00:02:18 sbp (~sean@m281-mp1-cvx3b.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack 00:08:39 LOL, sbp! deltab downloaded your whole website too. Must've been during our wossname scare. 00:09:48 p'on me? 00:10:52 Remember when you went around deleting your website? 00:11:30 yes, of course 00:12:12 Well, deltab seems to have archived all of it. 00:13:10 neat. How d'you know? 00:13:34 I was just poking around the ESP server. 00:14:24 heh, heh. There's barely any point in me running a server, is there? :-) 00:14:51 In fact, if I took it down, I'd probably end up with 5 new copies of it in other locations on the Web. It could actually be beneficial! 00:15:25 Heh, perhaps, but there's a lot of dynamic stuff on your server... redirects and such. 00:17:06 yeah, that's true. I'm hoping that when it's all represented in SVG, it'll spell out the word "FUCK" 00:17:19 lol 00:36:46 @ http://www.dtek.chalmers.se/~d3august/xt/index.html 00:36:50 A: The Xtraceroute homepage. from AaronSw 00:37:10 chumpster is a bot huh? 00:37:30 A:|Xtraceroute 00:37:34 titled item A 00:37:34 tansaku, yeah, a webloging bot 00:37:53 A::Maps traceroute hops onto a globe. 00:37:54 commented item A 00:38:43 where's the output to 00:38:44 ? 00:39:08 http://blogspace.com/swhack/weblog/ 00:39:13 http://blogspace.com/swhack/weblog/ 00:39:23 copycat 00:40:09 * sbp gets a copy of Finnegan's Wake from the Web 00:40:44 .google bartleby finnegan's wake 00:40:45 bartleby finnegan's wake: http://www.duke.edu/~mshumate/print.html 00:41:40 http://www.trentu.ca/jjoyce/ 00:42:23 BLURB:Finnegan's Wake eText / bookwarez 00:42:25 B: Finnegan's Wake eText / bookwarez from AaronSw 00:42:32 B:[Finnegans Web|http://www.duke.edu/~mshumate/print.html] 00:42:35 oops 00:42:42 heh, heh: "bookwares" 00:42:49 B::[Finnegans Web|http://www.trentu.ca/jjoyce/] 00:42:50 commented item B 00:43:21 pff, get it right :-) 00:43:25 and of course there's Jorn Barger's ite 00:43:31 B::Jorn Barger's [http://robotwisdom.com/jaj/fwake/short01.html|The online shorter Finnegans Wake (FW I.1 thru I.4, ch1-4)] 00:43:32 commented item B 00:43:49 yeah 00:46:26 * deltab wonders what he'll think of being chumped here :-) 00:46:52 heh: http://www.finneganswake.org/cartoonJJrefrigeratorgray.jpg 00:47:57 hehe 00:48:40 * sbp notes the lack of a ' 00:49:20 Why would Jorn mind being chumped here? 00:50:05 cf. http://members.ozemail.com.au/~caveman/Joyce/FW/FAQ/q19.htm 00:51:45 Heh: "If you worry that reading the news online will rob you of the serendipity factor you get with the newspaper, Jorn Barger solves the problem." --Dan Gillmor 00:51:51 via Jorn's .sig 00:55:01 SeanP (~sean@m257-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack 00:55:30 dinner time 00:55:33 sbp has quit (Killed (NickServ (Ghost: SeanP!~sean@m257-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com))) 00:55:37 SeanP is now known as sbp 00:55:53 c'ya 01:09:13 .translate Fra-Eng hegoak 01:09:13 Fra is not a valid language symbol. 01:10:06 Pff. Anyway, it's Basque, and related to a song. That'll do 01:12:40 * AaronSw tries to convince his parents to visit UK over winter vacation. 01:14:50 Visit in the summer. It still rains, but not as hard 01:14:59 Heh. 01:15:37 Well, we're trying to decide what to do for Winter Vacation, and our other choices are warm places like Florida, ick. 01:16:09 Go to Alaska 01:16:21 do not collect Ł200 01:17:13 sbp has changed the topic to: When all's said and done, there's nothing left to say or do. 01:18:46 Is this a rhetorical question, or what? 01:19:17 what? 01:19:22 :-) 01:27:08 .google jorn barger semantic web 01:27:11 jorn barger semantic web: http://www.robotwisdom.com/web 01:27:19 .google jorn barger xml 01:27:24 jorn barger xml: http://www.robotwisdom.com/weblogs 01:27:31 hmmph 01:27:52 What are you looking for? 01:27:55 here it is: http://www.robotwisdom.com/ai/xml.html 01:30:04 different 01:31:06 @ http://www.robotwisdom.com/ai/thicketfaq.html 01:31:18 C: Overview of 'Fractal Thicket' Indexing from AaronSw 01:31:34 C::By Jorn Barger 01:31:35 commented item C 01:32:56 C::"""It's been over forty years since the term "Artificial Intelligence" was coined in 1956. During that time, A.I. has pretty successfully maintained an aura of arcane impenetrability, funneling off billions of dollars in research grants... while delivering almost nothing that can really be called 'intelligent'!""" - [http://www.robotwisdom.com/ai/|Artificial Intelligence, and Robot Wisdom] 01:32:57 commented item C 01:35:02 C::Wow, sixdegrees alert. Jorn worked at NWU's ILS dept. which, in adittion to being rather near to my house, was led by Roger Schank, a school reform advocate and friend of Jim Hendler. 01:35:03 commented item C 01:39:11 so, you still gonna be using namespaces sans "#"? 01:39:20 Of course! 01:39:41 C::"""Schank's PR-image for ILS has been that they are "trying to fix the schools" by building educational software that better fits the natural ways students learn.""" - [Memoirs of an AI hacker|http://www.robotwisdom.com/ai/ilsmemoir.html] 01:39:45 can you state, for the millionth time, why? 01:39:45 commented item C 01:40:15 Because namespaces with "#" aren't Resources, and thus aren't compatible with the rest of the Web. 01:40:32 and why does that matter? 01:42:10 Because I like to be compatible? Because RDF isn't the center of the universe? Because it's a bit hypocritical to claim you're describing Resources and not describe them? Because Roy Fielding is a rather strong-looking guy and he could beat me up? 01:42:41 How many more do you want? 01:42:49 THe last one was fine enough 01:42:59 :-) 01:43:03 Did you see my Plex rant? Oh, of course you did... what did you think? 01:43:35 it was interesting, but you seem to have forgotten that the Plex isn't the kind of system that needs its own URI scheme. 01:43:45 We just leech off other people's. 01:43:54 how so? 01:44:01 The ELS scheme would be good for the Plex to use. 01:44:15 Because items in the Plex just use URIs as identifiers... they just store triples... 01:44:24 I thought that it'd have content on nodes, and end up being a bit like Freenet 01:44:37 Right, it would, but routing would still be done with RDF. 01:44:44 And so the content could have any URI. 01:44:57 You could resolve Freenet, HTTP, etc. URIs all thru the same protocol. 01:45:03 SHA1 hashes... 01:45:21 so then it comes back down to trust again 01:45:55 Right, ELS URIs would be much better from a trust pov 01:46:11 at the moment, it feels like a bin where people can throw absolutely anything. Mess, mess! 01:46:34 Why is that a mess? 01:46:38 Is the Web a mess? 01:46:42 yes! 01:47:03 Nothing wrong with a mess, then. 01:47:09 Mess are your friend. 01:47:17 We can only generate useful things from chaos. 01:47:26 Every other format loses something in some translation. 01:47:43 Well, I was just wondering about protocol concerns. Will there, for example, be things on the Plex that are definitive: e.g. triples for content and hashes 01:48:20 I don't follow... 01:48:28 Nothing is definitively definitive. 01:48:38 a hash thingy is 01:48:54 But a hash contains no data. 01:48:55 "Some really long bit of text" :hash "j3w4t90340t8340t02u0" . 01:49:04 That's not definitive, just verifiable. 01:49:35 if a verifiable thing is verified, then it's definitive 01:50:04 .wn definitive 01:50:06 definitive defined as: 01:50:07 - adj 1: clearly defined or formulated; "the plain and unequivocal language of the laws"- R.B.Taney [syn: {unequivocal}] 01:50:08 - 2: of recognized authority or excellence; "the definitive work on Greece"; "classical methods of navigation" [syn: {authoritative}, {classical}] 01:50:09 - 3: supplying or being a final or conclusive settlement; "a definitive verdict"; "a determinate answer to the problem" [syn: {determinate}] 01:50:31 ah, it's wonderful that 99.9% of the RDF/SW literature available through Google is still utter rubbish 01:51:14 the WN definitions clearly support my case... 01:51:46 Whatever. 01:52:07 I still don't understand the question. 01:52:16 People will insert triples and these triples will have signatures. 01:52:36 * sbp is still grappling with the high-level architecture 01:53:03 This is why ELS URIs are so cool -- they're signed, so if you get back a representation that's also signed, then you know the document is good. 01:53:12 I should tell Zooko that... 01:53:23 ESL, BTW 01:53:32 yes, you're right 01:53:51 say, "easel" 01:54:19 Ah. 01:54:23 Cool. 01:54:35 I was pretty close, tho. 01:54:40 I dunno, though. It's all soooo tricky; who do we have working on it 01:54:56 you were close enough to let me know what it was that you were talking about, so that's a success 01:55:21 s/it/it?/ 01:55:32 s/it/down, over there/ 01:56:14 what's up with Zooko.com? 01:56:38 Working on what? I don't follow. 01:56:57 Plex 01:56:57 Hmm, HavenCo Clubhouse must be down again. 01:57:01 "working on down, over there?"? 01:57:21 The Plex is down over there? 01:57:39 heh orry 01:57:45 s/orry/, sorry/ 01:57:48 Heh. 01:58:15 It's me, oierw and anubis3, mostly. deltab also helps out as usual. 01:58:21 * AaronSw tries to think of who he left out. 01:58:39 poor deltab 01:58:45 So, what's been done so far? 01:59:32 I dunno too much, as I've been messing with this computer, lately (Grrrrr!) so I'm really behind. 01:59:58 When I last left, they were finishing up a design for a network and storage system, and I was doing some small-scale tests with IRC. 02:05:27 sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds) 02:10:51 sbp (~sean@m401-mp1-cvx3b.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack 02:11:51 wb 02:11:52 .. 02:11:54 np 02:12:58 .. == ty 02:13:44 @ http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2001OctDec/0409 02:13:46 D: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2001OctDec/0409 from sbp 02:14:19 D::"""As you know, I think that developing Web browsers in the medium term without RDF parsers is a mistake [...]""" 02:14:20 commented item D 02:14:27 D:|Re: Clear and simple writing 02:14:28 titled item D 02:19:29 ooh, rich-metadata for HTML! 02:20:09 C::"even the Macintosh 'File' menu tells a chronological Open-Close-Quit story (by this principle, it ought to be arranged Open-Save-Print-Close-Quit)." - ibid. 02:20:11 commented item C 02:21:20 it should be possible to come up with an RDF vocabulary for adding decent metadata to XHTML pages, specifically oriented for that task, and then implmenting it using those JavaScript type things that Jim Ley was working on 02:22:01 And apparently, it ports well to both IE and Mozilla 02:22:16 Well, put it on the ToDo list 02:22:53 Cool. 02:23:44 It would be a staggeringly cool thing to try to implement, but I'll be fucked if I'm going to be the one to do it 02:24:23 Sounds like an added incentive for you to do it. ;-) 02:24:34 lol! 02:25:48 It's too much of a LEAD thing to be of any use 02:26:32 like making a television set in your shed 02:26:58 fax machines! 02:27:09 LEAD? 02:27:15 fax machines? 02:27:23 Live Early Adoption and Deletion 02:27:27 Oops, I mean Development ;) 02:27:36 heh 02:27:50 Being the only guy with a TV is sorta useful. Being the only guy with a fax machine really isn't. 02:28:06 'cuz you can still do closed circuit TV. 02:28:33 why not closed-circuit fax? 02:28:38 lol 02:28:59 (Hey guys, come sit on my lawn and you can watch *my bathroom* on this tiny box.) 02:29:22 Because why not photocopy and deliver the documents, deltab? 02:29:32 cool, Aaron's gone nuts. I knew it'd happen one day 02:30:01 heh. 02:30:19 one day? I thought I was always nuts. 02:30:32 well, "more so", then 02:31:21 a higher plateau of nuttiness 02:31:21 I had trouble thinking of an enticement for the neighbors. 02:31:40 stick a hooker on your front lawn 02:32:06 Ah, true, that's very Shirkian. 02:32:18 Shirky is the one I owe for the fax machine example. 02:33:48 so what apple bags of blossom delight have the fountains given the small inconsistent bees today? 02:34:26 * sbp reaches a higher plateau of nuttiness 02:35:53 we all *knew* that Roger had a third nipple called Penelope: I was just the first to state it in such a colorful fashion 02:36:08 .google "a third nipple called Penelope" 02:36:09 no results found. 02:36:17 Hmm, that sounds familiar. 02:36:26 .google "first to state it in such a colorful fashion" 02:36:26 no results found. 02:36:35 it should sound familiar! 02:36:46 Why? 02:36:49 try the first search, +Roger, and without the quotes 02:36:59 .google Roger had a third nipple called Penelope 02:37:00 Roger had a third nipple called Penelope: http://www.asstr.org/~spunknwagnels/nwmd19.html 02:37:06 Oh dear. 02:37:21 I had no idea it was this bad. 02:38:17 what was which bad? 02:38:48 Your insanity. 02:39:48 ah. If insanity is in a bad state, then that must add up to sanity, surely? 02:40:03 heh. 02:51:56 tansaku has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 02:57:10 AaronSw is now known as DanC2 02:57:50 DanC2 is now known as AaronSw 03:01:42 Homer: Ha, ha, ha, he said blink tag. 03:19:01 yo, Aaron, do you remember what happened to the MP3s of DanC playing that the plenary? 03:19:28 I didn't realize there were any. 03:19:55 I thought you said that some got recorded, but were either lost or not put online? 03:20:56 I think that was TimBL. 03:21:28 TimBL recorded some stuff, or TimBL's stuff got lost (or both)? 03:21:44 both. 04:10:53 SeanP (~sean@m503-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack 04:11:18 sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds) 04:11:27 SeanP is now known as sbp 04:32:52 Seems that all CWM does now anyway is to parse command line arguments 04:33:00 Llyn seems to do the real work 04:41:05 Gotta run 04:42:52 sbp has quit ("Homer: 20 dollars? I wanted a peanut!") 05:21:53 * AaronSw disconnects 11:13:49 tansaku (~sam@n144-001.tokyu-net.catv.ne.jp) has joined #swhack 11:16:39 tansaku has quit (Ping timeout: 184 seconds) 11:21:16 tansaku (~sam@n144-091.tokyu-net.catv.ne.jp) has joined #swhack 11:34:41 tansaku has quit (Ping timeout: 184 seconds) 13:20:22 tansaku (~sam@n144-001.tokyu-net.catv.ne.jp) has joined #swhack 14:39:25 Morbus (~Morbus@s81.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 14:40:46 tansaku has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds) 14:47:40 tansaku (~sam@h133-203.tokyu-net.catv.ne.jp) has joined #swhack 14:58:07 * AaronSw reconnects 14:58:53 sbp (~sean@m63-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack 14:59:34 I'm baaaaaaaaaaaack! 14:59:34 tansaku has quit (Ping timeout: 182 seconds) 14:59:43 Woohoo. 14:59:46 this sputnix works well 14:59:54 So I used the top secret Apple Disk Copy 6.5d45 software to back up my machine 14:59:55 and then I "cloned" it to the other hard drive. 14:59:58 And all was restored! 15:00:09 But then I realized that since I made a Read-Only image it had made my hard drive read only! 15:00:20 So I found a tool on google: 15:00:21 .google fwb unlock volume 15:00:22 fwb unlock volume: http://www.fwb.com/dc/special/unlock.html 15:00:31 which let me unlock it and now I'm back. 15:01:14 * AaronSw prepares to download all 1000s of things he missed. 15:01:50 wb 15:02:22 thank you 15:02:24 thank you 15:02:24 thank you 15:02:26 :-) 15:02:35 Morbus has quit ("http://www.disobey.com/") 15:02:44 np :-) 15:03:01 You have no idea how good it feels to be back. How long have I been at this? 15:03:11 days 15:03:11 logster, grep new hard drive.* came 15:04:27 I'm logging. I found 1 answer for 'new hard drive.* came' 15:04:28 0) 2001-11-26 15:03:11 logster, grep new hard drive.* came 15:04:29 clearly, but how many 15:04:29 they really need to do something about that logster bug... 15:04:29 which bug would that be? 15:04:32 Hmm, maybe not... 15:04:48 I thought it went and got back all results before returning, not just the first 5 15:04:52 but maybe I was wrong. 15:05:20 yeah, it's just slow. IF that was the only one that it found, then it had to go through the entire lot anyway 15:05:28 right 15:07:52 Aha, it was 2001-11-19 29:07:46. 15:08:05 Morbus (~Morbus@s126.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 15:08:07 That's 7 days! 15:08:22 Wow. 15:09:46 ok, time for school 15:12:31 sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds) 15:13:03 Morbus has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds) 15:14:09 Morbus (~Morbus@s98.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 15:16:50 crap. 15:16:56 snak is gonna quit in 30 minutes. 15:16:57 buggery 15:17:39 man, this sputnix is nice and fast. 15:18:26 AaronSw, are you gonna do anythign with this proxy thing for adam? 15:19:34 Morbus has quit ("http://www.disobey.com/") 15:20:01 Morbus (~Morbus@s98.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 15:20:06 Morbus has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 15:25:09 Morbus (~Morbus@s98.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 15:26:08 sbp (~sean@m410-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack 15:26:15 bah. 15:26:18 stupid snak. 15:26:28 hey sbpster. 15:26:33 Morbus has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 15:27:07 Morbus (~Snak@s98.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 15:27:22 Morbus has quit (Client Quit) 15:27:42 Morbus (~Morbus@s98.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 15:28:32 welp, i've determined that snak doesnt' store its date for registration in the pref file, or uses the pref files creation date to look for it. 15:31:35 Hi there Morby, deltab 15:32:10 hey there 15:32:11 Morbus has quit (Client Quit) 15:32:31 Morbus (~Morbus@s98.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 15:33:16 lol 15:37:15 Morbus has quit (Ping timeout: 183 seconds) 15:40:49 Morbus (~Morbus@s115.terminal3.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 15:41:31 AaronSw, you around? need to talk about your blogifyYP. 15:41:41 no, damn, he's at school. 16:06:22 Morbus has quit ("http://www.disobey.com/") 17:08:03 SeanP (~sean@m2-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack 17:08:05 sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds) 17:08:35 SeanP is now known as sbp 17:17:59 tav` (tav@host217-34-80-252.in-addr.btopenworld.com) has joined #swhack 17:59:46 sbp has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds) 18:16:00 Morbus (~Morbus@morbus.totalnetnh.net) has joined #swhack 18:38:35 sbp (~sean@m16-mp1-cvx4c.pop.ntl.com) has joined #swhack 18:44:36 hey sbp 18:45:01 Hi there 18:48:55 hi 18:49:08 * AaronSw will brb 18:49:20 i'm getting a cat tomorrow. yay1 18:49:23 * AaronSw disconnects 18:49:53 * AaronSw reconnects 18:50:06 cool. What are you going to call it? 18:50:15 dunno yet. i'm thinking about "bunny" 18:50:42 won't that be confusing? If you get a rabbit, you'll have to acll it "pussy" 18:51:04 we were gonna call it kitty. 18:51:14 we may name it something else. 18:51:17 my last cat was named goro. 18:51:31 a cat? 18:51:41 Heh heh. 18:52:22 Goro? Any particular reason? 18:53:54 yeah. long story. 18:57:57 Gotta run 18:57:59 sbp has quit ("Homer: 20 dollars? I wanted a peanut!") 19:04:14 Morbus, not really. 19:06:51 Wow, I'm in 16 IRC channels. 19:09:37 not really, what? 19:12:27 'cha doing today? 19:12:54 I'm working on a roadmap for the Plex. 19:13:11 ah. i wanna see when you're done. 19:13:26 OK... i'll put it up on the web 19:13:32 cool. 19:16:38 did you try the new ag client for the mac? i keep forgetting its name. 19:16:50 not yet 19:16:55 let me grab it 19:17:32 bwahah 19:17:38 i got 41 referers from monkeyfarts.org 19:17:42 lol 19:18:28 is the latest version of sputnix 0.1b? 19:18:40 yeah 19:18:48 GabeW (~gwachob@c1886218-a.smateo1.sfba.home.com) has joined #swhack 19:21:39 hi gabe 19:22:20 hey 19:34:32 * AaronSw desperately tries to remember his AudioGalaxy password. 19:34:37 heh. 19:35:52 Ah, luckily the preferences file is something that can pass for plain text in a desperate situation. 19:36:22 dammit. i got 500 downlaods of amphetadesk yesterday, and i dunno who mentioned it. 19:36:45 Yeah, SF needs referer tracking 19:36:53 deltab, take note of that for our project :) 19:37:17 i wonder if its from ask.com. i'm getting a huge amount of refers from them. (900+). 19:37:29 Heh: "Should Audiogalaxy change their protocols at any time, this client may break. Do not panic." 19:38:50 yeah, saw that too. 19:39:00 the about box contains a link to a reveng of the ag protocl. 19:39:17 Hmm, I can't get the about box to appear. 19:39:46 ?. odd. 19:40:50 yeah 19:40:57 I also get "Status: standing by" 19:44:28 yeah, thats normal. 19:44:33 that's what it should be. 19:44:40 you're logged in, and dandy. 19:46:37 its faster for me too - when i add a file, it downloads at an avergae of 5/6k on my box 19:46:50 cool 19:52:27 show_jacky (show_jacky@gate8-111.nordnet.fr) has joined #swhack 19:52:44 hello 19:52:51 .hey 19:53:26 do u program ? 19:54:12 yup 19:54:15 most of us do. 19:54:23 actually, i'm pretty sure all of us do. 19:54:23 ok 19:54:37 which languages ? 19:55:42 i search all documentation about hardware port 19:55:57 i know very little about hardware. 19:56:21 and, the others, who have forgot their keyboard ? 19:56:23