00:19:21 D'oh!! Talli's gone. 00:19:25 So who is who? 00:23:00 ruby is cool. 00:23:23 i'm a lost soul wandering the channels of irc for something to do. 00:28:51 I miss being a lost soul. 00:28:55 Being found sucks. 00:56:58 markd2 (~Snak@r-41.53.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 00:56:59 vinod has quit (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 00:58:53 Psychephylax (proxy@ool-18baa98f.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #openacs 01:03:47 :) 01:24:21 vinod (~vinod@209-122-233-7.s1817.apx2.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com) has joined #openacs 01:28:55 djg has left #openacs 01:32:13 Workiephylax... haha. 01:37:51 hehe 01:39:12 tomorrow it will be Bronxiephylax as I have to travel to the Bronx with my co-worker to do maintenance work on a system we deployed in a hospital 01:40:02 markd2 is now known as Funkyphylax 01:40:05 gitdown! gitfunky! 01:40:07 Funkyphylax is now known as markd2 01:40:39 ROFL 01:41:56 you're a nut 01:42:16 some times you feel like a nut 01:42:25 sometimes I need to fill my gut 01:42:39 only to get out of a rut 01:42:40 haha 01:42:50 looks like we have a nut glut around here 01:42:58 LOL 01:43:06 irc poetry - i love it 01:43:11 do not taunt happy fun nut glut 01:43:12 what is it... 01:43:18 Bah, I don't remember that song 01:44:31 markd2: love the snow pictures! still no snow in boston. went home to wisconsin for xmas and no snow there - it was very depressing 01:44:40 awwww 01:44:44 no snow for you? bummer 01:44:47 * Psychephylax goes to the freezer in his fridge 01:44:58 haha 01:45:02 * Psychephylax tags vinod square in the head with an icicle 01:45:04 yeah - i love snow and cold weather 01:45:09 c/icicle/ice cube 01:45:14 * vinod ducks 01:45:41 * Psychephylax points above vinod to a big net of ice cubes in a net as he pulls the lever 01:46:01 lol 01:46:10 Psychephylax always gets his man 01:46:20 * Psychephylax points at Workiephylax 01:46:23 It's all his fault! 01:46:23 * markd2 sings like ice cube 01:46:35 [#OpenACS] This channel is logged: http://www.blogspace.com/openacs/chatlogs/ and blogged: http://www.thedesignexperience.org/openacs/ircblog 01:46:36 * Psychephylax dives under the desk and begins to tremble 01:47:00 Psychephylax: what is this? bring your alter-ego to work day? 01:47:08 ROFL 01:47:11 Kinda 01:47:21 I try to leave him at work so he doesn't bother me at home 01:47:28 somehow he always finds his way home 01:47:36 I left him in the closet this time 01:47:41 haha 01:47:55 when is he coming out of the closet? 01:48:02 Words to your moms, 01:48:04 Not for a loooooooong time I hope 01:48:06 I came to drop bombs, 01:48:11 .I've got more rhymes than the bible's got psalms. 01:48:17 lol 01:48:17 And just like the prodigal son, I return. 01:48:23 Anyone stepping to me, you'll get burned. 01:48:25 * Psychephylax pokes denshi between the ribs..Who you be? 01:48:35 'Cause I got lyrics, but you ain't got none, 01:48:40 If you come to battle, bring a shotgun. (shotgun) 01:48:53 Jump around! 01:48:58 heh 01:49:05 Cypress Hill is a million times better :) 01:49:06 nothing like angry irish white boy rap. 01:49:16 * denshi be Todd G. 01:49:20 lol 01:49:24 who you be? 01:49:43 I be Bilbo Baggins, the Barrel Rider, the Burglar 01:49:57 Psychephylax is now known as Bilbo_Baggins 01:50:05 I quote Chrono Cross: "Ye be me!" 01:50:14 oh boy, oh boy, oh boy... My SCSI burner arrived 01:50:21 * Bilbo_Baggins cranks up House of Pain and begins jumping on Workiephylax 01:50:27 BURN! BURN THE DISC! 01:50:32 Burn the orcs? 01:50:34 LOL 01:50:42 Go RBM GO! 01:50:46 * markd2 puts on squirrel nut zippers 01:50:48 Jump up jump up and get down 01:51:02 * Bilbo_Baggins witholds a nut pun 01:51:03 * rbm will install his burner. brb 01:51:32 rbm gots ta move it.... he gots ta move it 01:51:42 roflmao 01:53:42 Bilbo_Baggins is now known as markd3 01:54:04 denshi is now known as markd4 01:54:05 markd3 is now known as loggy`s_pet 01:54:10 We are all Kosh. 01:54:15 lol 01:54:52 openacs is a three-edged sword 01:54:56 beauty... in the dork 01:55:00 lol 01:55:03 * vinod wants to know who's smoking what tonight 01:55:07 http://xalton.forum2000.org/matrix/forum_hof_answers?keepcookie=136&lm=1002259717 01:55:10 sez markd as he goes bork 01:55:32 goin' downtown, to buy some pork 01:55:45 but alas, mugged with a spork 01:55:45 how's the aftertaste on that, loggy? 01:55:58 and rapped with the wrench of torque 01:56:03 bahaha 01:56:13 * markd2 waits for Vinod's famous human beat box 01:56:30 Just remember, this is all being logged 01:56:34 rockin! 01:56:51 I've already proven myself to be a complete lunatic in this forum 01:56:59 haha 01:57:03 heh, so you've reached the bottom? 01:57:33 you don't reach the bottom -- the bottom reaches for you. 01:57:51 heh 01:57:59 Does anyone know if Heavy D has a glass eye? 01:58:03 * markd2 makes sure nobody is reaching for his... never mind 01:58:15 rofl 02:02:58 I highly recommend "Cypress Hill - Hand on the Pump" 02:03:58 well if you're going to have a hand on the pump, I should recommend "Talking Heads - Sand in the Vaseline" 02:04:05 ouch 02:04:18 hehe 02:05:05 9:06pm up 1:08, 2 users, load average: 0.00, 0.02, 0.00 02:05:08 !woot! 02:05:22 what the hell 02:05:24 oh 02:05:26 ROFL 02:05:39 9:18PM up 167 days, 12:30, 1 user, load averages: 1.00, 1.00, 1.00 02:05:41 that's what I meant 02:05:56 * Workiephylax runs back to his closet looking at loggy`s_pet 02:05:58 not bad 02:06:46 http://www.goats.com/archive/971223.html 02:07:14 * markd2 is worried about anything with 'goat' in it 02:08:43 markd4 is now known as goat_lord 02:09:09 loggy`s_pet is now known as lords_goat 02:09:25 bleeeeeeeat! 02:09:59 I just realized I have no goat-based idioms 02:10:27 well then I refuse to be your goat 02:10:33 you gotta be kidding me 02:10:37 nooo!!! 02:10:45 we should can this now 02:10:50 lords_goat is now known as markd2`s_goat 02:11:19 "For he who grazes upon my goat mountain shall have eternal bleating.... or something" 02:13:47 Anyone worried about goats must see Dexter's Laboratory "Chupacabra" episode. 02:13:57 That is _the_ best Dexter's Lab episode ever IMHO. 02:14:08 I am not familar with Mr. Dexter. Where is his lab? 02:14:10 all I can think about is the goatse.cx site. (do *not* visit) 02:14:20 goat_lord: Dexter's Lab is a cartoon aired at Cartoon Network. 02:14:36 It's an awesome cartoon. 02:16:45 goat_lord is now known as markd2`s_sheperd 02:17:05 the goat_lord is my sheperd, I shall not want 02:17:15 he maketh me answer oracle question 02:17:22 he annoyest my head. my tub runneth over 02:17:48 come follow me, and I shall make ye fishers of SDM bug reports. 02:18:18 bSDM 02:19:23 can I get a headcount of doms vs. subs? 02:20:16 oops... I read markd2's msg as 'bDSM'. 02:20:39 close enough for this crowd 02:20:45 we're all Vinod's whipping boys 02:20:50 * vinod uncovers eyes and checks if it's ok to start reading again 02:20:55 * vinod closes eyes 02:21:18 YES! /me is _finally_ partially SCSIfied 02:22:09 strangely enough, that fits in the current thread of conversation 02:22:14 markd2 is now known as scsi_goat 02:22:19 man, I miss san francisco. 02:22:26 uhhhh 02:22:29 scsi_goat is now known as markd2 02:23:17 there was this one guy who has a dungeon in his house in Noe -- with several computers on the LAN down there. 02:23:33 So you can get beaten and check your email concurrently, to save time. 02:24:17 that rules 02:24:27 that business plan must be an interesting read 02:24:28 BDSMTP 02:25:45 "the market for sadomasochistic email users is expected to increase by 200% by the year 2002 and by monetizing these ... blah blah blah" 02:25:47 it's not a shop, just some guy's house. But you know how wierd the public/private boundary becomes when your place is a regular party fixture. 02:30:28 SMLDAP: seamlessly maintain DM information for slaves across your enterprise! 02:30:33 I'll get right on it. 02:31:01 markd2`s_sheperd is now known as xenopsychologist 02:33:05 markd2`s_goat is now known as Sleepiephylax 02:33:08 later all 02:33:12 'nite 02:33:13 <--needs sleep 02:33:58 vinod has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 02:34:04 who is /\w+phylax/, anyway? 02:34:06 vinod_ (~vinod@209-122-233-7.s1817.apx2.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com) has joined #openacs 02:34:22 vinod_ is now known as vinod 02:34:28 I am not /\w+phylax/ 02:34:56 perhaps /\w+phylax/i? 02:35:00 bah 02:35:02 No use 02:35:04 * Sleepiephylax goes to bed 02:36:11 * xenopsychologist should prescribe *phylax something dangerous. 02:38:52 I, too, shall go. Night, all. 02:39:11 xenopsychologist has quit () 02:47:26 talli (talli@lti-4.dialup.access.net) has joined #openacs 02:48:01 rbm: dunno if you saw, but todd gillespie may help update the psets 02:50:38 [#OpenACS] This channel is logged: http://www.blogspace.com/openacs/chatlogs/ and blogged: http://www.thedesignexperience.org/openacs/ircblog 02:51:21 xenopsychologist (~chatzilla@adsl-216-62-223-193.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) has joined #openacs 02:51:24 xenopsychologist is now known as denshi 02:51:48 Ah, hell. I was going to go home, but now talli's back. 02:52:49 Talli, I wrote an email for your last questions when I got back (you had already left). But let me explain what my planning for psets. 02:53:46 ping? 02:55:48 hey denshi 02:55:57 didn't see you there 02:56:00 LAG! 02:56:04 sorry :) 02:56:13 i'm three hours ahead, you know 02:56:15 i've been nick swapping. 02:56:20 it takes a while for your words to catch up 02:56:27 only one, nowadays. 02:56:33 have you? so i should be careful in talking shit? 02:56:35 I'm in Texas. 02:56:42 sorry, two hours :) 02:57:08 anyway, here's my planning for psets. 02:57:22 what is your latest gig now? and what do you like about ruby? (not a language war...) ok, answer those afterwards 02:57:35 gah! 02:57:54 copying and pasting from my email (unsent)... 02:58:26 I am working in Dallas as a video editor. I seem to have an odd collection of skills. Come this summer, I will return to UT Austin to finish my degree, as a recession is a fine time to be trapped within the stifling, perverted grasp of undergraduate education. 02:58:36 ns_ruby.... 02:58:48 ha! 02:58:50 1. Tcl sucks. And I am tired of it sucks. 02:58:59 oops.. I am tired of it sucking. 02:59:00 you still haven't finished your degree? loser. :) 02:59:14 indeed. Poverty sucks. 02:59:18 :) 02:59:32 well, you seem to know your shit well enough with that silly little piece of paper 02:59:43 I left school at 19, and after 4 years of school I was broker than Enron. 02:59:45 i hope your getting a degree in something worthwhile, like literature 02:59:54 or Art History 03:00:07 you brokered for enron or are as broke as enron? either way... 03:00:40 what do you like about ruby vis a vis python or perl? 03:01:19 I have been refactoring the Scoop code base, which is just a big mess of mod_perl. I don't remember why I picked it up. 03:01:38 But not until now, like three weeks ago, did I realize perl sucks. 03:02:00 I've been using it for four years now and only now has that dawned on me. 03:02:07 perl is a bit scary 03:02:14 So I think I'm going to major in 'Grasping the Obvious'. 03:02:26 haha 03:02:31 ah. elementary education 03:02:35 Python is kind of weak -- meaning it doesn't really fix much. 03:02:43 how do you mean? 03:02:50 http://www.paulgraham.com/fix.html 03:03:08 yeah, i read through that today. thought it was cool 03:03:43 Paul Graham draws a nice list of languages and explains their role by what they fix. I don't think Python fixes too much beyond Perl, and what it does fix, namely a throughly redone object system, it doesn't do well enough. 03:03:58 i see. 03:04:12 i've read that some think that ruby is more OO than python 03:04:25 The most recent release fixes that to some degree, ie, brings the python object system almost up to where Ruby is. 03:05:18 heh. Basic: Fortran is scary 03:06:15 And the indentation-as-syntax always bugged me. I never knew why, until someone pointed out where Python got it from. It's from a niche teaching language with a nifty interactive system, where the indentation is used to show blocks in the entry. 03:07:24 so, sort of like how LISP is impossible to use without a parens-matching editor, Python is silly to use without that entry system. 03:08:37 http://www.paulgraham.com/reesoo.html 03:10:01 the link gives a good list of point that typify OO languages. It's good to know, as, well, "Because OO is a moving target, OO zealots will choose some subset of this menu by whim and then use it to try to convince you that you are a loser." 03:10:39 Ruby is more OO than Python because of 4,5 & 6. 03:11:10 denshi: i was just gonna paste that quote :-) 03:11:37 vinod: who's your goat lord?! 03:11:50 * vinod bows at denshi's feet 03:12:11 But I think the original question was my motivation for ns_ruby in particular. 03:12:16 uh, excuse me, vinod? 03:12:31 vinod has a foot fetish 03:12:39 talli: pay attention - denshi's talkin to ya 03:13:02 always wanted to be a podiatrist, but didn't realize they had their own schools 03:13:04 first, tcl sucks. 03:13:28 second, the only apps, by and large, worth writing at the moment are web apps. 03:14:02 third: I like Ruby, for the reasons above, and others, and I see a bright future for it. 03:14:23 rzolf (~rolf@adsl-21-208-25.mia.bellsouth.net) has joined #openacs 03:14:50 Hey, Rolf. Little ruby talk going on.. might want to grab the logs. 03:15:44 * hazmat peeks in 03:16:06 four: there are two schools of thought in writing web apps. One is to run within the web server, and have timing and general shape of the application defined by the pageflow nature of HTTP. The other is to wrap HTTP serving within a larger, monolithic, and almost certainly messier application. 03:16:52 Some people seem to dig the latter, but as I percieve most web apps as glue layer between users and a RDBMS, the former is much more natural to me. 03:16:54 what is going on in here. 03:17:13 i gave a looksee the other day to see if there are any webapp frameworks or projects built in ruby 03:17:16 couldn't find any 03:17:41 Taking that approach, nsd is the hands-down winner in that architecture. So I'm hacking it to support ruby, b/c I want the nsd architecture, and Ruby to write code. 03:17:51 QED. My hands are getting tired. 03:17:55 i tend to disagree with your perspective on python, but i think we're both biased. i find python syntax more elegant's than ruby. ruby has some syntatic oddities that look distinctly perlish to me. 03:18:04 yeah, i mean, that's what i figured :) 03:18:09 what is ruby? 03:18:14 www.ruby-lang.org ? 03:18:36 ah. got the link right :) 03:18:44 but denshi, why do want OO in webapps? (that is a true war statement, right?) 03:19:16 i want OO in webaps. 03:19:17 er 03:19:19 web apps. 03:19:27 i am OO in webapps 03:19:34 nutshell, reduce and reuse. 03:19:36 There are actually several webapp frameworks in Ruby, but none come near nsd or the ACS. And since Tcl is core to nsd, ns_ruby can pass values between ACS-tcl and itself. So we can use ACS, and sometimes hack something new in Ruby. 03:20:09 ok. 03:20:14 talli: that's both a good question and a funny question. But the answer is the same. 03:20:36 python seems pretty well suited to webapps. 03:20:46 People who spend time around me note that I'll build something just to see if I'm wrong. I'm messing around with Ruby just to see if OO is a good plan. 03:20:48 you can learn the language in 5 hours. 03:20:58 and you can cook up something useful in 2 hours. 03:21:08 and there are a zillion libraries for it. 03:21:23 so for instance, writing "webmail" takes like 2 hours 03:21:40 whereas with aolserver/tcl it is nearly impossible because 03:21:42 So far, Ruby is the best language where I can use OO without it getting in my way, unlike some things like Java where OO is a fragile mess mostly suited for generating lots of 'work' to impress suits. 03:21:50 there are no decent mail libs 03:21:51 for TCL 03:23:50 call me selfish, but I just write apps to see if I like them. Maybe I'll like this. 03:24:21 denshi: i've been trying to find a good 'toy' app to use ruby for... any suggestions? 03:24:57 dev work has stalled, considering the move & the decidedly NON-nsd job, but when I get a minute I really fly. Writing Ruby extensions is just stupid easy. 03:25:23 wait what is going on in here? 03:25:35 where is the place where we talk about the barbie jeep. 03:25:58 wait.... is Barbie is the front or the back of the jeep? 03:26:10 only after we hump that seal 03:26:13 er, dog. or whatever 03:43:25 mark, I *will* use the goats. 03:43:25 doc just fed me some "health drink" which seems to be sapping the power from my brain. 03:43:27 talli, can we get back to the psets? 03:43:33 lag! 03:43:33 sure denshi 03:43:34 rzolf: health drink? that sounds scary 03:43:34 it was scary. 03:43:34 at first, i couldn't see. 03:43:34 then as i regained my vision, i kept hearing like...helicopters 03:43:34 or something? 03:43:34 but then i ran a 4:20 minute mile. 03:43:35 hmmm.. blindness then cinchonism then mania - sounds like a combination of wood-alchol, aspirin and then cocaine 03:43:35 rzolf: wait till he gets you into those florida yoga classes... 03:43:35 okay... the psets are cool, but they don't address the two biggest complaints newbies have with the ACS -- 1. it takes goddamn forever to build your first app, and 2. since the psets bring users in from the bottom up there isn't a strong effort to teach them the ACS APIs...so there is a lot of reinventing the wheel. 03:43:35 I think I need to spend time with doc. 03:43:35 just tell the newbies to quit being such wimps. 03:43:35 and if they keep complaining, make them do it in C. 03:43:35 haha 03:43:35 rzolf! You'll never get the newbies into the back of the jeep talking like that. 03:43:40 i'm sick of all these newbies. taking our women, our jobs. 03:43:40 http://www.goats.com/archive/010205.html 03:43:40 vinod: in africa, drinking wood alcohol is a big problem. 03:43:40 there are big billboards on the roadside 03:43:41 that say like "don't drink chang'aa...you'll go blind" 03:43:41 anyway, if there isn't anything for me to rant randomly about 03:43:41 i should probably get back to work. 03:43:41 that sucks. it was a big problem during the prohibition here 03:43:41 yeah, we're trying to stay on topic here 03:43:41 also, the new imac is cool 03:43:41 way cool. once i get a real job, i'm gonna get one 03:43:41 aren't you a doctor. 03:43:41 part-time 03:43:41 what's your excuse for not having a real job. 03:43:42 laziness 03:43:42 heh 03:43:42 i want to work 1 day a week and make gobs of money 03:43:42 can't you take some radiology classes. 03:43:42 haha 03:43:42 but then i have to consent to be turned into a troll 03:43:42 they work in the dark and snarl if humans bother them 03:43:42 this lag sucks. I'm going to go eat and sleep. 03:43:42 kinda like programmers, i guess 03:43:42 yeah that sounds ideal. 03:43:42 speaking of trolls, anyone know any good camgirls to check out? 03:43:42 i'd rather be making $500,000/yr vs. $4000/yr 03:43:42 how do i get into this radiology thing. 03:43:42 medschool,residency, etc 03:43:42 hm 03:43:42 or marry a radiologist and sit on your ass at home 03:43:42 that sounds like it takes hard work, perseverence, etc. 03:43:42 bummer, eh? 03:43:45 yeah. 03:43:56 hey how do you get to be the guy that makes the radiology software. 03:44:09 that might be fun. 03:44:27 i don't know who makes that stuff. there are a bunch of medical software companies up here in boston 03:44:30 night guys 03:44:38 or it might be insanely hard and pays less than being a visual basic programmer. 03:45:23 yeah - i can imagine doctors as being pain-in-the-ass clients, too 03:45:30 rzolf, I know a NMR programmer in Ann Arbor. He makes more money than god and doesn't even have a high school diploma. 03:45:44 that's the weird thing about programming. it seems as though technical difficulty of a project is inversely proportional to compensation 03:45:54 denshi, thats good to konw. 03:46:39 denshi, can you put me in contact with him? ;-) 03:47:11 i just have no idea what you actually have to know to get into that field. hardcore DSP image processing, i'm guessing. 03:47:14 he's a real freak. assembly viruses in school, pc games in austin, robotics in taiwan, medical in michigan...... there's a geek to which we can all aspire. 03:47:42 I'll dig him up. 03:48:25 hey! where's my illegal employment in japan! 03:48:32 oh yeah. 03:48:38 actually...you dont want to do that. 03:48:50 yeah 03:48:54 hahahah 03:48:56 you end up AIMing your buddies at all sorts of weird hours of the night 03:48:59 the problem with illegally working in japan. is you have no legal recourse 03:49:06 when the client doesnt pay you. 03:49:15 rzolf has been deported.. 03:49:37 rzolf! When the client doesn't pay you, you pop a cap in his ass! That's the law of the street. 03:49:47 honestly, working in japan is a bad idea, unless you are working for an american company. 03:50:38 i popped a cap in their web server. 03:51:05 and am ignoring the pleas to restart it unless i see $5000 in my bank account. 03:51:16 * rzolf shrugs 03:51:22 ouch 03:51:43 what's henry up to? 03:51:54 i dont know. he moved to boston. 03:53:09 one of these days I'm going to compute the graph of openacsers. 03:53:32 i'm giving up on #openacs. 03:53:40 i'm getting my MBA. 03:53:55 you're too short for basketball 03:54:04 i played bball the other day. 03:54:22 I'm going to split before rzolf finds a rebuttal. 03:54:26 night. 03:54:29 denshi has quit () 03:56:00 rzolf: what about med school? 03:56:18 i'm trying to figure out something 03:56:38 i'd like to go to med school but that means i wont be working again until I'm like... 40 03:57:45 yeah... i wouldn't recommend it unless you really loved it 03:57:51 thats the thing though. 03:57:58 that always confused me. 03:58:13 how do the doctors know they "Really Love It" before they go to medical school? 03:59:12 most don't. we go into it becuz we think it's a great profession. 03:59:37 a lot of people will find that they love it as they go along, but a lot end up kinda miserable 03:59:38 i think it is pretty cool. 03:59:58