00:03:15 talli has quit (Remote closed the connection) 00:09:40 talli (~talli@pool-162-83-235-2.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 00:10:24 hi talli 00:12:33 hey davb 00:13:31 talli_ (~talli@pool-162-83-235-2.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 00:13:35 talli_ has quit (Client Quit) 00:24:12 good evening 00:24:36 talli, if you're there: any updates on the ad-hoc reporting issue for openacs? 00:25:41 no, not really 00:26:17 did you here of python-reportlab? 00:26:35 yeah, but that's not much help, is it? 00:26:43 that just greats the pdf, right? 00:27:05 right, but thats the hardest part 00:27:29 hmmm... not for our needs 00:27:38 at least, that's not the question i have 00:28:20 isn't that what you need something like "take this field and this field, order by this, and make it a list on A4?" 00:29:28 yes 00:29:40 or are you looking for a gui layout builder that can do all sorts of fancy things? 00:29:49 more or less the former 00:30:50 i am playing with reportlab right now to generate invoices, offers, and letters in general 00:32:01 there are some rather nice table generation facilities in reportlab 00:32:40 oh, ok. very cool 00:32:58 what's the url for reportlab? 00:33:31 www.reportlab.com 00:34:02 they also seem to offer what you need, for only 10000$ per server 00:35:13 nice 00:35:17 that's all, huh? 00:35:41 they also want your left kidney 00:36:56 to be honest, for some projects 10K isn't that much 00:37:26 the weakest link friggin' sucks 00:38:47 weakest link? 00:40:56 think of the worst game show in Germany 00:41:01 multiply that by 10 00:41:48 better not ... 00:42:35 good idea. 00:43:18 debian really does spoil a person 00:43:25 upgrading a distro is a snap 00:43:37 up2date just doesn't do it well 00:43:46 unless, of course, you want to pay 00:44:13 anyone know anything about the java 2 jre 1.4 for linux? 00:49:32 last i used was 1.2 ... 00:50:06 ok. I noticed that sun has a linux version of the new one. 00:52:36 43Hey 00:53:05 * Psychephylax kicks dave 00:55:58 bye 00:56:07 Bye til 00:58:27 Psychephylax: how do you like gentoo? 01:08:31 hi Psychephylax 01:08:42 it's like everyone is pimping gentoo these days 01:09:01 davb is now known as davb-matrix 01:09:22 denshi-away: have you tried gentoo yet? 01:13:02 no, but at the grocery like the 20th person told me to use it. 01:13:18 hmmm... 01:13:19 "try that stilton cheese! and run gentoo linux!" 01:13:31 i guess people think that it's something totally new 01:13:36 like... BSD never existed 01:13:47 denshi-away is now known as denshi 01:44:32 denshi: what does that mean, my friend? 01:52:49 ack 01:53:07 Well, BSD is more mature 01:53:16 and Gentoo is more bleeding edge 01:53:32 BSD is more server oriented 01:53:40 Gentoo is more desktop oriented 01:56:44 talli has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 01:57:09 When in doubt watch the Matrix 01:57:39 talli (~talli@pool-162-83-235-2.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 02:07:03 XP sucks 02:07:07 D-Link sucks 02:07:20 * Psychephylax watches matrix 02:34:37 talli has quit (Remote closed the connection) 02:38:08 talli (~talli@pool-162-83-235-2.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 03:21:57 talli has quit (Remote closed the connection) 03:24:57 talli (~talli@pool-162-83-235-2.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 04:40:51 talli is now known as uglybarstool 05:42:54 talli_ (~talli@pool-162-83-235-2.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 05:59:48 uglybarstool has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06:32:35 til has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 06:33:14 til (~tils@62.116.19.11) has joined #openacs 06:46:48 til has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 06:46:49 denshi has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 06:46:49 jim has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 06:46:50 davb-matrix has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 06:46:51 talli_ has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 06:48:10 til (~tils@62.116.19.11) has joined #openacs 06:48:10 talli_ (~talli@pool-162-83-235-2.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 06:48:11 denshi (~chatzilla@cs6625176-26.austin.rr.com) has joined #openacs 06:48:11 davb-matrix (dave@alb-24-58-162-46.nycap.rr.com) has joined #openacs 06:48:11 jim (~jim@12-233-225-152.client.attbi.com) has joined #openacs 06:49:21 [#openacs] This channel is logged: http://www.blogspace.com/openacs/chatlogs/ and blogged: http://www.thedesignexperience.org/openacs/ircblog 08:29:45 til has quit ("#debian-kde") 08:31:01 til (~tils@62.116.19.11) has joined #openacs 08:59:08 larspind (~none@213.237.67.169.adsl.by.worldonline.dk) has joined #openacs 09:35:22 denshi has quit (Remote closed the connection) 09:47:04 mornin 10:41:05 til has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 10:41:08 til (~tils@62.116.19.11) has joined #openacs 10:52:01 pete_openmsg (~Peter@213.107.207.130) has joined #openacs 10:52:50 hi peter! 10:53:03 Hi there! First time on the IRC channel.... 10:53:27 all the americans are still sleeping i guess 10:53:52 thus nice and quiet it is ;) 10:54:09 Indeed. I'd seen the channel mentioned a new times, but have never quite got round to dropping by. How busy does it get? 10:54:19 yes, we are sleeping still :) 10:54:30 no, you are still watching matrix ;) 10:55:20 can't compare busyness since i don't irc that much 10:56:33 are you Peter Harper? 10:56:52 Yep.... 10:56:59 davb-matrix is now known as davb 10:58:05 Peter "automated-testing" Harper ;) 10:58:39 Erm.... yeh, although I haven't had time to progress that recently. Work commitments have been getting the better of me... 10:59:41 i didn't do much with tclwebtest either 10:59:58 I'm also responsible for the Mobile additions that OpenMSG have just released to the community. 11:01:13 I still plan to continue the automated testing/tclwebtest integration at some point. Don and I had some discussion a while back about better integration with the acs-core as well. 11:02:36 cool 11:04:33 would be cooler if that discussion was on the bboard though ... 11:06:34 Indeed. I should have more free time in a month or so, and plan to progress the testing stuff again. 11:07:33 That would be great ... I am still interested too, and might find some time 11:08:34 do you have experience with other web application testing products? 11:10:06 Not web-application testing unfortunately. I worked for a company called IPL about 3 years ago who build module testing tools for C/C++ and Ada95, hence the acs-automated-testing being rather "code" oriented. 11:10:44 I.e, Testing individual functions/code blocks rather than the user-interface functionality. There's a place for both, but I know less about testing the latter. 11:11:43 Ok. I don't have practical experience with either, unfortunately 11:12:31 wish i had the opportunity to try some commercial stuff once, to see what's possible 11:44:02 davb has quit ("Client Exiting") 12:18:51 pete_openmsg has left #openacs 12:19:08 pete_openmsg (~Peter@213.107.207.130) has joined #openacs 12:56:18 hey pete_openmsg! 12:56:23 talli_ is now known as talli 12:58:58 davb (~chatzilla@rrcs-nys-24-97-22-203.biz.rr.com) has joined #openacs 12:59:06 hello 13:01:04 yo davb 13:01:12 good morning talli 13:04:12 Sorry, Hi Talli..... away from my desk. 13:05:59 no prob 13:09:26 Would someone mind saying something. I'm just trying to test some event scripts... 13:15:50 something :) 13:16:05 Cheers.... and again? 13:16:19 I've seen the greatest minds of my generation.... 13:16:24 Cheers.. 13:16:26 Thanks. All working fine. 13:16:35 Kewl 13:46:58 0/clear all 13:47:01 *grr8 14:03:49 pete_openmsg has quit ("KVIrc 2.1.1 'Monolith'") 14:05:59 pete_openmsg (~Peter@213.107.207.130) has joined #openacs 14:06:11 pete_openmsg has quit (Client Quit) 14:07:19 pete_openmsg (~pharper@213.107.207.130) has joined #openacs 14:11:44 cro (~cro@defiant.nca.asu.edu) has joined #openacs 14:46:16 hey pete_openmsg, can't you get some of your other "mates" and "blokes" in here? 14:46:36 we don't have enough foreigners in here. 14:46:42 i mean, not enough foreigners to make fun of 14:48:04 eh? 14:48:28 you're in that place that has a "queen" or something, right? 14:48:56 Yep, the lovely city of Bath in the UK. 14:49:09 where is that? 14:49:19 i mean Bath, not the UK. 14:49:26 although you may want to help me with the UK, too 14:49:41 as an american, i hardly even know the places that we're bombing! 14:50:23 ;-) Bath is south-west england, near Bristol (if that means anything to you). About 110 miles west of London. 14:50:35 ah, cool 14:50:51 You? 14:51:04 i would make a monty python joke about sparrows, but i'm not geeky enough to remember what the joke is 14:51:06 i'm in NYC 14:52:54 I live near Bath. (Bath, Ohio, USA that is) 14:53:26 shagster: you may live near there, but you really should visit it more often 14:53:29 at least the one in your house 14:53:46 I do, every Saturday night :P 14:53:55 nice 14:54:08 right before church, i imagine? 14:54:26 and after a hard week of nut harvesting? 14:54:36 Of course. I like to be squeky clean when I see the priest! LOL 14:54:49 Yep, that is hard word 14:54:52 Umm work 14:55:01 *grr*. Need more coffee 15:33:08 pete_openmsg has left #openacs 15:39:30 pete_openmsg (~pharper@213.107.207.130) has joined #openacs 15:41:57 is anyone familiar with a plain english definition of what the Mozilla Public License 1.1 means? 15:42:29 if i understand correctly, it says that any code derived and released is jointly copyrighted by both the contributor and the original developer 15:42:38 and there is no copyleft 15:42:51 is that right? 15:48:44 his is a free software license which is not a strong copyleft; unlike the X11 license, it has some complex restrictions that 15:48:45 make it incompatible with the GNU GPL. That is, a module covered by the GPL and a module covered by the MPL cannot 15:48:45 legally be linked together. We urge you not to use the MPL for this reason. 15:48:45 However, MPL 1.1 has a provision (section 13) that allows a program (or parts of it) to offer a choice of another license as 15:48:47 well. If part of a program allows the GNU GPL as an alternate choice, or any other GPL-compatible license as an alternate 15:48:49 choice, that part of the program has a GPL-compatible license. 15:48:55 From http://www.gnu.org/licenses/license-list.html 15:49:36 thanks 15:49:46 Hope that helps you out. I've alwasy avoid the MPL because, quite frankly, it still is a bit unclear to me 16:00:11 yeah, i would avoid it too 16:00:23 shagster: have i told you about Momentum? 16:00:30 the calendar server project i'm working on? 16:01:26 i like the Portable.Net license, which is GPL except for linking 16:01:40 that says you can link to it, but if you change any of the core code you have to release it 16:20:50 pete_openmsg has quit ("KVIrc 2.1.1 'Monolith'") 16:21:08 pete_openmsg (~pharper@213.107.207.130) has joined #openacs 16:29:36 denshi (~chatzilla@cs6625176-26.austin.rr.com) has joined #openacs 16:30:51 hi denshi, have you seen lua? 16:31:05 heard of it, vaguely 16:31:16 i just heard it was easy to embed. 16:31:49 also this sounds interesting: "A fundamental concept in the design of Lua is to provide meta-mechanisms for implementing features, instead of providing a host of features directly in the language." 16:33:24 sounds like the LISP philosophy 16:35:43 i've been over a barrel trying to find a threadsafe Scheme interpreter 16:38:45 speaking of barrel, does anyone know how to symlink friggin openoffice??? 16:38:56 why is symlinking so friggin hard? am i that stupid? 16:39:00 don't anser that 16:40:09 how does one check where a symlink originates? 16:40:13 please answer that question 16:40:39 denshi: supposedlu mzscheme is... 16:40:49 talli ls symlink-name -l 16:41:18 why are you doing all this symlinking anyway. it usually means you screwed something up if you need all these links :) 16:41:29 thanks davb 16:41:45 well, that has been my experience anyway. 16:41:56 well, i want to be able to call soffice from other users of the system 16:42:07 install as root. 16:43:04 "MzScheme is an excellent embeddable Scheme with real-world features like threads, regular expressions, sockets, full-featured libraries, etc." 16:43:12 does not actually say "thread safe" 16:43:22 talli: is there a debian package 16:43:31 davb: i'm running RH7.3 16:43:34 i did install as root 16:43:37 talli: oh. 16:43:43 and it doesn't "just work"? 16:43:45 strange. 16:44:05 perhaps the user you are trying to run doesn';t have his path set correctly. 16:44:17 maybe 16:44:43 how might i check that? 16:44:50 login as user 16:44:53 echo $PATH 16:45:06 see if the place openoffice is installed is in the path. 16:45:15 it is set in ~/.bash_profile 16:45:47 according to the guy who recommened lua in the same sentence as ruby, he says mzscheme has the best libraries etc... 16:50:04 OldhamCR (~cro@defiant.nca.asu.edu) has joined #openacs 16:50:05 cro has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 16:51:45 hey OldhamCR 16:52:30 davb: mzscheme is decidedly NOT thread-safe 16:53:26 MzScheme can co-exist with additional OS-implemented threads that are created by an extension or an embedding program, but the additional OS threads must not call any scheme_ function. Only the OS thread that originally calls scheme_basic_env can call scheme_ functions. 16:53:41 I should have quoted that; it's from the manual. bah. 16:54:33 mzscheme does seem to have the best libraries, though 16:56:08 one neat thing about using schemes/lisps for web dev: you can create pages fully interpreted, but you can compile them later for speed, with no source change. also cool: the compile function is part of the language environment, so you can programmatically control when to compile pages. 16:58:59 denshi: how's paul graham's project coming along? 16:59:13 that guy has dropped off the face of the earth 16:59:31 uh oh 16:59:34 maybe he's hacking/ 16:59:35 ? 17:00:14 denshi has quit (Remote closed the connection) 17:00:54 well, that's an ironic exit 17:01:00 denshi (~chatzilla@cs6625176-26.austin.rr.com) has joined #openacs 17:01:13 denshi has quit (Remote closed the connection) 17:01:56 denshi (~chatzilla@cs6625176-26.austin.rr.com) has joined #openacs 17:02:15 man, this mozilla build is unstable 17:02:31 re: paul graham, yeah, I'd assume he's hacking 17:04:01 pete_openmsg has quit ("KVIrc 2.1.1 'Monolith'") 17:07:06 that should be pretty cool if he's hacking 17:07:19 this new language he's supposedly building is especially for the web? 17:08:13 it would be a *real* bummer if his languaeg turns out to be good 17:08:33 what will all the python/perl/java bigots do if all of a sudden there's a new language to love? 17:09:58 get on with their hating? 17:10:59 :) 17:11:31 i wonder when the language wars are going to spill out into the street and start burning cars 17:11:52 when hackers lose enough weight they can get out of their chairs 17:19:02 denshi has quit (Remote closed the connection) 17:19:56 I wonder which Mozilla denshi is using. 1.0rc1 and rc2 work well for me. 17:31:53 talli is now known as uglybarstool 17:32:02 denshi (~chatzilla@cs6625176-26.austin.rr.com) has joined #openacs 17:44:47 yippee 17:45:35 oh yeah. why is it impossible for a login page to tell you which of your name or password you mistyped. they all say, we can't find you name or password, we don't know which, try again. 17:45:53 Isn't that a security issue? 17:45:56 OldhamCR is now known as cro 17:46:39 i suppose. 17:46:55 that is probably the reason. 17:50:41 the language wars are over... everybody lost 17:51:42 heh 17:55:17 barstool is now known as talli 17:59:42 how many talli's are there? 17:59:49 there are two 17:59:53 and they are both evil 17:59:56 beware! 18:00:28 uglybarstool is my home IRC 18:00:31 barstool is at the office 18:00:44 ah. 18:17:57 wow, I am getting alot of hits (well several a day) from openacs.org/sites.html 18:33:14 Starets (~Starets@home.clickvision.com) has joined #openacs 19:06:11 Starets has left #openacs 19:19:11 sooooo quuuuuiiiieeeetttt 19:23:20 Heh, maybe people are actually working today? 19:23:36 (heaven forbid!) 19:23:52 hey shagster 19:24:08 did you get my question earlier? about whether i had told you abou momentum? 19:25:32 Nope, sorry 19:25:58 did i tell you about it, or did you miss the questions? 19:26:25 I don't recall either (I got pulled away from the computer for a while) 19:27:05 well, i'm working with some others to build a free calendar server: http://www.museatech.net/faq/momentum 19:29:02 Ahh, Okay I think you did mention that a while back, during my busy days 19:29:16 lotsa nuts to harvest, i imagine 19:29:23 are you interested in such a project? 19:29:36 we could use some mean sysadmin and C hackers... know any? 19:30:03 I know lots of mean people :) 19:30:15 with long and sharp knices... 19:30:35 I'd be interested (and I might know a few others that may have the time ) 19:30:40 that's killer 19:30:50 do you know C? 19:31:46 Yea, between b and d right ? :) 19:31:50 Bad_Buay (user@cable249a194.usuarios.retecal.es) has joined #openacs 19:32:12 is it between those? i thought it was up your ass. 19:32:12 Bad_Buay has quit (Client Quit) 19:32:34 [to talli]: No, that is where my head usually is :) 19:32:34 nice timing there, talli 19:32:37 Bad_Buay (user@cable249a194.usuarios.retecal.es) has joined #openacs 19:32:40 hi 19:32:52 thanks denshi 19:32:54 hey Bad_Buay 19:32:59 I try not to stuff anything in my donkey though 19:33:05 He doesn't like it :P 19:33:15 is good to have a chat like this, I just found it in the forum 19:33:16 =) 19:33:32 Bad_Buay: who are you on the boards? 19:33:39 Seriously though, I use to work exclusively in FORTRAN and C before I gave it up to be a sysadmin 19:33:48 ah, very cool 19:34:01 Jorge, but i didn't post 19:34:08 ah, well, welcome 19:34:28 I've been following openacs and acs since 2 years now 19:34:34 sorry for my English 19:34:35 =) 19:34:49 talli: jasperreports.sf.net 19:35:00 [to Bad_Buay]: Can't be any worse than mine, and it is my native tongue 19:35:05 I just install 4.5 cvs acs-core 19:35:08 talli: i think thats a different report toolkit then the one previously mentioned 19:35:12 hehehe 19:35:14 very cool, thanks 19:36:06 I'm using FreeBSD 4.5, pg7.1 and openacs 4.5, two days old version 19:36:22 Bad_Buay: cool! 19:36:23 it still with the new_user.tcl bug 19:36:30 freebsd can be a bit problematic, though 19:36:47 that's all i can say. my technical knowledge has been exhausted 19:36:50 really? why is freebsd problematic? 19:36:54 hehehe 19:37:09 aolserver doesn't play well with freebsd, IIRC 19:37:17 at least it didn't when we tried 19:37:43 did you try the patches? 19:37:55 not i. 19:51:30 til has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 19:51:30 davb has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 19:51:30 jim has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 19:51:30 Bad_Buay has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 19:51:30 cro has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 19:51:30 larspind has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 19:51:30 uglybarstool has quit (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 19:51:33 As long as you have the exec patch, it works fine 19:51:33 The only problem with AOLserver and FreeBSD is using exec, there is a patch for that though 19:51:54 Bad_Buay (user@cable249a194.usuarios.retecal.es) has joined #openacs 19:51:54 cro (~cro@defiant.nca.asu.edu) has joined #openacs 19:51:54 davb (~chatzilla@rrcs-nys-24-97-22-203.biz.rr.com) has joined #openacs 19:51:54 til (~tils@62.116.19.11) has joined #openacs 19:51:54 larspind (~none@213.237.67.169.adsl.by.worldonline.dk) has joined #openacs 19:51:54 uglybarstool (~talli@pool-162-83-235-2.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #openacs 19:51:54 jim (~jim@12-233-225-152.client.attbi.com) has joined #openacs 19:52:10 [#openacs] This channel is logged: http://www.blogspace.com/openacs/chatlogs/ and blogged: http://www.thedesignexperience.org/openacs/ircblog 19:52:11 I want to help make it easy to delete things in oacs, that's probably the closest to the core I get :) 19:52:47 yer all back again :) 19:53:33 yep 19:54:21 talli: it seems like the difference is applying that patch... seems like if you do that, your aolserver will work at least well enough to support {,O}ACS 19:55:21 Bad_Buay: I worked on a little bit of it. 19:55:46 that little bit is miles more than me :) 19:56:54 heh 19:58:28 well, gotta go, nice to meet you 19:58:29 c ya 19:58:32 Bad_Buay has left #openacs 20:01:23 * jim was wondering what bad_buay's actual question was... 20:01:30 oh well :) 20:10:53 davb_ (~chatzilla@rrcs-nys-24-97-22-203.biz.rr.com) has joined #openacs 20:10:53 davb has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20:11:00 davb_ is now known as davb 20:14:55 what are you up to davb? 20:15:20 goofing off. 20:15:27 I want to finish up some stuff for etp 2.0 20:16:49 plus actually learn to program :) 20:17:02 jim: did you email that guy about SICP? 20:17:04 you and me both 20:17:05 How is etp 2.0 coming? 20:17:18 what's the diff between etp 1 & 2? 20:19:20 etp 2 is easier to create custom types. 20:19:25 or will be. 20:19:34 image support? 20:19:56 davb: not yet... I did look to see if he was here tho 20:20:06 ok. 20:20:12 here as in irc? 20:20:28 yeah, that's where the original conversation took place 20:20:36 ah. 20:20:49 http://ootips.org/ 20:20:49 A: http://ootips.org/ from davb 20:20:57 A:| OOTIPS 20:20:57 titled item A 20:21:09 A: looks interesting if you need that sort of thing 20:21:09 added comment A1 20:21:15 oo! tips! 20:22:22 http://theflangynews.editthispage.com/2002/05/11 20:22:22 B: http://theflangynews.editthispage.com/2002/05/11 from davb 20:22:39 B: Programming anti-idioms 20:22:39 added comment B1 20:23:21 B:"It is also important to know what not to do. Just because a language allows a certain coding style doesn't mean that style is a good one." 20:23:22 added comment B2 20:23:25