IRC log of swhack on 2001-12-09
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 00:14:13 [oierw]
- AaronSw: i mailed you a package today containing a book
- 00:15:54 [sbp]
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- 00:27:30 [sbp]
- ooh!
- 00:28:11 [sbp]
- cwm --rdf http://www.cs.umd.edu/projects/plus/DAML/onts/personal1.0.daml --n3 surf.n3 --think > pub.n3
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- 02:18:21 [sbp]
- big minutes: http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/2001/12/05-minutes
- 02:29:40 [sbp]
- heh, Nick: "Ah, yes, we were making a hash of it"
- 02:33:01 [AaronSw]
- hi all
- 02:35:54 [sbp]
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- 02:36:42 [AaronSw]
- wb
- 02:36:46 [sbp]
- ty
- 02:36:57 [AaronSw]
- at
- 02:37:26 [sbp]
- tanu
- 02:37:45 [AaronSw]
- ??
- 02:37:51 [sbp]
- that's a new one
- 02:37:58 [sbp]
- s/u/o/
- 02:38:06 [AaronSw]
- ah
- 02:38:09 [sbp]
- (Standard Upper Ontology)
- 02:38:17 [AaronSw]
- heh
- 02:38:19 [AaronSw]
- at -> any time
- 02:38:35 [sbp]
- yeah, I guessed that after about 10 seconds
- 02:39:11 [sbp]
- So... You like chat?
- 02:39:53 [AaronSw]
- Hmm?
- 02:40:22 [sbp]
- You like chat? Me talkee no good English - bad bad
- 02:40:32 [AaronSw]
- Ah, see good.
- 02:40:50 [AaronSw]
- Ruby read you much too!
- 02:41:19 [sbp]
- I did sure (and only a few of the lines at that)
- 02:41:49 [AaronSw]
- @ http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0312862075/coolbooks02
- 02:41:54 [chumpster]
- A: Amazon.com: Explore similar items from AaronSw
- 02:42:02 [AaronSw]
- A:|Amazon.com: True Names
- 02:42:02 [chumpster]
- titled item A
- 02:42:17 [AaronSw]
- A::After about 3 years of waiting, Amazon finally is shipping this book!
- 02:42:17 [chumpster]
- commented item A
- 02:42:39 [AaronSw]
- A::Unfortunately, it's too late. I already got a copy off of Mojo Nation. ;-)
- 02:42:40 [chumpster]
- commented item A
- 02:44:24 [sbp]
- heh, heh, heh
- 02:46:15 [AaronSw]
- I'm actually serious on that point.
- 02:46:28 [AaronSw]
- I cleaned it up somewhat and put it on my site.
- 02:46:36 [sbp]
- Uh huh
- 02:55:04 [sbp]
- * sbp cleans up the EARL 1.0 test specification
- 02:55:21 [sbp]
- I'm wondering how to capture threading in EARL; if it's even necessary, etc.
- 02:55:48 [sbp]
- also, we need to be able to point to very discrete things... precision is critical
- 02:56:12 [AaronSw]
- threading?
- 02:56:30 [AaronSw]
- How'd Danbri get into Ruby?
- 02:56:39 [sbp]
- yes: how to say that you're evaluating the "same thing"
- 02:56:44 [AaronSw]
- Boy, Ruby sure looks like Python... but without the colons
- 02:56:45 [sbp]
- DanBri: no idea whatsoever
- 02:56:48 [AaronSw]
- sbp, equivalentTo?
- 02:57:11 [sbp]
- no, it's not equivalentTo, because the content has changed... that's the point
- 02:57:21 [sbp]
- for example you might say "this was broken, now it's fixed"
- 02:57:39 [sbp]
- those are two different resources (one is a :Broken, the other is a :Fixed)
- 02:57:47 [sbp]
- but the author may regard them as not being so
- 02:57:54 [sbp]
- The basic model is: :Assertor earl:asserts { :SomeResource earl:passes :SomeTest } .
- 02:58:21 [sbp]
- let's say that the Assertor is the author of :SomeResource, and it doesn't comply to WCAG 1.0
- 02:58:26 [sbp]
- it'd be...
- 02:58:42 [sbp]
- :Assertor earl:asserts { :SomeResource earl:fails :WCAG10 } .
- 02:58:49 [sbp]
- then he fixes the page
- 02:58:59 [sbp]
- :Assertor earl:asserts { :SomeNewResource earl:passes :WCAG10 } .
- 02:59:09 [AaronSw]
- Aha.
- 02:59:25 [AaronSw]
- :SomeNewResource :previousVersion :SomeResource .
- 02:59:25 [sbp]
- now, he wants to say, the "general thing" identified in :SomeResource is the same as in :SomeNewResource
- 02:59:37 [sbp]
- well, that was one of quite a few suggestions, yes
- 03:00:01 [sbp]
- I also suggested a DAML List: (:SomeResource :SomeNewResource) a earl:Thread .
- 03:00:11 [sbp]
- but now I think that's unecessary
- 03:01:00 [GabeW]
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- 03:01:05 [sbp]
- because an EARL TestSubject (the subject in the formula) is actually comprised (as per your suggestion!) of a resource, and a date or some other disambiguating property
- 03:01:16 [AaronSw]
- :-)
- 03:01:23 [AaronSw]
- I don't like the list idea.
- 03:01:28 [sbp]
- so it's quite easy to do the logic on the following:-
- 03:01:57 [sbp]
- :SomeResource :resource <http://example.org/">http://example.org/>; :date "2001-10" . :SomeNewResource :resource <http://example.org/>; :date "2001-11" .
- 03:02:24 [sbp]
- list idea: well, you're probably right
- 03:02:41 [AaronSw]
- Yeah, doing inferences on the dates would be even better:
- 03:02:45 [sbp]
- it's difficult to construct a list automatically
- 03:03:57 [AaronSw]
- { ?x :resource ?uri ; :date ?date . ?y :resource ?uri ; :date ?date2 . ?date :laterThan ?date2 .} => { ?x :previousVersion ?y } .
- 03:04:09 [AaronSw]
- and make laterThan a cwm builtin
- 03:07:01 [sbp]
- well, you want to *filter* out all of the previous versions. { ?x :resource ?u; :date :d2 . ?y :resource ?u; :date ?d2 . ?d1 :laterThan ?d2 } log:implies { ?y :resource ?u; :date ?d2 } .
- 03:07:49 [sbp]
- that'd only work for two things, though... not sure how you'd get the "latest" property
- 03:07:49 [sbp]
- s/property/value/
- 03:08:16 [sbp]
- er the first d2:-
- 03:08:16 [sbp]
- s/d2/d1/
- 03:08:28 [sbp]
- oh, let me do that again
- 03:08:41 [sbp]
- { ?x :resource ?u; :date :d1 . ?y :resource ?u; :date ?d2 . ?d1 :laterThan ?d2 } log:implies { ?y :resource ?u; :date ?d1 } .
- 03:09:32 [sbp]
- note that we use "testSubject" at the moment instead of resource. I'm thinking of calling it resource... but actually, that's wrong
- 03:10:04 [sbp]
- the resource at time a should be the same as at time a'
- 03:10:04 [sbp]
- it really means the representation of
- 03:10:04 [sbp]
- :reprOf
- 03:10:32 [sbp]
- ah, that's perfect!
- 03:10:47 [sbp]
- :MyPageInOct earl:reprOf <http://example.org/>; earl:date "2001-10" .
- 03:11:12 [sbp]
- then you can add additional facets such as content negotiation, and so on
- 03:11:13 [sbp]
- :MyPageInOct earl:reprOf <http://example.org/>; earl:date "2001-10"; dc:format "text/html"; :language "en" .
- 03:12:21 [sbp]
- the problem then is that: earl:reprOf rdfs:domain :WebContent .
- 03:12:52 [sbp]
- it's a physical bag of bytes (well, I should go through the UAAG terminology for that)
- 03:13:34 [sbp]
- but in EARL, we want to be able to assess tools as well. Ah, then you just leave the earl:reprOf bit out
- 03:13:59 [sbp]
- we can set a cardinality restriction on the earl:WebContent class so that it must have exactly one "reprOf" arc coming off of it. That makes a lot of sense
- 03:15:24 [sbp]
- O.K., so, changes:-
- 03:15:33 [sbp]
- * Remove testSubject
- 03:15:40 [sbp]
- * Add reprOf
- 03:16:07 [sbp]
- * Set cardinality restriction on WebContent to have 1 and only 1 reprOf
- 03:16:52 [sbp]
- * Add conneg and langneg (?)
- 03:16:52 [sbp]
- * Add isDefinedBy arcs
- 03:20:08 [sbp]
- Now, do we want to give an arc for earl:Tool/earl:UA etc. that gives more information/download etc.?
- 03:20:16 [sbp]
- s/an arc/some arcs/
- 03:21:32 [AaronSw]
- Hmm.
- 03:21:35 [Morbus]
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- 03:22:18 [Morbus]
- anyone around? need a quick question / answer
- 03:22:33 [Morbus]
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- 03:23:08 [AaronSw]
- hmm
- 03:23:16 [AaronSw]
- i'm around but morb's not
- 03:23:25 [sbp]
- heh, heh, heh; me too
- 03:25:13 [GabeW]
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- 03:25:32 [AaronSw]
- ruby is so like python
- 03:26:14 [AaronSw]
- Wow, this is dumb: German government plans to ban Net-porn except from 11 pm - 6am
- 03:27:07 [AaronSw]
- Odd.
- 03:27:34 [sbp]
- lol!
- 03:27:49 [sbp]
- really?
- 03:28:05 [sbp]
- that's one of the silliest things ever decided, if so
- 03:28:20 [AaronSw]
- Yeah, according to the "Financial Times Deutschland"
- 03:28:57 [deltab]
- heh: >all such content is banned from 11 p.m. until 6 a.m.
- 03:29:14 [sbp]
- source?
- 03:29:25 [AaronSw]
- http://www.ftd.de/pw/de/FTDPRAR3MUC.html
- 03:29:32 [AaronSw]
- and http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/politik/0,1518,170361,00.html
- 03:29:33 [sbp]
- thanks
- 03:29:44 [AaronSw]
- it's from a recent RISKS, too lazy to grab the url now
- 03:32:07 [sbp]
- heh: "Wir können nicht alle Inhalte im Netz überprüfen", sagte Arthur Waldenberger, Vorstand der Freiwilligen Selbstkontrolle Multimedia (FSM). Das sei angesichts Milliarden von Seiten "Schwachsinn".
- 03:32:28 [AaronSw]
- I'm sure that'd be quite funny if I understood it.
- 03:32:51 [sbp]
- "We can monitor the entire network", said some guy. In the view of millions, that's "utter stupidity".
- 03:33:24 [AaronSw]
- Heh heh heh.
- 03:34:27 [sbp]
- DISCLAIMER: sbp does not vouch for the accuracy of his translations. For all you know, it could be discussing tax rises for farm animals
- 03:34:41 [AaronSw]
- Heh heh heh.
- 03:35:24 [sbp]
- oh, heh, I did mistranslate it. *nicht* alle: not all
- 03:36:03 [sbp]
- still makes sense 'though
- 03:39:05 [sbp]
- * sbp should stick to Welsh
- 03:42:01 [sbp]
- Well, really, I should hack on EARL more :-)
- 03:46:27 [AaronSw]
- :-)
- 03:47:29 [AaronSw]
- bbl, gingerbread
- 03:47:45 [sbp]
- c'ya
- 03:48:15 [sbp]
- Hmm... UAAG makes the distinction between document, and the document object; the difference being that the document object is the thing that User Agent represents
- 03:49:22 [sbp]
- I think that all EARL claims are going to be made about the code, surely? if you have an event in the browser document object (changing the rendering or whatever), then there must be a piece of addressable code that you can annotate and say "this is good/sucky, because xyz"
- 03:49:43 [sbp]
- IOW, the "Document Source"
- 04:19:30 [xena]
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- 04:26:43 [AaronSw]
- @ http://www.spaceweather.com/meteors/geminids/observingtips.html
- 04:26:50 [chumpster]
- B: http://www.spaceweather.com/meteors/geminids/observingtips.html from AaronSw
- 04:27:13 [AaronSw]
- B:|Geminid Observing Tips: Dec. 13-14, 2001
- 04:27:14 [chumpster]
- titled item B
- 04:30:17 [sbp]
- B::Great!
- 04:30:18 [chumpster]
- commented item B
- 04:34:17 [AaronSw]
- B::See also the very neat [Heavens-Above|http://www.heavens-above.com/].
- 04:34:19 [chumpster]
- commented item B
- 04:35:28 [sbp]
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- 04:35:42 [sbp]
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- 04:36:21 [sbp]
- B::Yes, heavens-above is an absolutely excellent site, highly recommended. I signed up for it a while ago, and they offer a wonderful service [Dec. 2001]
- 04:36:21 [chumpster]
- commented item B
- 04:37:13 [AaronSw]
- What do you get for signing up?
- 04:38:51 [sbp]
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- 04:41:10 [AaronSw]
- What do you get for signing up?
- 04:42:29 [sbp]
- access to the site!
- 04:43:31 [sbp]
- [[[
- 04:43:32 [sbp]
- <sbp> you have to log in and tell it exactly where you are for it to work, of course
- 04:43:32 [sbp]
- <sbp> otherwise, it can't compute the data for you
- 04:43:32 [sbp]
- <sbp> I'm typing in what appears to be the wrong window
- 04:43:34 [sbp]
- ]]] - #rdfig
- 04:43:40 [AaronSw]
- I see.
- 04:43:43 [AaronSw]
- :-)
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- 07:18:32 [AaronSw]
- nite all
- 08:31:25 [deus_x]
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- * AaronSw disconnects
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- * AaronSw reconnects
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- * AaronSw reconnects
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- * AaronSw reconnects
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- * AaronSw disconnects
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- * AaronSw reconnects
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- * AaronSw wonders why he keeps getting knocked off
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- * AaronSw disconnects
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- * AaronSw reconnects
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- grr!
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- * AaronSw disconnects
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- * AaronSw reconnects
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- 16:35:52 [AaronSw]
- .acronym yafap
- 16:35:59 [AaronSw]
- hi sbp
- 16:36:13 [sbp]
- Hi there Aaron
- 16:36:27 [AaronSw]
- * AaronSw tries to convince danbri to switch to Python
- 16:36:51 [sbp]
- heh, heh
- 16:40:06 [carter.openprojects.net]
- carter.openprojects.net has changed the topic to: swhack: An apparently artful arena, and an amazing Aaron
- 16:41:01 [AaronSw]
- Awww, thanks
- 16:41:18 [sbp]
- :-)
- 16:41:33 [AaronSw]
- @ http://dev.zope.org//Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/Zope3DiscussionSummaries
- 16:41:35 [chumpster]
- C: Zope3DiscussionSummaries of ComponentArchitecture from AaronSw
- 16:41:52 [AaronSw]
- C:|Summary of Zope3 Development
- 16:41:53 [chumpster]
- titled item C
- 16:42:07 [sbp]
- You, sniffing around Zope lists?
- 16:42:34 [AaronSw]
- C::[Zope Q&A|http://lists.zope.org/pipermail/zope-dev/2001-December/014313.html]: "Zope 3X is Zope rebuilt from the ground up, applying the lessons learned from Zope 2 and CMF."
- 16:42:35 [chumpster]
- commented item C
- 16:42:45 [AaronSw]
- I figure as long as they're rewriting, i might as well give them a piece of my mind!
- 16:44:06 [AaronSw]
- C::A big part seems to be the [ComponentArchitecture|http://dev.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/VisionStatement].
- 16:44:07 [chumpster]
- commented item C
- 16:44:36 [sbp]
- heh, heh
- 16:46:16 [AaronSw]
- C::Which seems to be related to [Interfaces|http://dev.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/ZopeInterfaces] which I think are a really stupid idea. Interfaces should be derived from the implementation, not from needlessly duplicated code.
- 16:46:18 [chumpster]
- commented item C
- 16:48:28 [AaronSw]
- C::They've got a [ZopeComponentArchitecture for PythonProgrammers tutorial|http://cvs.zope.org/Docs/ZopeComponentArchitecture/PythonProgrammerTutorial/].
- 16:48:29 [chumpster]
- commented item C
- 16:50:53 [AaronSw]
- C::They also seem to be getting rid of Zope's one decent feature: [decent URIs|http://dev.zope.org//Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/ExplicitNamespaceControlInURLs].
- 16:50:54 [chumpster]
- commented item C
- 17:11:53 [AaronSw]
- Heh, looking at the @@s (as special syntax in Ruby), DanC would say. Wow, nobody seems to have ever finished writing a Ruby program!
- 17:14:34 [AaronSw]
- Hmm, is "take" British for "minus"?
- 17:15:33 [sbp]
- yes, it is indeed
- 17:15:41 [sbp]
- lol @ @@
- 17:17:49 [sbp]
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- 17:21:34 [AaronSw]
- C::Ooh, Zope says that [eventually they will probably adopt capabilities|http://dev.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/SecurityFramework].
- 17:21:36 [chumpster]
- commented item C
- 17:29:00 [AaronSw]
- @ http://test.mnot.net/sparta/
- 17:29:07 [chumpster]
- D: http://test.mnot.net/sparta/ from AaronSw
- 17:29:40 [AaronSw]
- D:|Sparta: a Simple Api for Rdf
- 17:29:41 [chumpster]
- titled item D
- 17:30:14 [AaronSw]
- D::by [Mark|http://www.mnot.net/]
- 17:30:15 [chumpster]
- commented item D
- 17:31:45 [AaronSw]
- D::Very interesting!
- 17:31:46 [chumpster]
- commented item D
- 17:33:23 [AaronSw]
- @ http://www.w3.org/2001/12/rubyrdf/intro
- 17:33:24 [chumpster]
- E: http://www.w3.org/2001/12/rubyrdf/intro from AaronSw
- 17:33:33 [AaronSw]
- E:|Danbri Does Ruby-RDF
- 17:33:34 [chumpster]
- titled item E
- 17:42:07 [AaronSw]
- D::It's exactly these kinds of APIs that are essential for getting the Plex in common use.
- 17:42:08 [chumpster]
- commented item D
- 17:42:18 [AaronSw]
- E::We'll see if I can win him over to the Python side.
- 17:42:19 [chumpster]
- commented item E
- 17:42:57 [sbp]
- Gotta run
- 17:43:00 [sbp]
- sbp has quit ("Homer: 20 dollars? I wanted a peanut!")
- 17:57:04 [AaronSw]
- swhack: some silly stupifying seminar, so some sbp sings
- 18:58:15 [sbp]
- sbp (~sean@m821-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack
- 18:59:24 [AaronSw]
- swhack: some silly stupifying seminar, so some sbp sings
- 18:59:52 [sbp]
- * sbp is actually singing
- 19:00:03 [sbp]
- "Fool In The Rain", Led Zeppelin
- 19:04:43 [sbp]
- sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds)
- 19:07:40 [sbp]
- sbp (~sean@m533-mp1-cvx3b.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack
- 19:09:48 [sbp]
- Hmm... we need earl:format since dc:format isn't necessarily bound to a MIME type
- 19:10:03 [AaronSw]
- mime types are evil!
- 19:13:24 [sbp]
- Yeah. Not as bad as heirarchies though
- 19:13:32 [sbp]
- Still, they're a fact of the Web
- 19:13:42 [AaronSw]
- not reall
- 19:13:45 [AaronSw]
- err really
- 19:15:39 [sbp]
- er... yes. HTTP transactions, for better or worse, depend a lot on MIME types. Entities always have an associated MIME type
- 19:15:42 [sbp]
- If you don't like it, you can create a new system for transferring and recording data on the Web
- 19:15:44 [sbp]
- Oh... you are
- 19:16:31 [AaronSw]
- :-)
- 19:16:40 [AaronSw]
- sbp, depends on who you talk to.
- 19:16:49 [AaronSw]
- I claim that it's a URI field with a base uri of the mime type spec
- 19:17:29 [sbp]
- The MIME type specification doesn't say that (any of the three of them)
- 19:17:30 [AaronSw]
- I think it's a serious mistake to hobble systems like that.
- 19:17:38 [sbp]
- "hobble"?
- 19:17:44 [AaronSw]
- I'm not talking about MIME types
- 19:17:50 [AaronSw]
- I'm talking about HTTP.
- 19:18:21 [oierw``]
- oierw`` has quit ("hmm.")
- 19:18:24 [sbp]
- Hey, I'm not exactly in love with MIME. I'm saying that the majority of the billions of entities exchanged on the Web today have a MIME type attached. Live with it
- 19:18:39 [AaronSw]
- But those MIME types can also be represented as URIs
- 19:18:47 [AaronSw]
- yes, hobble.
- 19:18:58 [AaronSw]
- you're limiting your system to today, when there's clearly going to be change tomorrow
- 19:19:30 [sbp]
- How am I limiting it? What on earth are you talking about? You don't even know the particulars of the property!
- 19:19:45 [sbp]
- There are no cardinality restrictions on it
- 19:19:53 [AaronSw]
- So?
- 19:20:23 [sbp]
- So what's your point?
- 19:20:32 [AaronSw]
- I'm saying that your system should take the set of mime type URIs instead of thwe mime type strings.
- 19:20:48 [sbp]
- Ah, I see now
- 19:21:13 [sbp]
- * sbp cogitates that
- 19:21:53 [sbp]
- No. If people want to do that, they can create a new property
- 19:22:01 [AaronSw]
- EARL is a loser.
- 19:22:05 [AaronSw]
- (in that case)
- 19:22:11 [AaronSw]
- Even CC/PP did better than that.
- 19:22:16 [sbp]
- Erm... you should watch what you're saying
- 19:22:41 [AaronSw]
- Heh. This is going to be sent to the lists isn't it. ;-)
- 19:22:42 [sbp]
- You clearly aren't up on what you're talking about, because it's quite clear that EARL can allow for what you're talking about
- 19:22:57 [AaronSw]
- I don't want to be up on such a loser spec. ;-)
- 19:23:01 [sbp]
- :-)
- 19:23:21 [sbp]
- * sbp is reminded all of a sudden of the "wonder" of xWebL... will say no more
- 19:24:22 [AaronSw]
- * AaronSw has no idea what sbp means by that.
- 19:24:26 [sbp]
- If you want to come up with an aaron:format property, whose range is rdfs:Resource, then who's stopping you? There's nothing in the EARL specification or schema that stops you. The specification welcomes extensions; I'm just writing that part now
- 19:24:55 [AaronSw]
- Hah, the old "you do it then" argument.
- 19:24:58 [AaronSw]
- I'm not falling for that one.
- 19:25:15 [AaronSw]
- It's still a loser spec.
- 19:25:59 [sbp]
- Well, you can do it. And you can call it a daml:UniqueProperty
- 19:25:59 [sbp]
- heh, you have *no* idea what you're talking about here
- 19:25:59 [sbp]
- quite sad, really
- 19:26:16 [AaronSw]
- Oh, *I* have no idea what I'm talking about?
- 19:26:27 [sbp]
- Ooh, let's get all rhetorical
- 19:26:45 [AaronSw]
- Well, look who's talking!
- 19:26:52 [sbp]
- Who's talking?
- 19:26:55 [sbp]
- :-)
- 19:27:11 [AaronSw]
- Mr. Let's-Make-Up-Rehtorical-Questions-So-I-Don't-Have-To-Answer-Valid-Points.
- 19:27:23 [sbp]
- Such as?
- 19:27:34 [AaronSw]
- <sbp> heh, you have *no* idea what you're talking about here
- 19:27:37 [sbp]
- Interesting, considering that that's what you just did
- 19:27:47 [AaronSw]
- See, there you go again!
- 19:27:53 [sbp]
- Erm... I fail to see how that's a question. IT'
- 19:27:55 [sbp]
- It
- 19:27:57 [sbp]
- aaargh
- 19:28:00 [sbp]
- It's an assertion
- 19:28:13 [AaronSw]
- rhetorical questions can be assertions. that's why they're so rhetorical
- 19:28:29 [AaronSw]
- I invented that this morning.
- 19:28:34 [sbp]
- Heh, heh :-)
- 19:29:07 [sbp]
- [Simpsons, Gotta run]
- 19:29:12 [AaronSw]
- c'ya
- 19:30:41 [sbp]
- sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 182 seconds)
- 19:41:13 [carter.openprojects.net]
- carter.openprojects.net has changed the topic to: These days, money is too expensive to bother having.
- 19:58:11 [sbp]
- sbp (~sean@m137-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack
- 20:04:46 [sbp]
- sbp has quit ("Homer: 20 dollars? I wanted a peanut!")
- 20:13:20 [sbp]
- sbp (~sean@m285-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack
- 20:17:18 [sbp]
- grep -i <sbp>.* while
- 20:17:38 [sbp]
- logster, grep -i <sbp>.* while
- 20:18:36 [logster]
- I'm logging. I found 36 answers for '<sbp>.* while' (showing 0...4)
- 20:18:37 [logster]
- 0) 2001-12-09 20:17:38 <sbp> logster, grep -i <sbp>.* while
- 20:18:38 [logster]
- 1) 2001-12-09 20:17:18 <sbp> grep -i <sbp>.* while
- 20:18:39 [logster]
- 2) 2001-12-09 04:36:21 <sbp> B::Yes, heavens-above is an absolutely excellent site, highly recommended. I signed up for it a while ago, and they offer a wonderful service [Dec. 2001]
- 20:18:40 [logster]
- 3) 2001-12-07 04:50:33 <sbp> <MarkB> yah, that issue (URI vs. URI reference) has been bugging me for a while
- 20:18:41 [logster]
- 4) 2001-12-06 02:36:25 <sbp> it takes me a while...
- 20:18:42 [sbp]
- logster, grep -i <sbp>.* whilst
- 20:18:50 [logster]
- I'm logging. I found 15 answers for '<sbp>.* whilst' (showing 0...4)
- 20:18:51 [logster]
- 0) 2001-12-09 20:18:42 <sbp> logster, grep -i <sbp>.* whilst
- 20:18:52 [logster]
- 1) 2001-11-28 01:37:45 <sbp> Aaron: A bit of advice; ask to meet the Queen whilst you're in London
- 20:18:53 [logster]
- 2) 2001-11-23 18:54:24 <sbp> ...or you could go create an anthology of cams, whilst I listen to In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida
- 20:18:54 [logster]
- 3) 2001-10-31 20:14:37 <sbp> It's freezing here. I left my window open just a crack whilst watching The Simpsons, came back in, and it was like walking into a fridge
- 20:18:55 [logster]
- 4) 2001-10-29 22:56:46 <AaronSw> <sbp> once again, it worked whilst loading, tricking me into thinking that it had worked
- 20:18:57 [AaronSw]
- hmm
- 20:23:24 [sbp]
- Hmm...
- 20:23:36 [sbp]
- logster, grep -i <sbp>.* a while
- 20:23:54 [logster]
- I'm logging. I found 26 answers for '<sbp>.* a while' (showing 0...4)
- 20:23:55 [logster]
- 0) 2001-12-09 20:23:36 <sbp> logster, grep -i <sbp>.* a while
- 20:23:56 [logster]
- 1) 2001-12-09 04:36:21 <sbp> B::Yes, heavens-above is an absolutely excellent site, highly recommended. I signed up for it a while ago, and they offer a wonderful service [Dec. 2001]
- 20:23:57 [logster]
- 2) 2001-12-07 04:50:33 <sbp> <MarkB> yah, that issue (URI vs. URI reference) has been bugging me for a while
- 20:23:58 [logster]
- 3) 2001-12-06 02:36:25 <sbp> it takes me a while...
- 20:23:59 [logster]
- 4) 2001-12-02 20:11:22 <sbp> >>> RSAkey=RSA.generate(384, randfunc) # This will take a while...
- 20:24:11 [sbp]
- 15/(36 - 26) = 1.5
- 20:24:41 [AaronSw]
- What is it you're doing?
- 20:24:49 [sbp]
- I'm not too sure :-)
- 20:25:27 [sbp]
- I'm wondering how often I use "while" as opposed to "whilst"
- 20:25:59 [sbp]
- I try to use "whilst" consistently, but it seems from the grep that there's a 3:2 ration in favour of "whilst"
- 20:26:06 [sbp]
- s/ration/ratio/
- 20:26:59 [AaronSw]
- This is why I like sbp. ;-)
- 20:27:06 [AaronSw]
- And logs!
- 20:27:13 [sbp]
- Heh, heh, heh
- 20:28:44 [sbp]
- Yes, I do miss having a logged channel when I'm elsewhere. It's really useful
- 20:28:59 [AaronSw]
- 'Tis indeed.
- 20:29:04 [AaronSw]
- plexena shall fix this.
- 20:29:56 [sbp]
- ooh, nice little melded word there
- 20:34:51 [xena]
- xena has quit ()
- 20:35:16 [xena]
- xena (xena@mewtwo.espnow.com) has joined #swhack
- 20:57:22 [AaronSw]
- Oh, this is great: http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_468563.html?menu=news.quirkies
- 20:57:23 [AaronSw]
- @ http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_468563.html?menu=news.quirkies
- 20:57:30 [chumpster]
- F: http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_468563.html?menu=news.quirkies from AaronSw
- 20:57:38 [AaronSw]
- F:|Harry Potter leads to surge in broomstick sales
- 20:57:39 [chumpster]
- titled item F
- 20:59:33 [AaronSw]
- @ http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-8100898.html?tag=dd.ne.dht.nl-sty.0
- 20:59:37 [chumpster]
- G: States get tough in Microsoft case - Tech News - CNET.com from AaronSw
- 21:00:05 [AaronSw]
- G::"Among the highlights of the states' requests, [...] requiring Microsoft to continue offering Office for the Macintosh beyond the August expiration of an existing deal; and requiring Microsoft to develop a version of Office for Linux."
- 21:00:07 [chumpster]
- commented item G
- 21:02:44 [AaronSw]
- G::The full text is [available in PDF|http://www.naag.org/features/microsoft/ms-remedy_filing.pdf].
- 21:02:46 [chumpster]
- commented item G
- 21:20:11 [oierw]
- * oierw looks at aaron
- 21:20:20 [AaronSw]
- Hi.
- 21:20:43 [oierw]
- i really shouldn't be in two channels on the same window
- 21:20:45 [oierw]
- it messes me up :)
- 21:21:12 [AaronSw]
- Heh heh.
- 21:33:46 [sbp]
- sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds)
- 21:58:39 [sbp]
- sbp (~sean@m423-mp1-cvx3b.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack
- 21:59:04 [sbp]
- Oops, just deleted a funny bit of spam
- 21:59:33 [sbp]
- It appeared to be another one with slightly shoddy grammar: "Increase your sexual interest in men and women without any adverse effects!"
- 21:59:44 [sbp]
- I think they meant "or" :-)
- 21:59:44 [AaronSw]
- Heh heh.
- 22:05:17 [sbp]
- * sbp tapes "I Know What You Did Last Summer"
- 22:09:02 [AaronSw]
- We used to make fun of that movie all the time when it came out.
- 22:09:03 [AaronSw]
- .
- 22:09:03 [xena]
- usage: . <python-code>
- 22:09:04 [xena]
- - xena will attempt to execute the python-code in a restricted environment, sending any printable results to IRC
- 22:09:19 [AaronSw]
- need to fix that bug...
- 22:09:24 [AaronSw]
- x
- 22:09:24 [sbp]
- . print "This works"
- 22:09:38 [sbp]
- . print "This works"
- 22:09:38 [xena]
- This works
- 22:09:42 [sbp]
- aha
- 22:10:14 [AaronSw]
- .rehash
- 22:10:16 [AaronSw]
- .
- 22:10:21 [AaronSw]
- much better :-)
- 22:10:22 [AaronSw]
- .py
- 22:10:23 [xena]
- usage: .py <python-code>
- 22:10:23 [xena]
- - xena will attempt to execute the python-code in a restricted environment, sending any printable results to IRC
- 22:10:30 [sbp]
- * sbp wonders how anyone can make fun of a movie with SMG and JLH in it
- 22:11:05 [AaronSw]
- well it had a stupid name
- 22:11:58 [deltab]
- 221233Z <IgnoWHATyouDIDlastSUMMER:#openprojects> I KNOW!!!!!
- 22:12:04 [deltab]
- 221247Z * >IgnoWHATyouDIDlastSUMMER #openprojects guts people
- 22:33:12 [AaronSw]
- * AaronSw disconnects
- 22:34:58 [AaronSw]
- * AaronSw reconnects
- 22:35:11 [AaronSw]
- Grr!
- 22:45:19 [tav]
- tav has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds)
- 22:46:25 [tav]
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- 23:00:21 [dngxor]
- dngxor has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds)
- 23:00:52 [sbp]
- sbp has quit (Killed (NickServ (Ghost: SeanP!~sean@m691-mp1-cvx3b.pop.ntl.com)))
- 23:01:08 [dngxor_]
- dngxor_ (abuse@dialin-pm3-miami-FL-2-140.netrus.net) has joined #swhack
- 23:01:08 [sbp]
- sbp (~sean@m691-mp1-cvx3b.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack
- 23:10:50 [tav]
- tav has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds)
- 23:11:02 [tav]
- tav (~tav@host217-34-77-77.in-addr.btopenworld.com) has joined #swhack
- 23:16:46 [sbp]
- @ http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~//Amaya/doc/amaya/Attic/Annotations.html?rev=1.15&content-type=text/html#Issues1
- 23:16:52 [chumpster]
- H: Annotations in Amaya from sbp
- 23:17:09 [sbp]
- H::What happens when you move content around?
- 23:17:10 [chumpster]
- commented item H
- 23:17:38 [sbp]
- H::Cool URIs Don't Change => Cool IDs Don't Change => Cool XPointers Don't Change? Too far, surely
- 23:17:39 [chumpster]
- commented item H
- 23:20:07 [AaronSw]
- H::Yep, it does get silly. The best way to protect yourself might be to point to a specific version of a document (by its SHA512 hash, perhaps?) and talk about it. Certainly that will never change.
- 23:20:08 [chumpster]
- commented item H
- 23:22:09 [AaronSw]
- @ http://people.ne.mediaone.net/siracusa/proposal.html
- 23:22:14 [chumpster]
- I: Mac OS X Metadata Proposal from AaronSw
- 23:22:27 [AaronSw]
- I::via [Dave|http://scriptingnews.userland.com/backissues/2001/12/09#l9f32e996357dd4410d3b1f44355711d0]
- 23:22:28 [chumpster]
- commented item I
- 23:23:04 [sbp]
- H::Yep, a canonical hash is a very good idea
- 23:23:04 [chumpster]
- commented item H
- 23:23:36 [sbp]
- Plex is going to solve a lot of problems if it works
- 23:24:46 [AaronSw]
- Yeah, and I sure hope it works.
- 23:24:54 [AaronSw]
- I was thinking this morning -- we could change the world! :-)
- 23:25:09 [AaronSw]
- I mean, hey, if Netscape could do it...
- 23:31:40 [sbp]
- yeah
- 23:32:19 [tav]
- tav has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds)
- 23:32:32 [tav]
- tav (~tav@host217-34-77-77.in-addr.btopenworld.com) has joined #swhack
- 23:32:41 [sbp]
- Hmm... XPointers make sense when you use them on a representation, but not on a resource
- 23:33:44 [sbp]
- [ earl:reprOf <http://example.org/>; :XPointer "xpointer(id("toc")/li[3])" ] .
- 23:34:46 [sbp]
- The only way that you can use XPointer on URIs is when you have a consistent representation being sent back, and no content negociation
- 23:35:28 [sbp]
- the more I think about XPointer, the less I like it
- 23:36:44 [AaronSw]
- sbp! that's my problem with fragments!
- 23:38:15 [AaronSw]
- ding ding ding! 3 points to the man in red.
- 23:38:15 [sbp]
- :-)
- 23:38:15 [sbp]
- ID's not so bad, but it would have to be deployed consistently across MIME type specifications. Hmm...
- 23:38:15 [sbp]
- and it's not
- 23:38:15 [AaronSw]
- Right.
- 23:38:52 [sbp]
- * sbp decides to write a letter to xml-linking on behalf of ERT... will have to send to ERT first though, blargh
- 23:41:36 [AaronSw]
- * AaronSw decides to write up a problemsWithFragments webpage
- 23:44:29 [sbp]
- cool
- 23:45:09 [AaronSw]
- Don't you hate it when the word you want has been abused?
- 23:45:37 [AaronSw]
- Like I want revolution to mean things going 'round and 'round, but it already means a major change.
- 23:46:16 [AaronSw]
- And I want theoretical to refer to differenes in people's theories, but it means not practical.
- 23:46:38 [AaronSw]
- .dtrt 2396
- 23:46:41 [xena]
- 2396: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2396.txt
- 23:47:54 [sbp]
- Hmm... good points
- 23:48:16 [sbp]
- Just add "If you misread this, you suck!" at the end
- 23:48:23 [AaronSw]
- heh heh
- 23:48:23 [AaronSw]
- there was some other word which was really bad, but i can't remember what it is now.
- 23:50:44 [AaronSw]
- The problem, especially with 'revolution' is that people thing you're trying to trick them if you use the other meaning.
- 23:50:48 [sbp]
- bollocks
- 23:51:01 [sbp]
- bollocks (apparently) used to be a certain type of bishop
- 23:51:10 [AaronSw]
- Heh heh.
- 23:51:10 [sbp]
- according to dict.org, it's a verb only: http://www.dict.org/bin/Dict?Form=Dict2&Database=*&Query=bollocks
- 23:51:19 [sbp]
- to bollocks
- 23:51:30 [AaronSw]
- don't bollocks it, sbp!
- 23:51:30 [sbp]
- as in, "oh man, I bollocked it up again!"
- 23:51:41 [sbp]
- exactly
- 23:52:31 [AaronSw]
- Can I have a <blockquote> tag inside a <p>?
- 23:57:57 [deltab]
- no, but you can have a paragraph inside a blockquote
- 23:58:19 [AaronSw]
- hmm, ok, thanks
- 23:58:21 [deltab]
- http://htmlhelp.com/reference/html40/block/blockquote.html