22:59 [AaronSw]
Hey, I've been on the 'Net for at least ten years...
04:23:12 [sbp]
is the infogami code stable now?
04:23:32 [AaronSw]
Should be.
04:24:53 [AaronSw]
I'm happy to help
04:26:04 [sbp]
-> #semplesh
04:31:13 [AaronSw]
sup rm
04:31:38 [rm]
hehe
04:32:00 [rm]
not bad - watching a flick with wife and friend
04:32:38 [AaronSw]
cool
04:32:39 [rm]
you/
04:32:39 [rm]
?
04:32:45 [AaronSw]
just finished watching one
04:33:12 [AaronSw]
Ugh, school starts again tomorrow
04:34:01 [AaronSw]
TODO: clean up room
04:34:46 [rm]
oy
04:35:28 [rm]
ddid mine this afternoon before guests
04:35:46 [rm]
tough being a grownup ;-)
04:35:49 [rm]
lol
04:35:51 [rm]
sorry
04:36:52 [AaronSw]
I generally keep my room very tidy.
04:37:07 [AaronSw]
Becuase I get bored, so I clean stuff up.
04:37:12 [AaronSw]
I guess this is a sign I've been busy.
04:37:25 [wmf]
I never get that bored
04:40:16 [AaronSw]
I also clean keyboard lint while on telecons...
04:40:41 [wmf]
I don't see any lint in my keyboard
04:43:46 [AaronSw]
Well, I, um, "borrowed" the keyboard from someone else and they were very messy eaters.
04:43:54 [wmf]
ah
04:44:22 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw mutters something about stupid kids...
04:44:33 [wmf]
heh
04:44:53 [wmf]
when I was driving him around town, Cory asked me where I worked before IBM
04:45:08 [wmf]
when I said I was in school then, he said "you're just a punk kid!"
04:45:38 [AaronSw]
so you said, "you're just a punk sci-fi author"?
04:45:45 [wmf]
no, I said he was right
04:46:07 [AaronSw]
I'm surprised he didn't know that
04:46:38 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw looks up how digest auth works
04:47:20 [wmf]
I wish HTTP supported SASL so we could use SRP
04:47:32 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw looks for his deacronymizer
04:47:42 [wmf]
heh
04:48:07 [AaronSw]
Hmmmmm.
04:50:48 [wmf]
if I believed in reincarnation, I know I'd have Alzheimer's in my next life
04:51:28 [AaronSw]
There's still time left in this one...
04:52:23 [wmf]
then I could honestly tell the kids "I've forgotten more than you ever knew" :-)
04:53:23 [rm]
lol
04:54:46 [wmf]
* wmf does some serious name-dropping on HTP
04:56:09 [AaronSw]
Heh! How'd you find that out?
04:56:23 [wmf]
saw a stream of them giving talks
04:57:20 [wmf]
it was interesting to see them promoting mostly the same ideas as in the 70s
05:41:35 [rm]
wes, old?
05:41:38 [rm]
lol
05:41:51 [AaronSw]
quiet, youngin'
05:41:51 [wmf]
I'm just a punk kid!
05:42:08 [rm]
you're all punk kids!
05:42:19 [rm]
i was online when you were in diapers!
05:42:25 [rm]
(at least you, aaroin)
05:42:27 [rm]
;-)
05:42:30 [rm]
hahahahahahaha
05:42:31 [AaronSw]
I was online before you, so there.
05:42:32 [wmf]
* wmf cranks up the offspring
05:42:59 [rm]
well, ok
05:43:04 [AaronSw]
having children already? man, you're old
05:43:58 [wmf]
* wmf snickers
05:44:05 [rm]
you were online at 6 aaron?
05:44:08 [rm]
;-)
05:44:15 [AaronSw]
Yep.
05:44:17 [rm]
i knew you were a smarty pants but wow
05:44:20 [rm]
lol
05:44:39 [AaronSw]
I'm serious, we had a dial-in to my Dad's office where we surfed the muds over ZModem and Telnet.
05:44:42 [sbp]
and he has the usenet posts to prove it!
05:44:48 [rm]
i've seen
05:45:08 [AaronSw]
I still remember the ASCII art announcement for Mosaic...
05:45:28 [rm]
hehee
05:45:31 [sbp]
reference?
05:45:32 [rm]
i remember that
05:45:37 [rm]
been a while ;-)
05:46:47 [rm]
rm has quit (Remote closed the connection)
05:47:16 [AaronSw]
the nostalgia killed him
05:47:19 [sbp]
what'd I say[Interrobang]
05:47:54 [rm_]
rm_ (~chatzilla@ip68-2-102-26.ph.ph.cox.net) has joined #swhack
05:48:58 [rm_]
stupid moz crashed
05:49:12 [AaronSw]
heh: the INTERROBANG "expresses Modern Life's Incredibility."
05:50:11 [sbp]
Hmm... http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=1993Jan29.122243.26454%40dxcern.cern.ch
05:50:21 [sbp]
heh, cool
05:50:44 [AaronSw]
weird url:
05:51:00 [AaronSw]
file://ftp.ncsa.uiuc.edu/Web/xmosaic/xmosaic-0.5.tar.Z
05:52:04 [sbp]
heh, heh: http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=MARCA.93Dec22023055%40wintermute.ncsa.uiuc.edu
05:52:38 [AaronSw]
I can see the CNET headlines already
05:53:08 [sbp]
:-)
05:58:20 [AaronSw]
Heh: http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=MARCA.94Mar2193525%40wintermute.ncsa.uiuc.edu
05:59:47 [sbp]
ah, the announcement: http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=MARCA.93Mar14225600%40wintermute.ncsa.uiuc.edu
06:00:50 [sbp]
cool; first mention of IRC: http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=8772%40orstcs.CS.ORST.EDU
06:01:31 [AaronSw]
makes you wonder: why are we using the same sucky networks from back then...
06:02:00 [rm_]
becuase you weren't around to invent the plesh
06:02:16 [wmf]
wmf has quit ("wmf has no reason")
06:02:21 [sbp]
good point
06:02:37 [rm_]
we owe it all to tav` and aaronsw
06:03:19 [AaronSw]
wow, first message from brewster to www-talk: http://impressive.net/archives/www-talk/9202181358.AA28643@quake.think.com
06:04:34 [sbp]
rm: and many others before them
06:05:02 [AaronSw]
and very many after us
06:05:55 [AaronSw]
Marc's first email: http://impressive.net/archives/www-talk/9211170421.AA03160@wintermute.ncsa.uiuc.edu
06:06:37 [AaronSw]
and his results: http://impressive.net/archives/www-talk/9211180324.AA05780@wintermute.ncsa.uiuc.edu
06:07:24 [sbp]
cool
06:08:23 [rm_]
rm_ has quit ("night night")
06:08:41 [AaronSw]
Heh: http://impressive.net/archives/www-talk/9212011552.AA01907@www3.cern.ch
06:09:14 [AaronSw]
lol! guido's first message: http://impressive.net/archives/www-talk/9212070007.AA16719.guido@voorn.cwi.nl
06:09:48 [sbp]
heh, a little mention of Python in there...
06:09:52 [AaronSw]
Indeed!
06:10:34 [AaronSw]
Ironically, Guido is explaining the purpose of typed links to DanC!
06:11:06 [sbp]
what's this about Jim's comment syntax in Tim's mail?
06:11:24 [sbp]
"Jim's comment system is neat, and I'd like to adopt it here too.
06:11:25 [sbp]
"
06:12:06 [AaronSw]
dunno
06:12:17 [sbp]
Hmm... http://impressive.net/archives/www-talk/9211271643.AA09646@njitgw.njit.edu and others
06:13:20 [sbp]
it's a shame that none of the links in those mails work :-)
06:13:41 [AaronSw]
They weren't Cool back then
06:14:51 [AaronSw]
TimBL, inviting people to work at CERN: "Geneva, Switzerland, has lakes and mountains and an international community. There is Alpine skiing an hour away and hill walking 20 minutes away. But these things are material :-)" - http://impressive.net/archives/www-talk/9211191713.AA00333@www3.cern.ch
06:16:55 [sbp]
Gotta run
06:18:51 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw is away: sleep
06:43:48 [tansaku_sftwre_fcked]
tansaku_sftwre_fcked has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
09:11:22 [tansaku_sftwre_fcked]
tansaku_sftwre_fcked (~sam@h133-225.tokyu-net.catv.ne.jp) has joined #swhack
15:12:02 [AaronSw]
quiet morning
15:28:25 [redmonk]
redmonk (~steve@63.149.73.20) has joined #swhack
15:28:57 [AaronSw]
yo
15:29:27 [redmonk]
yo yo yo
15:29:32 [redmonk]
tunneling r00lz
15:29:37 [redmonk]
heh
15:29:39 [AaronSw]
Heh
15:29:52 [redmonk]
infogami.rdfapi is looking good
15:29:59 [AaronSw]
Cool
15:30:05 [redmonk]
redmonk is now known as rm_busy
15:30:09 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw is away: school
15:36:31 [Morbus]
Morbus (~Morbus@s102.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack
15:38:43 [Morbus]
quick, someone say something.
15:38:59 [Morbus]
.google say something
15:39:01 [xena]
say something: http://www.saysomethingsweet.com
15:39:07 [Morbus]
mmkay. good.
15:39:40 [rm_busy]
hello
15:39:50 [Morbus]
jeez, is the "show timestamps" ugly in Snak or what.
15:40:00 [Morbus]
hey red.
15:40:08 [rm_busy]
'ello
15:40:15 [rm_busy]
yes, it;s ugly
15:40:22 [Morbus]
well, that's dumb.
15:40:29 [Morbus]
the cycle forward/backward key commands don't loop.
15:40:32 [Morbus]
you're using snak too?
15:40:36 [rm_busy]
yes
15:40:38 [Morbus]
i'm fiddling with the tabbed interface.
15:40:44 [rm_busy]
hm
15:40:53 [Morbus]
and turned on timestamps, and now all my flipping text is way over there ;)
15:40:59 [Morbus]
and moving the nick column doesn't help much.
15:41:39 [rm_busy]
hm.
15:41:45 [rm_busy]
my timestampas are only:
15:41:55 [rm_busy]
[8:43] <rm_busy> my timestampas are only:
15:41:59 [rm_busy]
small
15:42:05 [rm_busy]
[time]
15:42:13 [rm_busy]
so it's not too bad
15:42:14 [Morbus]
yeah, but there's still a huge ga...
15:42:19 [Morbus]
hmm. lemme try again.
15:42:58 [Morbus]
hmm.
15:43:05 [Morbus]
well, it's small enough.
15:43:18 [Morbus]
but if i try to make it smaller (catering to 00:00) it'll cut off the nick name.
15:46:05 [Morbus]
ah well.
15:46:10 [Morbus]
maybe i'll get used to it.
15:46:30 [Morbus]
Morbus has quit ("http://www.disobey.com/")
15:46:42 [Morbus]
Morbus (~Morbus@s102.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack
15:47:39 [talli]
talli (~talli@lti-4.dialup.access.net) has joined #swhack
15:47:50 [talli]
fee fi fo
15:48:05 [Morbus]
hey there, tiki tiki talli
15:48:10 [talli]
yo Morbus
15:48:12 [talli]
que pasa?
15:48:26 [Morbus]
me llamo guacamole
15:48:37 [talli]
no way!
15:48:40 [talli]
that's my brother's name
15:48:42 [Morbus]
si ;)
15:48:44 [Morbus]
yeah?
15:48:52 [Morbus]
that was my spanish name in seventh grade spanish class.
15:49:05 [talli]
sevies suck
15:49:26 [talli]
there is nothing lower in this world than a seventh grader, for some reason
15:49:33 [talli]
at least, that's what i learned in junior high
15:49:37 [Morbus]
heh.
15:50:44 [talli]
Morbus, do you know any good iCalendar servers?
15:50:56 [Morbus]
nope.
15:51:07 [talli]
damn
15:51:14 [talli]
htat's a problem in the free software world
15:58:39 [rm_busy]
rm_busy has quit ("stupid snak. must kill pref file")
15:59:47 [redmonk]
redmonk (~steve@63.149.73.20) has joined #swhack
15:59:51 [talli]
talli has left #swhack
15:59:57 [redmonk]
ha!
15:59:59 [redmonk]
take that, snak
16:00:08 [Morbus]
hehehe
16:00:12 [redmonk]
redmonk is now known as rm_busy
16:08:07 [Morbus]
Morbus has quit ("http://www.disobey.com/")
17:28:06 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw waves
17:30:15 [AaronSw]
why do you need timestamps in snak? just leave your mouse over the nick, and they pop up for you
17:38:21 [AaronSw]
<jang> "lex luthor would know that we know he's planning world destruction, so I cannot drink from the goblet nearest me"
17:38:21 [AaronSw]
{ :Lex :knows { :Superman :knows { :Lex :plans { :Lex :destroy :World } } } } => { :Superman :noDrinkFrom :Goblet }
17:49:38 [rm_busy]
* rm_busy waves
17:49:59 [rm_busy]
lol
17:50:15 [Morbus]
Morbus (~morbus@morbus.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack
17:50:20 [rm_busy]
'ello
18:06:36 [rm_busy]
how's school aaron?
18:06:43 [rm_busy]
or is it ust not worht asking
18:06:49 [rm_busy]
(oy BTD)
18:31:52 [rm_busy]
rm_busy is now known as rm_back_from_twilight_zone
18:31:57 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
*whew*
18:32:08 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
it's been a busy morning here in the twilight zone
18:32:38 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
i got to work this morning and found two instances of my app had mysteriously decided to *BORK* on launch.
18:32:49 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
unfortunately, they were in auto-recover mode
18:33:11 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
so everytimee they blew chunks into the logs, the appserver re-started them
18:33:31 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
so this morning i find over *8000* empty log files in the log dir
18:34:08 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
and the appserver eating memory like i used to go through m&ms
18:34:30 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
sudo reboot
18:34:44 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
rm -fr *.log.*
18:34:48 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
*sigh*
18:35:18 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
then work on the appserver for a few hours wonderingg how conffig files can be mysteriously re-created in an old state
18:35:37 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
as if the appserver was reaching back in time to give me the borked (i love that word) version
18:35:41 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
just to spite me
18:36:09 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
i finally removed the offending host from the admin app's knowledge, and re-added it
18:36:17 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
at which point everything went rosy again
18:36:32 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
the sun came out
18:36:51 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
but there's a weird guy in black with an umbrella hiding behind a tree...
18:37:01 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
what a morning...
18:37:06 [rm_back_from_twilight_zone]
rm_back_from_twilight_zone is now known as rm_busy
18:52:48 [Morbus]
head... hurts!
18:54:14 [sbp]
* sbp wonders if Aaron is around
18:58:56 [rm_busy]
hehe
18:59:12 [rm_busy]
hi sbp
19:51:53 [rm_busy]
* rm_busy wonders iff anyone is around
19:52:06 [deltab]
"iff"? heh
19:52:25 [deltab]
and if no-one is around, you don't wonder?
19:52:36 [rm_busy]
right
19:52:51 [rm_busy]
i only want to know iffmorbus is around ;-)
19:53:13 [deltab]
know what?
19:53:35 [rm_busy]
iffmorbus! get with the program. ;-)
19:53:45 [rm_busy]
sorry - it's been a crazy am
19:54:09 [rm_busy]
i'm not firing on all cylinders
20:01:39 [sbp]
buy some new spark plugs
20:02:08 [rm_busy]
i did, but the mountain dew is not helping
20:02:47 [rm_busy]
besides, the plugs don't help if your distributors busted
20:03:28 [sbp]
true
20:03:47 [rm_busy]
so how's life?
20:03:58 [sbp]
ploddingful
20:08:57 [rm_busy]
bummer
20:09:23 [sbp]
bummer/
20:09:29 [sbp]
s/\//?/
20:17:55 [rm_busy]
<sbp> ploddingful
20:18:05 [rm_busy]
<rm_busy> bummer
20:18:12 [sbp]
ploddingful is good!
20:18:42 [rm_busy]
found a new(ha!) chord prog last night
20:18:52 [rm_busy]
have to make a melody now
20:19:41 [rm_busy]
G Bm C (walk down low E)
20:19:41 [rm_busy]
Em D(F#) G
20:19:57 [rm_busy]
nothing amazing, but it was new to me
20:20:24 [sbp]
Hmm...
20:20:33 [sbp]
* sbp strums away, trying to find the right rhythm
20:21:18 [rm_busy]
1 2 3 4
20:21:54 [rm_busy]
G Bm C (down one fret on E)
20:22:00 [rm_busy]
1 2 3 4
20:22:24 [rm_busy]
Em D(F#) G ...
20:22:26 [rm_busy]
oops
20:22:30 [rm_busy]
doesn't line up
20:22:43 [rm_busy]
slow rythm
20:22:50 [rm_busy]
rhythm
20:23:07 [sbp]
Yep, I think I've got something
20:23:18 [sbp]
that's pretty neat. certainly needs a cute melody
20:23:32 [rm_busy]
just wish i had a freebie app i could record stuff on on the tibook
20:23:35 [rm_busy]
(os x)
20:23:59 [rm_busy]
melody: yeah
20:24:03 [sbp]
I came up with a little versey bit last night: (Capo 2nd) AMaj CMaj7 D9 Am7(+high G)
20:24:25 [rm_busy]
we should start a guitar club ;-)
20:24:33 [sbp]
:-)
20:24:34 [rm_busy]
i could use some fresh input ;-)
20:37:28 [AaronSw]
BTD?
20:37:39 [walloper]
<lilo> Hi all. The new server code (1.0.31+maint2) is up on the testnet....pick your favorite server and use port 9001. Please give it a nice thrashing and let us know if you see any problems. Conversion soon. Thanks.
20:38:12 [rm_busy]
Bad Typing Day
20:38:23 [AaronSw]
ah
20:38:26 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw waves
20:38:34 [rm_busy]
* rm_busy waves
20:38:34 [sbp]
Aaron, did you scrunge N3Alternatives from Notation3?
20:38:41 [AaronSw]
scrunge?
20:38:52 [AaronSw]
I found the link in an email from TimBL to RDF Core.
20:38:57 [sbp]
ah
20:40:09 [rm_busy]
* rm_busy started an outline in OO 2.0 for guitar ideas
20:40:18 [sbp]
heh, heh, found it:-
20:40:18 [sbp]
[[[
20:40:19 [sbp]
(If the ISO folks have used both such that ambiguity arises, I will
20:40:19 [sbp]
[make them] eat my hat ;-)
20:40:19 [rm_busy]
columns are good for guitar tabs ;-)
20:40:24 [sbp]
]]] - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-rdfcore-wg/2002Mar/0234
20:44:59 [deltab]
there was something about - and _ in language or locale codes fairly recently
20:49:17 [d0wn3r]
d0wn3r (~downer@d141-117-205.home.cgocable.net) has joined #swhack
20:49:17 [Morbus]
Morbus has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
20:51:26 [Morbus]
Morbus (~morbus@morbus.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack
20:51:36 [sbp]
hey Morbus
20:52:05 [sbp]
deltab, can you remember where you saw that, at all?
20:52:21 [deltab]
in my mailbox - searching...
20:53:14 [rm_busy]
* rm_busy is not sure what prompted the comment
20:53:30 [rm_busy]
* rm_busy 's newbieness shows
20:53:49 [sbp]
[OLM]
20:57:05 [deltab]
aha - Subject: Using - or _ in language tags and/or locales
20:59:19 [d0wn3r]
d0wn3r has quit ()
20:59:35 [AaronSw]
Heh, I was just about to say hi too!
20:59:49 [sbp]
heh, heh
21:18:09 [rm_busy]
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21:18:09 [_rm]
_rm is now known as rm_busy
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rm_busy is now known as _rm
21:43:19 [talli]
talli (~talli@xcdfddb76.ip.ggn.net) has joined #swhack
21:43:28 [talli]
AaronSw: you here?
21:43:34 [AaronSw]
yep
21:43:39 [talli]
how's it going?
21:43:43 [AaronSw]
alright
21:44:01 [AaronSw]
what's up?
21:44:03 [talli]
i gotta a question for you. not because i like you, but because you're unfortunately the only person that might know this
21:44:15 [talli]
let me stress I DON'T LIKE YOU
21:44:20 [AaronSw]
ok, got it
21:44:23 [talli]
ok, ready to answer my question/
21:44:33 [talli]
?
21:44:36 [AaronSw]
yep
21:44:58 [sbp]
"why are you so annoying that I wouldn't like you?"
21:45:00 [talli]
ok, do you know anyone working on RDF definitions for the icalendar spec?
21:45:07 [AaronSw]
yep
21:45:20 [talli]
who might that be?
21:45:29 [AaronSw]
libby miller, mostly
21:45:38 [AaronSw]
.google rdf icalendar
21:45:39 [xena]
rdf icalendar: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-rdf-calendar/2001Aug/0003.html
21:45:52 [talli]
very nice
21:46:05 [talli]
i assume xena is a bot?
21:46:17 [AaronSw]
yep
21:46:30 [talli]
very nice
21:46:39 [talli]
thank you very much sir. i appreciate it
21:47:11 [AaronSw]
no problem
21:47:35 [AaronSw]
libby's online, might /msg libby
21:48:10 [talli]
cool, thanks
21:48:22 [talli]
do you know if anyone is working on building an icalendar server/
21:48:23 [talli]
?
21:48:37 [AaronSw]
that does what?
21:49:01 [talli]
group calendaring
21:49:19 [talli]
kinda like an mta, only focusing on delivering scheduling and calendaring apps
21:49:51 [AaronSw]
i've heard a lot of reqeusts for one, but can't think of anyone who's building it
21:49:57 [talli]
cool, thakns
21:50:11 [talli]
* talli begins to ponder a new project...
21:50:17 [talli]
thanks AaronSw.
21:50:23 [AaronSw]
sure. glad you like me :)
21:50:31 [talli]
did i say that?
21:50:46 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw ducks
21:50:58 [sbp]
<talli> let me stress I [...] LIKE YOU
21:50:59 [talli]
btw, i don;'t know how you might feel about this, but are you familiar with the open source now initiative at RedHat?
21:51:15 [AaronSw]
nope... link?
21:51:20 [talli]
sbp: i don't like butt kissers. but i'll make an exception for you
21:51:27 [talli]
http://www.redhat.com/opensourcenow
21:51:42 [sbp]
erm... I was quoting you, ya dumbwad
21:52:17 [talli]
ok.
21:52:35 [AaronSw]
OSN is a program to get redhat in schools?
21:52:35 [talli]
sbp: i no longer like you
21:52:40 [talli]
AaronSw: yeah
21:52:41 [sbp]
heh, heh :-)
21:52:55 [sbp]
I'd rather not be a butt kisser than have you like me
21:53:21 [talli]
careful, sbp, don't underestimate my power!
21:53:29 [talli]
AaronSw: tell sbp about my power
21:53:35 [AaronSw]
he has power
21:53:46 [sbp]
well, Aaron did say there'd be some kind of immense explosion if you met tav...
21:53:56 [talli]
tav???
21:54:02 [sbp]
Ain El-Milkeen
21:54:06 [talli]
i will destroy tav!!!
21:54:10 [sbp]
heh, heh
21:54:20 [sbp]
<talli> :archNemesisOf <tav> .
21:54:42 [talli]
who is talli?
21:54:50 [Morbus]
* Morbus sniffs.
21:55:08 [sbp]
"Gaim", apparently. I'm nonthewiser
21:55:14 [sbp]
Morbus: don't worry, he can have two
21:55:24 [talli]
haha. sbp you will never know me!
21:55:27 [Morbus]
AaronSw, i actually bought omni outliner today.
21:55:28 [sbp]
monotonicity!
21:55:41 [AaronSw]
heh, cool
21:55:43 [sbp]
the parallels with tav are spooky
21:55:45 [sbp]
anyway...
21:55:46 [sbp]
Gotta run
21:55:48 [talli]
* talli is getting so obnoxious he may try and kick his own ass
21:56:09 [talli]
anyway, thanks for the tips AaronSw
21:56:17 [AaronSw]
sure
21:56:22 [talli]
sbp, Morbus: catch you guys (or girls) later
21:56:32 [talli]
talli has left #swhack
21:57:01 [_rm]
morbus: oo is coool
21:57:08 [_rm]
2.0 is a righteous upgrade
21:57:28 [Morbus]
yeah, that's what made me move.
21:57:33 [Morbus]
it added some features i wanted myself.
21:57:46 [Morbus]
so i grabbed it today so i'd get a 9 dollar discount when 2.0 comes out ;)
21:57:56 [_rm]
yeah - the alternate row colors is a biggee, as is column types
21:58:03 [Morbus]
mmhmm.
21:58:08 [Morbus]
hey, i can't get popups to work - can you?
21:58:11 [_rm]
yeah
21:58:23 [Morbus]
i define a column as a popup, but can't define them in the actual column info screen.
21:58:23 [_rm]
go to the info panel
21:58:35 [_rm]
yes you can - just hit return
21:58:41 [_rm]
it will put in a new value
21:58:42 [Morbus]
right, and when I try clicking in the white box that appears after going to duration, it doesn't give me the opportunity to.
21:58:45 [Morbus]
...
21:58:51 [_rm]
hm.
21:58:57 [_rm]
hang on
21:58:59 [Morbus]
so, wait, i choose the popup, and then just hit "return"?
21:59:08 [Morbus]
sad thing is, i'm not in front of my box right now.
21:59:16 [Morbus]
i love its small footprint. its on all the time on my box ;)
21:59:22 [Morbus]
and the notes feature rocks.
21:59:30 [_rm]
yeah just hit return
21:59:46 [_rm]
yeah
21:59:46 [Morbus]
hmm. i'll try it when i get home.
21:59:49 [_rm]
ok
22:01:19 [_rm]
i turned off status check boxes,
22:01:34 [Morbus]
right, i have them turned off too.
22:01:36 [_rm]
then added a checkbox column with summary set to "calculate"
22:01:48 [_rm]
and it worked the exact same way, but in it's own column
22:01:59 [_rm]
i hate the checkboxes that folow the outline
22:02:07 [_rm]
woohoo
22:02:08 [Morbus]
i wish autonumbering woudl work smarter.
22:02:12 [_rm]
yeah
22:02:17 [Morbus]
i want autonumbering in its own column, not as part of the topic.
22:02:27 [_rm]
hm.
22:02:35 [_rm]
i see
22:07:42 [AaronSw]
Heh: 'This is not "yet another" Web services or Semantic Web workshop.'
22:08:47 [_rm]
YAWS/SWW
22:18:32 [Morbus]
Morbus has quit ("http://www.disobey.com/")
22:29:21 [tomc]
tomc (~lambda@modem-2893.porcupine.dialup.pol.co.uk) has joined #swhack
22:31:06 [AaronSw]
hm, did robbb ever come on irc?
22:32:24 [sbp]
robbb?
22:32:57 [AaronSw]
robb beal
22:33:03 [AaronSw]
.google robb beal swhack
22:33:04 [xena]
robb beal swhack: http://blogspace.com/swhack/weblog/2001/12/02
22:33:50 [sbp]
ah
22:38:55 [sbp]
ooh! the commons just voted to ban foxhunting
22:39:14 [tomc]
:o))
22:39:19 [sbp]
so democracy *does* work! :-)
22:40:04 [tomc]
I think I heard something recently about banning sexism in selling drinks.
22:40:37 [tomc]
That would neatly get rid of all that "Women Drink F***ing Free" stuff. Which is good.
22:40:56 [sbp]
now it moves to the Lords... that will be interesting
22:41:08 [sbp]
sexism: yeah
22:41:10 [tomc]
Heh, yes
22:41:57 [tomc]
Public pressure vs whatever the Lords believes it stands for. Or something.
22:42:30 [sbp]
indeed. Of course, on some occasions, the Lords actually correct dubious descisions by the commons...
22:42:57 [sbp]
but there are always going to be cases like this when you have to hope that the lords don't mess things up
22:43:32 [sbp]
it's a bit silly really; we vote for new people, and the old people move to the lords
22:43:36 [tomc]
Our systems are bizarre
22:43:50 [AaronSw]
Why are you against foxhunting?
22:43:57 [sbp]
yeah. although, I like the heriatage and eccenticity of it all :-)
22:44:08 [tomc]
Yes :)
22:44:16 [tomc]
*umm*
22:44:44 [tomc]
...
22:45:41 [sbp]
Well, I think that when you measure it on the scale of dumbassed things that humans do, ripping up foxes as a substitute for gonads ranks quite high on the scale
22:45:47 [tomc]
Boxing is controversial, but vaguely defendable. Foxhunting's controversial.
22:47:51 [sbp]
in general, I am conservative about British heritage, and upper class anachronisms, so you can't catch me out on being too liberal. I want to keep the pound, I was against dissolving the lords, I think that we should keep the royal family. But foxhunting is just silly
22:49:19 [sbp]
* sbp is more neutral on the lords these days. Some of the exceptional cases get too much press, IMO
22:50:19 [tomc]
*hmm* I don't mind esoteric bits of heritage, but if they're getting in the way, replacing them seems like a good idea.
22:50:25 [sbp]
agreed
22:50:40 [AaronSw]
I wonder if there are any fairly-elected governments out there.
22:51:15 [AaronSw]
fair meaning proportional representation, condorcet, etc.
22:51:21 [sbp]
so the argument is over whether or not the lords are getting in the way. I have to admit that they probably do, but there are still the exceptions. I guess if we hadn't have had the lords in the first place, no one would have said "ooh, lets have a house of lords too!", so the reasons for keeping it seem pretty silly
22:51:38 [sbp]
fairly-elected: who was it that proved that there's no such thing as a perfect democracy? :-)
22:52:31 [tomc]
democracy's a pretty crap system IMHO :)
22:52:32 [AaronSw]
what's a perfect democracy?
22:52:44 [AaronSw]
...except for all others which have been tried from time to time
22:52:45 [tomc]
it was good 2000 years ago.
22:52:52 [sbp]
Aaron: sorry, I don't know to any papers to cite...
22:53:11 [AaronSw]
tomc, what's better than democracy?
22:53:29 [sbp]
I don't think that people actually contemplate and realise the full ramifications of their votes, which has always interested me. Do people really know why they're voting? I reckon most of them just flip a coin
22:53:55 [sbp]
two party system, heads for the current leader, tails for the opposition :-)
22:54:06 [AaronSw]
There was a fray piece where some guy said something that really irritated me...
22:54:08 [tomc]
* tomc applauds
22:54:24 [AaronSw]
He said that he was sure some judges did good jobs, and some needed to be booted, but he didn't know which ones did, so he picked randomly.
22:54:36 [sbp]
ugh!
22:54:59 [tomc]
fray?
22:55:03 [sbp]
so he actually said that he knew that there was a distinction in quality, but chose to ignore it? What an idiot!
22:55:17 [AaronSw]
{fray} - fray.{com, org, net}
22:55:35 [tomc]
oh
22:56:00 [sbp]
OTOH, we all make mistakes
22:56:10 [AaronSw]
Ah, here's the story: http://www.fray.com/criminal/vote/
22:56:42 [AaronSw]
"Yogic flying sounds like fun, so I voted for the Natural Law Party at every chance. In Illinois half the ballot is a list of judges, for each of which we vote whether to retain or not. I had no idea, but I was pretty sure that A) they weren't all bad and B) they weren't all good. So the odd-numbered ones I voted to retain; the others I kicked to the curb."
22:57:05 [sbp]
heh! "Yogic flying sounds like fun, so I voted for the Natural Law Party at every chance."
22:57:17 [sbp]
man, you always get there before I do
22:57:47 [AaronSw]
yogic flying looks very fun, although painful without the right padding
22:57:52 [sbp]
now that I read it in context, I think he was just being comical
22:57:59 [sbp]
and apologize for my earlier slur :-)
22:58:09 [sbp]
painful without padding: tell me about it
22:59:08 [AaronSw]
can someone send me a test email?
22:59:50 [deltab]
where?
23:00:08 [AaronSw]
me@aaronsw.com
23:00:13 [AaronSw]
I miss xena's mail service...
23:00:15 [sbp]
sent
23:00:18 [AaronSw]
thanks
23:03:34 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw gets emails. Thanks
23:03:51 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw looks for 10c...
23:04:00 [AaronSw]
Ah, deltab has changed his email.
23:04:44 [sbp]
10c: heh, heh
23:04:57 [AaronSw]
err email address
23:07:23 [AaronSw]
Man, RCS is expensive!
23:07:28 [_rm]
hhe
23:07:41 [_rm]
yeah, either 800 bucks or 40
23:08:20 [AaronSw]
<phone>
23:08:30 [_rm]
<web>
23:08:46 [sbp]
<AaronSw> <isOnThe> <Phone> .
23:08:49 [sbp]
or, rather...
23:09:00 [sbp]
<believesThat> { <AaronSw> <isOnThe> <Phone> } .
23:09:21 [tomc]
heh :o)
23:09:38 [_rm]
heh
23:10:58 [_rm]
_rm is now known as rm
23:11:04 [rm]
yay i'm rm again
23:11:26 [sbp]
mv _rm rm
23:11:33 [rm]
i'm a full visible member again
23:11:39 [rm]
(i can be imported!)
23:11:42 [sbp]
heh, heh
23:11:47 [rm]
from redmonk import rm
23:11:56 [sbp]
dir(rm)
23:12:28 [rm]
__drink__, __eat__, code, chat
23:12:36 [rm]
__sleep__
23:12:37 [sbp]
heh, heh
23:12:45 [rm]
blog
23:12:58 [sbp]
so, I guess you're currently in...
23:13:01 [sbp]
while 1:
23:13:06 [sbp]
rm.chat()
23:13:06 [rm]
http://www.redmonk.net/index/2002/03/18#item1081
23:13:17 [sbp]
if rm.tired(): break
23:13:17 [rm]
while 1:
23:13:42 [rm]
rm.chat() && rm.code() && rm.blog()
23:15:49 [sbp]
* sbp listens to "Dear Mr. Fantasy"
23:16:27 [Morbus]
Morbus (~Morbus@s87.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack
23:16:33 [rm]
* rm listens to heather noble (sp?) doing "We Can Work It Out"
23:17:12 [sbp]
Heather Nova
23:17:17 [rm]
ah
23:17:18 [rm]
cool
23:18:44 [Morbus]
must ... get... something... done!
23:18:51 [sbp]
I actually haven't heard her version... what's it like?
23:18:55 [sbp]
I've heard that it sucks
23:19:06 [rm]
well...
23:19:07 [rm]
yeah
23:19:11 [sbp]
:-)
23:19:24 [sbp]
* sbp won't bother getting it, then
23:19:32 [rm]
my co-worker has about 7 gb of mp3's that just play in shuffle mode all day long
23:19:37 [sbp]
Morbus.printTodoList()
23:19:53 [Morbus]
heh, i'd get kicked for flodding.
23:19:57 [sbp]
heh
23:19:57 [Morbus]
flooding too even.
23:20:02 [rm]
nah, sbp:
23:20:06 [sbp]
.google flodding
23:20:07 [xena]
flodding: http://www.iiasa.ac.at/Research/LUC/ChinaFood/data/water/wat_5a_m.htm
23:20:10 [rm]
print Morbus.toDoList()
23:20:12 [sbp]
7GB? neat
23:20:16 [rm]
yeah
23:20:23 [rm]
all kinds of stuff
23:20:24 [sbp]
rm: yeah, I was just about to suggest that my method sucked
23:20:29 [rm]
or more likely...
23:20:48 [rm]
print "\n".join(Morbus.toDoList())
23:20:57 [Morbus]
for the first hour, I will do email!
23:21:01 [Morbus]
yes, yes, email it is!
23:21:13 [sbp]
print '\n'.join(Morbus.toDoList()).strip()
23:21:30 [Morbus]
* Morbus gets nekkid.
23:21:31 [rm]
i don't thinkstripping is invloved
23:21:32 [sbp]
Hmm... not necessary, in fact
23:21:34 [rm]
though i could be wrong
23:21:39 [sbp]
nekkid? not on IRC, bub!
23:21:48 [sbp]
no, you're right. just me going a bit nuts
23:22:42 [rm]
* rm is going to shave his head again tonight
23:22:59 [rm]
it's getting long (@ 1.2 cm)
23:24:14 [sbp]
1.2cm? wow, your head must get so hot in summer...
23:25:21 [sbp]
I took the Morbus approach to hair-length
23:25:36 [rm]
mine is too thick for that
23:25:46 [Morbus]
the Morbus approach. heh.
23:25:54 [sbp]
thick: bummer...
23:26:34 [Morbus]
i'm unsubscribed from four more mailing lists today.
23:26:35 [sbp]
for just about every procedure, there happens to be a Morbus approach. It's just part of the way in which the Universe is constructed, AFAICT
23:27:12 [sbp]
Homer: Kids, there are three ways to do things! There's the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power way!
23:27:17 [sbp]
Bart: Isn't that the wrong way?
23:27:22 [sbp]
Homer: Yeah... but faster!
23:28:04 [sbp]
rm: hear about Buck's trial?
23:29:18 [Morbus]
waaaah: http://www.disobey.com/dnn/archives/2002/03/index.shtml#001303
23:29:37 [Morbus]
the fuck.
23:29:40 [Morbus]
goddamit.
23:29:45 [Morbus]
the stupid links are all messed up.
23:29:46 [sbp]
Hmm... http://www.bbc.co.uk/choice/60seconds/entertainment/180302/rem.shtml
23:29:46 [Morbus]
grrr.
23:29:59 [sbp]
[[[
23:30:00 [sbp]
The prosecution claim at the time he said "I am REM and I can make up a story that I was assaulted".
23:30:00 [sbp]
]]]
23:30:52 [sbp]
er... wow, that's really smegged, Morb
23:31:01 [Morbus]
yeah, i'm fixing it now.
23:31:07 [Morbus]
there's not supposed to be an archives dir
23:31:44 [sbp]
"I fancy myself" - Morbus Iff in http://www.disobey.com/dnn/archives/2002/03/index.shtml#001300
23:32:00 [rm]
heehee
23:32:01 [Morbus]
yeah, refresh bucko ;)
23:32:07 [rm]
only mstipe could do that
23:32:22 [sbp]
damn!
23:32:29 [Morbus]
just remove archives/
23:32:29 [sbp]
I should have archived it
23:32:51 [sbp]
only mstipe: heh, indeed
23:32:51 [Morbus]
http://www.disobey.com/dnn/2002/03/index.shtml#001300
23:32:53 [rm]
damn buck looks oooooold
23:34:02 [rm]
rm has left #swhack
23:34:16 [rm]
rm (~steve@63.149.73.20) has joined #swhack
23:34:21 [rm]
that was weird
23:34:31 [rm]
accidently cmd-w'ed the window
23:34:33 [rm]
i hate that
23:34:43 [sbp]
mIRC propmts you
23:34:53 [sbp]
and prompts
23:35:17 [rm]
go, and propmtly!
23:38:01 [rm]
hey cool!
23:38:02 [rm]
http://www.red-dove.com/python_logging.html
23:38:07 [rm]
python logging
23:38:11 [rm]
via daily python url
23:38:17 [rm]
can i chump it?
23:38:21 [rm]
@ http://www.red-dove.com/python_logging.html
23:38:30 [chumpster]
B: A Logging System for Python from rm
23:38:43 [rm]
B| Python Logging tool
23:39:10 [rm]
B:like log4j...
23:39:15 [rm]
B:but not
23:39:33 [rm]
i think i broke it
23:39:37 [rm]
damn!
23:39:45 [rm]
should have RTFMed
23:39:53 [rm]
help!
23:45:41 [sbp]
title: B:|Title; comment: B::comment
23:45:59 [rm]
ah
23:46:05 [tomc]
:o)
23:46:17 [rm]
now everyone can see me flail in the logs
23:46:30 [rm]
oh well. humility is good for the soul
23:46:58 [tomc]
There is honour in flailing.
23:47:54 [rm]
heh
23:48:05 [rm]
B:|Python Logging tool
23:48:07 [chumpster]
titled item B
23:48:17 [rm]
B::like log4j...
23:48:20 [chumpster]
commented item B
23:48:21 [rm]
B::but not
23:48:23 [chumpster]
commented item B
23:48:40 [rm]
much better
23:48:56 [rm]
* rm salvages last scraps of honour
23:50:02 [rm]
would the themesong of the Python Logging System be "I'm a lumberjack" /
23:50:28 [rm]
B::Would the theme song of the Python Logging System be "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm ok"?
23:50:31 [chumpster]
commented item B
23:50:51 [deltab]
yes!
23:52:10 [sbp]
heh
23:52:13 [tomc]
* tomc laughs :o))
23:52:59 [sbp]
sbp has changed the topic to: <rm> Would the theme song of the Python Logging System be "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm ok"?
23:53:14 [hazmat]
;)
23:53:35 [sbp]
* sbp bows to rm for what may be the most whimsical joke of the season
23:54:18 [sbp]
ooh, perfect encryption in Python:-
23:54:19 [sbp]
[[[
23:54:19 [sbp]
from sys import*;t=p=1;s=stdout;[i,j]=map(lambda f: open(f, 'r'), argv[1:3])
23:54:19 [sbp]
while(t and p):t,p=i.read(1),j.read(1);t and p and s.write(chr(ord(t)^ord(p)))
23:54:25 [sbp]
]]] - http://www.amk.ca/python/writing/crypto-curiosa.html
23:54:48 [sbp]
er... if you have some truly random data, that is
23:55:02 [tomc]
is that encrypted??
23:55:13 [rm]
* rm bows graciously
23:55:21 [sbp]
is what encrypted? the Python? no, it's just straight Python
23:55:22 [rm]
see what a little humility can do for you?
23:55:26 [sbp]
heh, heh
23:55:30 [rm]
heh
23:56:33 [sbp]
* sbp makes it a u script
23:56:40 [sbp]
might come in handy one day
23:57:01 [sbp]
cool:-
23:57:02 [sbp]
$ u otp blargh.txt MyFile.txt
23:57:02 [sbp]
;
23:57:02 [sbp]
zT)H
23:57:02 [sbp]
h*
23:57:02 [sbp]
a}Z
23:57:05 [sbp]
[EOF]
23:57:26 [tomc]
it's rather complicated-looking Python, was my point.
23:57:38 [tomc]
that's all :-)
23:58:00 [sbp]
yep. Python isn't always readable, y'know :-)
23:58:08 [deltab]
that's because it's squeezed onto two lines
23:58:08 [sbp]
map and lambda worked wonders
23:59:08 [sbp]
[[[
23:59:08 [sbp]
from sys import *
23:59:08 [sbp]
t = p = 1
23:59:08 [sbp]
[i, j] = map(lambda f: open(f, 'r'), argv[1:3])
23:59:08 [sbp]
while(t and p):
23:59:08 [sbp]
t, p = i.read(1), j.read(1)
23:59:10 [sbp]
t and p and stdout.write(chr(ord(t)^ord(p)))
23:59:12 [sbp]
]]]
23:59:19 [tomc]
hehe
23:59:56 [Morbus]
6 more emails to go!