IRC log of openacs on 2002-03-12

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:02:26 [talli]
talli (~talli@lti-4.dialup.access.net) has joined #openacs
00:02:34 [talli]
rbm: dotGNU rocks!
00:03:36 [talli]
rbm, i think i was saying it earlier, but i think OACS should get involved iwth the dotgnu people
00:03:55 [talli]
at least to share some of the authentication and identity protocols they're coming up with
00:04:31 [talli]
we're kind of a compliment to the phpgroupware folks (but i think our system is a bit more robust). docwolf, wanna fight about that?
00:08:48 [talli]
paje, seen rbm
00:08:48 [paje]
rbm was last seen on #openacs 39 minutes and 57 seconds ago, saying: Hmm, the dotGNU folks seem to be doing a good job [Mon Mar 11 16:30:52 2002]
00:09:00 [talli]
paje, spank markd2
00:09:00 [paje]
talli: what?
00:09:07 [talli]
paje learn markd2
00:09:07 [paje]
talli: huh?
00:09:14 [rbm]
shazam!
00:09:33 [talli]
paje, do you know that markd2 is slug butcher?
00:09:34 [paje]
talli: bugger all, i dunno
00:09:38 [talli]
hey rbm
00:09:46 [talli]
dotgnu is pretty cool. mono gets all the pub, but pnet is cooler
00:10:09 [rbm]
They seem to be doing a great job down there. And it's cool that you can run .NET apps on it.
00:10:16 [talli]
yeah
00:10:24 [talli]
and it's pretty much one guy coding pnet
00:10:28 [rbm]
And it's all free software, no hidden catches.
00:10:30 [talli]
and it's all on linux
00:10:32 [talli]
yeah
00:11:57 [rbm]
I like the license of pnetlib. GPL with linking exception. That's totally fair, while still allowing you to do proprietary software if you'd like.
00:12:14 [talli]
is that different from the LGPL?
00:12:18 [rbm]
yep
00:12:24 [talli]
hmm.. how so?
00:13:01 [rbm]
The LGPL is basically a BSD license (AFAIK). It allows you to take a lib and make modifications to it without disclosure of changes to the lib.
00:13:14 [rbm]
(upon redistribution)
00:13:36 [talli]
really
00:13:37 [talli]
?
00:13:38 [talli]
weird
00:14:04 [rbm]
The "GPL with linking exception" says that you can link a program to that library and make it proprietary, not problem. But if you make changes to the library itself, then you have to disclose those changes if you're going to redistribute them.
00:14:17 [talli]
i see
00:14:40 [rbm]
Which is only fair.
00:14:55 [talli]
so the part of Mono that has people bothered is that the libraries are being released under the MIT/X11 license, right?
00:15:13 [rbm]
There are other concerns with mono as well
00:16:07 [talli]
it seems that the GPL+linking was written expressly so that MS couldn't steal the code
00:17:34 [shagster]
* shagster does a cvs update of the beta and see if he can verify and fix some bugs
00:17:42 [talli]
hey shagster
00:17:45 [talli]
how was teh lasagna?
00:17:51 [shagster]
Very good...
00:18:01 [talli]
did you make it?
00:18:18 [shagster]
Ha!
00:18:25 [talli]
:)
00:18:34 [shagster]
Girlfriend did
00:18:39 [talli]
http://www.rons.net.cn/english/FSM/issue02
00:18:40 [chump]
A: http://www.rons.net.cn/english/FSM/issue02 from talli
00:18:51 [rbm]
talli: I was just reading that.
00:18:53 [talli]
A: Issue 2 of Free Software Magazine
00:18:53 [chump]
commented item A
00:19:05 [talli]
http://www.rons.net.cn/english/FSM/ISSUE02/postgresqlhistory.pdf
00:19:05 [chump]
B: http://www.rons.net.cn/english/FSM/ISSUE02/postgresqlhistory.pdf from talli
00:19:14 [rbm]
talli: I think I'll write to them and ask if they would like an OpenACS 4article
00:19:18 [talli]
B: History of PostgreSQL by Bruce Momjian
00:19:18 [chump]
commented item B
00:19:24 [talli]
rbm: that would be great!
00:19:28 [talli]
i'd be happy to help
00:19:40 [rbm]
* rbm ^5's talli
00:19:42 [talli]
i think that we should submit a proposal to dotGNU to add OACS to the list of projects
00:20:11 [talli]
they're doing a lot of the things we're doing, and also some compliment
00:20:15 [talli]
compliments
00:22:53 [rbm]
indeed
00:23:22 [talli]
B: "It was amazing to see how many bugs were fixed with one line of C code"
00:23:22 [chump]
commented item B
00:26:03 [rbm]
crap, bummer, *sighs*
00:26:24 [rbm]
Looks like I'll have to return my scanner. Work doesn't want to pay for it at they had promised.
00:26:31 [rbm]
s/at/as/
00:26:44 [rbm]
I need to find a better or better-paying job.
00:28:33 [talli]
i'm reading the article by the guy that is writing pnet
00:28:40 [talli]
about what it takes to write a compiler
00:29:03 [talli]
and i'm glad that the lead of the OACS is a guy that's been writing compilers for at least 20 years
00:29:15 [talli]
a web database system must be a joke for donb
00:30:52 [rbm]
he said he got burned out of it.
00:31:00 [talli]
i'm sure he did
00:31:07 [rbm]
I wonder if donb is/was involved in the "Portland Compilers"
00:31:25 [rbm]
They're famous in the cluster world
00:31:30 [talli]
i think his company was called Oregan Software
00:31:39 [talli]
right?
00:32:28 [rbm]
* rbm goes home
00:32:34 [rbm]
bb later
00:32:34 [talli]
later
00:35:36 [davb]
davb (dave@alb-24-58-162-46.nycap.rr.com) has joined #openacs
00:35:42 [talli]
yo davb
00:35:52 [davb]
howdy
00:36:06 [talli]
ugh. why is everything in FSM a pdf?
00:50:33 [hazmat]
hazmat is now known as buglord
01:01:15 [buglord]
buglord is now known as hazmat
01:12:29 [docwolf]
docwolf is now known as NuttyMcS
01:13:20 [talli]
ah, so NuttyMcS, you've returned
01:20:11 [talli]
anybody wanna play backgammon
01:20:13 [talli]
?
01:20:57 [talli]
i'm just kidding
01:21:05 [talli]
anyone wanna roll some bones?
01:23:27 [shagster]
Nah, I've actually got to finish some client code *grr*
01:30:45 [NuttyMcS]
aw, nuts
01:49:18 [shagster]
That is about what they pay me in....
01:53:34 [rbm]
talli: I _love_ backgammon.
01:54:22 [rbm]
talli: wanna play bubble bobble?
01:55:11 [rbm]
paje: seen talli?
01:55:11 [paje]
talli was last seen on #openacs 34 minutes and 6 seconds ago, saying: anyone wanna roll some bones? [Mon Mar 11 18:23:06 2002]
02:12:50 [rbm]
bbiab
02:58:38 [talli]
paje, seen rbm?
02:58:39 [paje]
rbm was last seen on #openacs 45 minutes and 49 seconds ago, saying: bbiab [Mon Mar 11 19:14:51 2002]
02:58:55 [talli]
rbm, you don't want to play me in backgammon
02:58:58 [talli]
i will destroy you
02:59:07 [talli]
as NuttyMcS, might say, HULK SMASH
02:59:28 [rbm]
talli: I haven't played gammon in years, but I'd like to get back to it.
02:59:39 [davb]
go sign up over at ola's site!
03:00:01 [talli]
btw, those two lights out of the WTC are pretty fat
03:00:05 [davb]
I can't remember the URL though :(
03:00:06 [talli]
i mean their big
03:00:20 [davb]
what lights?
03:01:41 [talli]
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&u=/ap/20020312/ap_on_re_us/attacks_six_months_20
03:01:41 [chump]
C: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&u=/ap/20020312/ap_on_re_us/attacks_six_months_20 from talli
03:02:21 [rbm]
* rbm tries to fix a screwed-up-by-virus hard drive from a friend
03:02:24 [talli]
there is some seriously perverted stuff going on in the jabber foundation mailing list
03:02:26 [rbm]
bbl
03:03:26 [talli]
the jabber project is a bit of a mess, AFAICS
03:03:37 [davb]
that is too bad. It has alot of potential.
03:03:45 [talli]
it does
03:03:51 [talli]
but it's so stretched out
03:03:59 [talli]
there's no one central location for info
03:04:06 [davb]
cool. that sounds like that light project two artists suggested way back
03:07:39 [davb]
darn, the backgammon appears to be unavailable :(
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03:13:19 [ChanServ]
[#OpenACS] This channel is logged: http://www.blogspace.com/openacs/chatlogs/ and blogged: http://www.thedesignexperience.org/openacs/ircblog
03:46:34 [talli]
rbm, you there?
03:50:04 [talli]
if you show up, rbm, i wanted to return to that convo from the morning about the features box
03:50:14 [talli]
rather, about the new oacs.org
03:52:52 [rbm]
* rbm is back
03:52:58 [talli]
hey
03:53:09 [rbm]
* rbm makes a mental note to _nevermore_ help anybody with windows problems
03:53:20 [talli]
whoops
03:53:23 [talli]
that ugly, huh?
03:54:11 [rbm]
Well, now the whole mobo won't bootstrap nor give me any diagnostic beeps
03:54:17 [talli]
yowza
03:54:21 [talli]
what did you do to it?
03:56:07 [rbm]
just took the HD out because it was giving lots of garbage'd output
03:59:10 [talli]
anyway, you got some time to chat about the oacs.org?
04:00:07 [rbm]
shoot it. I'll be working on this machine and coming back to the channel
04:01:13 [talli]
ok. lemme catch up on what we talk abotu actually...
04:01:24 [talli]
* talli goes to read this morning's log
04:02:21 [talli]
ok
04:02:50 [talli]
rbm, so there are two pieces of the site we're talking about, and hte question is whether to combine them or to put them in separate sections.
04:03:12 [talli]
they aren't mutually exclusive, but one would be a sub-section of the other if we chose to combine them
04:04:04 [talli]
they are a Features Section with feature articles about people in teh community, sites that are built with the OACS, articles about the OACS tech, etc.
04:04:19 [talli]
the other is a section regarding features of the OACS
04:04:43 [talli]
so, the API, AOLserver, why tcl is a fine language for dev, etc.
04:05:05 [talli]
i don't think that it's a bad thing to have the features of the OACS in the features section
04:08:25 [rafa]
rafa (rafa@ebt.ee.usyd.edu.au) has joined #openacs
04:08:37 [rafa]
hello
04:08:37 [paje]
hello, rafa
04:08:43 [rafa]
hi paje
04:08:58 [rafa]
how are things?
04:10:05 [rbm]
talli: But the features page would be big. It won't fit in that little box on the left, unless you're talking about just links as in phpgroupware.org
04:11:48 [rafa]
rbm: I fixed yesterday's problem. I will try to write a page explaining how to do it.
04:11:50 [talli]
hmmm...
04:12:04 [talli]
i think i haven't explained my self well
04:12:11 [rafa]
the problems is that the groups need to be created as application groups
04:12:33 [talli]
your features of OACS will have a summary, right?
04:12:45 [talli]
(like any good article needs to have)
04:12:56 [talli]
so in the features box just the summary would show up
04:13:05 [talli]
same as any other article in the features nox
04:13:06 [talli]
box
04:13:54 [talli]
so for each feature you talk about (API, Permissioning model, Request Processor, CR, etc) there will be a small summary that can be displayed in the features box with a link to the entire article
04:13:55 [talli]
make sense>?
04:14:26 [rbm]
and you want that "features" box to display different articles that rotate rightL
04:14:30 [rbm]
s/L/?/
04:15:05 [talli]
right
04:15:23 [talli]
fresh content on the homepage to advertise parts of the OACS project or community
04:15:37 [talli]
draw people into the site to learn more about the system
04:15:45 [talli]
and make everything more transparent
04:19:05 [rbm]
fresh content is great, but I still think there should be a link from the top page where someone evaluating/comparing openacs can quickly get to with the features of the system
04:19:18 [rbm]
one that doesn't rotate, that is always there
04:19:19 [talli]
that's fine
04:19:26 [talli]
i agree
04:19:42 [talli]
there needs to be a link to the Features Section
04:19:46 [talli]
that is for sure
04:20:07 [talli]
but if the features of the OACS is not in the features section, then it can go in the documentation or software section
04:20:31 [talli]
and the content in the features of the oacs can still be in the queue regardless
04:20:48 [talli]
however, i think the software and documentation sections should be about just software and documentation
04:21:07 [rbm]
okay
04:21:11 [talli]
but, your features of the oacs can be considered the "oacs in a nutshell" docs
04:21:43 [talli]
also, there can be a link in the text of the homepage saying, "if you want to see a quick list of the features of the oacs, click here"
04:22:39 [rbm]
did you see the phpgroupware page?
04:22:51 [talli]
yeah
04:24:38 [talli]
do you want to do the exact same thing or just something similar?
04:24:41 [talli]
what are you thinking about?
04:27:43 [rbm]
what I said... a features page
04:28:42 [talli]
what kind of features page, though? like what they have? a features section like what i'm talking about?
04:28:52 [talli]
do you have any specific idea of what you're thinking about?
04:30:29 [talli]
what they have there isn't really a page, it's a section with all the features of phpgroupware (in a rather non-technical way. check out the API page)
04:31:28 [rbm]
I'd like a more detailed page. And I think you agree with me, but I'm not sure about the layout you're suggesting
04:31:54 [talli]
yeah, i agree with you
04:32:05 [talli]
but do you want to have one looooong page listing everything
04:32:24 [talli]
or a section with the pieces broken up according to different features
04:32:56 [rbm]
the latter
04:33:02 [talli]
ok, cool
04:33:08 [rbm]
But I want a link from the top / to that page
04:33:18 [talli]
sure, no prob
04:33:59 [talli]
what i am suggesting (each section being features in the feature box on a rotating schedule) is not exclusive from having a link to the page listing the features
04:34:06 [talli]
here's an example
04:34:33 [talli]
in the text of the home page, there will be a prominent line saying "if you'd like to learn more about the features of the OACS, click here"
04:34:42 [talli]
which takes you to the section you want to right
04:36:26 [talli]
meanwhile, in the features box, there is short quote from the Content Repository that says, "The OACS stores all of its content in the Content Repository which enables advanced features like versioning and facilitates site wide search. For more information about the CR, click here" this link takes you directly to the section about the CR
04:36:57 [talli]
so if someone wants to surf through the site, they can click on the link to the top level of the featues of the oacs
04:37:31 [talli]
but if they're not so sure about the system, we catch their eye with some quick candy, which pushes them right into the heart of the site
04:38:02 [talli]
the next time they come to the home page, they will see another piece of content in the features box, perhaps about the API or about the RP
04:38:32 [talli]
or, they'll see a little article about Roberto Mello, a brazilian who loves free software so much he helped start the oacs community
04:39:02 [talli]
or, a quick little article about dotLRN, a project initiated by the Sloan school to build a GPL course management system
04:39:11 [talli]
does this stuff make more sense?
04:43:27 [talli]
rbm: still there?
04:45:06 [rbm]
yeah, sorry. Just revived the mobo
04:45:40 [rbm]
talli: I see what you're saying now. I agree wholeheartedly.
04:45:45 [talli]
ok, great
04:46:20 [talli]
this effort is just to get the content inside the site more available to visitors
04:56:26 [rbm]
talli: do you have the thread url handy?
04:58:04 [talli]
which one?
04:59:06 [rbm]
the site task list that you just e
04:59:09 [rbm]
the site task list that you just e-mailed
04:59:14 [rbm]
!#$^@$#)^@( enter key
05:01:30 [chris_]
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05:04:09 [chris_]
hey, anyone ever have a problem installing packages with the message that acs-messaging is not installed? that's what I'm getting
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05:43:47 [rbm]
moo?
05:43:48 [paje]
moo rbm, glad to see you back!
05:43:59 [talli]
rbm: http://openacs.org/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=00047F&topic_id=12&topic=OpenACS%204%2e0%20Design
05:44:06 [talli]
that's the task list for the new site
05:44:13 [rbm]
k
05:44:26 [talli]
if you want to help implement that feature site, i think it might be the hardest piece
05:44:36 [talli]
unless the ad server module actually works
05:45:25 [talli]
oh, man
05:45:31 [talli]
i missed that jun also volunteered
05:45:44 [talli]
i'll have to ping him too
05:49:35 [talli]
there is one nasty ugly fight going on in the jabber foundation. whoa
05:50:27 [talli]
reminds me of the great OACS wars
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15:14:38 [davb]
paje: excuse
15:14:39 [paje]
davb: Program load too heavy for processor to lift.
15:14:52 [davb]
paje: excuse
15:14:52 [paje]
davb: Traffic jam on the Information Superhighway.
15:28:07 [markd2]
* markd2 likes toast with traffic jam
15:28:36 [markd2]
heh
15:29:28 [davb]
:)
15:33:14 [davb]
testing, testing installation, creating
15:33:15 [davb]
RPMs, debs, windows installable packages, etc etc, should probably work with
15:33:15 [davb]
the tagged oacs-4-5 branch. Only those doing long term development work should
15:33:15 [davb]
use the default (untagged) branch.
15:33:16 [davb]
argh
15:33:25 [davb]
http://www.ordinary-life.net/blog/archives/cat_web_design_the_business.php
15:33:25 [chump]
D: http://www.ordinary-life.net/blog/archives/cat_web_design_the_business.php from davb
15:33:36 [davb]
D:|Web Design, The Business Archives
15:33:36 [chump]
titled item D
15:33:48 [davb]
D: links to business resources for web designers
15:33:48 [chump]
commented item D
16:07:24 [k2pts]
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16:08:11 [markd2]
hello
16:08:11 [paje]
que tal, markd2
16:08:17 [k2pts]
hey markd2
16:08:32 [k2pts]
paje: seen me?
16:08:32 [paje]
I haven't seen 'me', k2pts
16:08:48 [k2pts]
paje: hide
16:08:48 [paje]
k2pts: huh?
16:08:58 [k2pts]
paje: hide?
16:08:58 [paje]
i don't know, k2pts
16:09:08 [k2pts]
markd2: how's it going?
16:09:25 [markd2]
going well
16:09:39 [markd2]
doing some maintenance on my colocated box
16:09:46 [markd2]
the IP addresses are being renumberd :-|
16:10:40 [k2pts]
yeah, I was just reading in your borklog
16:11:07 [markd2]
I'm always nervous doing network configs
16:11:13 [markd2]
one slip and 'poof' you're disconnected
16:11:29 [k2pts]
I know what you mean
16:13:54 [k2pts]
paje: seen davb?
16:13:54 [paje]
davb was last seen on #openacs 40 minutes and 6 seconds ago, saying: D: links to business resources for web designers [Tue Mar 12 08:35:49 2002]
16:14:13 [k2pts]
paje: seen talli?
16:14:13 [paje]
talli was last seen on #openacs 10 hours, 23 minutes and 45 seconds ago, saying: reminds me of the great OACS wars [Mon Mar 11 22:52:29 2002]
16:14:29 [k2pts]
l8r markd2
16:14:43 [k2pts]
k2pts has left #openacs
16:17:16 [markd2]
seen pschepylax?
16:17:16 [paje]
I haven't seen 'pschepylax', markd2
16:17:21 [markd2]
seen psychepylax?
16:17:21 [paje]
I haven't seen 'psychepylax', markd2
16:17:26 [markd2]
seen psychephylax?
16:17:27 [paje]
psychephylax was last seen on #openacs 8 days, 20 hours, 55 minutes and 14 seconds ago, saying: BSD and XP no like each other [Sun Mar 3 12:24:14 2002]
16:17:31 [markd2]
* markd2 leanrs to spell one of these days
16:19:18 [davb]
darn
16:19:23 [davb]
* davb misses k2pts again
16:19:42 [denshi]
denshi (~chatzilla@adsl-216-62-223-193.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) has joined #openacs
16:20:02 [markd2]
if he's a registered user, you can leave him memos
16:28:11 [denshi]
hey markd2
16:28:16 [markd2]
yo
16:29:09 [denshi]
In continuing the goats thread, I have a link for you
16:29:12 [denshi]
bobbins.org
16:30:18 [denshi]
neat stuff on badgerblog lately... shouldn't you be working?
16:32:58 [markd2]
heh
16:33:02 [markd2]
I've been studying for an oracle test
16:33:08 [markd2]
gotta take some mental breaks
17:10:26 [denshi]
open question: how much programmability would you like to see exposed to users of a community site?
17:11:21 [rbm]
define programabillity
17:12:05 [denshi]
hmm...
17:12:41 [davb]
to visitors?
17:14:50 [denshi]
I should first note that the 'program' for an active community website comprises both the code running it, and the very large dataset that has accumulated.
17:16:26 [denshi]
So if you, say, wanted to write something for photo.net or slashdot, your tools should optimally be both the source and access to the user data.
17:16:44 [denshi]
with those definitions out of the way...
17:18:02 [denshi]
rbm: programmability in that users are able to upload code that runs on my server. I have long wanted to do something like that.
17:19:04 [davb]
interesting. Tcl/Adp code? or some custom language?
17:19:41 [denshi]
that way, a user who knows of a better way of manipulating or presenting the community data can write it, and run it on the large dataset, and on my server.
17:21:31 [denshi]
I think the way that net.comm has transformed (from peer systems like NNTP to centralized bboards on RDBMSes) has an ugly downside, in that system evolution is constrained by the operators of the central bboards.
17:23:49 [denshi]
the dangers of user security and resource hogging are obvious.
17:25:15 [denshi]
The reason I'm asking is that I'm writing a test language with the design goal of 'user permission errors are impossible'. The above is a natural test bed. So I'm asking how much programmability people ask for as users.
17:26:44 [davb]
I think mostly users want to change the way the data is displayed. which is more a template kind of function.
17:27:14 [davb]
Your idea I can see more for an intranet situation
17:29:20 [andyn]
andyn has quit ("leaving")
17:33:02 [denshi]
I'm more interested in finding out what the non-average user would do -- that tiny group that writes new code. It would be trivial to extend to community to share code between users.
17:33:16 [denshi]
so targeting the nerds first is a productive plan.
17:34:13 [markd2]
interesting idea
17:34:17 [markd2]
I had never considered something like that
17:35:55 [davb]
ow, my brain
17:36:40 [davb]
denshi: here is another weblog at least partially related to programming languages
17:36:42 [davb]
http://radio.weblogs.com/0100812/
17:36:42 [chump]
E: http://radio.weblogs.com/0100812/ from davb
17:36:49 [davb]
E:|Patrick Logan's Weblog
17:36:49 [chump]
titled item E
17:37:55 [denshi]
I have considered that the first time I read slashdot, and thought "I could write a better UI for my /. user". But I never thought it was feasible b/c of the small number of users who will devote their lives to crashing your server.
17:38:41 [denshi]
But since I started on this kick about formal proofs of multiuser safety, I'm reevaluating it.
17:41:23 [andyn]
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17:44:28 [k2pts]
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17:45:38 [denshi]
hey neo
17:45:58 [k2pts]
hey denshi
17:46:05 [k2pts]
how's it going?
17:46:13 [denshi]
okay
17:46:25 [denshi]
talli sez you have a new lang to play with.
17:46:25 [davb]
hi k2pts
17:47:05 [hazmat]
ola
17:47:17 [k2pts]
hey hazmat,davb
17:49:28 [davb]
Mozilla 0.99!
17:49:37 [davb]
0.9.9 that is
17:49:47 [markd2]
* markd2 waits for moz 0.99999
17:49:50 [markd2]
gotta have 5 9's aftera ll
17:49:59 [markd2]
after all too
17:50:10 [davb]
cool: include TrueType font support for UNIX and SOAP support"
17:57:05 [k2pts]
davb: you there?
17:57:53 [k2pts]
paje: what's going on?
17:57:53 [paje]
wish i knew, k2pts
17:58:38 [davb]
I am here.
17:58:49 [k2pts]
check your private messages
17:59:17 [davb]
oops. (no sound) :)
18:06:15 [rbm]
SOAP support?
18:06:45 [davb]
Their site was slow so I didn't investigate. Probably means it can act as a SOAP client.
18:07:04 [rbm]
Why?
18:07:35 [davb]
part of the Mozilla as platform thing probably
18:08:38 [hazmat]
yup
18:09:08 [rbm]
I guess mozilla will become everything but a browser
18:10:14 [davb]
yeah, we need mozilla-lite with just a browser. But I can think of alot of things to do with the mozilla-platform
18:10:39 [k2pts]
hi rbm, I was just leaving...I hope you are well...we chat l8r
18:10:54 [davb]
time for lunch
18:11:04 [k2pts]
time for dinner :)
18:11:26 [k2pts]
k2pts has left #openacs
18:11:31 [rbm]
hey k2...
18:11:33 [rbm]
darn
18:47:57 [denshi]
davb: what's up with the blog?
19:09:35 [davb]
patrick logans?
19:09:55 [denshi]
no, yours.
19:10:36 [denshi]
the #openacs blog hasn't been updated since the 4th.
19:10:57 [davb]
argh.
19:11:25 [talli]
which blog? chump or loggy?
19:12:18 [denshi]
chump: wtf is wrong with you?
19:12:18 [chump]
Not understood: wtf is wrong with you?
19:12:42 [denshi]
chump: when I get back from lunch, I want to see some pages.
19:12:42 [chump]
Not understood: when I get back from lunch, I want to see some pages.
19:12:42 [davb]
its not chumps fault. it is my script to convert from XML to HTML
19:12:45 [denshi]
brb
19:13:51 [davb]
oops. it was my HTML, sorry about that.
19:14:34 [davb]
hopefully it will be fixed when it updated in 5 mins
19:20:10 [talli]
denshi, when you get back, i want to tell you abotu some of my thoughts regarding the C# projects
19:22:30 [davb]
http://www.thedesignexperience.org
19:22:31 [chump]
F: http://www.thedesignexperience.org from davb
19:22:34 [davb]
F:|Test
19:22:35 [chump]
titled item F
19:26:11 [davb]
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1590590171/ref%3Dnosim/joelonsoftware/002-9433575-2719258
19:26:11 [chump]
G: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1590590171/ref%3Dnosim/joelonsoftware/002-9433575-2719258 from davb
19:26:16 [davb]
G:| Herding Cats
19:26:17 [chump]
titled item G
19:27:12 [davb]
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1590590082/ref%3Dnosim/joelonsoftware/002-9433575-2719258
19:27:12 [chump]
H: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1590590082/ref%3Dnosim/joelonsoftware/002-9433575-2719258 from davb
19:27:18 [davb]
H:| The Career Programmer
19:27:18 [chump]
titled item H
19:33:31 [talli_]
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19:33:31 [talli]
talli has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
19:33:59 [talli_]
talli_ is now known as talli
19:37:53 [davb]
ok, one more try.
19:58:56 [denshi]
denshi has quit (Remote closed the connection)
19:59:56 [davb]
tada.
20:00:15 [davb]
I tried to add a search form to the pages, but I was unsuccessful, so you have to click search.
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21:44:05 [jim]
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21:44:10 [jim]
re
21:44:37 [talli]
hey jim
21:48:12 [rbm]
By the Powers of Greyskull!!!
21:48:28 [rbm]
* rbm is looking for a replacement for his tired 'moo'
21:48:45 [talli]
how about, "hello" ;)
21:48:58 [rbm]
talli: Bah, too boring :)
21:49:32 [talli]
* talli is glad that his suggestions last year to set up an OACS foundation ws turned down
21:49:53 [talli]
there are still a whole lot of problems we need to work out in the OACS community, but i'm glad we didn't set up a bureacracy
21:49:54 [markd2]
I've always been a fan of "By the Power of Numbskull!!"
21:50:35 [talli]
* talli tries to raise his Sword of Numbskull but instead drops it on his foot
21:53:18 [rbm]
* rbm gives talli a Skeleton maniacal laugh
21:53:24 [rbm]
paje: again!
21:53:25 [paje]
* paje spanks talli
21:53:50 [rbm]
paje: botsnack
21:53:50 [paje]
:)
21:54:21 [talli]
* talli quickly goes from being bent over, servicing his hurt foot to standing straight up and at attention due to paje's wicked spank
22:06:50 [jim]
is there a list of openacs-4 pkgs that has a description string?
22:07:16 [talli]
ybos may have something up, but if not, check out http://www.arsdigita.com/acs-reposiroty
22:07:30 [talli]
i meant http://www.arsdigita.com/acs-repository
22:07:39 [talli]
or did i mean www.arsdigita.com/acs-suppository?
22:16:23 [jim]
I suppose ;)
22:17:06 [jim]
ybos?
22:17:14 [jim]
paje, ybos>?
22:17:14 [paje]
no idea, jim
22:17:16 [jim]
paje, ybos?
22:17:17 [paje]
wish i knew, jim
22:17:42 [shagster]
* shagster curses the cm11a protocol and gives up for the day
22:17:44 [talli]
ybos is a acs company
22:17:48 [talli]
hey shagster
22:17:55 [jim]
ok, checking...
22:17:56 [shagster]
Hey talli
22:18:15 [shagster]
Ybos up to something? Nah. They just seem a bit strange
22:18:36 [jim]
shagster: x10?
22:18:41 [shagster]
* shagster . o O ( of -)
22:18:48 [shagster]
Jim: yes
22:19:13 [talli]
i've been very suspicious of ybos, but it looks like they are becoming good and valuable community members, which would be great
22:19:22 [jim]
so x10 protocol is open?
22:19:38 [shagster]
Yea, the specs have been out there for quite a while
22:20:01 [jim]
anyone have kits for things other than x10.com?
22:20:35 [jim]
maybe a relay with an x10 interface?
22:20:39 [talli]
shagster, what thread were you have the convo about IMAP vs. other mail protocols?
22:20:46 [shagster]
There are others out there...I just happen to have a bunch of x10 stuff and I've decied to roll my own conroll
22:20:56 [talli]
wait, i found it
22:20:56 [jim]
or an x10 interface capable of controlling a relay?
22:21:00 [talli]
the webmail contributors
22:21:03 [shagster]
[talli]: yes
22:21:23 [shagster]
[jim]: I have a serial interface, I just want to make my own interface for it
22:21:34 [jim]
I have this big relay, and some x10.com stuff...
22:21:40 [jim]
we have a light timer
22:22:22 [shagster]
I have a few motion sensors, application outlets and light outlets
22:22:43 [jim]
the motion sensors are those battery-powered things from x10.com?
22:22:51 [shagster]
Yep
22:23:01 [shagster]
work fairly well too
22:23:08 [jim]
they didn't think straight when they made those :)
22:23:41 [shagster]
x10 thinks ... what can we sell... not what is useful :)
22:23:51 [jim]
maybe they work good, but why battery when they can use power line? :)
22:24:23 [shagster]
Because you may not always have an outlet where you want to put them. Mine are almost all in hallways
22:25:20 [jim]
do these have radio transmitters/
22:25:21 [jim]
?
22:25:39 [shagster]
yes....
22:26:13 [shagster]
Hey, I sat down with ETP today...fairly kewl
22:26:44 [jim]
ok, yeah, that can work...
22:27:07 [talli]
yeah, ETP is nice
22:27:24 [talli]
and ETP2 is going to be great as jun, davb and luke are putting some nice stuff together
22:27:28 [talli]
have you seen modetp?
22:27:32 [jim]
but are there kits that have x10 interface electronics?
22:27:43 [shagster]
I believe so...
22:27:50 [shagster]
I'm just using stuff somebody gave me :)
22:27:57 [shagster]
[talli]: Not yet
22:28:18 [jim]
good enuf :)
22:28:22 [shagster]
I'm just testing the beta cvs branch, trying to find and attempt to fix bugs
22:28:45 [shagster]
[jim]: and I need a non work related project to waste some time on :)
22:28:52 [jim]
heh :)
22:29:03 [jim]
I use q-bert for that :)
22:29:10 [talli]
shagster: check out http://demo.infiniteinfo.com/modetp/
22:29:25 [talli]
jun kinda kludged this interface on top of ETP1
22:29:53 [shagster]
this is what I did with ETP http://oacs4-pg.alal.com/linux/
22:29:56 [talli]
ETP2 will use a similar interface (i hope) to something like this but keep the same kind of flexibility
22:30:32 [shagster]
that looks pretty good
22:30:35 [talli]
nice
22:30:40 [talli]
how did ETP help you?
22:30:52 [talli]
i see you used the ETP FAQ
22:31:09 [shagster]
http://oacs4-pg.alal.com/linux/clug-support/
22:31:09 [chump]
I: http://oacs4-pg.alal.com/linux/clug-support/ from shagster
22:31:14 [shagster]
Yep
22:31:23 [talli]
versioning, templating and date stuff, i assume?
22:31:35 [shagster]
Yep....
22:31:44 [talli]
gotta head out... talk to you germs in 60
22:31:56 [shagster]
I like that i can setup pages, version control them and control the access with clicks :)
22:32:00 [shagster]
later tallie
22:32:04 [shagster]
Umm...talli
22:32:09 [shagster]
opps
22:32:16 [jim]
what does the versioning?
22:32:35 [shagster]
ETP
22:32:38 [jim]
ahh
22:32:42 [shagster]
It is built in
22:32:55 [jim]
can you hook the version-control package in?
22:33:08 [jim]
and then hook that to a repository?
22:33:14 [jim]
cvs that is
22:33:17 [shagster]
I haven't looked at the code much yet, I'm not sure how they did it
22:44:03 [denshi]
denshi (~chatzilla@216.62.223.193) has joined #openacs
23:00:28 [markd2]
paje, excuse
23:00:29 [paje]
markd2: It's not plugged in.
23:19:13 [markd2]
heh
23:21:52 [davb]
davb (dave@24.58.162.46) has joined #openacs
23:32:06 [markd2]
markd2 has quit ("wheeeee")
23:32:38 [talli]
denshi, what are you complaining about now/
23:32:39 [talli]
?
23:33:00 [talli]
must reboot. MS tax
23:33:09 [talli]
talli has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:38:24 [rafa_]
hello
23:41:47 [denshi]
hey rafa
23:42:05 [rafa_]
hi denshi
23:43:34 [rafa_]
I am tried to use the code form oacs-4-5 branch but lots of problems, am I the only one?
23:43:34 [denshi]
talli takes a helluva long time to reboot
23:43:43 [rafa_]
s/tried/trying/
23:43:49 [denshi]
which module?
23:44:01 [rafa_]
news, bboard, etp
23:44:39 [rafa_]
Don says that the bboard problem is a bug that Talli fixed, but is nit there yet
23:45:07 [rafa_]
in news, It doesn't accept new announcements (I just posted it in the bboard)
23:45:23 [rafa_]
etp gave me some error at install time so I just skiped it
23:48:04 [davb]
rafa, I haven't had any problems lately. let me try to install.
23:49:58 [davb]
You need to scroll back in the error log to get the REAL error message from postgresql to find out which query is failing :)
23:58:01 [rafa_]
the one posted is not good?