IRC log of openacs on 2002-02-19

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:35:43 [talilee]
talilee is now known as talli
00:55:01 [vinod]
vinod has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:03:03 [vinod]
vinod (~vinod@209-122-233-187.s1997.apx2.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com) has joined #openacs
01:06:43 [davb]
wb vinod
01:08:11 [vinod]
thanks davb
01:09:20 [vinod]
how's the secret project going?
01:09:28 [davb]
pretty bad :)
01:09:51 [vinod]
doh!
01:10:04 [davb]
I am supposed to be doing graphic design for it, but its not going to good. I am way out of practice. I have been hacking for almost two years on OpenACS stuff.
01:10:18 [davb]
I am sure it will all work out.
01:10:52 [vinod]
cool. well, if it's any consolation, i'm sure you've forgotten more design stuff than i've ever known :-)
01:11:04 [davb]
:)
01:12:28 [vinod]
you host your stuff on your dsl line, right?
01:12:37 [davb]
cable now.
01:13:33 [vinod]
ahh - cool. i need to find some hosting. i've been looking at hub.org and the prices seem pretty good
01:14:11 [davb]
they are ok, also check out cornerhost.com
01:14:27 [davb]
one of these days I am going to setup an OpenACS site over there.
01:14:46 [davb]
he said it would be $30/month
01:14:56 [davb]
which is really cheap for OpenACS.
01:15:21 [davb]
but its not on the menu yet, you have to ask :)
01:15:28 [vinod]
cool!
01:32:02 [marduk_away]
marduk_away has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:32:02 [shagster]
shagster has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:44:17 [davb]
vinod: top secret project? :)
01:45:00 [vinod]
heh - i wish
01:45:15 [vinod]
just need to update my site to openacs
01:45:32 [davb]
ah
01:45:34 [talli]
vinod, you can program OACS?
01:45:44 [davb]
uhoh, sorry ...
01:45:54 [talli]
what?
01:46:03 [vinod]
no, no - i assumed it would already be programmed
01:46:16 [talli]
by your monkey
01:46:17 [talli]
?
01:46:19 [vinod]
don't i just have to click on the Windows installer button?
01:47:03 [talli]
no, you're supposed to click the blinkiing button that says, "Free XXX and Home Loans!!!"
01:47:13 [talli]
that works pretty good and easy
01:47:29 [vinod]
yeah, i've tried that, but the interest rates are ridiculous
02:00:24 [vinod]
cool... cornerhost has a blog where he documents all his problems as they happen
02:00:40 [vinod]
http://cornerhost.blogspot.com/
02:00:41 [chump]
A: http://cornerhost.blogspot.com/ from vinod
02:00:53 [vinod]
A:| Cornerhost - webhosting
02:00:53 [chump]
titled item A
02:01:39 [vinod]
that seems pretty open for a webhosting company
02:02:38 [davb]
yeah, its pretty cool. I have two sites there, but they are not OpenACS yet.
02:02:59 [davb]
good luck. and good night :)
02:03:24 [vinod]
gnight
02:03:32 [davb]
davb has quit ("Client Exiting")
02:25:00 [shagster]
shagster (~mkovach@web1.alal.com) has joined #openacs
02:25:12 [shagster]
*grr*
02:38:51 [vinod]
vinod has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:42:33 [Psychephylax]
Psychephylax (nblyumbe@ool-18bd7775.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #openacs
02:42:38 [Psychephylax]
hey talli
02:42:46 [talli]
hey Psychephylax. welcome back
02:42:51 [Psychephylax]
long time no see
02:42:55 [Psychephylax]
How's everyone
02:43:04 [Psychephylax]
* Psychephylax lurks around looking for dave and mark
02:43:08 [Psychephylax]
* Psychephylax checks behind chump
02:43:13 [Psychephylax]
nope, not here
02:43:14 [talli]
markd's not been here today
02:43:20 [talli]
and davb left a little while ago
02:43:21 [Psychephylax]
* Psychephylax lifts up loggy
02:43:23 [Psychephylax]
no dave here
02:43:35 [Psychephylax]
Cool
02:43:38 [Psychephylax]
How's everything?
02:44:48 [Psychephylax]
* Psychephylax pokes talli
02:44:49 [talli]
good. you?
02:44:56 [Psychephylax]
Keepin' busy
02:45:00 [Psychephylax]
Went to the gym today
02:45:08 [Psychephylax]
woooo :) weight loss!
02:45:20 [talli]
stayin' lazy
02:45:25 [talli]
didn't go to the office today
02:45:27 [Psychephylax]
Work is alright...getting lots of overtime :)
02:45:32 [Psychephylax]
Ah
02:45:35 [Psychephylax]
I worked
02:45:37 [talli]
woooo :( beer guts!
02:45:44 [Psychephylax]
Went up to the bronx to fix stuff
02:45:48 [talli]
i worked from home
02:45:51 [Psychephylax]
Hehe
02:45:52 [talli]
where are you working?
02:46:04 [Psychephylax]
It's kind of hard to move a server from point a to point b from home :P
02:46:06 [vinod]
vinod (~vinod@207-172-97-193.s193.apx1.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com) has joined #openacs
02:46:23 [talli]
not hard for vinod!
02:46:32 [Psychephylax]
* Psychephylax thwaps vinod
02:46:35 [Psychephylax]
:-D
02:46:36 [talli]
(that's what all the boys say)
02:46:58 [Psychephylax]
talli you know Montefiore Children's Hospital?
02:47:02 [Psychephylax]
it's in the bronx
02:47:05 [talli]
yeah
02:47:10 [talli]
ybos built them an ACS system
02:47:12 [vinod]
* vinod doesn't want to know what talli's talkin bout
02:47:19 [Psychephylax]
ybos?
02:47:28 [vinod]
hey Psychephylax
02:47:32 [talli]
an ACS company
02:47:32 [Psychephylax]
hey vinod ltns
02:47:35 [Psychephylax]
Ah...
02:48:00 [talli]
oh man
02:49:30 [talli]
yeah
02:49:44 [talli]
they went to all the OACs companies last fall to get people to build them a system.
02:49:48 [talli]
you mean the planetarium?
02:49:59 [Psychephylax]
no, the non-medical floor
02:50:00 [talli]
did you notice that each bed has a 42 in plasma monitor next to it?
02:50:08 [Psychephylax]
yeah we put them there :)
02:50:09 [talli]
all 600 beds, i think?
02:50:14 [Psychephylax]
Well, not our choice
02:50:24 [talli]
who are you working for?
02:50:33 [vinod]
* vinod adds montefiore to his job-search list
02:50:36 [Psychephylax]
Cablevision
02:50:39 [talli]
ah, cool
02:50:53 [Psychephylax]
You know their TVs are powered by our programs :)
02:51:10 [talli]
vinod, if you can get a pediatrics gig at this hosptal, i imagine it would be sweet
02:51:20 [Psychephylax]
yeah
02:51:26 [Psychephylax]
you can flirt with all the hot nurses
02:51:28 [talli]
they also have gigabit ethernet by every bed as well
02:51:31 [Psychephylax]
Just pretend you're lost
02:51:41 [Psychephylax]
talli, I don't think it's gigabit
02:51:48 [Psychephylax]
100mbps more like it
02:51:49 [vinod]
haha - i spose i'd have to learn pediatrics, then
02:52:01 [talli]
they told everyone originally that they were gigabit
02:52:07 [talli]
yes, alas.
02:52:07 [Psychephylax]
it might be
02:52:22 [Psychephylax]
it pulls VOD off of the servers in Yonkers
02:52:25 [Psychephylax]
actually
02:52:26 [Psychephylax]
I'm sorry
02:52:29 [Psychephylax]
VOD off Hicksville
02:52:59 [shagster]
kewl
02:53:20 [vinod]
hey shagster
02:53:24 [shagster]
Hey...
02:53:40 [shagster]
I almost got arrested, today ... LOL
02:53:44 [Psychephylax]
bah
02:53:46 [Psychephylax]
that's NOTHING
02:53:53 [vinod]
for hanging out with talli again?
02:53:56 [Psychephylax]
I almost got KILLED today
02:54:06 [talli]
shagster, what happened?
02:54:14 [Psychephylax]
talli, if you ever go to the bronx don't trust the red lights
02:54:25 [Psychephylax]
Apparently they're optional
02:54:32 [shagster]
XO's salesman pissed me off :)
02:54:40 [talli]
XO?
02:55:01 [Psychephylax]
Crossover
02:55:02 [shagster]
XO communication,htp://www.xo.com
02:55:03 [Psychephylax]
Duh!
02:55:16 [talli]
ah
02:55:20 [talli]
what happened?
02:55:20 [Psychephylax]
so how did you get arrested from that
02:55:25 [Psychephylax]
I piss off lots of salespeople
02:55:34 [shagster]
Salesman pised me off, been trying to get this line up for 3 months...
02:56:15 [shagster]
Went to their sales office and explain I wanted to either a) talked to the sales reps office or b) leave with his balls
02:56:16 [Psychephylax]
yeah
02:56:20 [Psychephylax]
sometimes DSL companies do that
02:56:21 [talli]
haha
02:56:37 [talli]
so...
02:56:51 [Psychephylax]
Some other ones (PhoenixDSL) like to waste your time for 3 months then go bankrupt
02:56:54 [talli]
does he mind not having balls anymore?
02:57:01 [shagster]
Somebody said they aren't here, so I said, Fine I'll take your balls...then somebody called the cops...
02:57:07 [Psychephylax]
lol
02:57:08 [talli]
haha
02:57:12 [vinod]
lol
02:57:15 [shagster]
p: this is a 100MB ethernet connection...
02:57:18 [talli]
oh man
02:57:29 [Psychephylax]
* Psychephylax wonders when he's been nicknamed "P"
02:57:55 [shagster]
Cop was laughing so hard he let me go..told them they should consider getting my line working...
02:58:07 [talli]
that's a good cop
02:58:15 [shagster]
Psychephylax because I'd never spell your name right consistantly
02:58:25 [Psychephylax]
That's ok
02:58:32 [Psychephylax]
just try to remember Psy (tab)
02:58:38 [shagster]
Well, I host his wife's company website :)
02:58:39 [talli]
shagster, i'm going to try using that negotiating technique
02:59:14 [shagster]
No problem, learned it from my dad...it works :)
02:59:29 [vinod]
"enterprise class websites or we'll get your competitor's balls"
02:59:52 [talli]
i build nonprofit websites
02:59:52 [Psychephylax]
lol
03:00:03 [Psychephylax]
talli can you build me a website/
03:00:03 [shagster]
But I ripped there connection out of my data center tonite and stuffed in their mailslot :)
03:00:06 [Psychephylax]
it's non-profit
03:00:12 [Psychephylax]
as in there will be no profit for you :)
03:00:12 [talli]
so, it might be more like "enterprise class websites or i'll give you vinod's balls"
03:00:15 [talli]
that's threat enough
03:00:35 [shagster]
Enterprise websites or rub my manboobs!
03:00:58 [vinod]
* vinod hopes talli doesn't sign up any customers
03:01:50 [shagster]
I need to get back into more web stuff...email is going to kill me :)
03:02:11 [Psychephylax]
hehe
03:02:30 [shagster]
I officially use 2 t1's today just for incoming spam *grr*
03:03:00 [talli]
jesus
03:03:13 [Psychephylax]
lol
03:03:20 [Psychephylax]
I think you need to spam the incoming mail addresses
03:03:42 [Psychephylax]
What people need to do is for every spam mail sent to you
03:03:54 [Psychephylax]
Forward that e-mail 5 times to the ISP
03:04:07 [shagster]
and use up more of my bandwidth :) Nah!
03:04:10 [Psychephylax]
Eventually abuse@isp.* will get kinda worried after getting hundreds of spam mails themselves
03:04:20 [Psychephylax]
They'll go hunting them down
03:05:25 [shagster]
I'm spent part of today talking ot upstream providers, I'm going to start blocking IP's on my border routers (on smtp for spam)
03:05:46 [Psychephylax]
Psychephylax has quit ("My damn controlling terminal disappeared!")
03:08:51 [shagster]
Okay, who thinks OpenACS could be use to create an 'Exchange' Replacement on Steriods?
03:09:16 [talli]
be great. but exchange is nice cuz it integrates iwth a desktop app
03:09:19 [shagster]
Well, Exchange/IIS replacement
03:09:33 [talli]
build something other than a browser and i think you're right
03:10:12 [shagster]
Well, I'm thinking or a mapi->openacs component
03:10:27 [talli]
like what?
03:10:43 [shagster]
Openmail and Evolution type intergration...
03:11:29 [talli]
like integrate with Evolution?
03:11:34 [talli]
that would be really cool
03:11:37 [shagster]
Basically create a OpenACS server to server domain/department websites, using user adminstration for email/calendar/address book control
03:11:54 [talli]
that would be awesome
03:12:09 [talli]
could use RPC and SOAP as well
03:12:35 [shagster]
I'm giving serious thought to it...
03:12:44 [shagster]
Of course, I would need some serious help :)
03:12:47 [vinod]
sounds good to me
03:12:54 [vinod]
(except for that last part)
03:12:57 [vinod]
:-)
03:13:01 [talli]
you should post your ideas
03:13:12 [shagster]
I have to finalize them....
03:13:13 [talli]
maybe write a spec
03:13:22 [talli]
post it and see people's reactions
03:13:38 [talli]
i bet it would be something someone's client would eventually look for
03:13:46 [shagster]
I'm contracting with BP right now and they are so Windows centric it is scarey
03:13:59 [talli]
british pet?
03:14:00 [shagster]
So I asked them why....
03:14:05 [talli]
petroleum
03:14:23 [shagster]
Yea, you've seen the gas stations :)
03:14:32 [talli]
right
03:16:09 [shagster]
And they love the email/address book/calendar/web site intergration that windows "can do"
03:16:10 [talli]
so why are they windows centric?
03:16:21 [talli]
everyone loves it. it's great.
03:16:28 [talli]
it's just that it's on windows
03:16:35 [talli]
as you say, maybe it's not so hard to fake...
03:16:41 [talli]
or rebuild
03:16:47 [marduk_away]
marduk_away (~marduk@206-72-66-50.dsl.dock.net) has joined #openacs
03:16:59 [shagster]
Yes, they replaced 3 Linux boxes running qmail with 15 NT servers to run their mail
03:17:08 [shagster]
(virus scanning, spam blocking, etc)
03:17:29 [shagster]
They called me back in to fix the "performance and security" issues
03:18:09 [shagster]
So I asked them why they went to Windows NT for it
03:18:40 [talli]
no way
03:19:15 [shagster]
Yep...
03:19:41 [shagster]
they spend over 1.5M dollars to have a slower, less secure and useful system ...
03:19:57 [shagster]
Put they are going to start allow the use of Apache this year
03:20:08 [talli]
oh man
03:21:22 [shagster]
It was just a very interesting conversation...Im talking to them now to see how much they'll let me "repeat"
03:21:37 [talli]
repeat what?
03:21:49 [shagster]
Of the conversation....
03:22:01 [talli]
ah man. that bad, huh?
03:22:01 [shagster]
They tend to keep IT on a very tight lip
03:22:20 [talli]
because they don't like being embarrassed? or security through obscurity?
03:22:32 [shagster]
the first part
03:22:39 [talli]
bummer.
03:22:45 [talli]
well, as long as they pay i guess
03:23:12 [shagster]
Actually they pay on time!
03:23:25 [talli]
the bastards!
03:24:50 [shagster]
Yea, they confuse the well out of me...
03:25:18 [vinod]
of course they pay on time. they probably heard about the "balls" story
03:25:34 [shagster]
Actually, they have :)
03:25:37 [talli]
haha
03:25:50 [vinod]
that's a good story to "leak" :-)
03:26:04 [talli]
i think that's how BP negotiates deals in third world countries
03:26:13 [vinod]
haha
03:26:48 [shagster]
heh...
03:32:23 [shagster]
* shagster has a scotch...for everybody
03:33:00 [vinod]
* vinod coughs and soothes his throat with his beer
03:33:35 [talli]
* talli sparks up ano... uh, picks up his Little Women book
03:36:09 [vinod]
hey talli, not sure if you know this, but 'little women' isn't a porno
03:36:56 [talli]
that explains it. i was wondering why all the pictures were so small, black and close together.
03:37:05 [vinod]
haha
03:39:41 [shagster]
Heh..
03:41:37 [shagster]
Well, it is offical now, the NorthEast Ohio Linux Users Group's IRC is offically on a FreeBSD box behind an OpenBSD firewall
03:41:52 [talli]
haha
03:41:56 [talli]
who pulled that fast one?
03:42:04 [talli]
shagster, are you a BSD head?
03:42:58 [shagster]
The Debian box lost a power supply, I had a box..it just happen to have FreeBSD on it :)
03:43:04 [shagster]
and all my firewalls are OpenBSD
03:43:32 [shagster]
But, I've done kernel work on Linux...I'm a Open-type Unix guy
03:44:03 [vinod]
give shagster an inch and he'll take over your world
03:44:53 [talli]
and show you his open unix
03:45:18 [shagster]
http://cobalt22.cobalt.com, I did the initial port :)
03:45:19 [chump]
B: http://cobalt22.cobalt.com, from shagster
03:45:46 [talli]
dead links for me
03:46:16 [shagster]
Maybe the killed it since Sun bought cobalt
03:46:32 [vinod]
works for me
03:46:43 [shagster]
Yes, I've actually had Linux ignore my patches..
03:47:06 [talli]
what did you do for the cobalt?
03:47:12 [talli]
and does linus really ignore patches?
03:47:13 [vinod]
"14-Jun-2000 Mat continues to be the Man: "
03:47:37 [shagster]
Heh, it still says that? LOL
03:48:04 [shagster]
talli: I help start porting the 2.2/2.4 kernel to it
03:48:06 [talli]
ok, now i get the site
03:48:09 [talli]
wow, cool
03:48:48 [shagster]
But the mips kernel guys have taken it and ran with it...
03:49:03 [shagster]
Leaving me more time for non-kernel stuff
03:49:05 [talli]
does the cobalt run nicely with linux?
03:49:22 [shagster]
Oh, they run as great...for their purpose...
03:49:25 [shagster]
http://www.cobalt.com
03:49:26 [chump]
C: http://www.cobalt.com from shagster
03:49:35 [talli]
yeah, i saw that
03:49:43 [talli]
their purpose?
03:49:57 [shagster]
I have a older Cobalt I'm thinking of attempting to get OpenACS running on...
03:50:11 [talli]
they're just good web servers?
03:50:34 [shagster]
basically web/email servers for simple apache based websites...
03:50:57 [shagster]
Install a 1U rack unit, run 50-200 sites on it...
03:51:12 [shagster]
Use less power than a light bulb
03:51:30 [talli]
that's plenty
03:51:49 [talli]
would they be worth running a db on?
03:51:56 [talli]
or just a front end AOLserver box?
03:52:25 [shagster]
Well, the i386 machines would make nice db/aolserver combo's I think...
03:52:45 [shagster]
I'm going to test on a low-end mips cobalt and see..
03:54:13 [shagster]
I have a 256MB 133Mhz version, I'm going to stick two IDE drivers in it and see how well in runs on it...
03:54:29 [talli]
whoa
03:54:35 [talli]
that's a tiny little sucker
03:54:49 [shagster]
one rack unit...
03:55:04 [talli]
running the DB too, huh?
03:55:04 [talli]
well, i guess an OACS site is easy on CPU, heavy on RAM
03:55:26 [talli]
have you seen the dual-AMD 1Us that Penguin Computing sells? those look really nice
03:55:47 [talli]
but RAM is cheap
03:55:51 [shagster]
That is my thinking, plus the MIPS processor (think SGI) can really run even under heavy load
03:56:17 [shagster]
Yea, Penguin Computing has always had nice boxes...
03:56:21 [talli]
did you see one of the threads on /. about the Itanium vs. other CPUs?
03:56:30 [talli]
we have a couple of penguins that work realy nicely
03:56:59 [shagster]
I try to avoid threads on /. :)
03:57:05 [talli]
:)
03:57:11 [talli]
mod 4 at least for me
03:57:42 [shagster]
I have actually taken so discard i386 raq's and modified them to nice virus scanning servers...
03:58:01 [talli]
cool
03:58:06 [shagster]
I just look on the front page of slashdot...
04:00:07 [shagster]
But since OpenACS is so easy on CPU, I've been looking for a simple (and inexpesive) hosting "box' for it...
04:00:24 [talli]
right, makes sense
04:00:44 [shagster]
Then create a pre-package "solution" for it (kernel mods, etc.)
04:01:08 [talli]
whoa, that would be rad
04:01:17 [talli]
like the Rocket Start servers aD useed to sell?
04:01:23 [shagster]
Yep...
04:01:25 [talli]
only not 15K
04:01:47 [shagster]
I'm actually looking around the 2K-3K low end point..
04:02:13 [talli]
that would be great
04:02:15 [shagster]
Obviously if somebody had a high end client and needs a high end solution they should pay the higher price
04:02:27 [talli]
for some of my clients that might be enough
04:02:56 [talli]
shagster, you ever use Collabnet's SourceCast, or ever seen it?
04:03:20 [shagster]
I've looked at it...not seriously though
04:03:31 [talli]
does it do anyting that the OACS can't?
04:03:37 [shagster]
(but I was a peer review for Collabnet)
04:03:53 [talli]
yeah, i saw that.
04:04:04 [shagster]
I didn't see where it did anything that OACS didn't
04:04:20 [shagster]
and It lacked in a few areas, but I did compare it to 3.x
04:04:26 [talli]
ah, i see
04:04:49 [shagster]
But I'm really still getting use to 4.x
04:05:08 [shagster]
workflow looks really nice though
04:06:06 [talli]
workflow is really cool
04:06:13 [talli]
lars doesn't screw things up too much
04:06:15 [shagster]
but in the near future, I see myself being more on the low-level/installation/hosting end of OACS
04:06:38 [talli]
well, if you're interested in doing that, i may have some clients for oyu
04:07:20 [shagster]
Heh, somebody needs to be on that end :)
04:08:53 [shagster]
talli, that is good...
04:09:58 [shagster]
At some point I really need to see if I can get some of the serious OACS development companys and really see what they want for Installation/low-level area...
04:10:15 [shagster]
monitoring, that type of area...
04:10:27 [talli]
if you want to find out what we're looking for, contact dave hill at dh@museatech.net
04:10:35 [talli]
i know he's speccing for two clients right now
04:11:09 [shagster]
I'll do that
04:12:16 [shagster]
* shagster crashed mozilla
04:12:17 [shagster]
*grr*
04:13:07 [talli]
* talli applauds shagster for stopping the monster Mozilla and saving the good people of Tokyo
04:13:23 [shagster]
Heh....
04:14:02 [shagster]
Hey, the ultimategamemachine (sister show of junkyard wars) is using uptime!
04:14:03 [vinod]
no... mozilla's the good moster, isn't it?
04:17:09 [shagster]
http://uptime.openacs.org/uptime/reports.tcl?monitor_id=7147
04:17:10 [chump]
D: http://uptime.openacs.org/uptime/reports.tcl?monitor_id=7147 from shagster
04:18:21 [shagster]
Of course, I love this one: http://uptime.openacs.org/uptime/reports.tcl?monitor_id=5181
04:18:39 [shagster]
OpenACS monitoring zope.org :)
04:18:48 [talli]
no
04:18:54 [talli]
!!!
04:19:24 [shagster]
Well, it is I member page, but basically the entire site!
04:19:54 [talli]
not too reliable
04:20:38 [shagster]
it is Simon, he post on the Forums....
04:21:02 [shagster]
I just find in amussing (since they can't have a simular function)
04:21:29 [talli]
well, you know what they use for their developer discussions?
04:21:39 [shagster]
No, do you?
04:21:43 [talli]
yahoo! groups
04:21:49 [shagster]
hah!
04:21:59 [talli]
yeah. some "collaborative" software
04:22:08 [shagster]
Only time I used that is when h2g2 was down
04:22:34 [shagster]
1819 URLs monitored; 312 are current marked unreachable, of which 252 are considered stale. In other words, 4% of the actively monitored
04:22:36 [shagster]
URLs are unreachable.
04:22:51 [shagster]
1819 sites in uptime....kewl!
04:23:02 [talli]
that's quite a few
04:23:07 [talli]
running on oracle or pG?
04:23:18 [shagster]
postgres
04:23:21 [talli]
nice
04:23:32 [talli]
have you found a reason to use Oracle yet?
04:23:48 [shagster]
I did the conversion went they sent the first 'uptime is going away' page
04:23:55 [shagster]
Not really...
04:24:01 [shagster]
* shagster plus I"m too cheap!
04:24:02 [talli]
we have yet to run across a project that really truly needed oracle
04:24:02 [shagster]
:)
04:24:30 [talli]
what do you think PG's scalability may be like?
04:24:30 [shagster]
Unless you're doing high end finicials or such, I can't really think of one...
04:24:46 [talli]
do you think it's more scalable than oracle?
04:24:52 [shagster]
I think it would scale well
04:24:59 [talli]
maybe just throw more hardware at it if you need more work?
04:25:18 [shagster]
Until they have replication they'll still be a bit behind..
04:25:47 [shagster]
Actually system configuration/app configuration before hardware for scaling...
04:26:00 [shagster]
postgres stock is really low-end...
04:26:07 [talli]
right, well assuming that was done
04:26:17 [talli]
what do you mean?
04:26:30 [shagster]
I think for mid-sized installation, postgres would compete
04:26:47 [talli]
what's midsized, though?
04:26:57 [talli]
100K hits per day? 1MM hits per day?
04:27:03 [shagster]
A stock install of postgres really need to be tweaked..
04:27:17 [talli]
ah, right
04:27:20 [shagster]
Oh, I think properly configured, postgres could run amazon
04:27:26 [talli]
whoa.
04:27:34 [talli]
i guess that answers my question
04:27:48 [shagster]
Remember, I have it as the database for my mail servers..
04:27:56 [talli]
how big are your mailservers?
04:28:10 [shagster]
I get around 1M emails a day..
04:28:13 [talli]
whoa
04:28:19 [shagster]
plus, that same server does uptime
04:28:23 [talli]
sheesh
04:28:32 [talli]
ok, that's probably enough empirical evidence
04:28:42 [talli]
so is amazon a mid-sized installation?
04:28:51 [shagster]
1800 sites, 4 db hits/site, every 15 mins
04:29:07 [shagster]
Well it is heavy for a web site
04:29:16 [talli]
sheesh
04:29:19 [shagster]
but mid size for oracle installations
04:29:23 [talli]
ah, ok
04:29:38 [talli]
what's a large oracle install?
04:29:44 [shagster]
Think of a fortune 500 company doing accounting and time tracking...
04:29:48 [talli]
like goldman sach's historical trading?
04:30:09 [talli]
ah, ok
04:30:28 [shagster]
I know right now oracle is the backend for all BP finical transactions
04:30:50 [talli]
holy
04:30:52 [shagster]
They have 4 Sun E10K's handling it...
04:31:00 [talli]
whoa
04:31:15 [talli]
how many processors is that?
04:31:50 [talli]
it's amazing that oracle pulled such a con job on all of the dotcoms
04:31:59 [shagster]
I know...
04:32:12 [shagster]
I'm not sure about the system specs, I'll have to ask..
04:32:13 [talli]
PG wasn't ready, but if they had just poured half the money they gave to oracle into PG dev it would be the greatest DB in the owrld
04:32:38 [shagster]
I really once PG hit 7 , it was ready...
04:32:57 [talli]
yeah
04:33:05 [talli]
we don't even touch oracle for our development work
04:33:09 [talli]
all of our clients are on PG
04:33:19 [shagster]
Uptime is running on a "small server" (old sparc) and does about 250,000+ db transactions a day...no problem
04:33:45 [talli]
whoa.
04:33:49 [shagster]
I should really do some sar outputs for postgres developers...
04:33:51 [talli]
that's a good number to have, thanks
04:34:22 [shagster]
talli, think about it 1819 sites x 4 db hits per hour
04:34:45 [talli]
do you mind giving my the specs on that? i would love to use it in a sales presentation
04:35:00 [talli]
that's the kind of thing you might want to put on the boards for people to see, or on the PG hackers list
04:35:44 [shagster]
Yea, I'll look into it tommorow, get some usage stats, system states and put them out there...
04:35:52 [talli]
thanks, taht would be great
04:36:07 [shagster]
heh..for a t-shirt!...LOL
04:36:31 [talli]
no prob
04:36:39 [talli]
how about a cleveland social?
04:36:52 [talli]
but only if i get to leave with my balls
04:37:02 [shagster]
I'm working on it. I'll be talking to the current LUG pres shortly
04:37:21 [shagster]
Okay, you can keep them, but I can show you my collection!
04:37:21 [talli]
so each record in uptime uses 4 DB hits?
04:37:26 [talli]
oh man.
04:37:32 [shagster]
per hour
04:37:32 [talli]
that's ok
04:37:36 [talli]
oh
04:37:40 [talli]
so 1 hit per transaction
04:37:42 [shagster]
assuming the site is available
04:37:53 [talli]
4 transactions per hour
04:37:55 [talli]
per site
04:37:56 [talli]
?
04:38:08 [shagster]
At the least...
04:38:12 [talli]
ok, cool
04:38:40 [shagster]
I changed things a bit from the orignal uptime code
04:39:32 [shagster]
the original code was based on AOLserver 2.3.3, 3.x has better db control
04:39:51 [talli]
aolserver really does rock
04:40:30 [shagster]
Yes it does. Once they get a bit better with virtual hosting, I'd use it much more...
04:40:49 [talli]
have you taken a look at AOLserver 4?
04:41:03 [shagster]
A bit...
04:41:21 [shagster]
but I've had a lot on my plate lately
04:41:32 [talli]
understood
04:42:21 [shagster]
But now the dotcom boom has gone down, I have a bit more time..
04:42:30 [talli]
:)
04:42:57 [talli]
have you ever used netbsd?
04:43:28 [shagster]
Yep...
04:43:39 [talli]
like it?
04:43:47 [shagster]
Actually yes...
04:43:51 [talli]
how do you feel about it as a server environment?
04:44:13 [shagster]
I think it would be a good server
04:44:14 [talli]
i hear it's got an incredibly clean architecture. i also have a friend who i respect who's a netbsd developer
04:44:55 [shagster]
Netbsd is very clean, but in most cases that I could use it, OpenBSD runs on the same hardware and I'm a bit more secure with it...
04:45:34 [shagster]
But I'm looking at NetBSD for some smaller DNS/DHCP things I"m currently working on
04:46:04 [talli]
embedded?
04:46:23 [shagster]
Actually low-end hardware (cheap customers)
04:46:35 [talli]
cool
04:46:48 [talli]
my friend the netbsd developer is getting interested in the OACS
04:46:56 [shagster]
Actually old Dec 3000/600's that use to run OpenVMS
04:47:13 [talli]
he's going to start making a concerted effort to get the threading issues in netbsd cleaned up so it can run aolserver well
04:47:15 [shagster]
I think NetBSD could be a good platform for OpenACS
04:47:29 [shagster]
That was what I was going to mention...
04:47:41 [talli]
the thread stuff?
04:47:46 [shagster]
Yea...
04:47:50 [talli]
yeah, hopefully it will get fixed soon
04:48:06 [talli]
why do you think it would be a good platform? because then people could run OACS on their toasters?
04:48:10 [shagster]
They have been making very good progress on that front...
04:48:26 [talli]
OACS on toasters? great!
04:48:38 [shagster]
Netbsd is just do clean. Small, simple and stable
04:48:48 [shagster]
But threading is the big issue there..
04:48:58 [talli]
yeah, i hear their developers are top notch
04:49:25 [shagster]
I think NetBSD has the best *BSD developers
04:49:37 [talli]
oh yeah? how so?
04:49:40 [talli]
QA?
04:50:05 [shagster]
Well, the platforms they support and the quality they put out..
04:50:24 [talli]
cool
04:50:25 [shagster]
minus threading, they have an excellent system
04:50:39 [talli]
i hear that the thread issues should be cleaned up in 1.6
04:50:48 [talli]
which will be hte next release
04:50:53 [talli]
they're at 1.5.3
04:50:57 [shagster]
When I need a kernel or low level "idea" I usually look at netbsd code
04:51:53 [talli]
whoa, cool
04:51:56 [shagster]
If they fix the threading issue, I may just move a large part of my non-firewall stuff to it...
04:52:08 [talli]
so, does linus ignore patches?
04:52:24 [shagster]
At times, I think he just doesn't get to them...
04:52:30 [talli]
ah, cool
04:53:02 [shagster]
You have to remember, he has the final say on ALL linux patches...I think they said he gets at least 40 per day
04:53:21 [talli]
whoof.
04:53:34 [shagster]
look at how quick DonB can get overloaded
04:53:41 [talli]
but he defers a lot to other kernel hackers like alan cox, right?
04:53:58 [talli]
yeah, imagine if it were Donux
04:53:59 [shagster]
Yes, but Linus is stil the final say
04:54:03 [talli]
whoa
04:54:10 [talli]
THAT is the new OACS name!
04:54:12 [talli]
Donux
04:54:13 [shagster]
Hey, I like that name....
04:54:25 [talli]
like Donughts
04:54:28 [shagster]
We should suggest it :)
04:54:37 [talli]
it's all yours!
04:54:43 [talli]
vinod, you there?
04:54:44 [shagster]
Donux, less code, works great!
04:54:51 [talli]
we have a new name idea
04:55:05 [talli]
mmm... Donux
04:55:08 [vinod]
i like it!
04:55:26 [talli]
D'ohnux
04:55:37 [vinod]
haha
04:55:49 [shagster]
Flying High to the Web with Donux!
04:55:51 [shagster]
:)
04:58:55 [shagster]
Hah!
04:59:01 [shagster]
From: ed@kovach.cx
04:59:01 [shagster]
To: mat@kovach.cx
04:59:01 [shagster]
Subject: New pair
04:59:02 [shagster]
Did you get them?
04:59:48 [shagster]
My father is insane, but then so is my mother...what hope did I have...
05:00:11 [talli]
new pair of pants?
05:00:26 [talli]
vinod, why aren't your parents more like the shagster's?
05:00:55 [vinod]
we don't wear pants in india
05:01:07 [shagster]
talli : to pair of balls :)
05:01:11 [talli]
i know. i can smell it from here.
05:01:22 [talli]
oh man. the balls again
05:01:24 [talli]
balls hunters
05:01:44 [shagster]
We make dad where pants, stubby little legs :)
05:02:11 [shagster]
I'm actually luck, I can goto the nudie bars with my dad and tell my mom about it!
05:02:15 [talli]
your officers of the peace are delinquent, shagster. you should have been thrown in jail the way you hunt for testes
05:02:43 [talli]
nudie bars with pops... ah, the thought.
05:02:50 [talli]
:(
05:03:25 [shagster]
Well, since they sent me a bill for a non-working circuit, the cop looked at the bill and looked at me and smiled...
05:03:48 [shagster]
I have to admit, my parents at fairly kewl...
05:04:32 [shagster]
When they are both 1/2 drunk standing up the on the back of your convertible, you have to give them credit :)
05:04:57 [talli]
yeah, true enough
05:05:18 [talli]
and take all that away with interest when you realize they raised a man who hunts for gonads
05:05:32 [talli]
and has man boobs
05:05:37 [talli]
or at least manboobs.com
05:07:23 [shagster]
Well, I visit one a week, mom loves me despite my flaws :)
05:07:41 [shagster]
* shagster says moms are easy...
05:08:02 [shagster]
your forgot..I have a cat named 'Nasty' :)
05:08:36 [talli]
a trained attack cat, huh?
05:09:12 [talli]
how many women do you spend time with, shagster? me thinks you need a release before all of central Ohio's male population loses their manhood.
05:09:13 [shagster]
We'll I'm trying to train him to get me beer, but he alwasy seems to just drink the scotch
05:10:20 [shagster]
I just spend time with one women. For some strange reason she hangs around :)
05:10:38 [talli]
wow.
05:10:55 [talli]
and you don't have to threaten at all?
05:11:20 [shagster]
Nope...
05:11:40 [talli]
impressive. gonna have to get me one of those...
05:11:43 [shagster]
I'm in just as much shock :)
05:12:02 [talli]
:)
05:12:02 [shagster]
In fact she got me a playstation for Xmas :)
05:12:06 [talli]
whoa
05:12:21 [talli]
that's almost as good as belly rubs
05:12:42 [shagster]
HA!
05:14:02 [shagster]
but did I mention the cookes and pasta :)
05:14:14 [shagster]
Umm..cookies *grr*
05:15:24 [talli]
wow.
05:17:13 [shagster]
I'll get a Cleveland Social together and see if I can get some cookies for ya
05:17:46 [talli]
sounds like a plan!
05:17:49 [shagster]
Just 5AM (EST) comes early...
05:17:54 [shagster]
talk to ya later...
05:19:40 [talli]
see ya
05:19:41 [talli]
have a good eve
05:19:44 [talli]
i'm crashing too, btw
05:19:54 [talli]
just finished a longgggg email
06:05:05 [vinod]
vinod has quit ("changing universes")
06:34:18 [andyn]
andyn has quit (Remote closed the connection)
06:34:50 [dlk]
dlk (dlk@walter.ita.chalmers.se) has joined #openacs
07:06:42 [talilee]
talilee (~talli@talli.dialup.access.net) has joined #openacs
07:06:42 [talli]
talli has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
07:49:01 [dlk]
dlk is now known as dlk-tuesday-meeting
09:09:12 [dlk-tuesday-meeting]
dlk-tuesday-meeting is now known as dlk
13:24:07 [davb]
davb (~dave@rrcs-nys-24-97-22-203.biz.rr.com) has joined #openacs
13:24:19 [davb]
Hello
14:22:25 [davb]
http://www.geocities.com/onelibrarian.geo/here_to_stay.html
14:22:25 [chump]
E: http://www.geocities.com/onelibrarian.geo/here_to_stay.html from davb
14:22:34 [davb]
E:|Here To Stay, 3.0
14:22:34 [davb]
Why the American Public Library Will Endure
14:22:34 [chump]
titled item E
14:22:48 [davb]
E: Why the American Public Library Will Endure [?]
14:22:48 [chump]
commented item E
14:23:34 [davb]
E: I love libraries, but this article is wrong in many ways. It is very adversarial to the internet, which was never created, nor is its mission to destroy public libraries.
14:23:34 [chump]
commented item E
14:24:14 [davb]
E: This article completely ignores the fact that the internet was created for sharing knowledge, and most of the sucessful uses of it, even today, involve sharing.
14:24:14 [chump]
commented item E
14:25:35 [davb]
E: Also, the author says more than once, than any worthy sites that remain are probably associated with universities, libraries, or other government agencies.
14:25:35 [chump]
commented item E
14:25:43 [davb]
E: ouch!
14:25:43 [chump]
commented item E
14:43:33 [Psychephylax]
Psychephylax (nblyumbe@ool-18bd7775.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #openacs
14:43:43 [davb]
davb has quit ()
14:44:03 [Psychephylax]
* Psychephylax thwaps© dave knocking him into a different dimention
14:47:50 [davb]
davb (~dave@rrcs-nys-24-97-22-203.biz.rr.com) has joined #openacs
14:52:21 [markd2]
markd2 (~Snak@63.224.170.247) has joined #openacs
14:52:30 [davb]
hi markd2
14:52:39 [markd2]
greetings
14:53:20 [Starets]
Starets (~Starets@home.clickvision.com) has joined #openacs
14:53:59 [Psychephylax]
* Psychephylax thwaps© dave knocking him into a different dimention with the aftershock knocking markd2 to the ground
14:55:23 [Starets]
Starets has left #openacs
14:55:26 [markd2]
heh
14:55:43 [Psychephylax]
* Psychephylax grins and pulls chump's pants down
14:56:06 [davb]
wb Psychephylax
14:56:06 [Starets]
Starets (~petej@home.clickvision.com) has joined #openacs
14:56:21 [markd2]
heya
14:56:28 [davb]
btw, can I have the link to those photos of your new PC?
14:56:42 [Psychephylax]
markd2: hey how goes it?
14:56:46 [markd2]
pretty good
14:56:54 [markd2]
I'm in Omaha NE now for a little bit
14:57:03 [Psychephylax]
dave: http://www.sinc.sunysb.edu/Stu/nblyumbe/casemod
14:57:13 [Psychephylax]
New England? What are you doing up there?
14:57:24 [Psychephylax]
:-D
14:57:30 [markd2]
* markd2 thwacks(tm) psychephylax
14:57:44 [Psychephylax]
ouch
14:57:57 [davb]
http://news.com.com/2100-1001-839705.html
14:57:57 [chump]
F: http://news.com.com/2100-1001-839705.html from davb
14:58:08 [davb]
F:|Open-source projects grab dot-com dropouts
14:58:09 [chump]
titled item F
15:00:04 [Psychephylax]
I lost my credit card :(
15:00:13 [markd2]
zoinks
15:00:33 [davb]
Thanks, I love my new computer, I mean, thats too bad...
15:01:34 [Psychephylax]
Dave how fast?
15:01:55 [Psychephylax]
oh...heh...You can't charge anything on the card it's already cancelled
15:03:53 [davb]
heh. I am getting a 1Ghz computer finally. Ordered it monday. Well the parts anyway :)
15:06:38 [Psychephylax]
cool
15:06:44 [Psychephylax]
I hope not intel
15:08:55 [davb]
nah, AMD Tbird. I had a free motherboard, but it only goes up to 1Ghz. Unfortunately RAM in expensive right now...
15:09:07 [davb]
I wish I had stocked up 6 month ago.
15:38:13 [vinod]
vinod (~vinod@207-172-102-212.s466.apx1.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com) has joined #openacs
15:38:26 [markd2]
Hey Vînöd
15:38:29 [markd2]
gotta go. l8r
15:38:30 [markd2]
markd2 has quit ("wheeeee")
15:39:15 [vinod]
wow - didn't mean to scare him away
15:40:42 [davb]
hi vinod
15:40:56 [vinod]
hey davb
15:48:37 [Starets]
Starets has left #openacs
16:00:59 [peregrine2112]
peregrine2112 (~tinytim@66-3-244-163.customer.algx.net) has joined #openacs
16:04:02 [peregrine2112]
Morning everyone! I need to pick someone's brain re: web content filter software. I'm on a WinNT domain but I'm setting up a Linux firewall, and want to be able to limit specific user groups to particular web sites. Any ideas?
16:04:28 [peregrine2112]
Sorry, I have a GNU/Linux machine running Debian.
16:10:23 [vinod]
hi peregrine2112 - sorry, i got no clue. i've never done that before
16:11:04 [vinod]
google search brings up this - http://freshmeat.net/projects/dansguardian/
16:11:56 [peregrine2112]
I'll check it out. Any other channels you might suggest I check out? The people over in #Debian sent me here.
16:12:59 [vinod]
heh - that's strange. #openacs is about web development http://openacs.org
16:13:08 [vinod]
i was going to point you to #debian :-)
16:13:47 [peregrine2112]
heheh... thanks anyway. I was hoping not to have to mess with Squid, but if that's the best way to do it I'll figure it out.
16:14:32 [vinod]
try 'apt-cache search proxy' it might lead to some other projects
16:15:07 [peregrine2112]
I'll do that. If there was a module to read WinNT user groups that would be the best, but I haven't found one of them yet.
16:15:53 [dlk]
dlk has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
16:16:20 [vinod]
i'm clueless about winnt (happily!)
16:18:01 [peregrine2112]
I don't blame you. Unfortunately, I don't have any say over the network. 'Course, I'm just learning linux myself, so a major network overhaul would likely be a major disaster.
16:18:41 [peregrine2112]
Anyway, thanks for your help. Best!
16:18:54 [vinod]
np - good luck!
16:18:58 [peregrine2112]
peregrine2112 has left #openacs
16:31:05 [til]
til (~tils@port-212-202-128-195.reverse.qsc.de) has joined #openacs
16:58:10 [Psychephylax]
so much work
16:58:14 [Psychephylax]
so so much work....
16:58:19 [Psychephylax]
* Psychephylax wanders off to the lab once again
17:10:46 [davb]
* davb wonders if Psychephylax is the mad-scientist or the assistant...
17:10:57 [talilee]
talilee is now known as talli
17:11:36 [vinod]
or the subject...
17:11:55 [davb]
hi talli
17:34:45 [Psychephylax]
I'm the ass-is-tant
17:37:09 [hamScience]
hamScience (~rolf@above.badgertronics.com) has joined #openacs
17:37:29 [hamScience]
what's the easiest way to a select that returns 0 if no rows are returned.
17:37:37 [hamScience]
in postgrease.
17:38:15 [davb]
I never tried it in postgresql by itself, only the OpenACS DB api
17:38:21 [hamScience]
hm.
17:39:41 [hamScience]
there's gotta be some trick.
17:39:54 [hamScience]
don't make me do a case statment.
17:40:07 [davb]
heh
17:40:13 [davb]
I am sure there is a way.
17:40:51 [davb]
try #postgresql?
17:41:21 [davb]
* davb pokes vinod
17:42:37 [til]
why not select count(*) ?
17:43:36 [hamScience]
i'm doing select price from shipping where shipping_ID = someID
17:43:50 [hamScience]
if someID doesn't exist in the table, I want price = 0
17:43:55 [hamScience]
rather than just not appearing.
17:43:58 [hamScience]
er
17:44:02 [hamScience]
not returning any results
17:44:18 [davb]
how does db_0or1row work?
17:44:28 [til]
i see
17:44:29 [davb]
ie. do it outside of the database?
17:44:58 [hamScience]
davb i can't remember but i think the tcl func just sets the result to 0 if no rows are found.
17:45:55 [davb]
ok.
17:48:10 [til]
what about that: put the query in a subselect that is the first argument to a coalesce, and the second argument is your default value
17:48:49 [til]
like this: select coalesce ((select price from bla where bla), 0);
17:49:41 [til]
i think i'm just making you use a case statement ;-)
17:49:50 [hamScience]
yah
17:50:04 [hamScience]
that's what i did.
17:50:05 [hamScience]
;-)
17:50:08 [hamScience]
it works
17:50:16 [hamScience]
i was doing a subselect anyway
17:54:45 [marduk_away]
* marduk_away is away: I'm busy
17:54:48 [marduk_away]
* marduk_away is back (gone 00:00:02)
17:54:51 [marduk_away]
marduk_away is now known as marduk
17:57:24 [vinod]
hamScience: you can also use max() to get 0, but you still need coalesce
17:57:43 [vinod]
select coalesce(max(price),0) from bla where bal
17:57:44 [hamScience]
i could do the unspeakable and just create a phony entry
17:57:56 [hamScience]
ship_id =0 price=0.00
17:58:04 [hamScience]
and i wouldn't have to do anything fancy.
17:58:25 [hamScience]
tasteless, but perhaps the most sensible option.
18:00:31 [vinod]
will that work? 'select price from shipping where ship_id=2223131' - would return 0 rows, no?
18:03:53 [til]
using max() is much better because it will always only return one entry, even if there are more matches
18:06:16 [til]
(will it?) anyway that doesnt matter if you are querying for a unique id
18:06:55 [hamScience]
there won't be a case where ship_id=21214124124
18:07:02 [hamScience]
it is just a widget.
18:10:29 [vinod]
ahhh... so someID (in your example above) will always be a valid id or 0. i thought it could be anything
18:11:11 [hamScience]
yeah.
18:12:25 [vinod]
then - a phony entry will work, and will still throw an error if someone tries to query an invalid id
18:17:09 [docwolf]
docwolf (~docwolf@adsl-34-183-205.bct.bellsouth.net) has joined #openacs
18:17:18 [docwolf]
hiyo!
18:18:05 [vinod]
hey docwolf!
18:39:40 [jim]
jim (~jim@12-233-187-5.client.attbi.com) has joined #openacs
18:39:44 [jim]
re.
18:40:05 [jim]
anyone here yet? :)
18:41:23 [davb]
hi
18:41:44 [docwolf]
hi!
18:42:10 [vinod]
hey jim
18:45:20 [jim]
cool :)
18:46:02 [jim]
ok, so I'd like to try folding the two things I did back into etp... anyone up for helping? :)
18:46:11 [davb]
jim; Sure
18:46:15 [jim]
cool :)
18:46:23 [jim]
ok...
18:46:53 [jim]
I want to add a coupla boolean checkbox type things to the admin params
18:48:19 [davb]
Ok. I know you can edit the .info file, I am not sure if there is a web interface to do it.
18:48:34 [jim]
ok... looking into that
18:49:10 [jim]
wonder if I should put up a new instance of oacs first?
18:50:00 [davb]
can't hurt, its a good idea to test on a clean install.
18:50:11 [jim]
ok...
18:50:23 [jim]
gimme 10 mins
18:50:56 [davb]
aha. Apm->edit-this-page->manage parameter information->add a new parameter :)
18:53:38 [davb]
http://www.turbulence.org/Works/nums/index.html
18:53:38 [chump]
G: http://www.turbulence.org/Works/nums/index.html from davb
18:53:45 [davb]
G:|The Secret Lives of Numbers
18:53:45 [chump]
titled item G
19:01:21 [vinod]
vinod has left #openacs
19:02:00 [talli]
hey guys
19:02:10 [docwolf]
here comes trouble...
19:02:20 [talli]
look who's talking
19:02:32 [docwolf]
hehe
19:02:34 [talli]
did you settle that peeping tom suit out of case yet docwolf?
19:02:44 [talli]
out of court, sorry
19:02:57 [docwolf]
i will fight the allegation to the end. The _end_, i tell you!
19:03:26 [talli]
yes, well, you and OJ
19:03:57 [docwolf]
me & OJ are buds.. .kicking back on the beaches of miami.
19:04:38 [talli]
actively searching for the men who framed you...
19:04:59 [docwolf]
hehe
19:05:08 [jim]
talking to a swami on the beaches of miami?
19:05:33 [docwolf]
almost as shameful..
19:05:42 [docwolf]
i'm sitting next to rolf, reading the Enquirer.
19:06:09 [docwolf]
did you know that Oprah is up to 261lbs?
19:06:28 [talli]
my god!
19:06:29 [marduk]
marduk has left #openacs
19:06:33 [marduk]
marduk (~marduk@206-72-66-50.dsl.dock.net) has joined #openacs
19:07:00 [docwolf]
she needs my "energy" drink
19:07:14 [talli]
oh man.
19:07:23 [talli]
only the dead need your "energy" drink
19:07:50 [jim]
the dead already had your "energy" drink?
19:07:58 [docwolf]
i have a special formula for the deceased.. "liquid life"
19:08:01 [docwolf]
with ginseng.
19:08:13 [jim]
just add water?
19:09:10 [talli]
add a little gingko biloba so they can remember their way home, too
19:12:39 [jim]
I got a medium-sized flood for ya...
19:16:28 [jim]
preping it
19:18:27 [jim]
if($#ARGV + 1 != 2)
19:18:27 [jim]
{
19:18:27 [jim]
print STDERR "usage: tblspace-create.perl <serviceName> <dbPasswd>\n";
19:18:27 [jim]
exit 1;
19:18:27 [jim]
}
19:18:29 [jim]
$service_name = $ARGV[0];
19:18:33 [jim]
$database_password = $ARGV[1];
19:18:46 [jim]
19:18:49 [jim]
print
19:18:50 [jim]
"create tablespace $service_name datafile '/ora8/m02/oradata/ora8/" .
19:18:50 [jim]
$service_name .
19:18:50 [jim]
"01.dbf' size 50m autoextend on default storage (pctincrease 1);\n\n";
19:18:53 [jim]
19:19:11 [jim]
print
19:19:11 [jim]
"create user $service_name " .
19:19:11 [jim]
"identified by $database_password " .
19:19:11 [jim]
"default tablespace $service_name " .
19:19:11 [jim]
"temporary tablespace temp " .
19:19:11 [jim]
"quota unlimited on $service_name;\n\n";
19:19:15 [jim]
19:19:20 [jim]
print
19:19:21 [jim]
"grant " .
19:19:23 [jim]
"connect, resource, ctxapp, javasyspriv, query rewrite " .
19:19:25 [jim]
"to $service_name;\n\n";
19:19:27 [jim]
19:19:29 [jim]
print "revoke unlimited tablespace from $service_name;\n\n";
19:19:34 [jim]
19:19:38 [jim]
print "alter user $service_name quota unlimited on $service_name;\n\n";
19:19:53 [jim]
19:19:58 [jim]
print
19:19:58 [jim]
"(the following is for deleting an acs install " .
19:19:58 [jim]
"w/o redoing oracle's init db)\n\n";
19:20:03 [jim]
19:20:08 [jim]
print "drop user $service_name cascade;\n\n";
19:20:09 [jim]
19:20:14 [jim]
print
19:20:14 [jim]
"(must be done with no current connections as " .
19:20:14 [jim]
"database user `$service_name` to oracle)\n";
19:20:23 [jim]
that's the whole thing
19:20:50 [jim]
makes the oracle create/destroy thing easier
19:21:13 [davb]
cool
19:22:03 [jim]
if you want to distribute it, put a copyright this year by me, followed by a GPL boilerplate
19:22:56 [jim]
put that in a file called...
19:23:05 [jim]
tblspace-create.perl
19:33:41 [jim]
it's acting weird
19:37:05 [jim]
* jim rebuilds everything
19:37:30 [talli]
take that you perl bigot!
19:37:43 [jim]
hah :)
19:37:58 [jim]
Yes, I am :)
19:38:18 [jim]
well, not really, I just not too partial to tcl :P)
19:38:28 [talli]
which means you're an indecipherable bastard. ;)
19:38:47 [jim]
no, actually my perl code is quite readable :)
19:39:15 [talli]
yeah, perl isn't so bad to read, i guess. i just could never remember all the syntax
19:39:21 [davb]
perl doesn't have to be ugly, its just popular with people who have yet to learn how to program :)
19:39:30 [talli]
i imagine if you're versed in the language, it's a blast
19:39:30 [jim]
:P
19:40:05 [talli]
i know some of the freakiest and smartest people that love perl. i think they just find they can fly in it.
19:40:27 [davb]
kinda, thinking in perl
19:40:32 [davb]
meeting bbl
19:40:41 [jim]
* jim listened to the Larry Wall interview yesterday
19:40:54 [jim]
err, not interview, a keynote
19:40:57 [talli]
i hear larry wall is one of the truly weird humans on earth
19:41:09 [talli]
and this was told to me by one of the truly weird humans on earth
19:42:01 [jim]
oh man, he has some of the worst puns you ever heard (partially because you have heard most of em before too many times :)
19:42:49 [talli]
oh, bad puns.
19:43:06 [talli]
bad puns and freaky hackers would be a little too much, i think
19:43:08 [jim]
worse than mine!!
19:43:32 [docwolf]
wall is out of his mind
19:43:43 [docwolf]
i had to endure his "state of perl" address at o'reilly last year
19:43:56 [docwolf]
he walked around the stage, trying to play a variety of unusual instruments.
19:43:59 [talli]
what was it like? is he worse than RMS?
19:44:04 [docwolf]
it was really distressing
19:44:15 [docwolf]
far worse than RMS, because at least you can concentrate on what RMS is trying to say
19:44:18 [docwolf]
wall was incoherent.
19:44:25 [docwolf]
i've met psychotics who have had similar demeanors.
19:45:37 [jim]
is that the one where he says perl 6 will be the community's rewrite of perl and itself?
19:45:46 [docwolf]
yeah, that's the one.
19:46:07 [jim]
and he demoed 3-against-4 and 3-against-5 isorhythms?
19:46:58 [jim]
and kept saying "everything's negotiable" wrt the new perl?
19:47:06 [docwolf]
i don't remember the specifics
19:47:12 [docwolf]
i was too distracted by the instruments
19:47:16 [docwolf]
and the weird rambling.
19:47:21 [docwolf]
it was sort of uncomfortable
19:47:45 [jim]
after he was done with the instruments, he got into more about perl
19:48:07 [docwolf]
all i remember him doing was essentially saying PERL6 was out of his hands, and good luck.
19:48:58 [jim]
while he was doing the music thing, he was making comparisons between rhythm and particles, melody and waves, harmony and fields?
19:49:18 [docwolf]
yeah
19:49:29 [jim]
I believe that was the thing I listened to
19:56:44 [talli]
whoa
19:57:09 [talli]
well, he's been more successful than philip in building his cult
19:57:31 [talli]
he's clearly a pretty smart guy
20:02:37 [jim]
oh, now that I've looked over the current state of parrot...
20:03:01 [jim]
I can tell you specific reasons why perl-aol can't use parrot yet :)
20:04:44 [talli]
ok, shoot, but i'm on the phone right now
20:07:30 [jim]
one, my data structures are starting to have several pieces...
20:07:52 [jim]
so, I'm attaching those pieces with a hash, which is the blessed thing
20:07:52 [marduk]
marduk is now known as marduk_away
20:08:02 [marduk_away]
* marduk_away is away: i need food
20:08:26 [jim]
the problem: parrot has no hashes, scalars or references yet
20:09:53 [talli]
ah, ok
20:10:03 [talli]
yeah, when johnseq said it wasn't ready, that was enough for me
20:10:51 [jim]
still, might be an idea to play with it
20:11:20 [talli]
so maybe we should just start working on ns_mono ;)
20:11:25 [jim]
not try to actually do anything with it, but just see what its internals are like
20:11:39 [jim]
what's mono?
20:11:45 [talli]
titus brown just announced another beta release of PyWX
20:11:54 [talli]
mono is the open source implementation of C#
20:12:04 [talli]
it's at http://www.go-mono.com
20:12:12 [jim]
ugh :)
20:12:52 [jim]
I'm almost positive I'm not the person to go in that direction :)
20:12:57 [talli]
:)
20:13:37 [talli]
titus brown said in his announcement that PyWX is near a full release, which is pretty cool
20:14:06 [jim]
that's the python-aolserver thing?
20:14:10 [talli]
yeah
20:14:18 [talli]
pywx.idyll.org
20:23:57 [jim]
NOW it's working
20:24:09 [talli]
the perl stuff?
20:24:20 [jim]
no, my fresh install of openacs
20:24:28 [talli]
ah, cool
20:24:41 [jim]
must be my startup script is pointing to the wrong thing
20:26:24 [markd2]
markd2 (~Snak@63.224.170.8) has joined #openacs
20:26:46 [talli]
yo markd2
20:33:52 [markd2]
yo talli
20:43:34 [hamScience]
hamScience has quit ("she blinded me with (ham) science")
20:44:19 [marduk_away]
* marduk_away is back (gone 00:36:17)
20:44:32 [marduk_away]
marduk_away is now known as marduk
20:46:07 [markd2]
* markd2 sighs
20:46:11 [markd2]
markd2 has quit ("wheeeee")
20:46:18 [jim]
the site works, but the root startup script fails every time
20:47:03 [jim]
I have to do bin/nsd8x -f -t mysite.tcl as user aolserver
20:47:23 [jim]
well, no matter, this'll work fine for what I'm doing
21:10:13 [davb]
davb has quit ()
22:15:32 [Starets]
Starets (~petej@home.clickvision.com) has joined #openacs
22:24:44 [rbm]
rbm (rmello@fslc.usu.edu) has joined #openacs
22:27:22 [Starets]
Starets has left #openacs
23:06:25 [davb]
davb (dave@alb-24-58-162-46.nycap.rr.com) has joined #openacs
23:15:22 [davb]
davb has quit ("Client Exiting")
23:22:21 [marduk]
marduk has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:24:50 [Psychephylax]
Time to go home
23:24:51 [Psychephylax]
yaaay
23:32:05 [talilee]
talilee (~talli@talli.dialup.access.net) has joined #openacs
23:32:05 [talli]
talli has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))