IRC log of openacs on 2002-03-18

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:22:37 [davb]

has anyone used the template::util::multirow_to_list proc?

00:27:32 [k2pts]

k2pts (~nkd@213.149.180.151) has joined #openacs

00:27:36 [k2pts]

hey guys

00:27:39 [davb]

hi k2pts

00:27:42 [k2pts]

hey dave

00:27:53 [k2pts]

I'm gonna send a friend here from cyprus...so be nice with him ;)

00:27:59 [davb]

np :)

00:28:04 [k2pts]

I'm trying to get more people involved in free software projects

00:28:48 [davb]

great. you are the Cyprus LUG :)

00:29:12 [k2pts]

no, there are no such things in cyprus

00:29:24 [k2pts]

:)

00:30:58 [Chris0000]

Chris0000 (noBan@li-11-46.cytanet.com.cy) has joined #openacs

00:31:30 [k2pts]

davb: Chris0000 is the guy I was tellin you about

00:32:08 [Chris0000]

hey guyz

00:32:17 [davb]

Welcome Chris0000

00:32:26 [Chris0000]

thnx davb

00:32:28 [k2pts]

I just told Christos about openacs

00:32:36 [k2pts]

he is rookie but not for long...

00:33:01 [k2pts]

davb: didn't have time to look at the rss stuff

00:33:31 [k2pts]

I was thinking to use xslt to parse adp files and include them as somekind of portlets..what do you think?

00:34:43 [davb]

interesting. how is that better than what we have now? also how will the xslt get the tcl variables?

00:35:01 [k2pts]

the ns_xml module doesn't parse the xslt files as expected

00:35:15 [k2pts]

davb: how do I get paje to log something for christos?

00:36:06 [k2pts]

I was thinking that after we fetch the feeds, to store them in the file system...don't see why we need tcl vars...please elaborate

00:36:06 [davb]

I am not sure what you mean.

00:36:16 [k2pts]

paje: christos is a hell of a coder

00:36:16 [paje]

OK, k2pts.

00:36:23 [k2pts]

paje: who is christos?

00:36:23 [paje]

well, christos is a hell of a coder

00:36:25 [davb]

ah, you mean rss?

00:36:30 [k2pts]

yes

00:36:34 [davb]

ok. sorry :)

00:36:43 [k2pts]

paje: spank talli

00:36:43 [paje]

k2pts: what?

00:36:49 [k2pts]

paje: again

00:36:49 [paje]

k2pts: what?

00:36:57 [k2pts]

paje: again?

00:36:57 [paje]

wish i knew, k2pts

00:37:04 [davb]

must have been removed from his memory.

00:37:23 [k2pts]

yeap

00:37:32 [k2pts]

paje: who is talli?

00:37:32 [paje]

i think talli is the slayer of innocent domo-kuns the world over.

00:37:36 [k2pts]

:)

00:37:44 [davb]

k2pts: My idea has usually been to provide the data to a package/template and let the template decide how to display or use it.

00:38:36 [k2pts]

we need the ns_xml stuff to work for that, I think...

00:39:06 [k2pts]

storing it in the filesystem, is just some intermediate state for parsing it into adp files

00:39:29 [k2pts]

and then just include them with templates...we can always modify 10-to-xhtml.xsl

00:39:56 [davb]

right. but if I want to change the html of the display of the rss, I need to modify the stylesheet instead of my adp template.

00:40:19 [k2pts]

right...

00:40:26 [k2pts]

it's not the best solution but it's a start

00:40:47 [k2pts]

do you know what happened with the guy who was going to work on improving the ns_xml stuff?

00:42:06 [davb]

k2pts: that is why I parse the rss into a nsv variable. (on my old non-openacs aolserver site)

00:42:13 [k2pts]

paje: seen hazmat?

00:42:13 [paje]

hazmat was last seen on #openacs 2 hours, 42 minutes and 44 seconds ago, saying: thats a strange concept. [Sun Mar 17 15:01:30 2002]

00:42:17 [davb]

I don't know who was planning on working on ns_xml.

00:42:27 [k2pts]

let me get the url

00:42:37 [davb]

it shouldn't be too hard. it is just a little wrapper on libxml2. hardly any code really.

00:43:11 [rbm]

hey k2pts!

00:43:13 [k2pts]

http://openacs.org/new-file-storage/download/nsxml-2.html?version_id=477

00:43:13 [chump]

A: http://openacs.org/new-file-storage/download/nsxml-2.html?version_id=477 from k2pts

00:43:16 [k2pts]

hey rbm

00:43:25 [k2pts]

rbm: let me introduce to Christos

00:43:53 [davb]

k2pts: wow, I never saw that.

00:43:53 [k2pts]

Chris0000: rbm is our documentation maintainer and one of the openacs gatekeepers...

00:44:12 [Chris0000]

Chris0000 is now known as Chris^

00:44:32 [Chris^]

ic

00:44:41 [k2pts]

paje: who is rbm?

00:44:41 [paje]

i heard rbm was Roberto, http://www.brasileiro.net/

00:44:46 [rbm]

hi Chris^

00:44:55 [Chris^]

hey rbm

00:45:07 [k2pts]

rbm: Chris is a 3rd year CS student at the university of cyprus

00:45:23 [rbm]

Nice.

00:45:25 [k2pts]

I have known him for almost half a decade...he participated in the valkan olympiads in informatics

00:45:33 [Chris^]

what u're trying to do is very nice u guyz

00:45:38 [rbm]

* rbm is also a 3rd year CS student and he is graduating in MAY!!!!

00:46:24 [Chris^]

how's it going rbm ?

00:46:41 [k2pts]

rbm: what's the word for 3rd year student (sophomore,etc)

00:47:02 [rbm]

k2pts: junior. But I'm a senior :)

00:47:07 [k2pts]

:)

00:47:39 [davb]

that ns_xml plan looks really good. A decent C hacker could probably handle it in a short time.

00:48:06 [k2pts]

yeah it's pretty nice but I have already told you which one I prefer...to bad it's MPL

00:48:14 [k2pts]

s/to/too

00:48:32 [k2pts]

paje: insult Chris^

00:48:33 [paje]

Chris^ is nothing but an unoriginal thimbleful of bootless Stimpy-drool.

00:48:33 [k2pts]

:)

00:48:40 [Chris^]

!!!

00:48:46 [davb]

right. I also would prefera real DOM parser instead of the pseudo dom one hacked in nsxml.

00:49:02 [k2pts]

exactly

00:49:13 [k2pts]

paje: insult talli

00:49:13 [paje]

talli is nothing but an unoriginal thimbleful of beef-witted craptacular carpet droppings.

00:49:26 [rbm]

* rbm tries to finish his cheat sheet

00:49:27 [k2pts]

rbm: I like paje a lot

00:49:28 [davb]

TclDOM uses expat also. I wonder where the performance hit is.

00:49:38 [davb]

I guess its in the TclDOM code :)

00:49:52 [k2pts]

I don't know...but there was an article at developer works and Zoran is mentioned there

00:50:21 [davb]

Yes, I recall that.

00:50:58 [k2pts]

rbm: for the first time ever "theory of computation" had an easy exam last friday...everybody was smiling...first time ever

00:51:00 [k2pts]

:)

00:52:25 [davb]

k2pts: reportedly:" Just an update. I'm testing ns_xml 2.0 now, "

00:52:43 [k2pts]

where did you get it from? :)

00:53:05 [davb]

here: http://openacs.org/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=0003me&topic_id=OpenACS%204%2e0%20Design&topic=12

00:53:27 [rbm]

k2pts: Oh. I'm taking that class here too, and I have an exam wednesday.

00:53:43 [davb]

if he needs someone to test I definitely will help him out.

00:53:51 [Chris^]

no sweat rbm :)

00:54:08 [rbm]

:)

00:54:31 [rbm]

The cheat sheet I'm preparing is for my Multimedia Development's exam, which is tomorrow

00:54:49 [rbm]

s/'s//

00:54:52 [k2pts]

davb: it's been a while since that post...

00:55:12 [Chris^]

rbm: are you going to have a project ?

00:56:03 [k2pts]

paje: who is GEM

00:56:03 [paje]

GEM is installing on GEM's Debian system, and hate to sully it with non-aptable stuff if I can help it :-)

00:56:11 [jim]

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00:56:15 [k2pts]

hey jim

00:56:16 [jim]

re

00:56:19 [davb]

hi jim

00:56:21 [jim]

hi k2pts

00:56:29 [jim]

hya davb

00:56:48 [Chris^]

hey jimy

00:56:50 [k2pts]

davb, jim: how's the packages contract goes?

00:57:00 [k2pts]

jim: Chris^ is from Cyprus

00:57:05 [k2pts]

paje: who is jim?

00:57:06 [paje]

jim is as jim does

00:57:10 [k2pts]

:)

00:57:24 [k2pts]

Chris^: jim...he's a lot into Debian stuff...

00:57:29 [k2pts]

jim: right?

00:57:36 [jim]

yeah, I'm a debian maint

00:58:04 [davb]

* davb emails

00:58:18 [k2pts]

davb: for the ns_xml 2.0 ?

00:59:17 [davb]

yes.

00:59:45 [k2pts]

would love to know what comes out of it? :)

00:59:55 [jim]

k2pts: we have an initial plan on the contracting, involving the creation of a contract with a single operation (I just had another idea on that, davb) which takes a package instance id and removes all data associated with that instance

01:00:26 [k2pts]

sounds good to me...I have read part of the chatlogs but not into the details

01:01:28 [jim]

I was thinking something along the lines of this:

01:02:00 [jim]

a second call that removes data associated with all instances of the package

01:02:42 [jim]

so the first one could be a no-op if desired for certain packages

01:02:56 [k2pts]

are you going to do a contract for removing stuff...I think a more general contract would be better IMHO...

01:03:06 [k2pts]

s/stuff/stuff only

01:03:52 [jim]

well, now's the time to throw out ideas on the contract...

01:04:07 [jim]

we haven't even tried anything yet ;)

01:04:18 [k2pts]

I have thought about aggregators in the past but never get around implementing one

01:04:29 [jim]

* jim might need a new somethingorother (mobo? mem? video?)

01:04:32 [k2pts]

aggregating packages that si

01:04:44 [k2pts]

s/si/is

01:05:27 [jim]

before I get too far, slipped my mind you just made an introduction...

01:05:34 [jim]

Hiya Chris^ :)

01:05:46 [Chris^]

n/p jim

01:05:47 [Chris^]

s/n

01:05:52 [jim]

what's Cyprus?

01:05:55 [k2pts]

heh

01:05:58 [Chris^]

s/n\/p/np/

01:06:23 [k2pts]

it's a country at the crossroads of Europe, Asia and Africa and a lovely home for Chris^and Neophytos

01:06:32 [jim]

ahh :)

01:06:48 [Chris^]

oh yes it is :)

01:07:10 [Chris^]

though i'd rather be in new zealand :)

01:07:17 [Chris^]

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01:07:21 [Chris^]

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01:07:29 [k2pts]

among other things, an aggregator can be used to instantiate/restore hierarchies of site-nodes...so you could have a pre-configured vertical app that it can be mount through the use of aggregators...

01:07:57 [k2pts]

think of it as a connector of packages at the application level

01:08:18 [k2pts]

that way you can develop new apps by just a few clicks

01:09:00 [jim]

so like a struct whose members are package instances?

01:09:13 [k2pts]

yeap

01:09:28 [jim]

and packages could be refactored into mostly services?

01:09:37 [jim]

that's really big

01:09:44 [k2pts]

that's one way to think about it...

01:09:54 [k2pts]

it's not as big as it seems in my opinion

01:10:05 [k2pts]

edit-this-page does something similar

01:10:34 [k2pts]

I use to say that edit-this-page is half an aggregator and half of a cms

01:11:09 [jim]

well, could you come up with a contract that would include an instance deleter?

01:11:21 [jim]

something that would facilitate what you'

01:11:25 [jim]

re looking at?

01:12:05 [k2pts]

I can try to prepare something for you...

01:12:13 [k2pts]

I'm not looking at aggregators these days.

01:12:36 [k2pts]

I look at the issue a few months back but I'm waiting for the new portal package unti I work on that again

01:12:49 [k2pts]

I'm now working on a persistence layer but it's not moving very fast

01:13:06 [k2pts]

Chris^: hazmat is a good friend and a great dev

01:13:17 [k2pts]

hazmat: Chris^ is a friend from Cyprus

01:13:24 [k2pts]

paje: who is hazmat?

01:13:24 [paje]

i heard hazmat was somebody that drinks often from the river lethe

01:13:32 [hazmat]

if someone does aggregator interface, generalizing it to a general purpose event channel would be cool.

01:13:35 [k2pts]

heh, I knew it was that one

01:13:39 [hazmat]

;)

01:13:41 [Chris^]

hehe

01:13:44 [jim]

note that my reasoning behind the instance deleter is towards the appearance of stability in the ui, by completing the vision statement in the package mgr...

01:13:45 [hazmat]

hi Chris^

01:13:47 [jim]

having said that...

01:13:54 [Chris^]

hi hazmat

01:14:16 [Chris^]

i'm wondering ... what if ....

01:14:25 [Chris^]

paje: do something

01:14:25 [paje]

Chris^: what?

01:14:33 [Chris^]

oh :)

01:14:59 [k2pts]

jim: go on

01:15:04 [jim]

paje: do something is <action> (wiggles|dances|runs|walks)

01:15:04 [paje]

OK, jim.

01:15:15 [jim]

paje: do something

01:15:16 [paje]

* paje (wiggles

01:15:22 [jim]

paje: do something

01:15:23 [paje]

* paje (wiggles

01:15:33 [jim]

paje: do something

01:15:34 [paje]

somebody said do something was walks)

01:16:04 [jim]

ok, so it doesnt' factor that way :)

01:18:22 [jim]

k2pts: your ideas for increased factorability and increased admin control and designing of apps (and more infrastructure to allow that kind of thing to happen in the UI) is a definite vision, and the existing vision statement is interpretable in that way

01:19:00 [jim]

I had a much more lowbrow idea, which was to make sure that more of the admin ui worked

01:19:25 [k2pts]

right, I was just throwing ideas :)

01:19:33 [davb]

jim: its not lowbrow, just a first step. read lars on focusing :)

01:20:02 [jim]

well, ok, so lowbrow was the wrong choice of word :)

01:21:23 [jim]

but I think the deleting thing could be done as a part of oacs-4.5.1, and the things you're talking about -seems- to me like oacs 5 or so

01:21:37 [k2pts]

right

01:22:38 [jim]

your expansion highly desirable to increase capabilities, my original thing necessary for basic stability

01:22:58 [hazmat]

on the subject of ui, a suggestion, i think one of the biggest things needed from an end user perspective and a development perspective is to have /pvt/home turn into a user workspace with external api for packages/applications to plug in panels. to create a centralized user interface to the site functionality.

01:23:11 [jim]

agreed

01:23:24 [jim]

sheesh, I have a philg story about that :)

01:23:30 [davb]

hazmat: hopefully dotlrn will have some of that

01:23:50 [hazmat]

i would expect it would, but i wonder in what form.

01:23:54 [k2pts]

I think that all of the ui should be available as api

01:24:07 [davb]

we will see (i hope)

01:24:31 [davb]

k2pts: I think so. so that it can be customized without digging into the tcl code?

01:24:34 [k2pts]

for example a page could have been called/dispatched from another one...we can do that already using include statements but we need a better control

01:25:17 [davb]

I want to easy way to link to pages in other packages or the url of an arbitrary acs_object.

01:25:25 [davb]

I also want a pony.

01:25:32 [hazmat]

lol

01:26:13 [Chris^]

hehe

01:26:20 [k2pts]

heh

01:26:57 [jim]

I also want a pony with Steph Seymour riding it sidesaddle, going "c'mere, I'll show you entire VS line"

01:28:22 [davb]

wow! I got rss-support working. at least on my dev site. now to move it to the production site.

01:28:32 [k2pts]

no kidding... :)

01:28:34 [jim]

what's that?

01:28:41 [k2pts]

rss feeds...

01:28:49 [k2pts]

links from other sites...automated

01:29:02 [davb]

this is actually the generation of an RSS feed from my site.

01:29:34 [davb]

oops, I lied, its still partially broken.

01:29:36 [k2pts]

davb: I was over excited. I thought you were talking about the RSS stylesheets

01:29:44 [davb]

sorry :(

01:29:50 [davb]

But that is next!

01:30:55 [jim]

k2pts: could you give a ballpark estimate of the operations you think should be in the contract (not number of, but actual functions)

01:30:56 [jim]

?

01:31:16 [k2pts]

not off the top of my head. I have to think about it a bit

01:31:34 [k2pts]

but I will get back to you and davb on this one

01:32:09 [jim]

meanwhile we can do a refinement of the notes package with the delete contract

01:32:51 [k2pts]

one request if it's possible

01:33:14 [k2pts]

before you work on the notes package, please someone make it subsite specific by addin a package_id column

01:33:18 [Chris^]

i think I'll be going u guyz. goodnight everybody !

01:33:27 [k2pts]

bye Chris^

01:33:33 [jim]

(with bags@ad.com's help, last feb, rewrote a notes delete script)

01:33:43 [Chris^]

[ swarz. ] I'll be back :)

01:34:04 [jim]

k2pts: but it is specific, as each note's context_id is the package instance id

01:34:33 [k2pts]

yeah, I haven't checked it for a while. someone must have changed it

01:34:53 [jim]

it worked that way back in Feb, iirc

01:35:04 [davb]

bye Chris^

01:35:19 [Chris^]

cya :)

01:35:29 [jim]

I could have green notes, red notes, and (for music lovers) blue notes...

01:37:42 [k2pts]

jim: have to check it out. I was so sure that it was not package specific

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01:47:23 [k2pts]

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01:47:54 [k2pts]

davb: I was reading the chatlogs and now I see why it didn't make sense about the RSS talk I did earlier

01:48:05 [davb]

ok.

01:48:13 [k2pts]

I meant use xsltproc and store the parsed files as adp

01:48:15 [k2pts]

then use include

01:48:27 [k2pts]

admitedly, my original post was confusing

01:48:38 [k2pts]

00:33:31 <k2pts> I was thinking to use xslt to parse adp files and include them as somekind of portlets..what do you think?

01:48:48 [davb]

I see. that is a neat idea.

01:48:50 [k2pts]

it should have been:

01:49:17 [k2pts]

use xsltproc to parse the rss feeds into adp files and then use include as somekind of portlets

01:49:38 [k2pts]

that would be a start until we have a new xml package

01:50:03 [k2pts]

does it make sense now?

01:50:09 [k2pts]

sorry if I have confused you earlier

01:50:31 [davb]

I see.

01:50:36 [davb]

sure that makes sense.

01:51:11 [k2pts]

ok, we talk l8r

01:51:14 [k2pts]

have to head out

01:51:31 [davb]

ok bye.

01:51:34 [k2pts]

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01:53:52 [davb]

is there a proc to get the main url of the site?

01:56:30 [Chris^]

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01:58:27 [jim]

umm

01:59:03 [jim]

can you look at the site return url (a kernel parameter)?

01:59:46 [davb]

maybe. I want the URL of the main site. I thought there might be a built in way to get it without explicity querying the database.

02:01:40 [jim]

ad_conn url?

02:01:42 [davb]

here goes. I am installing my rss code into the live site.

02:01:50 [davb]

that seems like cheating :)

02:02:59 [jim]

that might have a better idea of the url than the parameter... the user could have made a mistake typing it in on install, and not installed any pkgs that depended on it being correct

02:03:10 [davb]

well I have the ns_xml 2.0 code in it's current state. looks liek its time to learn C :)

02:03:14 [davb]

true.

02:03:43 [jim]

you gotta learn C fast?

02:03:59 [davb]

not really. But I will try out the code and look at it.

02:04:13 [davb]

if I really want to contribute I would need some knowledge of C.

02:04:48 [jim]

well, either way, Holub's The C Companion is good as an advanced sidekick to a c primer

02:05:03 [davb]

great. I'll put it on my list.

02:07:50 [davb]

hmmmm.

02:08:35 [davb]

oops, forgot to restart the server

02:15:32 [davb]

does anyone know the command to start up the mozilla source code viewer? I want to register it as theapplication for xml files.

03:08:43 [jim]

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03:09:47 [talilee]

davb, you're talking about john mileham's nsxml, right?

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03:46:53 [davb]

talilee: yes

03:55:05 [davb]

well bye

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15:45:43 [talli]

morning fellows

15:50:51 [davb]

hi talli

15:51:04 [talli]

hey davb

16:17:06 [rbm]

morning

16:17:12 [talli]

hey rbm

16:17:24 [talli]

anyone know of any good free icalendar projects?

16:20:55 [davb]

sorry, no.

16:21:06 [talli]

i fear one does not exist

16:21:53 [talli]

lotsa talk about how to build one, not much action. i wonder if it's a hard problem

16:22:21 [rbm]

server or client?

16:23:12 [talli]

server

16:24:26 [rbm]

have you looked at the one in StarOffice? I used it for a while. Supposedly it supports icalendar, but I never did much with it. The docs were really poor.

16:25:27 [talli]

yeah, that's pretty much what every ical project is like

16:28:53 [rbm]

http://reefknot.org/whitepaper/whitepaper.pdf <-- maybe?

16:28:54 [chump]

B: http://reefknot.org/whitepaper/whitepaper.pdf from rbm

16:29:22 [talli]

i know that one

16:29:30 [talli]

but i don't know how alive it is

16:30:32 [davb]

any project that is a whitepaper and not a cvs archive does not inspire confidence :)

16:30:40 [talli]

yeah

16:30:49 [talli]

they released some things, but not in a while

16:31:06 [talli]

and i am developing less and less trust in proejcts that use sourceforge

16:31:18 [talli]

it seems sourceforge is where OSS projects go to die

16:32:02 [davb]

as in, if you can;t maintain a webserver and cvs repository, you probably don't have the project management skills?

16:32:16 [talli]

anyway, something just needs to be built. there's this data model at w3c which seems pretty nice: http://www.w3.org/2000/01/foo

16:32:25 [talli]

davb, i didn't think of it that way, but good point ;)

16:34:05 [rbm]

talli: why?

16:34:28 [talli]

sourceforge also has a horrible UI

16:34:44 [talli]

so whenever i go there i can never find enough info about a proejct to see wheter it lives or not

16:35:13 [talli]

it has really poor transparency, too

16:35:26 [talli]

the mailing lists are too hidden

16:35:49 [talli]

and probably i assign alot of guilt by association

16:36:16 [talli]

so many projects are dead there since people think that opening a sourceforge project == a true open source project

16:36:53 [davb]

hopefully the people who started those projects have moved on to real projects.

16:39:38 [rbm]

I don't like the UI much either. But before you'd have to search for things all over the web and only then find out if they were dead

16:39:51 [talli]

yeah, that's true

16:39:52 [rbm]

so projects died everywhere, always.

16:40:05 [talli]

no we have a central graveyard :)

16:40:32 [rbm]

But at least if you find something you like (and sourceforge makes that easier), at least you can pick it up and run with it.

16:40:54 [talli]

true enough

16:41:27 [talli]

that doesn't really fix my dislike of sourceforge, just point out the utility of a central project manager

16:41:35 [rbm]

true

16:42:06 [talli]

savannah does a similar thing, but it's just a reverse engineered sourceforge

16:42:16 [rbm]

but it'll be distributed

16:42:28 [talli]

that's a feature of GNU, not a bug, but it's not always the best feature

16:43:25 [rbm]

i don't think it's a reverse engineered sourceforge. That would mean savannah is sourceforge r-engineered and re-written. It _is_ sourceforge, without the proprietary features introduced in later versions.

16:43:36 [talli]

oh yeah?

16:43:42 [talli]

i thought that sourceforge wasn't OSS

16:43:49 [talli]

for sure not GPl

16:43:57 [rbm]

it is. You can download it.

16:44:08 [talli]

hmm... didn't know that

16:44:11 [rbm]

Not sure about the later versions. I think the license was changed.

16:44:22 [talli]

ah

16:44:39 [rbm]

but sourceforge itself was kept at sourceforge.

16:45:11 [rbm]

and to be on sourceforge it has to be on a DFSG license

16:45:26 [talli]

what's that?

16:45:42 [talli]

when will people realize that GPL is the One True License?

16:46:12 [rbm]

Debian Free Software Guidelines. Defines guidelines for a free software project. The Open Source definition is basically DFSG without "Debian" in it.

16:46:24 [talli]

ah, ok

16:47:19 [rbm]

If a project is DFSG-compliant, it cam be included in Debian's main tree. If it can't, it has to go on contrib (if it's DFSG but depends on non-free) or non-free (if it's not DFSG compliant)

16:52:39 [rbm]

One of the reasons why Debian rocks so much

16:54:10 [talli]

true enough

17:23:13 [talli]

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17:36:24 [talli]

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17:37:13 [talli]

rbm: you still here?

17:37:55 [rbm]

talli: sorta. trying to do some studying and checking irc every so often

17:38:03 [talli]

ok

17:38:12 [talli]

what is the deb package for openssh?

17:38:22 [talli]

for sid

17:39:59 [rbm]

ssh=

17:40:05 [rbm]

err, ssh

17:40:22 [rbm]

apt-cache search ssh

17:40:44 [rbm]

apt-cache search openssh

17:40:49 [talli]

i tried that. it doesn't find anything for some strange reason

17:41:01 [rbm]

do you have non-US in your /etc/apt/sources.list?

17:41:09 [talli]

ah, no i dont'

17:41:11 [rbm]

crypto stuff has to be in nos-US

17:41:13 [talli]

thanks for the tip

17:41:15 [rbm]

s/nos/non/

17:41:32 [rbm]

didn't I send you my sources.list? It has non-US there

17:41:39 [talli]

yeah, you did. thanks a lot

17:41:51 [talli]

i was tearing my hair out trying to figure the openssh prob

17:41:53 [talli]

thanks alot

17:42:29 [rbm]

np

17:50:16 [talli]

rbm: thanks for the tip. got it to install

18:04:47 [davb]

talli: did you look at the testing server? apparently you can register and look.

18:10:24 [talli]

will do

18:27:25 [til]

hi there ... anyone with oracle knowledge around?

18:27:49 [til]

does this string concatenation work under oracle: select

18:27:51 [til]

first_names || ' ' || last_name from persons

18:28:08 [til]

?

18:31:51 [davb]

I think it should work.

18:32:00 [davb]

but I don't have an oracle handy right now.

18:34:40 [til]

i want to patch acs-admin/users/user-add-2, because it puts a "0" instead of the admin's name in the email body

18:34:51 [til]

when you add a user manually

18:38:50 [til]

i had to add the above query, which works under pg but before submitting i'd like to make sure it works under oracle

18:43:23 [davb]

talli: do you have an oracle handy?

19:02:08 [talli]

hey davb

19:02:12 [talli]

yeah, i kinda do

19:36:39 [talli]

davb: you get my message?

19:39:24 [til]

talli: you have a minute to test the above query?

19:40:48 [talli]

til: i'm kinda not a programmer

19:40:51 [talli]

so i wouldn't know where to start

19:41:03 [talli]

i can give you access to oracle, though

19:41:10 [til]

alright, never mind ... i just decided i have to reactivate my oracle installation

19:41:24 [til]

anyway for the acceptance testing

19:41:29 [talli]

ok

19:42:51 [til]

i backed up the complete /ora8/ directory in a huge .tar.gz before moving to a new harddrive, now let's see if oracle is happy with its new home ;)

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20:53:04 [davb]

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20:53:12 [davb]

thanks talli. I was away.

21:10:05 [davb]

have a persistent login cookie would suddenly be logged

21:10:05 [davb]

out and would have to re-login.

21:10:05 [davb]

A quick grep suggests that besides acs-tcl/tcl/security-procs.tcl where almost

21:10:05 [davb]

all of the cookie stuff is done one would only have to change some stuff in

21:10:05 [davb]

ecommerce which sets the cookies explicitely for some reason and some

21:10:06 [davb]

occurences of the cookie names in the docs.

21:10:08 [davb]

argh

21:10:14 [davb]

http://www.cs.mcgill.ca/~dchest/xfthack/

21:10:14 [chump]

C: http://www.cs.mcgill.ca/~dchest/xfthack/ from davb

21:10:18 [davb]

C:|Xft Hack

21:10:18 [chump]

titled item C

21:12:09 [til]

haha

21:21:43 [davb]

http://isg.ee.ethz.ch/tools/gedafe/

21:21:43 [chump]

D: http://isg.ee.ethz.ch/tools/gedafe/ from davb

21:21:57 [davb]

D:|gedage: generic database frontend

21:21:57 [chump]

titled item D

21:22:09 [davb]

D: web based front end, currently supports postgresql

21:22:09 [chump]

commented item D

21:23:56 [davb]

time to go

21:23:59 [davb]

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21:24:38 [talli]

dpes anyone have experience or heard any reviews about the apache portable runtime?

22:41:53 [rbm]

no, what's that?

22:43:08 [talli]

the apr is a layer of C code that is supposed to bring greater portability to apache

22:43:14 [talli]

apache 2 is built on it

22:45:17 [rbm]

ah, that

22:45:18 [paje]

rumour has it ah, that is more important

22:56:01 [hazmat]

talli: its being used by several other projects.

22:56:24 [talli]

yeah, i know

22:56:28 [talli]

how mature is it?

22:56:54 [hazmat]

i'd say pretty to very.

22:57:34 [hazmat]

subversion comes to mind, and i know there are some others.

22:57:42 [talli]

yeah

23:00:46 [hazmat]

the only real alternative for c/c++ programmers afaik, is the nspr, which is c++

23:02:52 [talli]

i see. and apr works reasonably well on MS too

23:03:15 [talli]

and C is much more reliable than java...

23:03:18 [talli]

thanks hazmat

23:03:23 [talli]

talk to you guys later

23:03:27 [talli]

must run

23:03:29 [talli]

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23:03:30 [hazmat]

cheers.

23:16:11 [davb]

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