IRC log of openacs on 2002-01-03

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:00:16 [vinod]

yes, you must make the proper incantions to the gods of gui and hope that they are in a good mood

00:00:58 [ola]

ok. I forgot that part.

00:01:05 [vinod]

haha

00:01:29 [ola]

x-window-system is a grouping of many x programs, I think...

00:02:59 [ola]

talli: have you ever installed debian on your dell laptop?

00:03:26 [ola]

(I think I'm going to buy a Inspiron 4100)

00:04:34 [talli]

ahh.... debian on a laptop

00:04:46 [talli]

lemme tell you about a great white whale i've been chasing for some years now...

00:05:08 [talli]

THEORETICALLY, installing X on my dell laptop is possible.

00:05:13 [vinod]

i'm using debian on this powerbook

00:05:25 [talli]

practically, i fear it is more elusive than cold fusion

00:05:33 [vinod]

haha

00:05:35 [talli]

vinod: powerbook? a mac?

00:05:45 [vinod]

yup! debian-powerpc

00:06:03 [talli]

how is it?

00:06:20 [vinod]

it's a wallstreet G3 266 and it still seems speedy when Linux is running. When i switch to Mac, it seems sluggish

00:06:42 [vinod]

I use it as my main machine and while there are occasional problems, it usually runs perfectly

00:06:57 [talli]

yowch. i would figure that linux works better

00:07:16 [talli]

so debian installs reasonably well on a mac, huh? i have a G3 at home that i tried yellow dog on and it crapped out

00:07:37 [talli]

i'll get the CD image of debian and try it out. or possibly netbsd. i would really like to learn a BSD

00:07:39 [ola]

talli: heh heh. but RedHat is a piece of cake, right?

00:08:04 [vinod]

well, i've never done a straight debian install on it. i bought and installed linuxppc a while ago and then somehow migrated it to Debian. but the debian-powerpc list is pretty active with good reports

00:08:46 [vinod]

i need to try BSD at some point, too

00:10:07 [talli]

redhat is, uh, crap. i always am afraid of installing redhat because for some reason, against any of my wishes, it demands to install and run sendmail

00:13:16 [ola]

I just removed the better part of my debian install. Thankfully enough the erasing stopped because "Processing was halted because there were too many errors"...

00:13:20 [ola]

doh!

00:13:36 [vinod]

ouch

00:13:40 [ola]

by mistake that is

00:13:45 [vinod]

ouch ouch

00:13:49 [ola]

hehe

00:15:18 [ola]

talli: sendmail is easy to remove; rpm -e sendmail ...

00:16:53 [talli]

yes, well i don't want it there in the first pkace

00:17:18 [ola]

at this point I sure like RedHat better than debian (but that will probably change)

00:17:30 [talli]

even though i try to convince my clients to use Redhat (by buying Redhat DB because they usually feel better spending money on SOME piece of software) i don't like it compared to debian

00:17:54 [vinod]

ola - once you get it running, you'll love it (i hope!)

00:17:56 [talli]

debian is just harder. you need to know linux much more extensively than you do redhat

00:18:41 [talli]

but debian is great

00:20:46 [ola]

vinod: that wouldn't surprise me at all. (I trust things that seem complicated at first)

00:21:07 [ola]

s/trust/like

00:21:23 [vinod]

haha - that's probably a good policy

00:21:38 [vinod]

for example, talli seems *very* complicated

00:24:46 [talli]

i'm really not that complicated. but the most sophisticated game vinod can play is tic tac toe, so to him i seem like the sphynx

00:26:16 [vinod]

now you're dissin tic-tac-toe?

00:27:01 [ola]

what is a sphynx. that's complicated to me:-)

00:27:29 [vinod]

see, i told ya talli was complicated

00:27:36 [ola]

haha

00:28:17 [ola]

vinod, where are you from?

00:29:02 [ola]

from kerala?

00:29:27 [vinod]

yup, i was born in the US, though

00:29:41 [ola]

aha. cool

00:30:02 [vinod]

how'd you guess?

00:30:23 [ola]

Kerala is the coolest part of India (or so my brother says)

00:31:00 [vinod]

absolutely (being a somewhat biased observer)

00:32:25 [ola]

I was just guessing. I only know Kerala, New Dehli, Madras and Bombay;-)

00:32:39 [vinod]

ahh - 1 in 4 - pretty good odds :-)

00:36:17 [ola]

I have to go (1.40 am) *sigh*

00:36:28 [ola]

ola has quit ("ircII EPIC4-1.0.1 -- Are we there yet?")

00:47:39 [hazmat]

hazmat has quit (Remote closed the connection)

00:55:00 [Spork]

time to bitch on the phone

00:55:09 [Spork]

those bastards have not cancelled my AOL those lamers

00:55:10 [talli]

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01:00:42 [dave]

dave (dave@alb-24-58-162-46.nycap.rr.com) has joined #openacs

01:00:57 [dave]

dave is now known as davb

01:03:37 [Spork]

hey

01:03:47 [davb]

there

01:04:11 [Spork]

no, not there...Here!

01:04:27 [davb]

I got my desktop working, but evolution won't install :(

01:04:35 [Spork]

awww

01:04:41 [davb]

vinod: thanks. i like icewm so far.

01:04:49 [Spork]

icewm = windows

01:04:53 [Spork]

too much like windows

01:04:59 [Spork]

I use Xfce and WindowMaker

01:05:01 [davb]

really?

01:05:14 [Spork]

It has a friggin Start-like button

01:05:16 [davb]

well I am running it under Ximian Gnome.

01:05:19 [davb]

:)

01:05:37 [Spork]

Xfce is really fast and it looks like OpenStep

01:05:51 [Spork]

Or whatever the Solaris X thing is called

01:05:55 [davb]

I don't like OpenStep ones. I probably would if I got used to it :)

01:06:03 [Spork]

Oh it's great

01:06:28 [davb]

hmmmm... what is Xfce?

01:06:39 [Spork]

It's really fast, everything is right there, i like the way the mouse buttons work and the way everything is laid out...It also restores my apps from when I restart the X session

01:07:03 [Spork]

WindowMaker is cool too

01:07:11 [davb]

so does gnome, at least with enlightenment, but I dont have enough horsepower to run enlightenment :)

01:07:11 [Spork]

http://www.xfce.org

01:07:12 [chump]

I: http://www.xfce.org from Spork

01:07:23 [davb]

sure, make me work for it :)

01:07:42 [Spork]

I:| A very light weight and fast window manager

01:07:42 [davb]

windowmaker is the window manager?

01:07:43 [chump]

titled item I

01:07:47 [Spork]

A: Get yours today!

01:07:47 [chump]

commented item A

01:07:54 [davb]

you use them together?

01:07:57 [davb]

or seperate?

01:08:03 [Spork]

separate

01:08:17 [davb]

aha, now I understand. I will try out a few different ones.

01:08:36 [davb]

I am apt-getting xfce

01:08:43 [Spork]

Gnome and KDE are resource hogs and at least 50% of Linux people run them, so I like to be different

01:09:11 [Spork]

want a screen shot of my desktop?

01:09:15 [davb]

right. I wanted to see nautilis and evolution.

01:09:17 [davb]

sure!

01:09:31 [davb]

I don't know how to stop Gnome though :)

01:11:42 [Spork]

you know how to dcc stuff?

01:11:59 [davb]

sure

01:12:09 [davb]

its one of these buttons :)

01:14:53 [Spork]

let's see if my XChat can send...

01:14:54 [Spork]

hold on

01:16:59 [Spork]

go go gadget file transfer

01:17:26 [davb]

hmmm I have a little window, it says waiting...

01:17:35 [davb]

argh, it now says Failed.

01:17:41 [Spork]

ok

01:18:24 [Spork]

have no ph34r

01:18:29 [Spork]

I'll upload the file..here

01:21:30 [rbm]

So that's XFCE eh?

01:21:34 [davb]

argh.

01:21:37 [rbm]

Maybe I should give it another whirl

01:21:48 [davb]

cool. I will try it.

01:22:01 [davb]

now I have to get rid of Gnome.

01:22:28 [Spork]

heh

01:22:40 [Spork]

Saying "get rid of Gnome" is like saying "get rid of Microsoft"

01:22:53 [Spork]

xfce rocks!

01:23:10 [rbm]

I prefer KDE, but until the GNU linker problem is fixed, C++ apps like KDE (huge) are too slow for me to run

01:23:13 [Spork]

My theme (which is why it looks yellowish) is because it's "Cheese"

01:23:32 [rbm]

I'm a WindowMaker user myself

01:23:43 [Spork]

i like window maker

01:23:53 [rbm]

* rbm notes that WindowMaker's author is Brazilian

01:23:59 [Spork]

lol

01:24:12 [rbm]

?

01:24:23 [Spork]

just funny

01:24:34 [Spork]

Anyways, I am going to change and go bowling...then I'll come and read

01:25:00 [Spork]

My new year's resolutions are: 1. To use computer less 2. Go to the gym more 3. eat less 4. read more

01:25:05 [rbm]

I'm thinking about going bowling.

01:25:13 [Spork]

Cool, you got an airport by you?

01:25:17 [Spork]

There's always room for one more!

01:25:18 [rbm]

* rbm played racquetball and did some Tae Bo today

01:25:37 [rbm]

Spork: The SLC Intl Airport is just 2 hours away :)

01:25:55 [Spork]

I ate some bow ties and played bowling

01:30:16 [davb]

* davb downloads postgresql

01:30:17 [vinod]

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01:30:22 [davb]

has anyone tried evolution?

01:32:01 [davb]

looks like I am stuck with Gnome for now.

01:33:30 [Spork]

I might have

01:37:52 [davb]

you might have tried evolution?

01:39:06 [rbm]

* rbm leaves

01:40:57 [davb]

brb

01:40:59 [davb]

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01:42:17 [davb]

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01:43:51 [davb]

wow these fonts are ugly

01:45:20 [davb]

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01:45:40 [davb]

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02:21:43 [markd2]

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02:23:35 [rzolf]

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02:23:42 [davb]

hi markd2 and rzolf

02:23:42 [rzolf]

rzolf has left #openacs

02:23:43 [markd2]

rzolfster

02:23:48 [davb]

oops

02:23:59 [markd2]

prolly got booted

02:24:07 [davb]

:)

02:24:42 [davb]

I would pay good money for a Linux distribution with a couple of real fonts.

02:24:56 [markd2]

does Suse come with good fonts?

02:26:53 [davb]

I am not sure.

02:27:12 [davb]

They are all free so I think that is the problem :)

02:29:54 [docwolf]

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02:30:04 [markd2]

hey docwolf

02:30:07 [docwolf]

greets

02:30:26 [docwolf]

happy new year, one and all

02:31:56 [talli]

talli (~talli@dsl092-013-011.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net) has joined #openacs

02:32:14 [talli]

hey guys

02:32:17 [docwolf]

hi!

02:32:46 [markd2]

give rzolf a noogie for me

02:32:55 [docwolf]

hehe

02:33:07 [docwolf]

rzolf was trapped on a plane for 5 hours

02:33:17 [docwolf]

with football loonies going to the orange bowl

02:33:23 [markd2]

heh

02:33:32 [markd2]

he *is* in hell!

02:33:39 [markd2]

did he get strip-searched?

02:33:51 [docwolf]

yes

02:33:58 [docwolf]

he looked particularly shady today

02:34:01 [docwolf]

with the one-way ticket

02:34:06 [docwolf]

and long, mysterious object

02:34:30 [markd2]

I told him to keep his pants zipped

02:34:37 [docwolf]

hehe

02:34:57 [talli]

did he have an exploding cucumber in his pants?

02:35:34 [docwolf]

hey, isn't this a "family" IRC channel?

02:35:49 [markd2]

heh

02:35:56 [markd2]

loggy might get offended

02:35:59 [docwolf]

haha

02:37:48 [davb]

wow the whole gang is here!

02:38:02 [docwolf]

yeah

02:38:05 [docwolf]

it's crowded in here

02:38:58 [talli]

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02:42:10 [davb]

* davb is in a really bad mood....

02:42:17 [davb]

postgresql still does not work :(

02:42:36 [davb]

wait...

02:43:10 [davb]

nevermind

02:46:54 [docwolf]

anyone seen senior adida lately?

02:49:11 [davb]

no

02:58:33 [davb]

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03:02:21 [markd2]

http://crazy.codetroop.com/randimg/?stone.jpg

03:02:22 [chump]

J: http://crazy.codetroop.com/randimg/?stone.jpg from markd2

03:02:26 [markd2]

J:| Who got the last laugh?

03:02:27 [chump]

titled item J

03:02:33 [markd2]

J: not approprite for the easily offended

03:02:34 [chump]

commented item J

03:11:06 [ChanServ]

[#OpenACS] This channel is logged: http://www.blogspace.com/openacs/chatlogs/ and blogged: http://www.thedesignexperience.org/openacs/ircblog

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03:19:24 [vinod]

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03:19:35 [markd2]

just missed docwolf

03:20:13 [vinod]

that's good - i think there's an MD limit on this channel

03:20:46 [vinod]

i think talli's trying to get it set to zero

03:20:49 [markd2]

so that explains the lack of people from baltimore around here

03:20:59 [vinod]

haha

03:21:04 [vinod]

moldovia, you mean

03:21:26 [rzolf]

re: vinod.

03:21:27 [markd2]

heh

03:21:42 [rzolf]

help me process credit cards.

03:21:42 [vinod]

hey rzolf!

03:21:55 [vinod]

sure - send em to me ;-)

03:21:58 [rzolf]

what's up?

03:22:20 [vinod]

not much - just waiting for my beer bottles to dry so i can start bottlin'

03:22:25 [vinod]

* vinod is excited!

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03:23:31 [markd2]

thought you were supposed to use little plastic cups for that....

03:24:20 [vinod]

no, no - the plastic cups are for the urine samples

03:24:24 [vinod]

don't get those mixed up!

03:26:37 [talli]

vinod: are you going to make your infamous " the indian mr. jekyll" brew?

03:30:08 [markd2]

* markd2 runs and hydes

03:31:29 [vinod]

lol

03:33:03 [talli]

oh, right. mr hyde, huh?

03:33:41 [vinod]

* vinod forgets which is which

03:34:11 [vinod]

i don't need to drink anything to turn into a raving lunatic

03:34:16 [talli]

* talli must begin referring to talli in the third person more often

03:34:22 [talli]

haha

03:35:21 [vinod]

* vinod can talk to vinod when he gets lonely

03:45:09 [vinod]

bbiab

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talli has quit ("See ya!")

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06:34:00 [ChanServ]

[#OpenACS] This channel is logged: http://www.blogspace.com/openacs/chatlogs/ and blogged: http://www.thedesignexperience.org/openacs/ircblog

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14:00:09 [lilo--]

[Global Notice] Hi all. Another netsplit in a moment, please bear with us while we reroute.

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14:24:17 [davb]

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14:24:25 [Spork]

hey dave

14:24:27 [davb]

hi

14:24:37 [Spork]

Those books are not that hard to read

14:24:45 [Spork]

i picked up all 4 last night

14:27:41 [davb]

Then you are a better reader than me. :)

14:27:57 [davb]

I think there are some very tedious parts in there, but some good parts too.

14:29:02 [Spork]

Well, I can't really say that, I just read the first 2 chapters of "The Hobbit" in 45 min or so

14:29:17 [Spork]

But I remember reading books like that in russian

14:29:35 [Spork]

I used to read one for breakfast, one for lunch and a couple for dinner lol...I used to love reading

14:30:13 [davb]

Ah. you didn't hit The Fellowship of the Ring yet. Its more dense/

14:30:20 [davb]

Although I suspect you are up to the challange.

14:30:51 [davb]

I found Edward Tutfte's books easier :)

14:31:00 [Spork]

I used to get caught up into books really well

14:31:31 [davb]

Me too.

14:31:33 [Spork]

like i would not put it down until I found a spot where I was happy with the progress of the characters and I was not leaving off in some spot where they're in some sort of a mess or something

14:32:52 [davb]

sounds like me. I think my brain is just too tired these days.

14:33:39 [Spork]

heh

14:38:02 [Spork]

Got a banking question for you

14:38:26 [Spork]

if I want to deposit an x amount of money into savings and x amount of money into checking do I have to fill out 2 different deposit slips or just one?

14:40:52 [davb]

Depends on the bank. Probably.

14:41:07 [davb]

Some have different slips for checking and savings.

14:41:31 [davb]

from one check or cash?

14:42:16 [Spork]

one check

14:42:31 [davb]

Ah, tricky :)

14:42:31 [Spork]

i can always just transfer from one to the other online if it doesn't let me do it on one

14:48:15 [Spork]

anyhoo

14:48:37 [Spork]

I'm off to the bank and then to treat myself to some Starbucks since I'm late for my 10am arrival anyway, might as well make it a nice 10:30

14:48:50 [Spork]

hasta la bye bye...

14:48:54 [Spork]

* Spork is away: at work

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15:44:11 [Psychephylax]

hidly ho markasaurus

15:44:53 [markd2]

howdeee

15:45:16 [Psychephylax]

I picked up the Lord of the Rings books

15:45:23 [Psychephylax]

Gonna read them all by end of January

15:48:14 [davb]

http://www.digital-digest.com/dvd/articles/region.html

15:48:14 [chump]

A: http://www.digital-digest.com/dvd/articles/region.html from davb

15:48:26 [davb]

A:|The Complete Region-Free PC-DVD Guide

15:48:26 [chump]

titled item A

15:54:29 [Psychephylax]

I'm off to do some work in the lab

15:54:36 [Psychephylax]

Muahahaha

15:54:40 [Psychephylax]

They're creeeepy crawlers

15:54:48 [Psychephylax]

* Psychephylax apologizes and wanders off

15:57:42 [markd2]

heh,

15:58:52 [vinod]

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16:00:08 [davb]

hi vinod!

16:00:15 [davb]

How goes the documentation?

16:01:25 [vinod]

hey davb!

16:01:51 [davb]

I had some ideas after installing postgresql.

16:01:55 [vinod]

it's going ok - mostly just cleaning things up and filling out a couple sections.

16:02:08 [davb]

want them here or should I comment?

16:02:08 [vinod]

cool!

16:02:21 [vinod]

if they're short, here is fine

16:02:48 [davb]

Ok. They are related to OpenFTS, but its easier if you do them when you install postgresql :)

16:03:02 [davb]

1) make-install-all-headers

16:03:19 [davb]

2) go to the postgresql source dir /contrib/intarray, make, make install

16:03:41 [davb]

So I don't know if they should go as a footnote or something in the install guide.

16:04:02 [vinod]

so, if i do make-install-all-headers, do i have to do make install?

16:04:02 [davb]

If you compile postgresql from source, you can always do it later. It is in the OpenFTS install docs.

16:04:07 [davb]

yes.

16:04:19 [davb]

install-all-headers just installs the extra headers.

16:04:48 [davb]

You don't _need_ those steps unless you are using OpenFTS.

16:05:12 [vinod]

ok. i think i'll just add it in the postgresql section - it won't hurt to do it

16:05:38 [vinod]

thanks dave!

16:05:40 [davb]

I suspect most people will want OpenFTS after then see what it can do.

16:05:56 [davb]

NP. I thought of it while I was installing postgres and I knew I needed those things :)

16:06:19 [davb]

I forgot to enable password-login for SSH on my machine though :(

16:06:55 [vinod]

you have to enable that? I thought that was the default

16:12:26 [dlk]

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16:25:46 [davb]

I think not. Or I screwed something else up :)

16:28:43 [vinod]

haha - i'm probably wrong. i haven't installed ssh in a while

16:28:45 [Psychephylax]

no it is

16:29:10 [markd2]

yes it isn't!

16:29:22 [Psychephylax]

wtf

16:29:28 [Psychephylax]

* Psychephylax thwaps© markd

16:29:28 [markd2]

(or something like that)

16:29:39 [markd2]

oof

16:30:50 [davb]

not in the debian package :)

16:30:57 [davb]

they like to be different.

16:31:35 [Psychephylax]

fools :-)

16:31:56 [davb]

I think its a security thing. Nothing wrong with making you turn it on.

16:32:18 [davb]

At least you _can_ turn it on, unlike other systems I won;t mention where there is no way to change things :)

16:32:51 [Psychephylax]

hehe

16:41:39 [Psychephylax]

it's fsck to check the filesystem in *nix right?

16:42:26 [davb]

yes.

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17:26:57 [davb]

bbl

18:26:28 [davb]

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18:42:07 [Psychephylax]

ewww

18:42:13 [Psychephylax]

I have coke in my shoes

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20:04:17 [davb]

http://users.netwit.net.au/~pursang/lofat.html

20:04:17 [chump]

B: http://users.netwit.net.au/~pursang/lofat.html from davb

20:04:25 [davb]

B:|Building the Lo-Fat Linux Desktop

20:04:26 [chump]

titled item B

20:04:40 [davb]

B: running a Linux desktop with less horsepower

20:04:40 [chump]

commented item B

20:05:17 [hazmat]

hazmat (~ender@adsl-66-123-57-58.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net) has joined #openacs

20:07:18 [rzolf]

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20:07:30 [rzolf]

hey hazmat.

20:07:50 [rzolf]

are you around?

20:13:28 [Psychephylax]

no

20:13:30 [Psychephylax]

we ate him

20:13:50 [rzolf]

psychephlax.

20:15:07 [markd2]

rzolf

20:15:14 [rzolf]

markd2.

20:15:39 [markd2]

docwolf

20:15:42 [hazmat]

hello

20:16:51 [davb]

http://www.oreillynet.com/cs/weblog/view/wlg/968

20:16:51 [chump]

C: http://www.oreillynet.com/cs/weblog/view/wlg/968 from davb

20:16:52 [rzolf]

hazmat: docwolf forwarded some email notes about python

20:16:56 [rzolf]

to me

20:17:00 [davb]

C:|Open Source and the Obligation to Recycle

20:17:01 [chump]

titled item C

20:17:21 [davb]

C:Should a companies code be released into the wild after they go out of business?

20:17:22 [chump]

commented item C

20:17:44 [rzolf]

i was wondering, have you successfully hooked up to postgres using medusa or twisted matrix?

20:17:55 [hazmat]

rzolf: there basically some fumblings i was doing with integration between openacs and python, which i stopped working on, might be useful.

20:18:28 [rzolf]

hazmat: i checked out the code. i was doing some integration with aolserver and pywx

20:18:46 [hazmat]

rzolf: twistedmatrix use twistedenterprise it should be compatible with any dbapi adaptor. the architecture is worth examing before using though.

20:18:53 [rzolf]

however, then i found medusa and twisted matrix and decided i dont really need

20:18:57 [rzolf]

aolserver

20:19:01 [hazmat]

:-)

20:19:18 [rzolf]

however it isnt apparent that twisted.enterpise actually works.

20:19:23 [hazmat]

is this for something web primarily related

20:19:31 [rzolf]

the CVS snapshot is missing some vital files.

20:19:38 [rzolf]

and the guy who wrote it isn't that much help.

20:19:47 [rzolf]

yeah it is primarily web related.

20:19:48 [hazmat]

rzolf, get one of the cvs snapshots, it works much better. who wrote it?

20:20:05 [rzolf]

dash on #python says that glyph wrote it.

20:20:08 [hazmat]

rzolf, someone told be that the cvs has some fixes in it.

20:20:27 [rzolf]

the cvs supposedly does work, but no one has committed any of the .tap files

20:20:41 [rzolf]

and i dont really know how to write them yet.

20:20:43 [hazmat]

ah.. well if you're on #python and glyph is around he generally answers questions (he's on alot) and the mailing list.

20:21:01 [hazmat]

to be honest, i've just been exploring twisted, have used it for any client projects yet.

20:21:14 [rzolf]

have you used python for many client projects?

20:21:29 [hazmat]

almost all.

20:21:31 [rzolf]

i have done loads of ACS projects, but want to switch to python

20:21:54 [rzolf]

because i have determined thatOO design techniques can help me out ALOT

20:21:57 [rzolf]

and...

20:22:09 [rzolf]

the OO -ness needs to be in the scripting layer.

20:22:17 [hazmat]

yup

20:22:46 [rzolf]

have you done any e-commerce stuff with python?

20:23:02 [rzolf]

specifically, just standard retail shopping?

20:23:34 [hazmat]

as for medusa and pg, its possible, but you have to write to the libpq async interfaces. its really not the best way to do a webapp. specialized async stuff sure...

20:23:56 [hazmat]

you might want to checkout webware.sf.net as well, and its MiddleKit relational layer.

20:24:46 [rzolf]

webware looks nice.

20:25:06 [hazmat]

rzolf, ecommerce... nope most of my stuff tends to be intranet jaunx with zope.

20:25:15 [rzolf]

the main reason i want to use something like medusa, is i want to ensure that this will scale up to a huge number of users, cheaply

20:25:44 [rzolf]

i would just use zope but there is no evidence that there are any zope sites that have more than 100,000 users

20:25:45 [hazmat]

really if thats a concern, twisted is more reliable and easier to extend than medusa.

20:26:09 [rzolf]

i really want to use twisted because it seems like a fun project

20:26:18 [hazmat]

100K registered members?

20:26:30 [rzolf]

er

20:26:51 [rzolf]

that'\s not what i really meant.

20:27:12 [rzolf]

hopefully i can figure out the twisted enterprise stuff.

20:27:45 [hazmat]

i had a discussion in #python yesterday regarding twisted v. medusa, the conclusion was clear that the twisted is a better platform. why? its easier to extend and reuse protocols, much better support and active development, and much better packaging.

20:28:33 [rzolf]

webware looks nice. have you used it?

20:30:00 [hazmat]

well i have found zope to be very scalable in load testing, esp. with squid in front of it. the sandiego tribune site uses it for their classifieds systems, as does nbcnewyork, check out some of the case studies. but in some respects in depends on your data model and programming style (fs, vs ttw). (i tend to write in python products for zope under cvs, no ttw).

20:30:25 [markd2]

ttw?

20:30:46 [rzolf]

what do you mean by "ttw"

20:30:49 [markd2]

Through The Window, as in "markd2 throws rzolf"

20:30:57 [hazmat]

re webware, i've experimented with it, i was/am more interested in middlekit than the package as a whole. zope is for me, the most productive environment (transparent persistence and builtin transactions with catloging are hard to beat).

20:31:02 [hazmat]

ttw - through the web.

20:31:20 [markd2]

I was close

20:31:21 [rzolf]

what web server do you use with zope?

20:31:25 [markd2]

* markd2 throws rzolf through the web

20:32:31 [hazmat]

either apache (for ssl) or squid directly if its on the internet, else i just run it naked on intranet sites. many people run it naked on the internet. but i like the flexibility of apache in front of it.

20:33:04 [rzolf]

cool.

20:36:42 [hazmat]

the other reasons i like zope, its cause it tends to sell itself, which i'm not big on. and the community which is nice (the python community as a whole is very nice), the relationship with ZC and zope community is not* like the relationship with aD and the acs community. night and day would hardly describe the differences.

20:37:31 [markd2]

aD had a relationship with the acs community?

20:37:31 [markd2]

wow

20:38:42 [rzolf]

with zope, is there an easy way to set up virtual domains that point heh

20:38:45 [rzolf]

erf.

20:38:56 [rzolf]

let me rephrase that.

20:38:58 [rzolf]

;-)

20:39:05 [rzolf]

with zope, is this easy?

20:39:08 [rzolf]

:

20:39:20 [rzolf]

one site, say

20:39:24 [rzolf]

www.foobar.com

20:39:42 [hazmat]

rzolf: default install look at SiteAccess and Vhost monsters, easy yes, although the first gnerally means a hunt through the docs.

20:39:49 [rzolf]

when a user goes to www.foobarblah.com

20:40:04 [rzolf]

they are just getting a template at www.foobar.com

20:40:30 [rzolf]

i'm trying to set up something where the same domains all point to the same website, but it serves up a different template for each domain

20:40:35 [rzolf]

but the underlying system is the same

20:40:38 [rzolf]

for everyone.

20:40:57 [rzolf]

also hazmat where are you located?

20:43:15 [hazmat]

yes, thats easy. how you set it up would depend on how much of the site infrastructure you want to share, basically what it sounds like is you want to skin the same datamodel for different vdomains, which is very easy (although i should probably toss in a disclaimer that i'm a zope guru (not self-proclaimed:)). if you want to discuss further i suggest we move this discussion to #zope

20:43:35 [hazmat]

pasadena, ca

20:43:42 [rzolf]

hehe, good point.

20:44:11 [rzolf]

ok, i'll join zope

20:44:17 [hazmat]

cool

20:44:24 [hazmat]

* hazmat heads out for a smoke break.

20:45:28 [davb]

Wow, the only discussion going on here, and we lost it :)

20:45:49 [rzolf]

davb: ;-)

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20:46:34 [rzolf]

doc.

20:46:41 [docwolf]

hi, everybody!

20:47:40 [davb]

hi doc

20:48:49 [hazmat]

whats up doc?

20:49:02 [docwolf]

not much

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21:16:02 [davb]

hi ola

21:16:42 [ola]

hello

21:17:16 [ola]

debian is tricky.

21:17:54 [davb]

http://www.google.com/corporate/today.html

21:17:54 [chump]

D: http://www.google.com/corporate/today.html from davb

21:17:56 [davb]

in what way?

21:18:06 [davb]

Except for the paritioning...

21:18:20 [davb]

which is not too bad. I did it with fdisk off a floppy for redhat :)

21:18:36 [davb]

D:|10 things Google has found to be true

21:18:37 [chump]

titled item D

21:18:49 [davb]

D:6) You can make money without doing evil.

21:18:49 [chump]

commented item D

21:19:17 [davb]

D: can google put this on the home page so maybe so larger corporations on the left coast see it? hmmm?

21:19:18 [chump]

commented item D

21:19:42 [ola]

well partitioning is rather easy. X will not work though..

21:19:48 [davb]

ick.

21:19:54 [davb]

What error are you getting?

21:20:25 [ola]

can't find screens

21:20:31 [davb]

same as me.

21:20:33 [davb]

what video card?

21:21:00 [ola]

matrox mystique I think it is.

21:21:11 [davb]

ah. not mine. but probably the same problem.

21:21:47 [davb]

How did you setup X? Did you use the debconf setup? for Xfree86-setup or whatever the x setup program is?

21:22:01 [ola]

I have the base system + x-window-system + desktop-system..

21:22:20 [davb]

ok. try running dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86

21:22:26 [ola]

I set it up during the install

21:22:38 [davb]

it will ask you questions. I had to answer no to one of them that defaults to yes about the video card...

21:22:51 [davb]

I would remember if I saw it :)

21:23:21 [ola]

ok. I,ll try. thanks!

21:23:23 [davb]

wow that was the worst grammer I have ever seen!

21:23:27 [davb]

(mine)

21:24:05 [ola]

heh. I thought you referred to mine..

21:24:57 [davb]

ola: if you want to /msg me with the questions I can guess which one it was :)

21:28:37 [ola]

wow! thanks. I'll just install epic4 on my other box.

21:28:44 [ola]

I'll be back...

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22:47:19 [rzolf]

hazmat: have you used openacs (or acs) for any production systems?

22:59:52 [hazmat]

yes, i've used the acs4x on oracle in production.

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23:00:03 [rzolf]

ok.

23:00:05 [hazmat]

* hazmat runs to the airport to pick up his gf.

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23:23:54 [rzolf]

re vinod.

23:25:44 [vinod]

hey rzolf!

23:25:51 [rzolf]

what's up?

23:26:16 [vinod]

not much... just working on documentation

23:26:22 [rzolf]

cool.

23:26:29 [vinod]

how you doin?

23:26:50 [rzolf]

not bad.

23:27:56 [vinod]

are you back in minnesota?

23:28:41 [rzolf]

no i am in Florida. ;-)

23:29:22 [vinod]

ahh... good choice this time o'year :-)

23:29:46 [rzolf]

yeah.

23:30:35 [vinod]

so, you and docwolf planning on taking over the world?

23:32:50 [rzolf]

vinod: yeah.

23:33:01 [rzolf]

or at least, taking over Boca Raton.

23:33:06 [vinod]

haha

23:33:35 [vinod]

everything evil starts in florida ;-)

23:34:08 [rzolf]

the IBM pc was invented here

23:34:10 [rzolf]

muhahah

23:34:39 [vinod]

ahhh - just one more piece of evidence...

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