01:04:47 paje: see Psychephylax 01:04:52 rbm: excuse me? 01:04:52 paje: seen Psychephylax 01:04:52 Psychephylax was last seen on #openacs 1 days, 3 hours, 53 minutes and 42 seconds ago, saying: goes away [Wed May 22 15:12:06 2002] 01:04:53 wow 01:09:30 lethedrinker has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 01:09:54 rbm: you are working on and openacs project now? 01:13:03 davb: yes. 01:13:15 OACS 4 is really nice 01:13:18 * rbm goes to shower 01:17:31 hmmm, i am crashing aolserver, with stacksize=500000 01:21:41 why so high? 01:22:00 do you have a lot of ram? 01:23:43 well 512mb. 01:23:51 that is the minimum for openacs 4 01:24:02 its 500000 bytes 01:24:25 wow, that is more than a whole computer used to have :) 01:26:12 davb: Not true. I run OACS 4 with stacksize= 131072 01:26:22 don't ask me where I got that number from. 01:26:33 that is the default in vinods sample tcl file. 01:26:34 :) 01:26:38 oh, right :) 01:26:43 you may run into a problem. 01:26:47 * rbm goes out 01:26:52 ETP can overflow that stack. 01:26:56 also dotlrn will.... 01:28:01 hmm 01:38:37 kapil (~kapil@codeitnat.codeit.com) has joined #openacs 01:40:26 kapil is now known as lethedrinker 01:46:29 if microsoft code contains a flaw that could be exploited if the code is disclosed, isn't the code still vunerable? 01:46:41 shouldn't they just fix it? 01:46:55 ow, my brains hurts. this is worse than reading slashdot.... 02:02:24 rbm: zoran says he has ideas on how to fix aolserver. but he didn't share them... 02:16:12 ok, well, i'll be back tomorrow... 02:16:16 davb has quit ("Client Exiting") 02:57:36 doh 02:57:41 roll call! 02:57:41 I'm here! 02:57:59 * Psychephylax pokes rbm and talli with paje 03:01:23 hey 03:01:54 sup 03:44:20 paje: seen god 03:44:20 I haven't seen 'god', lethedrinker 03:44:34 paje: seen rats 03:44:35 I haven't seen 'rats', lethedrinker 03:44:46 paje: dance 03:44:46 lethedrinker: i'm not following you... 04:48:57 beezo has quit ("Client Exiting") 04:49:18 beezo (~talli@pool-162-83-236-44.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 04:50:20 paje: dance 04:50:20 * paje shakes his booties 04:51:23 what's the celebration for? 04:53:12 nothing :) 04:53:29 just saw what lethedrinker said to paje 04:53:31 i think i like gentoo more than debian 04:53:47 gentoo takes a whole loooooooong time to install 04:53:52 beezo: why? 04:53:54 but it works! with no trouble! 04:54:02 and it *screams* 04:54:15 portage is really very very nice 04:54:18 i recently had a discussion with a debian guy, who went ape on me for talking about gentoo. 04:54:28 of course portage is nice its written in python ;-) 04:54:32 * lethedrinker ducks 04:54:33 haha 04:54:42 yeah, well debian was written in perl, right? 04:54:52 language of the day... 04:54:53 apt is c and perl and afaik. 04:55:13 apt is C++ 04:55:17 AFAIK, no perl 04:55:24 portage is basically the same since it's python and bash (which i imagine is C) 04:55:57 anyway, portage is really slick. checks for dependencies and installs those if need be 04:56:02 gotta got get a CD. bbi 20 mins 04:56:09 the nice thing, though, is that it builds everything from sources 04:56:16 so it takes a *long* time 04:56:33 like i started building KDE this morning and it was finally ready around 8 pm 04:56:40 but once it's done it just *works* 04:57:06 debian mostly works, but it seems i've had to fight it a bit 04:57:20 like, a lot of apt-get install -f 04:58:02 i've had three bugs with installing gentoo, two which were very very minor and had very very easy fixes and one that was totally my fault (compiled the wrong kernel) 04:58:15 otherwise, it's been a breeze building and installing stuff, although it takes a long time 04:59:13 it's optimized for fast computers, though 04:59:23 so it would be murder installing on something less than a 686 04:59:50 and don't try it with a slow net connection 05:00:18 i'm getting 90Kb/sec downloads, and still i plan on sleeping through a lot of installations 06:01:48 goodnight, nerds 06:07:42 denshi has quit () 06:37:31 beezo: I've _never_ had to use "-f" with apt-get. 06:37:48 beezo: maybe you're too used to using "--force" to overcome rpm crap 11:11:37 til has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 12:15:41 hmmmm 12:15:43 mornings are evil 12:57:29 davb (~chatzilla@rrcs-nys-24-97-22-203.biz.rr.com) has joined #openacs 12:57:34 hi there 13:02:50 hey dave 13:04:17 Man, I wish someone bought me the FL-40 13:07:16 what's that? 13:07:16 that is not true 13:08:05 It's an Olympus Flash 13:08:09 but it's like 300$ 13:13:35 wow 13:40:44 argh 13:44:17 yup 13:44:29 but it interfaces with the camera a lot more than a regular flash 13:48:21 right. the built in one is not adequate for the zoom? 13:50:30 argh 13:50:57 there is no way to perform a query in VBA for Access that does not return any rows. I want to see if something exists, if not insert it. 13:51:36 nm, i figured out a way. 13:51:43 not my favorite way, but it will work :) 13:51:54 beezo has left #openacs 13:51:57 beezo (~talli@pool-162-83-236-44.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 13:58:54 beezo has quit (Remote closed the connection) 14:18:08 yeah! it works 14:26:06 http://www.outreach.washington.edu/openuw/asp/transform.asp?course=Jazz&xml=jazz_intro1 14:26:07 A: http://www.outreach.washington.edu/openuw/asp/transform.asp?course=Jazz&xml=jazz_intro1 from davb 15:01:26 heh 15:01:32 jury duty was fast today 15:03:20 i bet 15:05:23 :) 15:12:26 ooom 15:13:11 ooom! 15:20:39 Roberto 15:20:51 Do you want me to send you the stuff now, or wait until I get more stuff 15:31:05 Psychephylax: send now I guess. 15:31:10 ok 15:31:23 once i get money for FedEx ;-) 15:32:04 FedEx? Why FedEx? USPS works just fine. 15:32:32 I dislike UPS and USPS 15:32:46 Inefficient lying fools 15:36:20 lying? 15:38:33 Eh 15:38:42 They always lie when things break 15:44:03 hmm. Well, can you send it for me to pay here? 15:46:07 What do you mean 15:53:05 the fedex cost 15:53:18 oh, don't worry I'll pay for s&h 15:53:29 I have a fedex account so it will just get charged to my credit card 15:56:51 markd2 (~markd2@h166-102-041-033.ip.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 15:56:58 hey mark 15:57:05 paje, seen davb? 15:57:05 davb was last seen on #openacs 53 minutes and 44 seconds ago, saying: i bet [Fri May 24 09:04:18 2002] 15:57:06 y 15:57:10 yo 15:57:12 oy 15:57:13 y 15:57:18 o! 15:57:39 ПК 15:59:04 denshi (~chatzilla@cs6625176-26.austin.rr.com) has joined #openacs 15:59:08 Ѕі 15:59:26 morning 16:13:41 hey, who's looking for me? 16:17:32 * markd2 waves his hand 16:18:19 hi mark 16:19:57 beezo (~chatzilla@pool-162-83-236-44.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 16:20:15 boogle chach 16:20:48 beezo: let me repeat something I said last night that I don't think you picked up 16:20:53 i saw it 16:21:02 Oh, okay then. 16:21:02 i think the prob is that i didn't know my hardware 16:21:14 shouldn't matter for apt 16:21:24 but i've had major problems upgrading 16:21:40 doing apt-get upgrade dist-upgrade always results in some packages being held back 16:21:41 Hmmm, trying to install Dungeon Siege on this P2 233 is not going well. 16:21:48 beezo: So? 16:21:48 well, So is going to the play a bit like try before you buy ? 16:22:17 so the result is that i need to do apt-get install -f or apt-get upgrade -f 16:22:34 beezo: No, the result is that you're not trusting the tools. 16:22:58 i would be happy to trust the tools if they installed what i wanted to be installed 16:23:24 beezo: If the packages are being held back, it is because there's probably currently a dependency issue (some other packages need to be upgraded before these ones can) or the packages are marked to be held. 16:23:47 beezo: You asked it to upgrade, not install anything. It's upgrading in the safest way it sees. 16:23:54 well, that's kind of the prob. even if i do a dependency check stuff wasn't getting in 16:24:01 anyway, i'm digging gentoo 16:24:07 i wasn't crapping on debian 16:24:11 don't get defensive 16:24:15 I never said you were. 16:24:20 ok 16:24:35 I'm not. I'm trying to clear a misconception you might have. 16:24:47 beezo: somewhere something is screwed up. 16:24:52 :) 16:25:06 I had that problem when I had parts of ximian gnome on my system. 16:27:54 beezo: You should read this: http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/apt-howto/index.en.html 16:29:13 i keep forgetting, debian has great documentation...:) 16:29:33 doc... doc... documen.. wow. what weird words you use! 16:35:29 There's gotta be something wrong with my machine... Dungeon siege has been installing for over 20 minutens. 16:37:12 what's win2k's equivalent of fdisk? 16:38:16 miguel (~miguel@cable242a131.usuarios.retecal.es) has joined #openacs 16:38:31 hello guys!! 16:38:54 hello 16:39:02 paje: say hi to miguel 16:39:11 paje: dance 16:39:11 * paje shakes his booties 16:40:56 paje, attack! 16:40:56 * paje bites Mark's ankle 16:41:01 thanks rbm 16:41:06 paje? 16:41:06 miguel? 16:41:19 are you spanish or something? 16:41:36 I think he's like perlish or something. 16:41:43 paje, who are you? 16:41:44 somebody said i was a silly bot 16:41:46 paje, who are you? 16:41:46 i am probably a silly bot 16:41:47 paje, who are you? 16:41:48 i am the medicine man and oracle in Amazonian tribes 16:42:12 is paje a bot? 16:42:41 you know, whether paje is the bot or rbm is the bot is still an open question 16:42:51 I think they share a hive mind 16:42:55 but paje does seem to have more regular syntax 16:43:06 rbm: spank talli! 16:43:14 paje: again! 16:43:14 * paje spanks talli 16:43:17 markd2: with rbm installing dungeon siege, they certainly will be sharing a hive mind 16:43:19 paje has better reflexes 16:43:19 markd2: sorry... 16:43:27 ok roberto, i am about to start over again, i quitted the project where i was and i am going to install openacs 4.x, any recommendations? 16:43:35 nothing to apologize for, paje 16:43:35 markd2: Yeah! 16:43:35 denshi: what? 16:44:21 miguel: Follow Vinod's install documents :-) http://openacs.org/doc/ 16:44:50 ok, thanks i will do that 16:45:01 what about the ones in infogettable or something like that? 16:47:53 ? 16:48:11 i think was something started by ola 16:49:33 beezo, you here? 16:49:42 yo 16:49:44 paje, attack beezo 16:49:44 denshi: what? 16:49:52 what's up? how did the LUG meeting go? 16:49:59 rbm, paje needs a operator 16:50:01 paje, denshi is a tyrant 16:50:01 ...but denshi is the most off-beat genius you ever knew; he's so iconoclastic he's clastic.... 16:50:18 the LUG meeting went reasonably well 16:50:27 did everyone bow to you afterwards? 16:50:36 it was really wierd, the amount of ground I had to cover for different groups 16:51:32 like I got bogged down in explaining processes/threads/memory allocation/concurrency/IPC/etc/etc/etc/etc 16:52:25 so by the time I got the 'new toys' bit everyone was either bitter that I had knocked their favorite tools or just gibbering from the amount of new data to assimilate 16:53:35 was this some kind of presentation to a LUG? 16:54:19 yeah 16:54:30 about 35 people showed 16:54:32 * markd2 is a LUG nut 16:55:13 I managed to tank when explaining memozied functions with a global cache 16:55:37 which I found pretty ironic 17:01:59 okay, so a couple days ago Win2K said I was "running low on disk space" and asked if I wanted to compress seldom-used files. I said yes. Now how do I find out what it compressed and how do I uncompress it? 17:02:37 heh 17:02:40 its a secret. 17:02:56 it would compromise national security if they told you where they went. 17:03:12 rbm: did you find the fdisk-like function in win2k? 17:03:32 no 17:03:43 rbm: what do you want to do? 17:03:52 i think its in system tools->disk manager or soemthing like that 17:04:03 I am on XP and I can't find anything to manage a disk. 17:04:26 paje, XP SUCKS!!!!! 17:04:26 beezo: sorry... 17:04:31 XP SUCKS!!!! 17:04:34 paje, XP? 17:04:35 XP is user friendly enough to make it impossible to get inside if you need to. 17:04:41 ????? 17:04:47 heh 17:04:49 who the hell told paje that? 17:04:49 paje is a microsoft shill 17:04:52 me 17:05:08 beezo: Trying to find out if the files 2K compressed are the culprit for the slowness 17:05:09 davb is a microsoft shill 17:05:18 ah, i se 17:05:19 see 17:05:55 aigh. on XP its control Panel->computer management->storage->disk management 17:08:58 argh, those idiots 17:09:18 at Empire State College just offered me a bunch of financial aid, but last week said they couldn't accept my application 17:09:18 davb: same on 2k 17:09:32 rbm: cool. 17:09:55 Still I can't find anything about the compressed files, but at least I found out how to defragment my drive 17:11:01 rbm: they wanted to make it easy, by not bothering you with that information :) 17:12:00 whatevec 17:12:08 s/whatevec/whatever/ 17:13:11 aigh. Verizon is taking windows to cellulars 17:15:20 rbm: try this: http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;Q253597 17:15:22 So yesterday GM Brazil fired 33 and warned 111 for circulating porn e-mail within the company 17:15:41 Today GM re-hired 18 of the 33 that were fired because "they are too qualified to let go" 17:15:59 carte blanche for porn! woo hoo! 17:16:49 so they probably should have let the others go anyway.... 17:17:27 it should be noticed that GM Brazil had been warning employees about porn e-mail for months 17:19:05 One thing I really dislike about Brazil is that after the military dictatorship ended in the 80s, everybody was sick and tired of censorship, so they decided to completely abolish it. 17:19:33 As a result, free TV shows stuff at noon that MTV usually shows at 8 PM 17:19:42 s/that/what/ 17:21:35 There's a "varieties" show that goes on sunday afternoons where competitors have water guns to spray tight t-shirts of models without bras to "uncover" a secret message written on their chests. 17:23:04 what, you've never tried that? 17:23:38 word of warning: the secret messages are hard to read. look hard. 17:27:30 My point is not about doing it. If you want to do it, fine. What I disagree with is showing it on free tv on sunday noon. 17:28:31 eh. tv is typically tasteless anyway. I don't see the difference. 17:29:16 except for junkyard wars.... and fighting robots. 17:29:39 and star trek re-runs 17:29:58 actually. we unhooked our TV from outside connections and antennas a couple of years ago 17:30:01 haven't really missed it 17:30:42 I've been leaving a book in the coffee table. Every time I think about turning on the TV, I open the book instead 17:31:06 you didn't realize there was a tv show with remote control car jousting. as in two full size cars fighting. 17:32:10 Good. I'd have hated it. 17:32:29 :) 17:32:33 (: 17:32:42 I watch DVDs mostly. 17:33:31 I don't think my hard drive will be done defragmenting anytime today 17:34:55 doesn't it just run in the background? 17:35:52 no 17:37:13 hey guys! ive downloaded PG 7.2.1, is it possible to use it with OACS? 17:40:36 it should work. 17:40:40 ok 17:40:44 thaks davb 17:45:33 I use oacs4 on pg 7.2 17:46:03 thanks roberto, anyway should i use the latest tarball of OACS 4.x? 17:46:41 miguel: I grab the cvs version 17:46:57 should he get the beta? 17:47:04 probably 17:47:08 I grab the beta from cvs too 17:47:30 because the development branch of cvs has stuff that won't make it into the release. 17:47:33 is there any previous version? when i started with OACS 3.x there was a beta of 4.0 or something like that 17:47:44 k2pts (~nkd@adsl-180-151.cytanet.com.cy) has joined #openacs 17:47:45 k2pts has quit (Client Quit) 17:47:51 dungeon siege was definitely not made to work on a 233 machine 17:48:03 d'oh 17:48:04 even the installer takes minutes to come up 17:48:22 k2pts (~nkd@adsl-180-151.cytanet.com.cy) has joined #openacs 17:48:25 hey k2pts! 17:48:31 hey 17:48:35 how are we doing? 17:48:38 hiya! 17:48:39 rbm: that needs at last 1Ghz doesn't it? 17:48:42 missed you guys :) 17:48:43 hi k2pts ! 17:48:47 k2pts: I looked at your acs-service-contract this week 17:49:01 markd2, davb: thx 17:49:05 s/this/code this/ 17:49:16 rbm: what do you think? 17:49:22 k2pts: pretty neat. 17:49:39 davb: No. The box says 333 17:49:45 I wonder if I can overclock this machine... 17:49:48 major improvement: is to use xml for specifying the contracts it will lift the porting burden 17:49:49 Psychephylax: what do you think? 17:49:49 rbm: ok... 17:50:14 davb: any news about the soap module for nsd? 17:50:43 about 17:50:47 k2pts: I took a little break. tclsoap works nicely in aolserver. 17:51:08 Psychephylax: overclocking this P2 233? I've never overclocked anything. 17:51:23 I just need to figure out if it is OK to just load the whole thing with the openacs libraries and have it loaded in every thread, or just load it when necessary. 17:51:50 probably when necessary 17:51:56 davb: what about nssoap? 17:52:05 then I would like to get the packge require stuff fixed 17:52:07 is that effort still in progress? 17:52:16 k2pts: nssoap is an old version of tclsoap that has been abandoned. 17:52:27 ok 17:52:41 bye 17:52:42 well, should i use the beta? i am not very familiar with CVS 17:52:44 denshi has quit () 17:52:46 the new version of tclsoap is much nicer. although I did steal nsexpat and nstcldom from the nssoap code. and fixed some little bug in it. 17:52:56 miguel: now is the time to learn :) 17:53:39 if you want to get the code that is closet to the 4.5 release, checkout from the beta branch. 17:53:51 davb: haven't used tclsoap so far but it looks tcl only, right? 17:53:55 if you are just looking and not building any critical systems, get anything. 17:54:07 man windows sucks 17:54:21 k2pts: yes. but it can use the nstcldom and nsexpat C modules to parse xml faster. 17:54:42 or tcldom and expat is you aren't usign aolserver. 17:54:54 davb: what do you mean with anything...i am just trying to build a small web site community for a few friends, first the bboards and maybe a repository for us... 17:55:24 miguel: get the beta. the tarball should be fine. 17:55:32 rbm is correct. 17:55:59 ok guys 17:56:22 davb: where did you get nstcldom? 17:56:36 s/did you/can I 17:56:43 k2pts: its in the nssoap cvs I think. I can send it to you. 17:57:04 tclxml.sourceforge.net right? 17:57:18 that is for the regular version. 17:59:14 davb: nstcldom, not found in the cvs repository :) 17:59:34 for nssoap? 17:59:54 for tclsoap 18:00:09 right. they have a version of tcldom there, but not for aolserver. 18:00:38 ok 18:00:57 what do you know about ICE (esp. about adoption w.r.t RSS) 18:01:21 I have heard of it, it was mentioned on the syndication list, but I haven't kept up with it. 18:01:39 looks promising 18:01:57 cool 18:02:01 my camera is old and expensive 18:02:29 k2pts: i think you need nsexpat also. i fixed some bugs in that. That officially I think lives at aolserver.com. 18:02:52 http://www.icestandard.org/ 18:02:52 B: http://www.icestandard.org/ from k2pts 18:03:14 nsexpat for what, tclsoap? 18:03:35 nssoap used it. i don't know if tclsoap inside aolserver would need it. 18:04:37 i need to keep better notes :) 18:05:56 oops, i emailed you nstcldom, but I think it needs the changes I made. 18:06:18 I also patched it to work with AOLserver 4, so I have to figure out which changes I made :) 18:08:21 don't worry about it... i'm busy with other stuff these days...I'm just starting to catch up with a lot of things 18:08:37 no problem, i just want to figure it out for myself. 18:09:06 davb: since it seems that you have tried aolserver 4. what's the status? 18:09:23 any info about i18n support 18:09:27 it works fine. but did not solve any of the problems I was having. 18:09:28 ? 18:09:35 That should be better. 18:09:54 someone was changing all the commands to tclObjCommand 18:10:01 but I don't think he finished. 18:10:49 any idea of when it's gonna be released 18:11:10 No idea. 18:11:30 it looks like alot of the code has been cleaned up. 18:11:54 that was kind of neat 18:12:05 I took a picture of a helicopter in the sky and it stopped the blades 18:12:14