00:00:10 o-l-c? 00:00:20 oe eye sea 00:00:26 ah, ok 00:00:44 with emphasis, 00:00:55 oe, -EYE- sea 00:02:16 anyway, I wanted to know if people were thinking about service-contract and having all its pieces in pl/{,pg}sql 00:03:27 then having bindings that reached into tcl 00:03:37 k2pts, you there? 00:03:53 lurking, it seems :) 00:09:08 (reasoning, if all the pieces for discovering and invoking contract operations were in sql, it would allow for global abilities of all packages to be present in each package's respective data model (or not, if some package doesn't implement the interface)) 00:10:01 then, I can ask from a plsql func if a particular package implements the interface and invoke if so 00:10:25 presently, we're thinking of a "delete package instance" operation 00:12:20 hey jim 00:12:45 I have posted a reply if you don't mind reading the chatlogs (chat with davb) 00:12:51 basically, you don't need to define 00:13:00 the interfaces in pl/[pg]sql 00:13:20 you'll have to do it in tcl and wrap up any pl/[pg]sql. 00:13:34 this is not a workaround...this is the right way to things with a-s-c 00:14:25 (eventhough there were plans for supporting a-s-c at from pl/[pg]sql...half a year of a-s-c use shows that it's best to keep everything in tcl 00:14:29 . 00:14:35 bbiam 00:22:47 ok, but that would deny us the ability to use asc in, say, the overall package drop script 00:22:47 talilee has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 00:23:26 talilee (~talli@lti-4.dialup.access.net) has joined #openacs 00:23:29 jim:that's the point instead of calling the drop script from pl/[pg]sql you will call it from inside a db_transaction in a tcl script 00:23:51 does that makes sense? 00:30:42 jim: the package drop script is in tcl now :) 00:30:56 oh wait,never mind. the package instance drop script is tcl. 00:30:58 is in tcl? 00:31:11 see above -^ 00:31:48 also, a package should already know how it has implemented a service contract. 00:32:41 I'm not sure people would agree with this, but my gut feeling tells me that altering the db directly is something that doesnt' belong in the scripting language... 00:33:18 it should be a capability of the database, as provided by a stored proc 00:33:27 but, ok... 00:33:36 ok :) 00:35:48 (admittedly, it also has to do with a desire to be able to use other scripting languages, as something of a drop-in replacement) 00:35:57 perl sucks! 00:36:55 * talilee is impressed with jim's restraint in the face of such massive flame bait 00:37:42 if other scripting languages can use the xql thing, the combination of all those elements ought to do it... 00:38:48 you would just need to implement a dispatcher in your choosen langauge. 00:38:57 the info is in the database. 00:39:14 jim: do you want to mix langauges? a little tcl, a little perl? 00:43:27 that would be one possibility... 00:45:29 but the ability to -replace- tcl also interests me, so the more the data model knows how to do its own thing, the better for that 00:46:22 (but that's incredibly long-term, projects I have involving perl and aolserver aren't anywhere near ready for any of that, etc) 00:47:19 jim. putting all of that in the DB would be cool, but it would also make it very difficult to make OACS more DB independent. or at least allow the system to be ported to DBS 00:47:43 oic 00:48:00 so go one way, you get scripting language independence 00:48:14 go the other way, you get database independence 00:48:21 scalar 00:48:30 vector 00:48:35 tensor? 00:48:48 oops - missed matrix. 00:48:57 what do you mean, 'scalar'? 00:49:38 talilee: not reallly. not any more than porting over the other pl/[pg]sql stuff 00:49:56 of course, you can stick tcl and perl, and python inside postgresql... 00:50:26 paje has quit ("regrouping; bbiab") 00:50:29 denshi: on one end of the scale, you have scripting language indep 00:50:44 on the other, you get database independence 00:51:48 davb: you would just need to implement a dispatcher in your choosen langauge. 00:51:51 right 00:52:13 jim: see the chatlogs, we're moving a-s-c specifications to xml next release cycle 00:52:32 k2pts: very interesting. 00:52:49 davb: I have told you that already, didn't I? 00:52:56 probably, its still cool. 00:52:58 :) 00:53:02 :) 00:53:04 bbiam 00:54:16 hamsalad (~rolf@above.badgertronics.com) has joined #openacs 00:54:39 the_docwolf (~docwolf@adsl-34-207-203.bct.bellsouth.net) has joined #openacs 00:54:56 the_docwolf has left #openacs 00:54:57 well, well well. the doctor and his lackey have arrived 00:55:00 brb 00:55:01 and then left 00:55:06 heh 00:55:08 hmm. 00:55:23 hamsalad, huh? a little too much time in boca? 00:55:31 boca. 00:55:37 ...boca 00:55:54 dr_derek_smart (~docwolf@adsl-34-207-203.bct.bellsouth.net) has joined #openacs 00:56:03 whoa 00:56:22 dr_derek_smart is not a very jewish name 00:56:27 THE LAST GAME YOU WILL EVER NEED 00:57:26 oh come on guys... (tumbleweeds..>) 00:57:42 sigh. 00:57:51 ARE YOU MOCKING ME, HAMSALAD? 00:58:05 WHERE'S THAT DAMN COKE MACHINE? 00:58:19 hazmat is now known as z_igor 00:58:21 whoa 00:58:25 hamsalad, is dr_derek_smart having some trouble releasing some of his, uhm, aggression? 00:58:30 what's going on in here? 00:58:33 z_igor is now known as hazmat 00:58:45 perhaps you ought to take him to one of boca's finer exotic establishments. 00:58:47 dr_D is wearing a stylish band-collar dress shirt. 00:59:08 BattleACS 3k: THE LAST WEB FRAMEWORK YOU WILL EVER NEED 00:59:20 ah, yes. that's good. they only went out of style like 5 years ago. he's improving 01:00:21 OFF TO SAWGRASS TO RUN DOWN SOME SLACKJAWED PUNKS 01:00:25 dr_derek_smart has quit (Client Quit) 01:00:46 docwolf (~docwolf@adsl-34-207-203.bct.bellsouth.net) has joined #openacs 01:00:55 what... happened.. i must have blacked out. 01:01:02 heh 01:01:03 haha 01:01:08 docwolf! you just missed some crazy abstard talking about a new forked acs! 01:01:15 haha. 01:01:42 he was talking about releasing the code to the community so he wouldn't have to buy pizzas for his only programmer anymore 01:01:44 wow! was he from ybos? 01:01:45 it was... insane 01:02:08 i thought he might have been from ybos, but then he invoked the devil's name 01:02:41 * hamsalad is away - auto "haha" - [DorkBox] 01:03:07 anyone wanna hear an "only in new york city" story? 01:03:14 yup 01:03:17 haha 01:03:18 sure! 01:03:21 ok... 01:03:44 so i was coming back from the office this evening, and i got on the C train going north from Brooklyn (high st. exit) 01:04:27 so far, only in NYC, alright :) 01:04:35 i took a seat between a mumbling, insane homeless black man who was eating from a styrofoam plate a meal of chicken and yellow rice and a cute girl with curly brown hair and aqua blue eyes 01:04:52 go talilee! 01:05:08 as i sat down, i realized that the homeless dude started talking about me, saying something like, "this white dude is staring at me" 01:05:16 so i kept staring 01:05:20 and he kept talking about me 01:05:56 then i noticed he was talking about the girl, too. talking about how we were made for each other cuz we're both crazy 01:06:11 so i turned to her and asked her if he was talking about her before i got there. she said yes 01:06:31 after a little while, i noticed she was reading a script. so i asked her what the script was for 01:07:05 she said it was for a play she was doing at a theater on 42nd and 11th, i congratulated her on being an actress in NYC since that's such a rough gig... 01:07:23 go talilee! 01:07:25 so we talked a little more abotu the plays she's done,a nd what i did, and where she was from and where i was from.... 01:07:41 to borrow from a NYC jew from the upper west side, yadda yadda yadda 01:07:46 go talilee! 01:08:11 so when we reached my stop, i was a bit rushed so i asked her if she wanted to get some coffee sometime 01:08:16 she said yes, so i gave her my card. 01:08:31 all of a sudden, the homeless dude goes, "YEAH!!!" and offers me a high five 01:08:40 haha. 01:08:44 by this time, the car was pretty packed, so everyone turned 01:08:57 i ddin't really know what to do, so i returned his high five 01:09:14 i looked at the girl, and her head was in her hands, either laughing or trying to hide 01:09:21 and i had to jump off the train 01:09:32 but i never even got her name! 01:09:45 luckily, though, i remmeber the theater she's working at. 01:10:07 "i'm irciing from a minimum security cell" 01:10:07 i hope you're still at the sink, washing your hand. 01:10:09 so i looked it up, checked out the play she was reading and got her name... and left a message for her at the theater 01:10:21 hey now. 01:10:28 go talilee! :) 01:10:30 TALLI: THE LAST STALKER A NY ACTRESS WILL EVER NEED 01:10:31 Label TALLI not found. 01:11:21 NYC is the only place in the world that is so post-modern that it is both expected and accepted to pick up people on the subway. especially with the approval of the down and out 01:11:44 there's a fine line between stalking and romance, btw 01:11:53 i rely on vinod to show me that line. 01:13:34 that line blurs so easily. i say if you're not using binoculars it's not stalking 01:14:01 it blurs a lot more easily after you've had 15-20 white russians. 01:14:02 damn straight 01:14:09 haha 01:14:15 btw, i'm just trying to keep up with yon 01:14:50 but i don't have the accent, so it;s an uphill battle 01:16:21 one time i went out with yon. 01:16:32 it was to that place Dali in Cambridge. 01:16:39 the trendy tapas place. 01:16:46 it was packed, there was a 2 hour wait. 01:17:02 but since Yon has the secret spanish handsshake 01:17:09 some guy just cleared a table for us 01:17:22 haha 01:17:27 markd2 (~Snak@r-41.20.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 01:17:28 so, these two girls noticed that we were important people 01:17:35 and came over 01:17:37 markd2! 01:17:38 and sat down with us 01:17:45 you markd2 01:17:45 and chatted for a while. 01:17:50 and yon went home with both of them? 01:17:54 and then they said "so. what do you guys do?" 01:17:57 greets 01:18:01 uh oh 01:18:04 and we were like "we're computer geeks for arsdigita" 01:18:13 and they abruptly got up and left. 01:18:13 :-) 01:18:13 * markd2 is back from the omaha vacation 01:18:25 and they said, "OH MY GOD!!! DO YOU KNOW PHILIP????" 01:18:31 you could hear the needle scratching across the record 01:18:33 nice. they just left? 01:18:46 yes. they got up and left. almost immediately. 01:18:49 you should have told them your salaries 01:18:50 it was like a bad 80s movie. 01:18:54 haha 01:18:55 haha 01:19:19 it didn't help that i had on my bolo tie and slip on vans. 01:19:46 hamsalad: You should have said "we're hi-tech workers" 01:20:02 and you hadn't fixed your glasses yet, so the tape was still holding together the bridge, right? 01:20:07 to be honest i dont think we said arsdigita. i think we just said "we are software engineers" 01:20:14 "I HAVE BUILT THE LAST GAME YOU WILL EVER NEED". that gets all the chicks. 01:20:15 which is the kiss of death 01:20:15 k2pts: would it be possible to refactor asc such that both approaches can be taken? 01:20:51 I was in med school when I met my wife. I don't know if she'd have dated had I said "I'm a computer science student" ;-) 01:20:56 i think docwolf and dr_derek_smart have been hanging out together 01:20:59 s/dated/dated me/ 01:21:24 heh - i've tried both approaches, rbm. neither works for me 01:21:40 Actually I think she would have. In Brazil we don't have the "geek" stigma. This is a north-american-high-school-movie thing, /me thinks. 01:21:46 i get to bust out "i started a software company" but thankfully they dont' ask me wtf that means 01:22:12 vinod: Come to Brazil with me. I can introduce you to some very pretty friends of mine that are still single. 01:22:12 i usually just take the miata down to 7-11 and wait until someone needs me to buy a 12 of coors. 01:22:16 rbm, you can't run from the truth by blaming it on the gringos. you're a nerd, and it ain't cool 01:22:23 haha 01:22:26 * rbm is k00l :-) 01:22:31 rbm: lemme know when you're going! :-) 01:22:53 vinod: Buy us 2 tickets and I'm available anytime after mid-may :) 01:22:56 rbm: can you get me a date with a chick that had a breast reduction and a butt implant? 01:23:04 haha 01:23:19 talilee: That's how Brazilian women are by default. No need for artifical things. 01:24:31 rbm: yon likes to talk about how there is such a dearth of straight men in rio that the women are all insane nymphos. wait. that may not be yons story, but the plot of some porno i saw recently... 01:24:36 then again, is there a difference? 01:25:05 that's because they can shake their hips and butt 01:25:11 hey markd2 01:25:25 talilee: Rio is tough. Really tough. Lots of gay men, lots of beautiful women. Don't know about the nympho part. 01:25:31 (markd2 is shell-shocked by this conversation) 01:25:36 my bro just got back from doign a shoot in brazil. he said he was overwhelmedby the beauty of the women 01:25:52 talilee: "a shoot"? 01:26:03 the balloon hat project 01:26:03 * markd2 was struggling to get AIM working again 01:26:03 yeah rbm. he makes "movies"... ahem. 01:26:12 * k2pts thinks we should change the channel topic just in case 01:26:17 docwolf: Ah... 01:26:23 rbm: what makes that combo "tough" 01:26:25 ? 01:26:35 k2pts: Shhh! We're discussing important OpenACS matters! :) 01:26:41 :) 01:26:43 right 01:26:45 can I run CVS pserver with daemontools instead of inetd? 01:26:46 hey now. let's not drag my brother's name through the mud. 01:26:47 talilee: It's tough for women. 01:26:55 his movies are classy 01:27:18 this irc channel is classy. 01:27:20 oh. that's too bad. i would like to go and help them make it through such a difficult situation 01:27:25 in factk. it reeks of class. 01:27:52 I have a friend whose dead is a doctor and divorced. He is in his 50s and about to retire. Guess where he chose to retire and live??? 01:28:08 silicon valley!? 01:28:13 haha 01:28:48 talilee: I gotta warn you that women from Rio have the reputation of being astonoshingly beaultiful, as long as they don't say anything. 01:29:00 just the way i like them. 01:29:03 rbm: any truth to the rumor that they age badly? 01:29:04 talilee: But I think those times are past :-) Today beach women all go to college :) 01:29:12 damn 01:29:16 educated beach women 01:29:21 they'll want all kinds of right 01:29:23 rights 01:29:28 like, bikini tops 01:29:29 yeah, we have that type in boca. 01:29:44 docwolf: Nah. That was before everybody knew that too much sunlight without sunblock cause the skin to age faster. 01:29:46 but, docwolf, i think the women in brazil might have teeth 01:29:53 s/cause/caused/ 01:31:37 talli: who needs teeth? 01:31:44 touche 01:32:04 vinod: do you have run aolserver from daemontools in the docs? 01:32:29 davb: i show both approaches 01:32:33 cool. 01:33:07 speaking of toothless 01:33:10 i'm surprised denshi hasn't weighed in with his illuminating thoughts about love in the early twenty-first century 01:33:16 BTW, I tested my new site design in mozilla and it looked ok. 01:33:19 i bought a VIA C3 Ezra today 01:33:27 has anyone tried this chip yet? 01:33:33 what is it? 01:33:34 love is overrated compared to world domination. 01:33:44 celeron clone? 01:33:54 the C3 Ezra is unique, because it's an x86 that apparently can run without a fan. 01:34:11 it allows you to create the "holy grail" of a fan-free PC. 01:34:15 that is spiffy. 01:34:22 ah, the docwolf ears can rest peacefully now 01:34:28 you need that little case we were discussing before. 01:34:37 unfortunately, i have the shuttle case 01:34:42 and it's got the loudest fan ever. 01:34:51 I have 12 fans running in my little 7x9 office 01:34:58 davb: !!!!!!!! 01:35:03 3 PCs 01:35:08 that is horrendous. 01:35:14 no wonder davb can never hear us 01:35:16 noise pollution = bad for your health. 01:35:32 well one is hidden, I can't hear that one really. 01:35:56 hopefully the ezra will work well enough for daily tasks. 01:35:59 they aren't too bad actually. the little tiny gateways we have at work are louder with only one little fan. 01:36:06 docwolf, i'm not sure that davb has quite reached the decibel level of a jumbo jet engine 01:36:09 wow i'll have to vote jonathan ellis as the biggest dink on the openacs bboards (next to me, of course) 01:36:38 yeah, jonathon ellis gets pretty nasty sometimes. but he's honest at least 01:36:51 everytime posts something like "look at htis thing i built" the only thing he posts is "haha. i've always hated that style" 01:37:17 yeah, that was pretty bad 01:37:21 has he ever built anything we can see? 01:37:26 especially because gilbert's thing is really cool 01:37:34 davb: carnageblender :) 01:37:43 sigh. 01:38:26 ah. 01:38:52 talli: low-level noise can be harmful, too. 01:39:08 (it can be damaging,psychologically.) 01:39:21 I think I will put the web server in the basement...:) 01:39:37 for example, i sat next to my shuttle box all day today, and for some odd reason by 5:00 i felt like bludgeoning rolf 01:39:58 actually wait a minute. maybe this fan is why i feel like i'm about to pass out 01:40:08 either that or the rophynol 01:40:13 docwolf: maybe you shuold ask hamsalad to stop humming britney songs all day 01:40:33 that has to be more dangerous than a couple of fans 01:40:34 talli: it was that, or debbie gibson. lesser of two evils.. 01:41:05 davb: haha 01:41:07 they are both trailer trash. 01:41:39 speaking of which, tiffany is in the latest playboy 01:41:44 whoa. 01:42:25 sweet. tiffany, derek smart.. i feel like i'm back in 1988 01:42:42 i can cue up "one night in bangkok" 01:43:04 alas Tiffany had a boob job 01:43:08 Yikes 01:43:11 dude, i've already got the tesla spooled, thanks anyway. 01:43:14 haha 01:43:30 * rbm 's wife has about 3 or 4 "top 80's" cds 01:43:50 isn't tiffany like 36 now. 01:43:56 I sold all of mine. 01:44:08 I wore all mine out 01:44:09 i don't think she's that old. 01:44:17 i'll have to get the magazine to verify. 01:45:01 If she was 15 an 1988, she should be in her late 20s or early 30s. 01:45:27 she's 30 01:45:31 hm.. i should get her number. 01:45:33 k2pts: which table can I look in to see if my stuff is being indexed 01:46:11 k2pts: also will it index all the stuff I put int he CR before I installed openfts? 01:48:09 * rbm heads out to a meeting 01:48:14 bbl 01:48:56 davb: txt for object_ids etc, indexX for indexed words 01:49:16 ok thanks. 01:49:19 X between 1 and 13 01:49:26 * hamsalad gets in a serious irc discussion with docwolf. 01:49:29 13 is the defaullt 01:49:43 * docwolf must go teach rolf a lesson.. push the button, rolf. 01:49:46 * markd2 starts slogging through 4-5 days of backlogged email 01:50:58 nothing. 01:51:01 hmmm. 01:51:05 oops. 01:51:08 wow tiffany is younger than gwen stefani. 01:51:12 I think my content_type is wrong. 01:51:17 argh. 01:51:25 hamsalad: use your leet skills to find her phone number. 01:51:37 talli isn't the only one who can engage in high-level stalking. 01:51:49 i can get gwen stefani's number 01:52:00 tiffany's will be more of a challenge. 01:53:45 must exit 01:53:47 l8r 01:53:48 hamsalad has quit ("hamsalad has no reason") 01:54:14 no, they ARE content_revisions. 01:54:17 hmmmm. 01:54:36 k2pts: is there a way to have it reindex all my old content? 01:58:17 * denshi finishes his beer and logs off of this whirlwind of perversity. good luck with the stalking, talli. 01:58:25 thanks denshi 01:58:31 i'll give her a peep for ya 01:58:36 l8r. 01:58:41 denshi has quit () 02:00:02 davb: off the top of my head, a simple solution is to insert all searchable object_ids in the search queue with event='UPDATE' 02:02:17 k2pts has left #openacs 02:05:04 thanks (bye) 02:20:54 I think I need a seperate service-contract for my ETP items, even though they are in the CR 02:22:00 ah, now I remember. 02:22:17 I don't need triggers, but there has to be a datasource provider for every content_type. 02:44:46 darn: I forgot the secret incantation rbm told me to get a URL from a package_id 02:44:46 vinod has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 02:50:51 rafa has quit ("[x]chat") 03:06:41 bartt has quit () 03:07:39 markd2 has quit ("Connection reset by beer") 03:14:39 davb: Look at the log. 03:14:54 thanks. 03:16:10 I can't remember either and I don't want to ssh into my devel box now :) 03:16:31 no problem. 03:26:32 hmmm, still not indexing my worthless content... 03:37:27 time to go. bye 03:37:30 davb has quit ("Client Exiting") 04:57:30 Grax (~grax@ip68-13-3-74.om.om.cox.net) has joined #openacs 04:58:02 Grax is now known as dwalker 05:13:19 dwalker has quit ("http://www.grax.com") 05:24:59 andyn (~andy@12-254-190-230.client.attbi.com) has joined #openacs 06:04:30 andyn has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 06:04:39 andyn (~andy@12-254-190-230.client.attbi.com) has joined #openacs 07:32:31 hazmat has quit (Remote closed the connection) 07:48:05 til has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 08:08:30 echarp (manu@r38m112.cybercable.tm.fr) has joined #openacs 08:10:32 talilee has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 09:46:01 dlk (dlk@as2-1-4.va.g.bonet.se) has joined #openacs 09:46:25 dlk is now known as dlk-vacation 11:34:52 dlk-vacation is now known as dlk-afk 13:27:19 echarp has quit (Remote closed the connection) 13:40:12 dlk-afk is now known as dlk-vacation 13:44:04 davb (~dave@rrcs-nys-24-97-22-203.biz.rr.com) has joined #openacs 13:54:42 rzolf (~rolf@above.badgertronics.com) has joined #openacs 13:54:52 nyone alive? 13:56:37 only us supreme tacos. 13:59:12 hm 13:59:13 ok 14:13:03 dlk-vacation has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 14:13:03 dlk (dlk@as2-1-4.va.g.bonet.se) has joined #openacs 14:42:51 hello rzolf 14:52:45 hello davB 14:53:34 hazmat (~ender@adsl-66-123-57-58.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net) has joined #openacs 15:03:54 rzolf has quit ("rzolf has no reason") 15:17:08 dlk has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 15:48:38 markd2 (~Snak@r-41.38.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 15:51:27 vinod (~vinod@209-122-233-245.s2055.apx2.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com) has joined #openacs 15:56:06 hi hazmat, markd2, vinod 16:03:00 greetings 16:03:06 hi everyone 16:06:10 markd2 has left #openacs 16:06:13