IRC log of swhack on 2001-12-15

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:13:35 [deus_x]
deus_x (~deusx@nic-34-c160-7.mw.mediaone.net) has joined #swhack
00:14:59 [Morbus]
Morbus (~Morbus@s113.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack
00:15:07 [Morbus]
Morbus has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:16:51 [Morbus]
Morbus (~Morbus@s113.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack
00:17:57 [Morbus]
whoo. bout half an hour away for publicaiton, i think
00:37:20 [sbp]
* sbp emerges, having seen a few Geminids
00:37:21 [tav`]
tav` (tav@host217-34-83-190.in-addr.btopenworld.com) has joined #swhack
00:37:56 [carter.openprojects.net]
carter.openprojects.net has changed the topic to: #swhack: Where The Elite Meet To Sniff Their Feet
00:40:28 [sbp]
sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds)
00:47:32 [sbp]
sbp (~sean@m588-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack
00:48:45 [Morbus]
wb
00:52:07 [sbp]
ty
00:53:17 [GabeW]
welcome back kotter
01:01:57 [Morbus]
i love comics
01:21:50 [sbp]
<sbp> "If you think surfing hypertext is cool, that's because you haven't tried writing it." - http://www.w3.org/DesignIssues/Editor
01:21:51 [sbp]
<sbp> "The Web is universal and so should be able to encompass everything across the range from the very rough scribbled idea on the back of a virtual envelope to a beautifully polished work of art." - http://www.w3.org/DesignIssues/Editor
01:21:51 [sbp]
<sbp> I'd love a decent HyperText editor, but they simply don't come up to my pedantic standards. I should write my own, but I'd only get an outline :-)
01:24:19 [sbp]
I'd like an HTE to be able to save directly over the Web, having a preprogrammed HTTP => FTP redirect. It should just accept that fact that PUT it poorly implemented, and move on
01:25:03 [sbp]
It should not put cruddy DOCTYPE junk at the top of the file if I don't want to, or modify the source when I change it, even in a way which it doesn't like
01:25:36 [sbp]
editors are not browsers. It'd be good if they could recognize other popular browsers, so that I could simply click a link onto one of *their* pages
01:26:43 [sbp]
er... so that if I have http://www.w3.org/ up in IE6, and I want to create a link to it in a document that I'm editing on my HTE, the HTE should put me in some mode where it actually lets me get the address from that page just by moving to the app. or something. Might be impossible, or difficult, to program, but hey, this is my app we're talking about
01:27:16 [sbp]
It should still obviously be able to browse, supporting crap-HTML through Tidy, XHTML, and CSS styled XML. Oh, and XSLT
01:28:04 [sbp]
the page interface doesn't have to be perfect, but it has to be solid. I want to feel like I'm using a stable app. Amaya feels as if it's been put together with ten year old chewing gum - and the refresh rate is terrible
01:29:26 [sbp]
everything should be intuitive. The fact that there is a logical structure to the document needs to be exposed, but it should be natural
01:33:28 [sbp]
* sbp sucks the latest version of Amaya (5.2a) off of the Web
01:35:58 [Morbus]
i'm never used amaya
01:37:28 [sbp]
I don'
01:37:32 [sbp]
I don't blame you
01:37:44 [sbp]
did you mean to put a comma in there?
01:38:00 [sbp]
"I'm never used, amaya"
01:38:13 [Morbus]
oh. heh. i've, rather.
01:38:14 [sbp]
hey, where'd he go?
01:38:21 [sbp]
:-)
01:38:24 [Morbus]
working with movable type
01:49:53 [GabeW]
GabeW has quit ("Client Exiting")
01:51:50 [Morbus]
Morbus has quit ("http://www.disobey.com/")
02:06:23 [sbp]
Heh, Amaya just crashed. I'
02:06:29 [sbp]
I'm so surprised
02:06:55 [sbp]
Aargh, I want a decent HyperText editor!
02:35:34 [tansaku]
tansaku (~sam@n146-031.tokyu-net.catv.ne.jp) has joined #swhack
02:41:33 [tansaku]
tansaku is now known as tansaku_shower
02:48:10 [sbp]
sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds)
02:48:53 [sbp]
sbp (~sean@m644-mp1-cvx3b.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack
03:11:43 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. This is a semi-automated reminder. We are approaching our next release upgrade, to 1.0.31, a bug fix release. Please take some time today and through the weekend to use the test bed extensively. It's on irc.openprojects.net, port 9001. Use the channels, have conversations, do everything you do here only more so. It'll help ensure a smooth upgrade. bugs@openprojects.net for problems. This message will repeat. Thanks!
03:29:17 [deus_x]
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03:29:32 [deus_x]
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03:32:42 [deus_x]
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03:34:58 [em]
em has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net)
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03:38:02 [deus_x]
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03:38:19 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. We're just experienced a denial of service attack. Apologies. If the network goes down, and it may, please try the test bed on port 9001, which is not vulnerable to that attack. Apologies for the iconvenience.
03:42:42 [deus_x]
deus_x has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net)
03:42:42 [sbp]
sbp has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net)
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03:42:42 [AaronSw]
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03:42:42 [scipient]
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03:43:10 [irc.openprojects.net]
Disconnected from irc.openprojects.net (Connection reset by peer)
03:48:35 [logster]
logster (~swhack-lo@xcdfddb76.ip.ggn.net) has joined #swhack
03:48:35 [carter.openprojects.net]
Users on #swhack: logster
03:52:20 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. Again, please be aware that the test net is on port 9001 and should be immune to this attack. You may want to switch, as we cannot guarantee the attack will not recur. Thanks.
03:54:15 [sbp]
sbp (~sean@m644-mp1-cvx3b.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack
03:54:41 [sbp]
great, we're back
03:54:41 [xena]
xena (xena@mewtwo.espnow.com) has joined #swhack
03:54:43 [sbp]
although it's just me and logster :-)
03:54:49 [sbp]
[[[
03:54:51 [sbp]
<sbp> 03:38:19 <lilo> [Global Notice] Hi all. We're just experienced a denial of service attack. Apologies. If the network goes down, and it may, please try the test bed on port 9001, which is not vulnerable to that attack. Apologies for the iconvenience.
03:54:55 [sbp]
<sbp> I'm on that server (I already was) but no one else is there
03:54:57 [sbp]
<sbp> <Diablo-D3> anyhow, it isnt a mass packet flood from what ive been told.
03:54:59 [sbp]
<sbp> from #OpenProjects on 9001
03:55:01 [sbp]
<sbp> <LoneTech> why not start the port 9001 version on 6667 while this goes on?
03:55:03 [sbp]
<sbp> <Diablo-D3> and its a pretty bad exploit too.
03:55:05 [sbp]
<sbp> <brad[]> heheh
03:55:07 [sbp]
<sbp> <LittleNop> Any ideas on what this bug actually is?
03:55:09 [sbp]
<sbp> <Diablo-D3> LoneTech: thats what lilo is doing.
03:55:11 [sbp]
<sbp> so it should be running again soon
03:55:13 [sbp]
<sbp> <Diablo-D3> LoneTech: it takes awhile, up to a half hour.
03:55:15 [sbp]
<nick_kew> ah, that'll be the trouble witth openprojects?
03:55:17 [sbp]
<sbp> yep...
03:55:19 [sbp]
]]]
03:55:54 [sbp]
that was from W3C #er
03:58:59 [sbp]
Just the logster, xena, and I. Just fine :-)
03:59:59 [sbp]
heh, on 9001: -lilo- [Global Notice] Hi all....if you're here, exercise the servers....we'll probably cut over just a bit faster than originally intended. :)
04:06:46 [tav`]
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04:11:00 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. As you are aware, OPN was attacked via an exploit resolved in the current test bed code. We'll be putting that code up in production. Please bear with us.
04:20:19 [sbp]
on #OpenProjects:-
04:20:36 [sbp]
(some guy is wondering how to get sound working on his Win95 box)
04:20:48 [sbp]
(he says the internal speaker should be putting out the sound)
04:20:56 [sbp]
<*> Yes. The internal speaker goes FEEP
04:21:03 [sbp]
<*> and that's it.
04:21:20 [sbp]
heh, heh, that made me laugh
04:22:03 [sbp]
[that was some guy instructing him on the intracacies of internal speakers]
04:28:39 [chumpster]
chumpster (~chumpster@205.253.219.118) has joined #swhack
04:28:39 [AaronSw]
AaronSw (aaronsw@209.164.24.133) has joined #swhack
04:32:44 [sbp]
ah, Aaron and chumpster arrive together... Hmm...
04:44:26 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. Things should be fairly stable. More news in about 10 minutes. Thanks.
04:46:34 [lilo]
[Global Notice] You'll probably be getting '*** IDLE Unknown command' from time to time. Please disregard and let us know the frequency with which it happens. Thanks.
04:46:48 [sbp]
sbp has quit (Killed (NickServ (Ghost: SeanP!~sean@80.1.187.105)))
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04:51:40 [sbp]
[[[
04:51:40 [sbp]
-
04:51:40 [sbp]
IDLE Unknown command
04:51:40 [sbp]
-
04:51:40 [sbp]
]]]
04:57:54 [sbp]
just once so far...
05:05:19 [MysticOne]
[Server
05:06:10 [MysticOne]
[Server Notice] Hi all! We're having some problems with the production code and will be upgrading in just a moment. If you're receiving this message you're on a server that is going to go down for the upgrade, so please /server irc.openprojects.net as soon as possible to quickly hop on another server that's not vulnerable to the crash. We apologize for this inconvenience, but we do thank you for your patronage!
05:14:14 [lilo]
[ServerNotice] Hi all. Please be aware that the server you are on is running the old code and we can't guarantee it will not get attacked again. Please consider disconnecting and reconnecting to irc.openprojects.net as soon as possible. Thanks.
05:15:38 [sbp]
ah, I have quite a few more now. 5 in total! Ooh!
05:18:35 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. There will be a pretty large split in a moment. No users will be dumped other than those who are flooded out by the split and rejoin. Apologies for the inconvenience.
05:20:30 [AaronSw]
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05:22:36 [sbp]
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05:23:08 [sbp]
7 IDLE things
05:26:15 [chumpster]
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05:26:15 [AaronSw]
AaronSw (aaronsw@209.164.24.133) has joined #swhack
05:28:43 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Okay folks, here's where we are left. The IDLE error messages you're getting will probably persist for about 12 hours. It is possible they can be resolved with some splits and joins but without server restarts; but we need to do some diagnosis to be sure.
05:30:04 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Our basic problem occurred within the last couple of hours; apparently a kiddie discovered a critical exploit, fixed in the test bed release, which we were not quite ready to upgrade to. We went ahead and did the upgrade. We'll try to get the problems cleaned up within the next 48 hours. Apologies for the inconvenience.
05:35:13 [lilo]
[ServerNotice] Hi all. Be aware you are on the one major un-upgraded server. It could be taken out at any time. Please /disconnect and go to /server irc.openprojects.net again, to help us avoid a heavy, painful split later on. Thanks.
05:40:14 [sbp]
sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
05:41:25 [MysticOne]
[ServerNotice] Hey again, everyone. If you are receiving this message, you are on a server that has not yet been upgraded and is very vulnerable to a crash. Please disconnect and /server to irc.openprojects.net to get on an already upgraded server. This will help us avoid a painful, heavy split when the server goes down. Apologize for the inconvenience.
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05:55:38 [MysticOne]
[ServerNotice] Hey again, everyone. If you are receiving this message, you are on a server that has not yet been upgraded and is very vulnerable to a crash. Please disconnect and /server to irc.openprojects.net to get on an already upgraded server. This will help us avoid a painful, heavy split when the server goes down. Apologize for the inconvenience.
06:30:19 [GabeW]
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11:03:52 [tansaku_shower]
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tansaku_shower is now known as tansaku
12:27:35 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. Recapping the state of things: some hours ago, a kiddie discovered a critical exploit on our production servers and started killing them out. The exploit was fixed in the test bed release, which we've converted to. We hope to have the remaining nits ironed out this weekend. You'll notice "*** IDLE Unknown command" which is one of the nits and can be ignored for now.
12:27:54 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Apologies for the inconvenience.
13:17:10 [tav]
tav has left #swhack
13:18:05 [tav`]
tav` is now known as tav
13:27:49 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. Recapping the state of things: some hours ago, a kiddie discovered a critical exploit on our production servers and started killing them out. The exploit was fixed in the test bed release, which we've converted to. We hope to have the remaining nits ironed out this weekend. You'll notice "*** IDLE Unknown command" which is one of the nits and can be ignored for now. Apologies for the inconvenience.
15:10:59 [kmacleod]
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15:11:17 [kmacleod]
morning
15:18:02 [kmacleod]
kmacleod has quit ("Leaving")
15:52:21 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. Recapping the state of things: some hours ago, a kiddie discovered a critical exploit and within a short time had killed the production servers. We've upgraded to the version on test bed rather hurriedly to resolve the problem. The two main outstanding problems are (1) a hubbing problem which results in your getting "*** IDLE Unknown command" fairly frequently and (2) broken DNS. We have fixed problem number (2) on the test bed.
15:52:57 [lilo]
[Global Notice] We're working on problem (1) and it would be helpful if you could go use the current testbed, which is on: irc.openprojects.net, port 9002 . Please come help us finish cleaning things up. Thanks again!
16:14:55 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. We've reached the point where we'll need to do a little cautious testing, and we'll be shutting down services.
16:18:27 [sbp]
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16:19:36 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi again all. First stage testing completed. We are now going to need to split a server with about 800 users. I'll notify the users of that server. Please bear with us, we'll try to make this as painless as we can.
16:21:33 [sbp]
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16:25:07 [deltab]
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16:26:40 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Okay, folks. Looks like we got some good information. We'll keep you posted.
16:46:51 [sbp]
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sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
18:50:48 [lilo]
[Global Notice] We're currently recovering from a denial attack. For details, set your nick to mode +w. Thanks.
20:10:02 [sbp]
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20:36:15 [sbp]
Ooh, The Song Remains The Same is gonna be on T.V., tonight!
21:02:47 [sbp]
Hmm...
21:03:09 [sbp]
how about splitting up the EARL terms into vocabulary and model?
21:05:48 [sbp]
Hmm... the W3C namespace policy is now at http://www.w3.org/1999/10/nsuri That moved quite quickly :-)
21:06:00 [sbp]
Conditions:-
21:06:09 [sbp]
[[[
21:06:09 [sbp]
[This namespace name may be reused in any update of the specification which is made for the purpose of clarification or bug fixes. These changes will be minor in that they do not (a) change the meaning or validity of existing documents written using the namespace, or (b) affect the operation of existing software written to process such documents.]
21:06:09 [sbp]
[Warning: Until the specification reaches W3C Candidate Recommendation (CR) status, this namespace name may be reused by any update in such a way as to cause documents written using the namespace to become invalid or to change in meaning.]
21:06:09 [sbp]
[Warning: Until the specification reaches W3C CR status, this namespace name may be reused by any update in such a way as to affect the operation of existing software written to process documents written according to this specification.]
21:06:13 [sbp]
]]]
21:06:47 [sbp]
the funny thing is, EARL will never go to CR, since EARL will never be on the Rec. track. Does that give us lisence to do what we want with it? Of course not... but that's a bit of a loophole
21:07:22 [sbp]
I'm inclined to believe that the majority of EARL terms are fixed, and that we can publish them
21:15:39 [sbp]
heh, here we go:-
21:15:41 [sbp]
[[[
21:15:48 [sbp]
:EARL :contains earl:Assertion,
21:15:48 [sbp]
earl:Assertor,
21:15:48 [sbp]
earl:Auto,
21:15:48 [sbp]
earl:CannotTell,
21:15:48 [sbp]
earl:ContactInfo,
21:15:48 [sbp]
earl:EARL,
21:15:50 [sbp]
earl:Email,
21:15:53 [sbp]
earl:Evaluation,
21:15:54 [sbp]
earl:Exclusion,
21:15:56 [sbp]
earl:ExpectedResult,
21:15:58 [sbp]
earl:Fail,
21:15:58 [sbp]
sbp has quit (Excess Flood)
21:16:10 [sbp]
sbp (~sean@80.1.186.170) has joined #swhack
21:17:04 [sbp]
earl:Heuristic,
21:17:04 [sbp]
earl:Id,
21:17:04 [sbp]
earl:Machine,
21:17:04 [sbp]
earl:MachineAssertor,
21:17:04 [sbp]
earl:Manual,
21:17:04 [sbp]
earl:NotApplicable,
21:17:16 [sbp]
earl:NotTested,
21:17:16 [sbp]
earl:Operator,
21:17:16 [sbp]
earl:Pass,
21:17:16 [sbp]
earl:Person,
21:17:16 [sbp]
earl:PersonAssertor,
21:17:18 [sbp]
earl:Platform,
21:17:20 [sbp]
earl:RepairInfo,
21:17:30 [sbp]
earl:ResultProperty,
21:17:30 [sbp]
earl:Suite,
21:17:30 [sbp]
earl:TestCase,
21:17:30 [sbp]
earl:TestCriteria,
21:17:30 [sbp]
earl:TestMode,
21:17:33 [sbp]
earl:TestPlatform,
21:17:34 [sbp]
earl:TestSubject,
21:17:44 [sbp]
earl:Tool,
21:17:45 [sbp]
earl:UserAgent,
21:17:45 [sbp]
earl:ValidityProperty,
21:17:45 [sbp]
earl:ValidityState,
21:17:45 [sbp]
earl:WebContent,
21:17:46 [sbp]
earl:asserts,
21:17:48 [sbp]
earl:cannotTell,
21:17:50 [sbp]
earl:ccppSetting,
21:17:53 [sbp]
earl:confidence,
21:17:58 [sbp]
earl:contactInfo,
21:17:59 [sbp]
earl:date,
21:18:00 [sbp]
earl:email,
21:18:03 [sbp]
earl:excludes,
21:18:05 [sbp]
earl:expectedResult,
21:18:06 [sbp]
earl:fails,
21:18:08 [sbp]
earl:format,
21:18:11 [sbp]
earl:id,
21:18:12 [sbp]
earl:level,
21:18:15 [sbp]
earl:name,
21:18:16 [sbp]
earl:notApplicableTo,
21:18:18 [sbp]
earl:notTestedAgainst,
21:18:20 [sbp]
earl:note,
21:18:22 [sbp]
earl:operator,
21:18:26 [sbp]
earl:operatorInstructions,
21:18:28 [sbp]
earl:os,
21:18:30 [sbp]
earl:passes,
21:18:32 [sbp]
earl:platform,
21:18:34 [sbp]
earl:purpose,
21:18:36 [sbp]
earl:repairInfo,
21:18:40 [sbp]
earl:reprOf,
21:18:42 [sbp]
earl:reproducableStep,
21:18:44 [sbp]
earl:sameSubjectAs,
21:18:46 [sbp]
earl:snapshot,
21:18:48 [sbp]
earl:suite,
21:18:50 [sbp]
earl:testCriteria,
21:18:52 [sbp]
earl:testMode,
21:18:54 [sbp]
earl:uniqueMarker,
21:18:56 [sbp]
earl:validity,
21:18:58 [sbp]
earl:version .
21:19:01 [sbp]
]]]
21:19:18 [sbp]
Gprgrpgrgmpgh @ flood
21:31:31 [sbp]
* sbp makes a strings thing to get the documentation for EARL directly from the schema
21:32:04 [sbp]
neat, it works
21:34:53 [Morbus]
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21:40:29 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. As part of our recovery from yesterday's DoS, we'll be moving some servers to test modified hub code. More about that in a moment, on WALLOPS; for information, change your client mode to +w. Thanks.
21:48:24 [lilo]
[Global Notice] There will be a split or two as detailed on wallops, in just a moment. They'll be fairly large splits.
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* sbp works hard on EARL 1.0
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earl:note is going to be the super property of rdfs:comment and rdfs:seeAlso
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22:28:45 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. Global notices with status will follow. Due to our skript kiddie incursion early this morning, we will need to perform a final upgrade on the servers to clean up the remaining problems. Details follow.
22:30:04 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Early this morning OPN time (UTC), a kiddie discovered an exploit allowing him to crash nearly all of our production servers. This exploit had already been plugged in our testbed release, which was not quite ready to go. But the decision was made to go to that release to resolve the critical problem. We've spent the day resolving outstanding problems, and we believe the resulting 1.0.31 release should a good one.
22:31:20 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Obviously, we've finished up this upgrade in a bit of a hurry. Since we're concerned about stability issues, we need to do the upgrade fairly quickly, so that our lead coder will be present to handle any problems.
22:32:33 [lilo]
[Global Notice] We're finishing our config changes and source push, and in about 15-25 minutes we'll start upgrading. The upgrade will be done in 5 groups. Some of those groups will have high-load servers, so the disconnects and reconnects for the users and the split/join traffic will be pretty heavy.
22:33:24 [lilo]
[Global Notice] We apologize for the rushed nature of the upgrade, but it's essential we be able to deal with any problems that may occur. We'll keep you posted and will let you know before the first upgrade occurs. Thanks.
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23:13:41 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Okay folks. First upgrades will be in just a bit. We're starting with AU servers, group one, and users on those servers will be notified.
23:23:15 [AaronSw]
* AaronSw gets some Ginsu knife spam
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* AaronSw gets the IDLE message quite a bit.
23:25:05 [carter.openprojects.net]
carter.openprojects.net has changed the topic to: IDLE: Unknown Activity
23:31:11 [AaronSw]
And now for something completely the same.
23:31:14 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Okay folks, time for three servers and a hub, EU1....
23:37:17 [lilo]
[Global Notice] In a moment, EU2 will be upgraded, remaining servers and another hub. We'll notify the individual users who will be dumped, they should just reconnect. Thanks.
23:43:28 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Okay all. This is where it gets messy. One of our hub sponsors is doing maintenance on the network at the same time we are doing this. So there will be a bit of instability, and US1 and US2 upgrades will be one long noisy event. Please bear with us and reconnect manually if you get knocked off. Thanks.
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23:48:13 [zahn.openprojects.net]
topic is: IDLE: Unknown Activity
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Users on #swhack: logster deltab
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Users on #swhack: logster AaronSw
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23:48:43 [AaronSw]
hi mom
23:48:53 [AaronSw]
AaronSw has changed the topic to: And now for something completely the same.
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