IRC log of openacs on 2002-04-17

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:32:15 [lilo]
[Global Notice] Hi all. Please congratulate Bdale Garbee, the newly-elected Debian Project Leader. OPN extends its best wishes! :)
01:38:36 [markd2]
paje, FTS?
01:38:36 [paje]
markd2: wish i knew
01:38:41 [markd2]
what's the FTS system openacs uses?
01:55:55 [Homiephylax]
Homiephylax has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:00:39 [talilee]
talilee (~talli@lti-4.dialup.access.net) has joined #openacs
02:34:19 [Homiephylax]
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02:34:46 [davb]
openfts
02:35:02 [markd2]
thanks
02:35:06 [davb]
np.
02:35:13 [davb]
openfts.sourceforge.net
02:46:57 [markd2]
markd2 has quit ("wheeeee")
02:52:03 [denshi]
denshi (toddg@linux128.ma.utexas.edu) has joined #openacs
02:59:30 [davb]
denshi, all the links at ap5.com are broken :(
03:00:39 [davb]
and I know it is your fault.
03:02:28 [denshi]
yup.
03:02:37 [denshi]
even that guy's email is busted.
03:02:47 [davb]
darn.
03:02:59 [denshi]
turns out it's a 12-year old paper, with a minor revision in '96.
03:03:15 [denshi]
if I knew how, I would purge it from chump's memory.
03:04:46 [davb]
oh, i think there is a way.
03:04:51 [davb]
still is a cool idea.
03:07:30 [davb]
denshi, comments can be edited or deleted, but not the entire item.
03:09:01 [davb]
oh well, time to go. goodnight.
03:09:30 [denshi]
night
03:21:54 [davb]
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denshi has quit ("denshi has no reason")
11:31:12 [rbm]
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13:03:46 [til]
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13:20:01 [Homiephylax]
bah
13:20:01 [talilee]
talilee has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
13:20:16 [Homiephylax]
Homiephylax is now known as Pissedophylax
13:20:44 [Pissedophylax]
Have you ever had a day where you got out of bed and instantly knew you should just go back?
13:20:50 [Pissedophylax]
Today.....is one of those days
13:21:03 [til]
til (~tils@62.116.19.11) has joined #openacs
13:21:05 [markd2]
yep
13:21:24 [markd2]
usually for me those days involve a bad headache or coughing up lungs
13:21:29 [Pissedophylax]
eh
13:21:48 [Pissedophylax]
I already called Citibank
13:21:54 [Pissedophylax]
Sat in 45 minutes of traffic
13:22:04 [Pissedophylax]
and one of our labs Air Conditioning blew up
13:22:24 [markd2]
whoa
13:22:27 [markd2]
you're a disaster area
13:26:43 [Pissedophylax]
I know
13:28:33 [markd2]
maybe you should just go back to bed :-)
13:36:27 [Pissedophylax]
i should
13:36:31 [Pissedophylax]
I really really should
13:36:41 [markd2]
or bring a sleeping bag to the office
13:38:52 [Pissedophylax]
heh
13:38:56 [Pissedophylax]
I need to just quit work
13:39:09 [markd2]
go herd yaks in Mongolia
13:39:13 [markd2]
just arrange for a net connection
13:39:19 [markd2]
so you can continue to send me cookies
13:39:36 [Pissedophylax]
hahaha
13:39:42 [Pissedophylax]
yak milk cookies?
13:40:11 [markd2]
better than the goat milk version denshi keeps bringing
13:41:19 [rbm]
oom
13:41:46 [Pissedophylax]
Anyone have a FedEx account?
13:41:55 [rbm]
No
13:42:00 [rbm]
s/No/Not me/
13:42:08 [rbm]
Anyone here has used payment solutions?
13:42:28 [rbm]
e.g. Verisign's PayFlow Pro
13:42:39 [Pissedophylax]
heh, does anyone know if a FedEx account is free?
13:43:52 [Pissedophylax]
hehe
13:43:58 [Pissedophylax]
my browser must accept cookies
13:44:06 [Pissedophylax]
Well, it's not my fault Mark keeps stealing them!
13:46:56 [markd2]
robble robble
13:47:02 [markd2]
no wait, that's when I steal hamburgers
13:49:40 [Pissedophylax]
lol
14:08:13 [markd2]
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14:16:56 [markd2]
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14:16:59 [davb]
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14:17:13 [markd2]
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14:17:44 [Pissedophylax]
welcome back
14:18:03 [davb]
Pissedophylax: you just need a credit card.
14:18:14 [markd2]
alltel?
14:18:15 [paje]
alltel are a bunch of wankers
14:18:27 [davb]
for a fedex account
14:19:57 [rbm]
So what's bad about the ACS 3.x ecommerce module?
14:20:29 [Pissedophylax]
i have 2
14:20:42 [Pissedophylax]
oh
14:20:50 [Pissedophylax]
Dave, do they charge you to "have" the account
14:20:56 [Pissedophylax]
or only if you "use" the account?
14:21:10 [Pissedophylax]
I don't ship often
14:21:11 [rbm]
brb
14:21:24 [Pissedophylax]
So if I have to pay like 10$+ to "have" the account....I'll go broke
14:23:44 [Pissedophylax]
I need to clean my desk
14:24:03 [davb]
rbm: openacs 3 ecommerce is bad because everything is hard coded in, so you will need to rewrite most of the business logic that is trapped in tcl pages.
14:24:40 [davb]
all the triggers etc... are a big pain. it might be a good idea to move some of it to pl/pgsql if you can.
14:24:42 [jim]
where does business logic really belong, for specific case of openacs?
14:24:59 [davb]
jim: good question. I think in openacs 4, its in stored procedures.
14:25:15 [davb]
in openacs 3, it is hopelessly intertwined with display code.
14:25:28 [davb]
well, there are templates in ecommerce.
14:25:56 [jim]
what is Karl doing these days?
14:26:21 [jim]
(speaking of templating and its author...)
14:26:39 [davb]
jim: it is easy to use ecommerce if it does everything exactly the way you want it. if not it is alot of work. i rewrote most of the shopping cart code to calculate shipping in the cart instead of at checkout.
14:27:53 [jim]
would that same code go to a shipping company and ask for a quote?
14:28:11 [davb]
nah. i never got the far before the client bailed.
14:28:19 [jim]
oic
14:28:22 [davb]
they had fixed shipping per item.
14:28:34 [davb]
although now UPS and fedex i think have nice APIs
14:28:48 [davb]
you just need a zip code.
14:29:14 [Pissedophylax]
I think you need source, destination and weight
14:30:00 [jim]
(so for that case that particular company perhaps had a deal with a shipping co, or did shipping inhouse... general case might need to be more flexible
14:30:05 [davb]
well yeah
14:34:30 [jim]
I'd like to come uptodate with a calendar project I keep hearing about, a calendar server?
14:34:54 [davb]
yeah, to provide iCal/vCal data
14:35:02 [jim]
I think the first thing I'd like to know... is GPL?
14:35:06 [alltelsucks]
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14:35:32 [alltelsucks]
alltelsucks is now known as markd2
14:35:59 [davb]
oh, thats a talli question.
14:36:01 [jim]
or, URL to learn general facts
14:36:02 [jim]
yes
14:36:04 [davb]
i suspect so thought.
14:36:28 [davb]
that is all I know. i think there is a mailing list.
14:36:30 [Pissedophylax]
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,3054796~root=hwreviews~mode=flat
14:36:31 [oacs-chump]
A: http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,3054796~root=hwreviews~mode=flat from Pissedophylax
14:36:59 [Pissedophylax]
A:| The story of one man and his motherboard
14:36:59 [oacs-chump]
titled item A
14:37:22 [jim]
he's not here; I plan to ask him when he gets here (in the weeks before school ends for summer, I want to at least stay informed, if any more, would contribute code if GPL)
14:37:41 [jim]
ok
14:37:57 [jim]
paje, listkeys cal
14:37:57 [paje]
jim: sorry...
14:38:03 [jim]
dang
14:38:06 [jim]
no listkeys
14:38:51 [jim]
the blootbot project might have it (blootbot is modified and forked infobot)
14:39:01 [jim]
does paje use postgres?
14:39:28 [jim]
wait, yes he is here... he's barstool
14:39:39 [davb]
who's barstool?
14:39:42 [jim]
talli
14:39:47 [davb]
ah.
14:40:13 [jim]
still, I can wait till he wakes up :)
14:41:41 [rbm]
davb: what sort of things are hard coded?
14:41:45 [jim]
where can I read mroe about the iCal/vCal?
14:41:50 [jim]
morning rbm
14:42:31 [rbm]
hi jim
14:42:57 [rbm]
jim: Paje uses BDB.
14:43:07 [jim]
ahh
14:43:12 [rbm]
I think a modified infobot uses PG
14:43:20 [davb]
rbm: I have to think about it. one thing is the CC approval process/code assumes cybercash which I think is no more?
14:43:27 [rbm]
davb: Yeah.
14:44:33 [rbm]
davb: The reason I ask is because I'm doing this consulting foo in PHP (*sighs*) and I'm using the 3.x code as a guiding point to have an idea of what to do, and I'm using a good chunck to the datamodel.
14:44:46 [rbm]
(the 3.x code for e-commerce)
14:45:16 [rbm]
jim: Talli would know. There are rfc's for them, so some site that has them
14:45:34 [jim]
ok, cool
14:45:44 [rbm]
Every shopping cart I've looked for PHP uses MySQL. Every one of them.
14:46:02 [rbm]
I tried using that piece of crap, but it's way too much more trouble than it's worth.
14:47:43 [jim]
rbm: would it be good enuf at least to learn sql?
14:48:01 [jim]
(if not, pls elaborate)
14:48:03 [davb]
rbm: I thought I saw before some shopping cart that used postgresql.
14:48:17 [rbm]
jim: What?
14:48:18 [davb]
also might it not be easier to port an existing cart from mysql to postgresql?
14:48:35 [rbm]
Look at this "feature" of one of the PHP shopping carts: "# Easy to install, using just one table in MySQL"
14:49:21 [rbm]
davb: All the ones I looked that were decent were proprietary and cost a bunch of money. And then I still have to port it? For that money I can write my own.
14:50:03 [davb]
rbm: ah.
14:50:37 [davb]
i think the data model is OK actually.
14:55:32 [rbm]
I am using PHPLIB's template class to separate presentation and logic. It's very rudimentary compared to OpenACS' templating engine, but at least I get separate files for php and html
14:55:52 [rbm]
I extented the class so I could have a master template, much like OpenaCS
14:57:02 [rbm]
I've thought about releasing this code once I'm done, and after a little tweaking... however I'm afraid that if I did so, I'd have people pestering me about this project for a long time.
14:58:46 [rbm]
Look at this other PHP shopping cart "feature": "Databases are flat text files and you can edit them through your web browser or with a text editor"
15:00:03 [markd2]
* markd2 laughs
15:01:39 [davb]
oohhhh
15:01:46 [davb]
that seems pretty handy.
15:02:18 [davb]
and these are the people that make fun of postgresql and tcl...
15:02:32 [vinod]
vinod (~vinod@216-164-247-111.s2841.apx1.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com) has joined #openacs
15:02:58 [vinod]
hi everybuddy!
15:03:12 [rbm]
A while ago I looked into porting one of these MySQL shopping carts to PostgreSQL... but it seems that _everybody_ that develops for MySQL is completely and totally clueless about everything, so their code is hideous.
15:03:12 [davb]
VINOD!
15:03:23 [rbm]
hey vinod
15:03:31 [rbm]
vinod: You'll be at the social next week right?
15:03:54 [vinod]
yup - i'm pretty sure!
15:04:14 [markd2]
Vinodster!
15:04:23 [rbm]
vinod: Excellent, we'll meet each other face to face then.
15:04:27 [rbm]
Who else will be there?
15:04:29 [vinod]
rbm: cool!
15:04:34 [barstool]
barstool is now known as talli
15:04:38 [talli]
oh well well well
15:04:43 [talli]
if it isn't vinod
15:04:46 [rbm]
oh, talli was hiding :-)
15:04:46 [vinod]
damn, i was about to sit on that barstool
15:05:11 [talli]
you're butt isn't holy enough
15:05:57 [vinod]
i'm here 2 min and talli's already talkin bout my butt
15:06:36 [vinod]
markd2: it's going to take me a year to get thru all the new borklog links
15:07:09 [talli]
vinod, the KGB couldn't wrap you up and through you in siberia?
15:07:09 [markd2]
muahahahaha
15:07:14 [talli]
they must really be getting pathetic
15:09:23 [davb]
markd2: wow! dangermouse
15:10:39 [vinod]
heh - didn't see any kgb agents. moscow was awesome though
15:11:00 [markd2]
wonder if dangermouse is out on DVD
15:12:33 [jim]
talli: ahh, good, you're here
15:12:49 [jim]
questions about calendar server
15:13:00 [rbm]
AAAAAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHH!H!!!!!!!!
15:13:02 [davb]
they used to have VHS.
15:13:09 [jim]
1, is the code free software?
15:13:15 [jim]
(gpl?)
15:13:40 [jim]
2, where to learn more about data formats/
15:13:42 [jim]
?
15:13:59 [rbm]
http://www.usu.edu/about/webcam/
15:14:00 [oacs-chump]
B: http://www.usu.edu/about/webcam/ from rbm
15:14:16 [rbm]
It's snowing, AGAIN!!$!)(*)*)!%$@#!$%@!$#!^
15:14:34 [davb]
rbm: its 80 here
15:14:45 [davb]
wacky weather
15:15:12 [rbm]
It snowed yesterday, about 2-3 inches. By the end of the day everything had melted.
15:15:44 [rbm]
Now it's snowing big flakes (started about 30 mins ago) and the grass is already all white.
15:16:03 [jim]
he's not hertalli: in the weeks before school ends for summer, I want to at least stay informed about the calendar project, if any more, would contribute code if GPL... after school ends, I;m very interested in doing calendar type stuff, want to present users with their own events calendars
15:16:29 [jim]
oops, s/^he's not her//
15:16:39 [talli]
hey jim
15:16:45 [jim]
morning
15:16:54 [talli]
sorry
15:16:59 [talli]
was reading an article in another windo
15:17:01 [talli]
window
15:17:07 [jim]
no worries :)
15:17:16 [talli]
i really like using KDE and having different frames.
15:17:25 [talli]
but it's hard to keep up with chats!
15:17:31 [talli]
anyway, there is no code yet
15:17:39 [rbm]
* rbm can't use KDE because it slows his wimpy machine to a crawl
15:17:44 [jim]
planning stages?
15:17:59 [talli]
we're still in the process of recruiting volunteers, pulling together the spec, evaluating what's out there, etc
15:18:12 [markd2]
storage compartments?
15:18:12 [paje]
storage compartments
15:18:12 [jim]
what are your thoughts as far as license?
15:18:26 [vinod]
we need to set up a loadbalancer in front of the tallibot so he can respond to multiple questions at once
15:18:42 [talli]
i certainly plan on building GPL code, but there are others that aren't so supportive of it
15:18:51 [talli]
at worst, it will be dual license, GPL and MPL
15:19:44 [jim]
sounds pretty good, as long as licensees can't prevent others from GPLing
15:19:49 [talli]
vinod: the tallibot just needs a few pints of beer from redbones
15:20:01 [talli]
then he gets seriously scalabale
15:20:07 [talli]
scalable, too
15:20:17 [jim]
scale? bale? pale ale.
15:20:18 [vinod]
ahh, it runs on BeerML
15:23:53 [jim]
talli: so would I be able to store things like appointments/events?
15:24:08 [talli]
jim: yes, that's the idea
15:24:23 [talli]
the hope is to build an app that is similar to AOLserver in architecture
15:24:43 [jim]
can I say to this thing, "here's an object, schedule it for this event"
15:24:43 [talli]
the core server code written in a C and with tight DB integration
15:24:51 [rbm]
There would be serious interest in such a project
15:24:54 [talli]
and a high-level scripting language to implement biz logic
15:24:57 [jim]
err, s/can/will I be able to/
15:25:16 [jim]
but haven't you just now reinvented ACS?
15:25:23 [jim]
(or parts of it?)
15:25:36 [talli]
well, to a degree, it might be
15:26:12 [jim]
reason I say that, is I see it could be possible to do the server as an acs service package
15:26:26 [talli]
in other words you might have to build a packages to re-use data models and so on
15:26:44 [talli]
jim: that's pretty much exactly what i'd like to avoid
15:26:49 [jim]
hmm
15:26:56 [talli]
this thing should be JUST A CALENDAR server
15:27:03 [talli]
as sendmail is to email
15:27:07 [jim]
so acs would instead have a client package
15:27:32 [talli]
oacs != aolserver
15:27:42 [talli]
and aolserver is usually better than oacs
15:27:55 [jim]
well, except for TCL
15:28:07 [talli]
?
15:28:34 [talli]
btw, let's take this convo to the IRC channel for the project, which is #momentum
15:28:36 [jim]
I can't help it... I don't get along with TCL very much :)
15:28:53 [talli]
the scripting language will be python ;)
15:29:05 [jim]
cool, I can get with learning that
15:34:40 [markd2]
I think you should use javascript for all your scripting
15:35:05 [davb]
what? vbscript
15:35:22 [markd2]
that's for the "Enterprise" edition
15:35:40 [davb]
aigh. in this application, there is a query with a full join on a huge table that is not used for anything...
15:35:45 [talli]
personally, i prefer Gaelic Script
15:39:15 [markd2]
u r so gaelic
15:44:33 [rbm]
* rbm heads to school
16:06:58 [Pissedophylax]
woot
16:07:00 [Pissedophylax]
I love newegg
16:07:16 [markd2]
newegg?
16:07:24 [Pissedophylax]
www.newegg.com
16:07:34 [Pissedophylax]
If you ever need computer parts...buy them from them
16:08:12 [Pissedophylax]
first motherboard I got was DOA
16:08:40 [Pissedophylax]
So they sent me a 2nd one free 2nd day FedEx...Then the board I really wanted became available, so I re-routed the package to them
16:08:51 [Pissedophylax]
Called up today and ordered the one I wanted with 5$ overnight
16:10:01 [davb]
and that all worked?
16:17:25 [Pissedophylax]
yep
16:17:25 [vinod]
vinod has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
16:28:21 [talli]
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2002/04/17/MN159417.DTL
16:28:22 [oacs-chump]
C: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2002/04/17/MN159417.DTL from talli
16:28:41 [talli]
C: Another reason to use PostgreSQL - Oracle fleeces California
16:28:41 [oacs-chump]
added comment C1
16:30:48 [Pissedophylax]
food
16:30:56 [Pissedophylax]
Pissedophylax is now known as Foodiephylax
16:31:42 [jim]
hmmm, don't get the pissed on the foodie :)
16:31:57 [jim]
* jim is hungry too now
16:39:17 [davb]
oops, time for lunch, now I can relax and hit my head against the wall instead of untangling this mess of an "application"
16:46:13 [markd2]
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17:20:10 [Foodiephylax]
m1d3tz
17:20:14 [Foodiephylax]
oops
17:20:20 [Foodiephylax]
m1dg3tz
17:22:26 [denshi]
denshi (~chatzilla@adsl-216-62-223-193.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) has joined #openacs
17:29:51 [Foodiephylax]
Foodiephylax is now known as Workiephylax
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18:18:32 [markd2]
markd2 is now known as my_ass
18:18:38 [my_ass]
my_ass is now known as markd2
18:23:22 [Workiephylax]
paje seen your_ass
18:23:22 [paje]
I haven't seen 'your_ass', Workiephylax
18:23:27 [Workiephylax]
that's a good thing
18:23:35 [Workiephylax]
paje seen my_ass
18:23:35 [paje]
I haven't seen 'my_ass', Workiephylax
18:23:51 [markd2]
heh
18:23:53 [Workiephylax]
Too bad, Mark had his ass in your face just a few seconds ago
18:24:24 [Workiephylax]
That's probably why you haven't seen yours paje, marks was blocking out the view
18:24:47 [markd2]
it's HUGE
18:24:58 [Workiephylax]
ROFL
18:25:35 [Workiephylax]
i am very sleepy again
18:25:54 [Workiephylax]
i blame it on lunch
18:27:41 [talli]
is davb here?
18:27:52 [talli]
davb: what does it take to get RSS in oacs?
18:28:04 [talli]
i remember you talking about buildng it in. shouldn't be too bad, right?
18:29:47 [davb]
talli, its in
18:29:59 [markd2]
gee, that was easy
18:30:00 [davb]
well what exactly do you want to do with it.
18:30:08 [talli]
oh great!
18:30:20 [davb]
i have ETP exporting data as RSS. you can output rss from content.
18:30:29 [talli]
wow! killer!
18:30:31 [davb]
you can't suck RSS in to the database and use it though.
18:30:45 [talli]
what does it take to suck it in?
18:30:48 [davb]
but it only works for my weblog application.
18:31:04 [davb]
talli: depends. neophytos was working on something.
18:31:27 [davb]
you can parse it and stuff it in the database, or store the rss and manipulate it with xslt
18:40:30 [markd2]
http://www.customearpiece.com/
18:40:31 [oacs-chump]
D: http://www.customearpiece.com/ from markd2
18:40:36 [markd2]
D:| UI suggestions for the new openacs.org
18:40:37 [oacs-chump]
titled item D
18:41:18 [davb]
D: I am not sure they are using the RGB color space to it's fullest potential
18:41:18 [oacs-chump]
added comment D1
18:43:42 [talli]
i once managed to get my vomit looking almost as good as that
18:43:55 [talli]
i would say that it was a little farther northeast on the color wheel, though
18:55:28 [denshi]
davb, what are the components of RSS?
18:58:20 [davb]
what do you mean by components? what openacs needs? or describe the file format?
18:59:33 [denshi]
what oacs part does it pull together?
19:00:32 [davb]
the rss-support package basically defines a couple of service contracts. if you package can fulfill those contracts rss-support will create an rss file based on the content you send it.
19:01:01 [davb]
the rss general is all text based. no xml processing is required.
19:01:02 [talli]
so the feed can be anything from ETP articles to bug submissions?
19:01:18 [davb]
sure. if someone writes the service contract.
19:01:23 [talli]
killer!
19:01:29 [talli]
how hard is the service contract to write?
19:01:38 [davb]
it was tricky with ETP because each APP is a content-type and each content-type needs a service contract.
19:01:58 [davb]
not bad. a few lines of SQL to define it. and tcl to provide the actual content.
19:02:44 [davb]
can you get to : http://www.thedesignexperience.org/rss/doc/
19:03:38 [talli]
very cool!
19:07:43 [talli]
i was chatting with jim and griznog in the #momentum channel
19:07:58 [talli]
and griznog brought up the way that exchange does permissioning
19:08:06 [talli]
he said it uses something called ACL
19:08:20 [markd2]
markd2 has quit ("Bork")
19:08:32 [talli]
an Access Control List
19:08:40 [davb]
brb
19:08:53 [talli]
apparently a very simple interface for addressing permissioning schemes
19:09:18 [talli]
how he described it, it sounded a lot like RDF
19:09:37 [talli]
it made me realize that using RDF for momentum might be the right way of implementing permissions
19:09:55 [talli]
like, 1) i am talli 2) my friend is davb 3) davb can see my calendar
19:10:02 [markd2]
markd2 (~Snak@h166-102-041-128.ip.alltel.net) has joined #openacs
19:10:03 [talli]
might this work for OACS?
19:11:40 [denshi]
oacs already does something more complex than ACLs.
19:12:02 [talli]
complex may and may not be better, thopugh
19:12:11 [denshi]
in this case it is.
19:12:16 [talli]
ok
19:12:28 [denshi]
just to review the history, ACLs are ancient history.
19:12:37 [talli]
ah, ok
19:12:43 [denshi]
they had them back on MULTICS, if I remember correctly.
19:13:11 [denshi]
and different OSes and apps have implemented the concept differently and at different times.
19:15:10 [denshi]
anyway, there's a conflict between keeping the security of keeping ACLs around for each filesytem/object-tree node, versus space requirements for markd2's cookies and execution time of searching through acls on each node.
19:15:25 [denshi]
maybe someone has a really nice indexes acl system, but I don't know enough to say.
19:16:36 [denshi]
the OACS4 permission system is a neater hack on this, b/c the 'this permission on this distinct object' contains the ACL behaviour, but having the permission apply over trees of users and objects conserves space and time.
19:16:54 [talli]
ah, ok
19:16:55 [denshi]
ergo, oacs does something better than ACLs.
19:17:00 [talli]
i see
19:17:02 [denshi]
and mark owes me a cookie.
19:17:54 [talli]
http://www.w3.org/2000/01/sw/#access
19:17:54 [oacs-chump]
E: http://www.w3.org/2000/01/sw/#access from talli
19:18:08 [talli]
E: link to articles on using RDF for access to data
19:18:08 [oacs-chump]
added comment E1
19:18:38 [markd2]
I need to set up a signal generator when my cookie supply is regenerated
19:23:07 [talli]
markd2: that's the holy grail of FREE SOFTWARE!!!!
19:23:10 [talli]
cookie signaler
19:23:43 [Workiephylax]
LOL
19:23:58 [Workiephylax]
* Workiephylax gives mark a cookie
19:24:02 [markd2]
yay!
19:24:07 [markd2]
* markd2 hands the cookie to denshi
19:24:08 [markd2]
since I owe him one
19:24:18 [markd2]
cookie debt is a horrible thing
19:24:21 [Workiephylax]
* Workiephylax gives mark another cookie
19:24:22 [talli]
* talli sits in his corner, wondering where all the cookies have gone
19:24:33 [markd2]
you're just a bot
19:24:37 [Workiephylax]
* Workiephylax shakes his head and gives talli a cookie
19:26:38 [talli]
* talli eats the cookie while glaring at markd2 for insulting his material being
19:28:48 [Workiephylax]
* Workiephylax forgets to tell talli about the poison
19:29:35 [markd2]
oopsie
19:29:46 [talli]
* talli is not worried about the poison as he is a bot.
19:30:38 [Workiephylax]
* Workiephylax whispers to mark..."He does bring up a valid point..let's chase him with mallots"
19:31:19 [talli]
* talli , however, is armed with plenty of high powered plasma rockets that are to be used in case of his attempted assination
19:32:04 [Workiephylax]
b0t
19:32:06 [markd2]
hmm.. mallots vs plasma rockets
19:32:10 [markd2]
I think he'd win
19:33:39 [rbm]
oom
19:34:54 [talli]
hey rbm
19:35:23 [markd2]
rbm is armed with PHP shopping carts
19:35:26 [markd2]
I think he trumps all of us
19:35:59 [Workiephylax]
ROFL
19:36:02 [Workiephylax]
* Workiephylax folds
19:36:15 [talli]
well, at least it's not acs 3.x ecommerce
19:36:21 [talli]
that is the ultimate app
19:36:42 [talli]
i mean, killer app
19:36:44 [talli]
literally
19:36:58 [talli]
with a silver bullet
19:37:03 [talli]
and fangs
19:37:25 [talli]
and a fat german aunt brought to fiercely scrub your genitals
19:37:35 [markd2]
tease
19:38:16 [talli]
in my european history course in high school, we used the Palmer text book of modern Euro history
19:39:14 [talli]
in the book, he mentions that somewhere around nineteenth century prussia, they used to punish the young who were careless with their hormones by having large ugly women vigoursly wash their genitals
19:39:50 [markd2]
sounds like a job for paje
19:40:10 [Workiephylax]
LOL
19:42:13 [rbm]
* rbm shoots some PHP bullets
19:42:31 [talli]
is php bad? or is that just religious bias?
19:43:14 [rbm]
PHP has issues.
19:43:28 [rbm]
Some of them are really annoying.
19:43:33 [markd2]
"so if you've ever used C, Java, or Perl. PHP will be familiar because
19:43:33 [markd2]
it combines the worst of each language. But none of the powerful
19:43:33 [markd2]
parts. It looks a lot like cold fusion.
19:43:33 [markd2]
-- Rzolf
19:43:41 [talli]
haha
19:43:49 [rbm]
That's absolutely true
19:43:53 [talli]
but rzolf and docwolf have become two proponents of php
19:44:08 [talli]
at least docwolf is always telling me how php is a perfectly fine dev enviro
19:46:09 [rbm]
I'm not religiously biased to anything AFAIK
19:48:11 [markd2]
I am
19:48:14 [rbm]
Anybody knows a good ICQ client for Linux?
19:48:14 [markd2]
BURN!!BURN!BURN!
19:48:48 [rbm]
Licq has this awful "feature" of spawning 500 threads if I leave it running overnight
19:56:50 [rbm]
brb
20:01:53 [denshi]
* denshi has been kidnapped by a client.
20:02:04 [denshi]
* denshi stops to eat mark's cookie, tho. thx.
20:30:05 [markd2]
markd2 has quit ("wheeeee")
20:33:17 [davb]
bye
20:33:21 [davb]
davb has quit ()
20:37:48 [vinod]
vinod (~vinod@209-122-234-39.s2103.apx2.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com) has joined #openacs
20:52:16 [denshi]
vinod!
20:52:48 [vinod]
denshi!
20:54:08 [denshi]
kpants!
20:54:47 [denshi]
so are you back in the states?
20:55:00 [vinod]
yup! got back to boston last night
20:56:03 [denshi]
coolio. I'm closing in on my move date. when do you enter the dragon^H^H^H^H^H^H New York?
20:56:26 [vinod]
heh. hopefully june 1st.
20:56:29 [vinod]
where are you moving?
20:58:34 [denshi]
to my hizouse in austin
20:59:19 [denshi]
you've found a place then, in manhattan?
20:59:19 [vinod]
ahhh - you're a land owner now
20:59:30 [vinod]
no - not yet... that's the next project
21:03:40 [vinod]
it's f*&#ing hot here!
21:04:26 [vinod]
i want my A/C :-)
21:06:08 [rbm]
It's fscking cold here!
21:06:15 [rbm]
I want my heater
21:06:55 [rbm]
* rbm peeks outside
21:06:58 [vinod]
heh - i think we should switch places. i love snow :-)
21:07:02 [rbm]
Ah, nice, the snow melted
21:07:17 [vinod]
it's 93 degrees here and they haven't turned the heat off or the a/c on yet
21:07:40 [rbm]
vinod: I love snow too, but after having it literally on my face and everywhere else for 6 months, it's time for a break
21:07:47 [vinod]
haha
21:08:12 [rbm]
It started snowing in November, and this is mid april!@#!@$!$#%@
21:08:23 [vinod]
true... that's what we used to say about winter in wisconsin - it's the best 6 months of the year
21:08:26 [denshi]
so were you back in india these past couple weeks, vinod?
21:08:32 [rbm]
vinod: Yikes. They need to turn that heater off
21:08:47 [rbm]
* rbm has _lots_ of class mates from India
21:08:51 [vinod]
denshi: no, i was in moscow and finland
21:09:12 [denshi]
whoa. what'd you see?
21:09:12 [vinod]
haven't been back to india in 4 yrs or so, but i'm hoping to make it there in september
21:09:36 [vinod]
i was in each place for 5 days.
21:09:48 [vinod]
in moscow, we did all the touristy things
21:09:52 [rbm]
In a class I had last semester, out of 48 students in the class, 36 were from India, 7 were from China, 4 were from the U.S. and 1 from Brazil (me)
21:10:12 [vinod]
went to the bolshoy theater for ballet (which was amazing!), the pushkin museum, the kremlin
21:10:21 [vinod]
saw a bunch of tsar's palaces
21:10:26 [rbm]
wow, cool. /me would love to travel around the world
21:10:46 [vinod]
the history there is just overwhelming
21:11:18 [rbm]
"tsar"? You mean "kzar"?
21:11:37 [vinod]
in finland, we were visiting some old friends, so it was more laid back, but still had a lot of fun
21:11:58 [vinod]
rbm: dunno - what's a kzar?
21:12:34 [rbm]
vinod: The old rulers of Russia/Prussia.
21:12:36 [vinod]
by tsar, i mean the old royalty of russia. catherine the great, peter the great, ivan the terrible, etc
21:12:50 [rbm]
Yeah, that's what I'm referring to.
21:12:58 [talli]
rbm: i think the term is tsar
21:13:21 [rbm]
Ahh, it's Czar.
21:13:22 [rbm]
From Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary (1913) [web1913]:
21:13:22 [rbm]
Tsar \Tsar\, n.
21:13:22 [rbm]
The title of the emperor of Russia. See {Czar}.
21:13:31 [rbm]
From Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary (1913) [web1913]:
21:13:31 [rbm]
Czar \Czar\ (z["a]r), n. [Russ. tsare, fr. L. Caesar C[ae]sar;
21:13:31 [rbm]
cf. OPol. czar, Pol. car. ]
21:13:31 [rbm]
A king; a chief; the title of the emperor of Russia. [Written
21:13:31 [rbm]
also {tzar}
21:13:35 [vinod]
yeah - those guys :-)
21:13:53 [rbm]
* rbm hugs dict
21:17:26 [denshi]
'tsar' comes from the name of the tribal nomads that came out on top in pre-russian russia. 'czar' is the modern equivalent.
21:19:07 [paje]
paje has quit ("regrouping; bbiab")
21:28:45 [vinod]
Signoff: page ("stack overflow: too many spellings for a word we'll never use in this channel again")
21:29:55 [denshi]
I dunno....
21:30:08 [denshi]
denshi is now known as cookie_czar
21:30:28 [vinod]
all hail the cookie_czar!
21:32:48 [cookie_czar]
* cookie_czar doesn't hear enough hailing.
21:33:42 [vinod]
* vinod suspects a coup is brewing
21:34:32 [vinod]
* vinod suddenly has a craving for coffee
21:35:11 [rbm]
I went into single user because I'm getting funny errors from apt, so I fsck'd /var
21:42:59 [rbm]
I think my HD is foobar'd
21:44:07 [cookie_czar]
my HDs are kept alive through sheer force of will.
21:45:01 [cookie_czar]
they've already entered the phase of raising a joyful noise everytime I boot up; next up- head crashes.
21:47:54 [rbm]
This drive is not even 6 months old
21:48:03 [rbm]
I sholud've known better and never have gotten an IBM
21:48:20 [talli]
IBM's are supposed to be good, no?
21:48:43 [rbm]
No, they're horrible.
21:49:10 [rbm]
I've heard of more failures (recently) of IBM drives than any other brand
21:50:04 [cookie_czar]
yeah, 'recently' is the key. a year ago they were the best.
22:15:53 [markd2]
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22:34:20 [cookie_czar]
hey mark
22:46:22 [markd2]
heh
22:46:29 [markd2]
all my cookies are *not* belong to tallibot
22:47:02 [markd2]
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til has quit ("BitchX: No windows left!")
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23:24:06 [talilee_]
talilee_ is now known as barstool
23:36:05 [rbm]
hey barstool
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