IRC log of swhack on 2001-07-29

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:02:31 [sbp]

sbp has quit

00:02:40 [sbp]

sbp has joined #swhack

00:58:27 [sbp]

sbp has quit

01:02:00 [sbp]

sbp has joined #swhack

02:03:06 [sbp]

sbp has quit

08:42:57 [AaronSw]

AaronSw has quit

08:43:12 [AaronSw]

AaronSw has joined #swhack

14:43:40 [sbp]

sbp has joined #swhack

14:44:18 [sbp]

Hi Aaron, and how are we today?

14:44:40 [AaronSw]

Alright, how are you?

14:48:20 [sbp]

A bit ill; drunk a cup of chocolate that seems to have unsettled me for some reson

14:48:33 [sbp]

Just watched the Grand Prix; Ralf Schumacher won

14:49:03 [AaronSw]

Hmm, hope you feel better...

14:50:14 [AaronSw]

Did you get the email backlog I sent you?

14:50:56 [sbp]

Just going through all the mail right now

14:51:29 [AaronSw]

You should probably see how many bounced:

14:51:30 [AaronSw]

http://groups.yahoo.com/myprefs?bounce=sean@mysterylights.com

14:52:23 [sbp]

Weird, it wasn't offline for *that* long

14:52:38 [AaronSw]

Hmm, it must have just been offline when I send you messages. ;-)

14:52:47 [sbp]

:-)

14:53:02 [AaronSw]

You logged off exactly one minute before I logged on. ;-)

14:53:03 [sbp]

* sbp finds his computer struggling, is quite glad that he'll probably be getting a new one

14:53:09 [AaronSw]

Oh goodie!

14:57:17 [AaronSw]

Do you have a static IP address?

15:01:49 [AaronSw]

I can't talk about the details because of the W3C creed of Omerta, but suffice it to say that the little inconsistencies between the data models of the extended XML specifications (DOM, XPath, XSL, XQuery, the PSVI, the InfoSet, ad nausem) are slowing W3C progress to a crawl. The solution of breaking a few things, radically simplifying, and starting over is not even politely listened to in W3C circles. Godfather Darwin is going to be taking XML

15:01:49 [AaronSw]

--Michael Champion on the sml-dev mailing list

15:02:25 [sbp]

Heh, cool note

15:03:31 [sbp]

XML and evolution

15:03:41 [sbp]

It'll en up with four arses instead of a mouth soon

15:03:44 [sbp]

s/en/end

15:03:45 [AaronSw]

courtesy of cafe con leche, http://www.ibiblio.org/xml/

15:03:51 [sbp]

Yeah, I guessed that

15:05:09 [sbp]

What would you be doing on the sml-dev mailing list? :-)

15:05:55 [sbp]

Did you see the chat I had with Jonathan Robie last night?

15:06:11 [AaronSw]

sml-dev: Hey! I'm all for SML!

15:06:25 [AaronSw]

chat with robie: Yep... I wish I was there.

15:06:40 [AaronSw]

It's interesting to see how the XML folks are coping with the benefits we expect from RDF...

15:06:51 [sbp]

Pardon?

15:07:00 [sbp]

Oh, yeah

15:07:36 [AaronSw]

<robie> that's what's called hidden semantics - the semantics are in your code, or in your specification, or in your mind, but they aren't expressed in anything accessible to the computer.

15:07:47 [AaronSw]

And what is XML but hidden semantics?

15:08:26 [sbp]

Well, it was fun when I proved to him that RDF could express things that current schema languages can't

15:08:32 [AaronSw]

:-)

15:10:41 [AaronSw]

So are you still using the archiver?

15:10:46 [AaronSw]

I'm loving it -- it's so fast!

15:10:48 [sbp]

I'm just about to send a letter advising against recommending RDF for a task... that's quite odd

15:10:52 [sbp]

Archiver: no

15:11:01 [AaronSw]

odd: quite

15:11:12 [sbp]

You'll see though. Sending it to PF

15:11:25 [AaronSw]

archiver: you said it was archiving GIFs... is that true?

15:11:33 [sbp]

Archiver: until it scrapes out the *.gif files etc. :-)

15:11:41 [AaronSw]

It does, though...

15:11:48 [sbp]

Yes, that's true. That's why I'm not using it. Oh, that and the 1.html thing

15:11:53 [sbp]

er... shorter file names

15:12:12 [AaronSw]

Huh? You're not using it because it scrapes out the GIFs?

15:12:15 [sbp]

Plus, it takes a while to set up, and I need to set up the hard drive somehow

15:12:26 [sbp]

No, because it doesn't scrape out the *.gif's

15:12:30 [AaronSw]

But it does!

15:12:47 [AaronSw]

Just change set ARCHIVE_NON_TEXT = 1

15:12:52 [sbp]

Well, it doesn't for me... I can send you the files if you want proof

15:13:08 [sbp]

You have to switch that to 0

15:13:43 [AaronSw]

Hmm... let me test it...

15:13:56 [sbp]

But hopefully, I'll end up with a 20GB Hard Drvie, so stroing the junk should be no problem

15:14:25 [sbp]

Although, if I get too big a HD, it might slow down the access speed... that's a bit of a problem

15:16:20 [sbp]

Heh, Joe on GL:-

15:16:30 [sbp]

You're all supposed to be Internet experts. One is aware that the

15:16:30 [sbp]

worst mailer program in the history of humankind, Microsoft Outfukt,

15:16:30 [sbp]

defaults to this behaviour, but you must have enough skill to

15:16:30 [sbp]

override it.

15:17:01 [sbp]

I totally agree with him! That's one of my pet peeves

15:17:08 [AaronSw]

I know.

15:17:19 [AaronSw]

I hate it when folks send me HTML mail!

15:17:35 [sbp]

Yeah, that's annoying too

15:18:34 [AaronSw]

Hmm, you're right... it isn't deleting the files...

15:18:48 [sbp]

Of course I'm right

15:22:12 [sbp]

* sbp sends a mail to Joe

15:30:20 [AaronSw]

Ok, I've fixed the archiver bug... uploading...

15:30:32 [sbp]

sbp has quit

15:32:01 [sbp]

sbp has joined #swhack

15:32:05 [AaronSw]

Ok, I've fixed the archiver bug... uploading...done.

15:32:18 [AaronSw]

It now deletes the files properly...

15:32:29 [sbp]

Great!

15:32:35 [AaronSw]

Should it leave the headers, do you think?

15:32:36 [sbp]

And short file names?

15:32:43 [sbp]

Headers... no, I don't think so

15:32:58 [AaronSw]

Short file names are next on the list...

15:33:02 [sbp]

Cool

15:41:06 [AaronSw]

Hmm, fine... I'll just delete it on my end then.

15:41:22 [AaronSw]

Oops.

15:57:59 [sbp]

http://www.google.com/search?q=%22Semantic+Web%22

15:58:10 [sbp]

Between you and I, guess how many pages we're responsible for :-)

15:58:22 [AaronSw]

I'm worried...

15:59:29 [sbp]

3/10, which isn't bad

15:59:41 [AaronSw]

i think it works better without the quotes...

16:00:26 [sbp]

No, only 1 of the pages is ours then

16:00:32 [AaronSw]

Hmm...

16:00:42 [AaronSw]

OK, new version of the archiver uses better file names.

16:00:42 [AaronSw]

http://logicerror.com/archiverProxy-code

16:00:48 [AaronSw]

or at least shorter one. ;-)

16:01:11 [AaronSw]

Since you think shorter != better. ;-)

16:01:16 [sbp]

* sbp wonders what you've named it

16:01:28 [sbp]

Heh, Byte Size Boy

16:01:33 [sbp]

Ooh, and credit

16:01:40 [AaronSw]

:-)

16:02:02 [sbp]

What does # ARCHIVE_FILE_NAMES = 'date'

16:02:05 [sbp]

do?

16:02:10 [sbp]

Comparison?

16:02:18 [AaronSw]

Huh?

16:02:26 [AaronSw]

If you uncomment it then it switches to date mode.

16:02:31 [AaronSw]

(the old way)

16:02:44 [sbp]

Ugh

16:03:03 [AaronSw]

Hey, it's an option.

16:04:18 [AaronSw]

Best feature: comprehensive TODO list. ;-)

16:05:06 [sbp]

* sbp turns it on

16:07:21 [sbp]

It appears to work. Well done old chap

16:07:34 [AaronSw]

Great! :-)

16:07:53 [AaronSw]

I wonder where Gerald went, I'd love to show it to him...

16:08:04 [AaronSw]

His website is down, so I can't really look it up.

16:08:27 [sbp]

I can tell that my bug fix really hit the spot :-)

16:08:32 [sbp]

Yeah: try FOGO IRC

16:08:37 [AaronSw]

FOGO IRC?

16:08:44 [sbp]

Yeah, FOGO IRC

16:08:52 [AaronSw]

What's (or where's) that?

16:09:02 [sbp]

Hang on, let me find out

16:09:47 [AaronSw]

Well he's not on at the W3C and he's not responding to his email, so I suspect he's out-of-town...

16:09:50 [sbp]

irc.impressive.net - down

16:10:11 [sbp]

Er...

16:10:15 [sbp]

s/down/not down

16:10:45 [AaronSw]

How'd you find out about that?

16:15:35 [sbp]

from impressive.net

16:26:15 [AaronSw]

Where on impressive.net?

16:32:18 [sbp]

sbp has quit

16:34:54 [sbp]

sbp has joined #swhack

16:35:11 [sbp]

AaronSw, can we stop speaking like this now?

16:35:16 [AaronSw]

Yes, sbp.

16:35:24 [AaronSw]

That was weird.

16:35:25 [sbp]

that is good, AaronSw

16:35:27 [sbp]

What was?

16:35:36 [AaronSw]

donny is weird.

16:35:47 [sbp]

Oh, yes, AaronSw. donny is weird

16:35:56 [sbp]

How did you know about him?

16:36:06 [AaronSw]

There are a ton on this network.

16:36:14 [sbp]

Any particular rooms?

16:36:58 [AaronSw]

one on #monkeybot

16:37:13 [sbp]

Design issues for creating new homes. Axiom #1: provide a place to air out one's stinkables

16:37:26 [AaronSw]

homes?

16:37:28 [AaronSw]

stinkables?

16:37:46 [sbp]

homes = dwelling

16:37:52 [sbp]

stinkables = stinkables

16:37:57 [sbp]

(Simpsons term)

16:43:42 [sbp]

Gotta run

16:43:44 [sbp]

sbp has quit

17:54:39 [AaronSw]

Pat Hayes, RDF Model Theory: """We could propose a related language to RDF which might be called Resource Querying Format, which is identical to RDF except that RQF expressions are understood to be queries rather than assertions. <joke> The syntax of RQF could be identical to RDF except that an RQF document must end with the string ",eh?". </joke>"""

17:56:33 [AaronSw]

Today on www-talk: """hello, you sent me an email, im replying, it is cool, goodbye"""

18:12:34 [sbp]

sbp has joined #swhack

18:15:58 [sbp]

sbp has left channel

18:16:02 [sbp]

sbp has joined #swhack

18:17:20 [sbp]

Um... "hello, you sent me an email, im replying, it is cool, goodbye"

18:17:27 [AaronSw]

Yeah, I liked that.

18:17:40 [AaronSw]

It was in the funny stuff I logged earlier.

18:17:45 [sbp]

Cool

18:17:59 [AaronSw]

Along with another Pat Hayes joke.

18:18:36 [sbp]

a joke???

18:18:47 [AaronSw]

Yes, a joke! Even tagged as such!

18:18:54 [AaronSw]

<AaronSw> Pat Hayes, RDF Model Theory: """We could propose a related language to RDF which might be called Resource Querying Format, which is identical to RDF except that RQF expressions are understood to be queries rather than assertions. <joke> The syntax of RQF could be identical to RDF except that an RQF document must end with the string ",eh?". </joke>"""

18:19:10 [AaronSw]

Writing a model theory must make you do that kind of thing...

18:19:23 [sbp]

Yeah, just got that from the logs

18:19:27 [sbp]

Wow... a real joke

18:19:33 [sbp]

It's almost kinda funny, too

18:19:47 [AaronSw]

I thought it was funny.

18:21:02 [sbp]

Ooh, thanks for the travel log

18:21:10 [sbp]

[yes, it was actually very funny]

18:21:26 [sbp]

The "<joke>" tag does spoil it a little bit though

18:24:42 [sbp]

Hmm... away message: "I'm not in the office right now. Thankfully, I just bought a computer that not only answers, but reads my mail as well. Unfortunately, your letter sucks, and as such it has been deleted. Please resend it so that I can delete it personally upon my return."

18:25:10 [AaronSw]

He he he, who was that?

18:25:14 [googler]

googler has joined #swhack

18:25:19 [sbp]

aaargh!

18:25:19 [AaronSw]

googler, hi

18:25:20 [googler]

Argh, it's a stock quote page :(

18:25:29 [sbp]

TFW, up 25

18:25:38 [sbp]

FEJ, down 50 and a half

18:25:44 [AaronSw]

What?

18:25:46 [sbp]

FEO, stays the same

18:25:59 [sbp]

who was that: it was me, just now

18:26:05 [sbp]

* sbp wonders who googler is

18:26:22 [AaronSw]

googler, who is sean palmer?

18:26:23 [googler]

who is sean palmer: http://www.purl.org/net/sbp/

18:26:35 [sbp]

Ah

18:26:41 [sbp]

Oh no, please!

18:26:46 [sbp]

Not this again.....

18:26:55 [AaronSw]

What's wrong with him? I think he's cute.

18:27:04 [sbp]

googler, are you cute?

18:27:05 [googler]

are you cute: http://www.moondancing.net/AHAYC/

18:27:09 [sbp]

ooh

18:27:30 [sbp]

googler, what is the Semantic Web?

18:27:31 [googler]

what is the Semantic Web: http://www.sciam.com/2001/0501issue/0501berners-lee.html

18:27:45 [AaronSw]

googler, bottreat

18:27:45 [googler]

bottreat: http://bugs.uah.ualberta.ca/webbug/parasite/bottreat.htm

18:27:49 [sbp]

googler, what is the Semantic Web according to Sean?

18:27:51 [googler]

what is the Semantic Web according to Sean: http://www.araby-dalbo.com/users/1131/21207/200103/20010314_Triples.html

18:27:56 [AaronSw]

He he he.

18:27:58 [sbp]

Well, kind of

18:28:41 [googler]

googler has quit

18:28:45 [googler]

googler has joined #swhack

18:29:15 [AaronSw]

googler, botsnack

18:29:15 [googler]

yum!

18:29:26 [sbp]

lol

18:29:36 [AaronSw]

googler, windows

18:29:36 [googler]

windows: http://www.microsoft.com/windows/default.asp

18:29:58 [sbp]

googler, her googler! Good botty

18:29:58 [googler]

No matches for her googler! Good botty.

18:30:04 [AaronSw]

googler, linuxhelp?

18:30:05 [googler]

linuxhelp: http://www.linuxhelp.org/

18:30:07 [AaronSw]

googler, linuxhelp

18:30:08 [googler]

linuxhelp: http://www.linuxhelp.org/

18:30:10 [sbp]

er... I meant here, but still

18:30:32 [sbp]

googler, SWAG me baby

18:30:33 [googler]

SWAG me baby: http://www.kompaktkiste.de/tenor.htm

18:30:37 [sbp]

Hmm...

18:30:38 [AaronSw]

heh

18:31:04 [AaronSw]

googler, stats

18:31:04 [googler]

[stats] I have been running 00:02:20 (5 searches, 7 queries); connected 00:02:19; system uptime 139 days, 15:16

18:31:13 [sbp]

googler, Jimmy crack corn and I don't care

18:31:14 [googler]

Jimmy crack corn and I don't care: http://www.christaylormusic.com/worthlessart/

18:31:56 [AaronSw]

googler, xWebL

18:31:56 [googler]

xWebL: http://logicerror.com/xWeb-Aaron

18:32:02 [sbp]

Oh, damn it

18:32:27 [AaronSw]

You think I should invite him to #rdfig?

18:32:30 [sbp]

googler, xWebL specification

18:32:31 [googler]

xWebL specification: http://infomesh.net/2001/xWebL/spec/

18:32:35 [sbp]

Hah!

18:32:39 [sbp]

Yeah, you could do

18:32:51 [sbp]

But I'd play with it constantly

18:32:56 [AaronSw]

;-)

18:32:58 [sbp]

So you'd better not, for my sake

18:33:01 [AaronSw]

googler, join sbp

18:33:02 [googler]

join sbp: http://www.saic.com/sbp/jointeam.html

18:33:16 [AaronSw]

err...hmm

18:33:30 [sbp]

lol

18:33:34 [sbp]

googler, join #sbp

18:33:34 [googler]

join #sbp: http://www.saic.com/sbp/jointeam.html

18:33:48 [sbp]

smeg

18:34:03 [AaronSw]

.join #sbp

18:57:22 [sbp]

sbp has quit

18:58:42 [AaronSw]

googler, robster

18:58:42 [googler]

robster: http://www.advogato.org/person/robster/

19:00:04 [AaronSw]

googler, operserv

19:00:05 [googler]

operserv: http://www.valinor.sorcery.net/glossary/OperServ.html

19:06:37 [AaronSw]

googler, python

19:06:38 [googler]

python: http://www.python.org/

21:33:12 [sbp]

sbp has joined #swhack

21:36:54 [AaronSw]

Hi, I added the error logging feature to the archiver.

21:37:07 [sbp]

Ah, that's good

21:37:15 [AaronSw]

Hmm, it just logged an error....

21:37:41 [AaronSw]

Ahh, file name too long....

21:37:46 [AaronSw]

not sure what to do about that one. ;-)

21:49:38 [cdlu]

[GlobalSpam] Could all users interested in the preservation of their nicks and channels present themselves to the testnet (irc.openprojects.net:9000) and report any problems they see? We'll be putting the new code into production as soon as we're sure it's ready, and this is an important step. Thank you and have a nice day.

21:57:54 [cdlu]

[GlobalSpam] For clarification, direct questions and comments and criticisms to #openprojects (here). Only your nicks, your nicks' passwords, channel names, and the channel's founders have been preserved. Options, registration times, access lists, and so forth were not saved, in spite of extensive efforts.

22:15:06 [andy]

Friendly reminder to all our users: Please connect to irc.openprojects.net:9000 and have a look at your NickServ and ChanServ profiles. This is the last major step before we switch over to the new ircd. Please do so immediately. Thanks.

22:31:43 [sbp]

sbp has quit

22:46:18 [sbp]

sbp has joined #swhack

22:46:34 [sbp]

Aha

22:46:43 [AaronSw]

what was it?

22:47:23 [sbp]

Just slow

23:11:21 [sbp]

c'ya

23:11:24 [sbp]

sbp has quit