IRC log of openacs on 2002-03-15

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:02:02 [markd2]
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00:11:37 [hazmat]
* hazmat wanders
00:20:10 [talli]
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01:30:26 [davb]
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03:02:10 [talli]
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03:02:23 [talli]
google mapoogly
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13:05:59 [markd2]
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13:06:33 [markd2]
paje, nslookup badgertronics.com
13:06:34 [paje]
badgertronics.com is 63.84.105.162
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14:30:33 [davb]
http://www.terrasoftsolutions.com/products/gvs9000/
14:30:34 [chump]
A: http://www.terrasoftsolutions.com/products/gvs9000/ from davb
14:32:39 [davb]
A:|Rackmounted Dual-gigahertz PowerMac G4 - TerraSoft Solutions
14:32:39 [chump]
titled item A
14:44:17 [davb]
Userland does appear to be doing some interesting stuff: http://scriptingnews.userland.com/backissues/2002/03/13#paceOfInnovation I wonder what it is.
14:50:52 [tontsa]
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15:18:58 [_miguel_]
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15:19:05 [_miguel_]
hi guys!!!
15:20:01 [davb]
hi _miguel_
15:20:45 [_miguel_]
how are you doing?
15:20:51 [davb]
not bad.
15:20:58 [_miguel_]
sorry that yesterday i couldnt connect again
15:22:32 [davb]
np
15:23:17 [_miguel_]
ok
15:23:29 [rbm]
Miguel de Icaza on #openacs ?
15:23:41 [_miguel_]
no, miguel gonzalez
15:23:42 [_miguel_]
sorry
15:23:48 [_miguel_]
who is miguel de icaza?
15:23:55 [_miguel_]
im miguel from spain
15:24:10 [_miguel_]
dont you remember the crazy fool of the problem sets 3.x ? :)
15:24:12 [rbm]
_miguel_: :-) I know. I was just making a joke.
15:24:54 [_miguel_]
hehehe
15:25:00 [_miguel_]
who is miguel de icaza?
15:25:37 [_miguel_]
by the way someone took my nickname, guess that i need to register it
15:25:42 [rbm]
_miguel_: You need to read "Hackers of our lives"
15:25:53 [rbm]
paje: nickometer _miguel_
15:25:54 [paje]
'_miguel_' is 26% lame, rbm
15:26:04 [rbm]
paje: nickometer miguel
15:26:05 [paje]
'miguel' is 0% lame, rbm
15:26:19 [davb]
nt you remember the crazy fool of the problem sets 3.x ? :)
15:26:20 [davb]
<rbm> _miguel_: :-) I know. I was just making a joke.
15:26:20 [davb]
<_miguel_> hehehe
15:26:22 [davb]
arfg
15:26:23 [rbm]
paje: bostsnack
15:26:23 [paje]
rbm: sorry...
15:26:26 [rbm]
paje: botsnack
15:26:27 [paje]
thanks rbm :)
15:26:30 [davb]
http://www.vestasys.org/
15:26:30 [chump]
B: http://www.vestasys.org/ from davb
15:26:33 [_miguel_]
what?
15:26:37 [_miguel_]
i am getting lost
15:26:43 [_miguel_]
you are calling me a lamer?
15:26:43 [rbm]
* rbm twacks davb and his mouse
15:26:47 [davb]
B:|Vesta : Source Management
15:26:47 [chump]
titled item B
15:27:35 [_miguel_]
wow, ive just seen the vesta web site, looks great
15:27:40 [rbm]
_miguel_: Heheh. No. Paje is our resident bot (one of them). It has this "nickometer" feature that takes nicks and calculates how lame they are according to how many non-alphabetic and non-capitalised characters it has.
15:27:43 [davb]
B: darn, only for Tru64, no port to IA32 yet.
15:27:44 [chump]
commented item B
15:28:55 [_miguel_]
so that means that i am 0 % lame?
15:28:56 [davb]
argh. my gnome is all screwed up. curse Ximain!!
15:29:28 [_miguel_]
does anyone of you use redhat? is there any tool to update the rpms?
15:29:38 [_miguel_]
someone told me the name but i forgot
15:30:11 [davb]
does apt keep track of what it has uninstalled in a log somewhere?
15:31:14 [_miguel_]
Vesta is a GPL SCM?
15:31:53 [davb]
LGPL
15:32:16 [_miguel_]
L stands for what?
15:32:45 [davb]
wait: "Platform: Vesta currently runs on the following platforms:
15:32:45 [davb]
Linux on IA-32 compatible processors. The kits (one for i386 and one for i686) have been built in a RedHat 7.1 environment, but the binaries are statically linked and should work on a variety of distributions. A 2.4 kernel is a necessity, due to deficiencies in the 2.2 NFS client.
15:33:12 [rbm]
_miguel_: "Lesser"
15:33:22 [_miguel_]
ok
15:33:28 [rbm]
_miguel_: www.gnu.org for more info on the GNU licenses.
15:33:39 [_miguel_]
ok thanks sorry for my ignorance
15:33:42 [davb]
looks a little too complicated for OpenACS.
15:33:44 [_miguel_]
never heard about it
15:33:49 [rbm]
_miguel_: no problem.
15:33:57 [_miguel_]
anyway, where are the binaries?
15:33:59 [rbm]
_miguel_: never heard of what? LGPL or GNU?
15:34:04 [_miguel_]
LPGL
15:34:08 [_miguel_]
LGPL
15:34:51 [_miguel_]
only about GPL
15:37:01 [markd2]
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15:43:11 [_miguel_]
anyway, where are the binaries?
15:45:23 [davb]
I think there are none.
15:45:43 [davb]
for vesta? or openacs :) ?
15:45:53 [_miguel_]
vesta ;)
15:46:02 [_miguel_]
so, they are not for free?
15:46:04 [davb]
check their sourceforge site.
15:46:14 [davb]
not its free, but you need to get the source.
15:47:52 [davb]
ack, it IS free.
15:48:37 [_miguel_]
ok
15:48:43 [_miguel_]
where is their sourceforge site?
15:57:43 [markd2]
what's vesta?
15:57:43 [paje]
vesta is a GPL SCM?
15:57:49 [markd2]
ah
15:58:37 [_miguel_]
davb: do u know where is their sourceforget site?
15:59:36 [rbm]
paje: no, vista is a LGPL Source Management system. http://www.vestasys.org/
15:59:36 [paje]
OK, rbm.
16:03:07 [rbm]
Interesting article by John C. Dvorak on Linux on the desktop
16:03:10 [rbm]
http://www.pcmag.com/article/0,2997,s=1500&a=23172,00.asp
16:03:10 [chump]
C: http://www.pcmag.com/article/0,2997,s=1500&a=23172,00.asp from rbm
16:03:20 [rbm]
C:|Interesting article by John C. Dvorak on Linux on the desktop
16:03:20 [chump]
titled item C
16:03:50 [rbm]
He says Adobe Photoshop, not MS Office, is the main factor for Linux adoption on the mainstream desktop world.
16:03:58 [rbm]
s/MS//
16:05:52 [markd2]
do that many folks use photoshop?
16:07:14 [rbm]
I think his point is that with an app of the respect of Photoshop boing ported, many others would follow.
16:08:08 [markd2]
yeah
16:08:59 [dlk]
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16:09:56 [_miguel_]
yes, photoshop is widely used in electronic document generation (pdfs), and i think if linux would adopt apps for multimedia, it would be used as workstations in some companies
16:12:02 [rbm]
:)
16:12:06 [rbm]
* rbm goes to finish his homework
16:13:39 [_miguel_]
i love the part about the radicalism in the linux community, a spanish guy here complained about the same thing
16:17:19 [rbm]
I think the "radicals" are a minority, really
16:17:46 [rbm]
The biggest problem, IMHO, is not "listening" to end users.
16:18:03 [rbm]
http://www.linuxandmain.com/news/raymond.html
16:18:03 [chump]
D: http://www.linuxandmain.com/news/raymond.html from rbm
16:18:35 [rbm]
D:|In a far-ranging discussion that goes to the heart of whether developers know -- or care -- what users want, Catherine Olanich Raymond (Eric Raymond's wife) took her concerns to a succession of KDE developer mailing lists, with sadly unsurprising results.
16:18:35 [chump]
titled item D
16:18:43 [_miguel_]
yes, thats a problem in the software industry
16:18:57 [rbm]
It's more so a problem in the free software community.
16:21:08 [_miguel_]
really?
16:21:35 [rbm]
I think so.
16:22:59 [markd2]
yeah
16:23:06 [rbm]
Proprietary developers are developing things because their boss is telling them to. Free Software developers are developing because they want something for themselves.
16:23:14 [markd2]
the free software community really doesn't have a 'customer' to be accountable to
16:23:32 [markd2]
or a real unified vision
16:24:01 [rbm]
I think the free/open source development model is a lot better, but we need QA from end-users. We need people to give us feedback, and consistently do so.
16:25:51 [_miguel_]
i think you get such feedback once that you try to install something for a real customer, then you notice which are the problems with the software you are developing
16:27:24 [markd2]
http://drew.corrupt.net/think-of-the-domokun.jpg
16:27:24 [chump]
E: http://drew.corrupt.net/think-of-the-domokun.jpg from markd2
16:27:36 [markd2]
E|: Think of the Domo-Kun!
16:27:46 [markd2]
E:| Think of the Domo-Kun
16:27:46 [chump]
titled item E
16:27:58 [markd2]
E: (contains profanity) For those tired of the "God Kills a Kitten" picture floating around
16:27:58 [chump]
commented item E
16:28:00 [rbm]
What's a Domo-Kun?
16:28:19 [markd2]
Furry japanese brick with teeth
16:28:47 [markd2]
it's the latest all-your-base kind of meme
16:30:21 [markd2]
http://drew.corrupt.net/domo.html
16:30:21 [chump]
F: http://drew.corrupt.net/domo.html from markd2
16:30:28 [markd2]
F:| A domo-kun page
16:30:28 [chump]
titled item F
16:35:21 [_miguel_]
i am trying to find a irc daemon, with SSL support if possible, i found SIRCD, but there is no docs for installing it, anyone knows anything?
16:40:01 [markd2]
* markd2 is just a consumer
16:40:29 [rbm]
doesn't dancer support ssl?
16:41:18 [_miguel_]
dancer? mmm i will try to get info about it, thanks roberto
16:43:13 [_miguel_]
i just need a good irc server, with SSL if possible, for customer service (java or any kind of client) and for meeting with my colleagues
16:44:33 [rbm]
A member of our LUG wrote a Java IRC client
16:44:48 [_miguel_]
LUG?
16:44:53 [markd2]
Linux Users Group
16:44:56 [_miguel_]
ok
16:45:03 [markd2]
LUG is a TLA for "Linux Users Group"
16:45:07 [markd2]
paje, lug?
16:45:07 [paje]
i heard lug was a TLA for "Linux Users Group"
16:45:30 [_miguel_]
is a java irc client for web right?
16:46:03 [rbm]
_miguel_: usually. It's normally the only reason you'd subject yourself to the pain of using a graphical java app.
16:46:31 [_miguel_]
hehehe
16:46:49 [_miguel_]
where can i get that java irc client?
16:47:26 [rbm]
http://fslc.usu.edu/irc/
16:47:26 [chump]
G: http://fslc.usu.edu/irc/ from rbm
16:48:19 [_miguel_]
thanks
17:01:23 [_miguel_]
but it works for a customer service through a web page? i mean, a client connects and it is allocated to the IT guy who is free in that moment
17:04:23 [rbm]
_miguel_: It's an IRC client. It connects to an IRC server in the specified channel.
17:04:41 [rbm]
Anything more specific than that and you'll have to modify the sources to match your needs.
17:05:02 [rbm]
Or hire Nate (the author) to do it for you. I know he'd appreciate a consulting gig on the side.
17:05:27 [rbm]
He works for HP writing Java apps to control HP's large disk array products.
17:06:29 [rbm]
And yes, it works over the web. Just try it.
17:06:49 [_miguel_]
ok
17:21:34 [denshi]
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18:05:51 [denshi]
we meet again, monsieur somekh.
18:06:41 [_miguel_]
who´s that for? :)
18:06:54 [markd2]
talli?
18:06:54 [paje]
* paje cries out "pimp, talli, pimp!"
18:08:14 [talli]
ah... so now i'm a pimp?
18:08:16 [talli]
at last!
18:08:27 [_miguel_]
pimp?
18:08:31 [_miguel_]
whats that?
18:08:44 [talli]
_miguel_, it's a guy with putas
18:08:53 [talli]
wait, maybe that's wrong
18:09:22 [_miguel_]
putas?
18:09:25 [talli]
anyway, i'm busting out my satin bell bottoms and sequined, tassled and ruffled polyester shirt
18:09:27 [_miguel_]
XDDDDD
18:09:36 [_miguel_]
putas=bitches in spanish
18:09:39 [_miguel_]
watch out
18:10:05 [_miguel_]
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18:13:25 [davb]
denshi: I read this and thought of your multi-user language: http://www.treedragon.com/ged/map/ti/newMar02.htm#14mar02-cityscapes
18:14:45 [davb]
talli: do you know if dotlrn has online learning features or any sort?
18:14:59 [talli]
like what?
18:15:28 [talli]
it's "course management" but i don't really know how that is definied
18:15:32 [davb]
Ok.
18:15:37 [davb]
I will have to wait then :)
18:15:59 [denshi]
davb: badass. he's up to thinking about group-specific GC.
18:16:02 [talli]
ben said on the bboards they are a couple of days away from opening cvs up, or at least access to cvs, which is great
18:16:20 [davb]
yes. I will be downloading it.
18:17:00 [davb]
At work here, they are looking at the blackboard online ASP like service. I was wonderng if dotlrn can replace it.
18:17:22 [davb]
http://coursesites.blackboard.com/
18:17:22 [chump]
H: http://coursesites.blackboard.com/ from davb
18:17:23 [talli]
depends on your needs. what are they?
18:17:35 [davb]
Well that is also unknown at this time.
18:17:44 [davb]
So I will need to find out.
18:19:53 [talli]
davb, dotlrn will have that stuff
18:20:06 [davb]
cool!
18:20:30 [davb]
I think I will be setting up a demo soon after the alpha release.
18:25:11 [davb]
why are files called "Software Archives" in the download package?
18:27:00 [davb]
wait, I see. an archive is for one "package" you can have multiple versions in each archive.
18:31:02 [davb]
cool. the new testing package is very neat.
18:31:28 [davb]
talli: you should contact simon so you can see it. it might be helpful for your sdm research.
18:32:11 [denshi]
bye guys.
18:32:27 [denshi]
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18:47:07 [Grax]
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19:01:46 [talli]
davb, has simon posted his software?
19:06:23 [davb]
no, he just whipped it up for the testers.
19:07:10 [davb]
so we are testing it as well as openacs :)
19:07:19 [talli]
makes sense
19:28:43 [Grax]
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19:28:48 [Grax]
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19:29:17 [dwalker]
anyone know where I can get aolserver 2? I want to read some of the code from it
19:30:40 [markd2]
the aolserver 2 source was never released
19:30:48 [markd2]
C source
19:30:55 [markd2]
the tcl code included I can get to ya
19:31:30 [dwalker]
darn
19:31:36 [dwalker]
thanks
19:32:35 [markd2]
is that what you need?
19:32:59 [dwalker]
no. I'm trying to find the source for the old [ns_conn content] command
19:33:47 [dwalker]
or another solution I can use to read the uploaded body from tcl
19:34:42 [markd2]
like the payload for a POST ?
19:35:11 [dwalker]
yes exactly
19:37:58 [markd2]
ns_getform is written in tcl.
19:38:17 [markd2]
which grovels around in the POST payload
19:40:19 [dwalker]
it uses [ns_conn form] which is an ns_set
20:38:16 [dwalker]
I think I got it. I had to write c code for it
20:43:00 [davb]
I wonder if that is in AOLserver 4.0
20:43:40 [davb]
most workarounds include writing the content to a temporary file and then reading it in.
20:44:25 [dwalker]
looks like it is
20:44:30 [dwalker]
and after I went to all that work
20:44:32 [davb]
cool.
20:44:44 [davb]
ah, can you steal their code?
20:44:58 [dwalker]
maybe. I'll look into it
20:46:17 [dwalker]
my version requires it be hit before ns_conn form is hit
20:47:21 [davb]
yes, that sounds familiar.
20:47:30 [davb]
it is good to know they fixed it though.
20:50:56 [k2pts]
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dwalker has quit (Remote closed the connection)
20:54:18 [davb]
hi k2pts
20:54:28 [k2pts]
hey dave, check your priv messages
20:55:17 [davb]
I hate mirc. I never notice :)
20:55:22 [Grax]
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21:07:05 [dwalker]
OK. I figured out why I crashed. grep reqPrt->content is a bad command to type
21:07:41 [dwalker]
it was recursively pulling info out of the file it created called "content" and infinitely growing it
21:10:54 [dwalker]
and it doesn't look like I can steal aolserver 4 code for ns_conn content. it looks like they rewrote a whole section there so if I want it I should start running aolserver4
21:11:48 [davb]
you can write it to a temp file and read that :)
21:12:13 [dwalker]
I could but my module works now
21:12:27 [davb]
ah, that is more important.
21:13:11 [dwalker]
it just took me several hours to realize it needs to run before ns_conn
21:27:49 [davb]
I must be going now
21:27:59 [dwalker]
have fun
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23:40:26 [rbm]
shazam!