00:00:09 rbm: stalled. I forgot about them I was so busy :) 00:00:41 also the second half of the 5th lecture is corrupted. 00:00:44 I am not sure he was referring to the permissions. IIRC, this post was after Jon's team fixed the permissions. 00:01:07 right, I just meant I am confident it is fixable. But yes it probably needs to be fixed. 00:01:31 also the ACS CR stored everything in blobs. 00:01:32 ok 00:01:57 i'm more concerned if its a fundamental design flaw... 00:02:16 right. 00:02:21 davb: okay 00:02:39 I am going to email someone at aduni.org to see if they have a copy of it or something. 00:02:41 same here 00:02:54 are you talking about the aduni lecture videos 00:02:55 ? 00:02:58 yes. 00:03:15 80GB 00:03:16 These are the MIT SICP lectures. 00:03:29 or just the MIT SICP lectures. 12 CDs 00:03:40 cool. They are not available online anymore right? 00:04:05 I don;t think so. They are copyright MIT. The aduni lectures are still there. 00:04:58 do you have a link for the mit sicp videos 00:05:08 great introduction by abelson by the way 00:05:54 I don't know if there is one. I DLed them before arsdigita foundation folded. 00:06:26 Of course eventually they should be available because MIT is releasing their course materials online. 00:06:28 I have ask somebody for aduni to make a copy of all the lectures for me and ship them to me. But, I don't know if the mit sicp lectures will be included. 00:06:45 yes, I have read about it (opencourseware) 00:08:40 The introduction by Abelson was *great*. 00:08:57 ok, I got a semi-joke thing for you 00:09:04 me 00:09:05 ? 00:09:13 everyone 00:09:20 go ahead 00:09:29 I'm starting to read russian books again and of course my mom gave me an easy one 00:09:47 So it talks about little children talking and (translated of course) 00:10:02 One of them says "Mom, what's heaven" 00:10:19 "It's where apples and pears and oranges grow" 00:10:31 "I understand heaven...fruit punch" 00:10:50 and another one-- 00:11:04 A little kid cut a rain worm in half... 00:11:10 Why did you do that.. 00:11:13 It was lonely 00:11:20 now there are two, they're happier 00:11:31 ahh..what it's like to be a little innocent kid 00:12:47 I think it's time to change your nick to psychephylax :) 00:12:59 hehehe 00:13:01 Oh 00:13:03 :) 00:13:07 How do I pronounce it properly! 00:13:20 psi-chi-phi-lax 00:13:21 Seeing how russian + english don't mix and do not equal greek speak 00:13:31 so the p is not silent? 00:13:41 I thought it would be sy-ke fi-lax 00:13:57 no, like psi factor 00:14:10 i don't know how to pronounce it either hehe 00:14:19 give me a sec 00:14:27 going to record it? hehe 00:14:33 :) 00:14:47 going through my dictionary 00:14:52 ok 00:16:04 vinod: I am finally testing that idea for static-pages. 00:16:35 i can't find anything to explain. the psi is not silent. 00:16:36 ahh... cool 00:17:05 hang on 00:17:08 like pci 00:17:09 Time for me to look :P 00:17:49 ok since when did yahoo convert to using these gay annoying pop up ads 00:18:18 :) spell the letter c after p 00:18:19 vinod has quit 00:19:03 rbm has quit 00:19:17 aha 00:19:32 it's here: http://www.geocities.com/esperantujo/vocab.html 00:20:09 that's it 00:20:52 Nice 00:21:03 godess of soul hehe 00:21:08 :) 00:21:23 "Soul, considered collectively, has the care of all that which is soulless, 00:21:23 and it traverses the whole heaven, appearing sometimes in one form and 00:21:25 sometimes in another." [Socrates. Plato, Phaedrus 246b] 00:21:47 nice 00:22:00 yeah my quote 00:22:55 Greek mythology rules 00:23:16 yeah 00:23:55 k well i have conflicting info again: http://apk.net/~fjk/psyche.html 00:23:59 first question 00:24:28 I would agree with that more than with psi 00:24:36 I do think the p is silent 00:25:47 lol 00:25:54 Another take on it's prononcuation: 00:25:56 Pronunciation -- think of Psyche! 00:25:56 Is a paling stout and spikey? 00:26:28 the best nick is "outis" 00:26:34 ootis 00:26:35 hehe 00:26:50 Aha! 00:26:56 PSI 00:26:56 PSI is pronounced usually as P+S, but in English we often shorten it to an "S". Examples are 00:26:58 PSYCHE, PSYCHOLOGY, PSORIASIS. 00:27:12 PSORIASIS. 00:27:20 I was thinking of psychology 00:27:25 P is silent on that 00:27:33 sy-ko-lo-gy 00:27:37 not like psychology 00:27:51 p+c, not p+e+c 00:27:59 I won't argue 00:28:02 ok 00:28:03 :) 00:28:13 I see where you're right...After all, you guys invented the language :) 00:28:39 It's like a tongue twister 00:28:53 :) 00:29:22 Yikes: definetly don't wanna be associated with this: http://www.connext.net/~psyche/slaves.html 00:30:14 lol 00:30:36 yeah yeah 00:30:39 laugh all you want 00:31:31 have you ever read greek poetry? 00:31:49 umm...I might 00:31:51 have 00:31:53 I don't remember 00:32:32 I'm very upset with myself, I used to read things like Vern, Cooper, Poe, O. Henry, Greek Mythology when I was like 7-9 00:32:41 Now I can't read books...I don't know why 00:38:01 spork, have you read it? 00:40:08 spork 00:41:23 ack 00:41:34 I read a part of it before BitchX kicked in with a MSG flood 00:41:38 e-mail it to me? 00:42:08 ok 00:42:15 nick@neverhere.com 00:43:20 done 00:43:28 hazmat has quit 00:44:13 " have come to the end. I thank you for your patience. I am 00:44:14 also grateful that «the bounty of Sweden» has permitted me in 00:44:14 the end to feel as if I were «nobody» - understanding this word 00:44:14 in the sense that Ulysses gave it when he replied to the 00:44:14 Cyclops, Polyphemus: «outiz» - nobody, in that mysterious 00:44:14 current which is Greece. " George Seferis (Nobel Lecture -- Nobel Laureate 1963) 00:44:44 have to go get some sleep. It's almost 4 o' clock in the morning here in cyprus 00:45:19 cool 00:45:21 a poem about life 00:45:26 yeah. 00:45:38 anything interesting happening on the bboards? My email is still not working. 00:45:39 wow neat 00:45:58 spork would you forward it to davb? 00:45:58 nkd one of my mom's co-workers if from Cyprus 00:46:09 yeah. which city? 00:46:10 I'll just put it on my site :) 00:46:15 No clue 00:46:18 what's the url? 00:46:19 Don't remember 00:46:24 I didn't do it yet 00:46:36 ok 00:46:43 later guys 00:47:03 bye 00:47:07 ok 00:47:14 nkd has left #openacs 00:47:19 it's here http://www.neverhere.com:1085/ithaca.txt 00:48:35 cool. I fell like visiting central new york. 00:48:42 s/fell/feel 00:48:48 how's that? 00:49:18 Dave, you up for helping me? 00:49:22 "journey to Ithaca, 00:49:22 " 00:49:26 oh 00:49:27 hehe 00:49:29 Sure. 00:49:36 I will do my best. 00:49:40 No, I think the poem is more about life and how it shouldn't be rushed 00:49:46 it's easy kinda ;) 00:50:13 Since you must have seen me explain "what I'm doing" in non-professional terms at least 5 times you're a good candidate 00:50:34 plus, I find that if i throw ideas at someone I write better and make less mistakes (if writing or coding) 00:51:10 (Referring to me) Description of project. (I am currently working on) 00:51:21 How would you describe what I am doing? 00:52:39 Web-based technical support management and tracking application? 00:52:58 ok that's good 00:53:02 support call management and tracking... maybe 00:53:45 I love yahoo store. If you cookie expires, you don;t have to sign in, it just takes you to a random page with no way to get back. 00:53:56 heh 00:54:36 * AaronSw reconnects 00:54:42 hi AaronSw 00:54:58 are you using it to keep track of all the calls? or just to check the status/history of a modem? 00:55:13 just the status/history of a modem 00:55:34 ok. 00:55:52 so far I got Modem tracking, User Management..need one more 00:57:35 It queries the modem for status, and stores that information in a history....hmmm 00:58:12 is there an emacs command to get rid of extraneous whitespace? I did something by accident that seemd to have that result and now I need to do it on purpose. 00:59:17 heh, what's the file named? 00:59:33 It might have loaded a special editing mode and does white spaces when you don't want it :/ 00:59:51 This is what i have now: 00:59:54 Description of project 00:59:54 Benefit to Cablevision 00:59:54 How's cablevision experience helping you professionally 00:59:59 ack 01:01:29 it was an sql file. don't think so. I hit a key that did it. 01:25:31 talli has joined #openacs 01:25:37 hey guys 01:25:44 andrew, you found it! 01:25:44 hi talli! 01:25:53 hey dave 01:26:29 yeah, it was really bugging me so I worked on it tonight. 01:26:34 phew! 01:26:43 That's a load off my back. 01:27:05 it's a load off of *all* of our backs! 01:27:06 good work! 01:29:03 Hey talli 01:29:15 hey spork 01:29:25 * Spork gets pointy and attentive 01:29:55 OH! 01:30:05 talli you're a boss :) wanna check something out? hehe 01:30:19 haha. no. 01:30:24 Spork: you're fired 01:30:26 don't worry it's quick 01:30:29 yeah soon to be 01:30:37 that comes in the beginning of next month 01:30:43 around 7th or 9th of November 01:30:55 Demo time! 01:30:56 hehe 01:31:02 go ahead 01:31:03 shoot 01:31:06 ok 01:31:09 this is more of an outline 01:31:11 Description of project 01:31:12 Benefit to Cablevision 01:31:20 How's cablevision experience helping you professionally 01:31:24 send it talli@museatech.net 01:31:26 acl 01:31:30 it keeps trying ot message dave 01:31:32 lol 01:31:34 ok 01:32:05 sent 01:32:38 it's going through the internet... i haven't received it yet... 01:33:37 heh 01:33:42 try now 01:33:48 still haven't received it yet... 01:34:04 ok, got it. reading... 01:34:09 k 01:34:25 some questions ... 01:34:29 shoot 01:34:30 who is this for? 01:34:33 my boss 01:34:38 now, my question 01:34:43 what are you trying to do? 01:35:04 seeing how he gave me two papers on how to write this...Should I point out the 4 spelling and 1 grammar mistake on them to him? In the most obnoxios way? 01:35:17 uh... yes... wait - no 01:35:20 lol 01:35:22 Too badf 01:35:27 I would have had fun with that 01:35:31 what are you trying to do? what are you trying to say? 01:35:32 Get the fattest red marker I could find 01:35:39 Status report of sorts 01:35:53 From the piece of paper he gave me 01:35:55 Steps 01:36:12 did you write this for him? 01:36:16 1. Write an outline for each section. At least 3 statements supported by 3 bullet points 01:36:23 ok 01:36:23 2. Convert outline to composition form 01:36:38 3. validate correctness of information, check grammer and punciations 01:36:56 4. have mentor provide confirming cover document 01:37:07 that seems reasonable 01:37:16 ok, what I e-mailed you is part 1 01:37:22 ok 01:37:28 less 3 bullet points to support each statement 01:37:44 whats the escape char in a regexp for a space? 01:37:46 ah, you need 3 point per statement,huh? 01:37:47 whoa 01:37:56 uh huh 01:38:16 I don't understand why I have to justify the assignment my boss assigned me but I'll dance to his music I suppose 01:38:52 well, he may be asking you to confirm that you fully understand the project. 01:39:09 and have recognized the subtleties and details of the project 01:39:16 I don't like this project but not like I have much of a choice hehe 01:41:43 So, how's the outline? 01:42:03 i think it's good 01:42:45 the trick here, though, is to get slightly more detailed on each level 01:42:55 You mean for sub-bullets? 01:42:58 otherwise you have nothing to say when you get farther down 01:42:59 yes 01:43:12 so, for instance, rather than say 01:43:25 "merging technologies with development source" 01:43:34 you just have that part be technology 01:43:39 then you say: 01:43:53 * existing technology = 01:44:01 * open source technology = 01:44:14 * problem is to merge these two 01:44:25 then, for user management you say: 01:44:32 * problem = 01:44:43 * i needed to do = 01:44:50 * proposed solution = 01:45:03 etc. 01:45:11 ah 01:45:13 I c 01:45:16 that way you'll get through everything you need to do 01:45:17 I'll work on that 01:45:35 it's pretty simple 01:45:41 just think OOP 01:45:45 it's the same idea 01:45:52 abstract at the top, detail in the beginning 01:45:55 same bullshit 01:46:32 Affirmative 01:47:57 Is it ok to repeat things? 01:48:10 Like some of the stuff from the top is applicable in the "benefits" section 01:50:38 * Spork pokes talli 01:50:51 hey, sorry 01:50:59 yeah, i think it's ok 01:51:07 ok 01:51:15 there are enough words in english to be able to say things differently, though 01:51:16 I'm making swift progress 01:51:29 Well, english is not my native language 01:53:51 i bet there are enough words in russian too 01:53:53 make it happen 01:53:58 IN russian? ok! 01:53:59 use google translator or something 01:54:03 lol 01:54:09 Can I translate it to farsi? 01:54:38 Oh the joy of handing in my status report to my boss in Farsi 01:55:52 no sweedish chef! 01:55:59 hah! 01:56:03 sweedish would work too 01:56:36 or Elmer Fudd 01:56:41 :) 01:56:54 Heh, they have Hacker also. I wonder what that would say. 01:57:54 Ok, how do I say "Having a boss" in a "professional" manner 01:58:07 without using demeaning words or derogatory statements 02:00:51 anyone? 02:02:21 * AaronSw disconnects 02:02:24 thats a tough one. 02:02:31 Receiving supervision? 02:02:36 aha! 02:02:40 or lack thereof 02:03:06 Hierarchial supervision 02:03:07 ? 02:03:57 ok 02:04:00 here's another one 02:04:11 I would say Multiple project management 02:04:21 but I have one main project and small things that I had to try on the side 02:05:14 Managing multiple priorities? 02:05:23 good one! 02:05:27 * Spork gives dave a beer 02:05:47 * AaronSw reconnects 02:06:46 What about time management 02:07:08 hmmmm.... 02:07:40 I'm almost done :) then talli might be kind enough to take a second look at the stuph 02:07:45 utilizing effective time manangement techniques to balance multiple priorities? 02:07:52 nah 02:08:02 I win buzzword bingo! 02:08:12 that's kinda like "Project deadlines" 02:08:19 but yes, you win buzzword bingo! 02:08:25 how do I search for a newline in emacs? 02:08:30 umm 02:08:44 I would guess ctl+s \n 02:08:53 but I could be very wrong =) 02:09:55 asha 02:09:56 aha 02:09:58 rather... 02:10:00 I tried that. it matched n 02:10:05 hmm 02:10:16 Did you try " " around it? 02:10:20 anyway. nope. 02:10:25 How do I incorporate this: 02:10:33 reading work related materials at home 02:10:33 is this in the benefits to you sections? 02:10:37 yeah 02:10:54 aha! 02:10:56 I got one 02:10:56 lol 02:10:57 Ok. Using time management to realize project goals? 02:11:08 It's not really time management but "Paycheck" rofl 02:11:17 Timely paycheck retrieval 02:11:31 Very beneficial 02:11:41 to you yes. 02:11:50 How's cablevision experience helping you professionally 02:11:58 It's paying me for my time 02:11:59 lol 02:12:08 thats professional. 02:12:14 indeed it is 02:12:32 But is it the right thing to write? lol 02:12:37 probably not. 02:12:38 OK. 02:13:12 hmmmm 02:13:15 Any suggestions? 02:13:35 learn to organize tasks and priorities? or did we already use that one? 02:13:54 Learn to program OpenACS/AOLserver/Tcl which will get you a job just about anywhere? 02:14:23 How do you figure the last one? 02:14:36 that is sarcasm i think... :) 02:16:42 rbm has joined #openacs 02:17:00 how about sub-system implementation management in a timely fashion? 02:18:57 hmmmm.... 02:19:13 ARGH. \n is supposed to match a newline. Maybe its not newline after all. 02:19:24 heh 02:19:25 looks like one. but of course, they're invisible. 02:19:30 right ;) 02:19:41 there is a way to turn the visibility on I think 02:20:22 dave, what do you think of the sub-system implementation? 02:20:52 in the benefits to you part? 02:20:55 yeah 02:21:14 I think it works 02:21:26 how about "task" or "project" 02:21:43 sub-project doesn't sound as nice as sub-system 02:22:28 how about sub-system reogranization to speed up the implementation process 02:22:39 not bad. 02:23:05 adler has joined #openacs 02:23:09 wb 02:23:34 * Spork pokes talli 02:23:42 cheers 02:23:53 Coors! 02:24:48 * rbm pokes #openacs 02:24:59 Spork is now known as openacs 02:25:05 * openacs pokes rbm back 02:25:08 openacs is now known as Spork 02:25:29 it all makes for great stories to tell my grandkids 02:25:44 adler what does? 02:26:25 my irc experiences 02:26:27 argh. I keep asking how to do something in emacs in #linux and everyone says to use a different app. 02:26:40 hah 02:26:43 I don't need to install/learn another app. I just need to strip out 600 or so extra newlines 02:26:44 * rbm acts poked 02:26:46 What app? eVIl 02:26:54 meta-x-do sometime 02:27:02 no. awk tr 02:27:06 oh 02:27:08 awk is useful 02:27:29 Yeah, but I don't want to learn it to do this one thing... emacs should just do it. 02:27:30 You can use regexps to parse the input file and rewrite an output file 02:27:36 sed does a similar function 02:27:53 s/\n{2,}/\n/ 02:28:03 Well, Dave, this is what separates a genius Unix user from an average shmoe 02:28:20 oh yeah. I am a genius shmoe though, what do i do? 02:28:28 :) not to say I'm a genius because sed and awk are beyond me as well 02:28:33 thanks adler. 02:29:17 what can i say? it's from one schmoe to another 02:29:35 will that work in emacs? 02:29:54 nevermind... 02:29:57 hey 02:29:59 no 02:30:01 Dave, have you tried jEdit? 02:30:08 talli 02:30:13 er, I don't know emacs regexs 02:30:16 can you look at the new and improved status report? 02:30:19 sure 02:30:21 send it over 02:30:23 adler , I think they use the same ones as perl 02:30:32 oh yes. In fact I have EVERY editor know to man installed. I am going to delete each newline with a different program :) 02:30:49 spork that strikes me as simply too appropriate 02:31:00 docwolf has joined #openacs 02:31:03 no they are different enough to screw you up. 02:31:15 hi docwolf 02:31:27 Sent 02:31:28 hi docwolf 02:31:29 davb - i will write the windows port which use 2x apps to delete the cr/lf 02:31:39 did you ever find out your vcr to digital media dilemma 02:31:40 cool! 02:32:13 howdy 02:32:20 i've given up 02:32:25 awww 02:32:25 i'm going to build a GarbageClone 02:32:36 adler , what looks too appropriate? 02:32:39 and just stick in a crummy card 02:32:53 Spork: looks great to me 02:32:57 cool 02:33:09 any suggestions on the part i have left with just -'s? 02:33:18 I think it would be identical to the above item 02:33:37 spork - that all apps/langs would use consisten regexps 02:33:42 Ah 02:33:48 Well, wishful thinking, what can I say 02:34:00 you can start with an apology 02:34:11 * Spork apologizes 02:34:16 I'm sorry ;( 02:34:20 * Spork hangs his head 02:34:32 now go right davb a oneliner 02:34:41 ? 02:34:43 jerryasher has joined #openacs 02:34:53 hey it's the person I've been waiting to bug :P 02:35:12 It's Mista Jerry Asher from The Asher Group...quick, everyone hide! 02:35:15 whuh me? 02:35:24 What does that mean? 02:35:26 * Spork hides inside a beer bottle 02:35:45 * jerryasher damnit I finally get a surprise but it's on irc 02:35:46 Sorry I didn't reply to the e-mail :) 02:36:04 davb - what solution are you going after? 02:36:36 hit end .... hit delete 02:36:48 I am done. 600+ lines down to 135 02:37:07 I did get rid of the 79 spaces between each word automatically so its still a win. 02:37:08 Anyone know how to destroy queries in BitchX? 02:37:20 hey jerry 02:37:38 hi 02:37:47 yeah. I need to learn Perl enough to do this. 02:38:04 Jerry, you about to run off somewhere or can I bug you now? 02:38:29 I forgot I had a good one-liner to do a s/// regexp replace. It works on all the files in a folder too. 02:38:29 Nope, I'm here, although when last we talked via email.... 02:38:53 yes? 02:38:54 you had decided I didn't quite understand. that so, maybe we should speak via at&t 02:39:03 instead of irc 02:39:04 at&t? 02:39:15 they used to be involved in the phone system 02:39:23 oh....har har har :P 02:39:44 Well, this is fine for now...I think I can do a better job of explaining if I do it from the top 02:39:55 please do! 02:39:58 :) 02:40:05 Am I gonna get billed ? hehehe 02:40:13 j/k 02:40:16 I dunno, can I? 02:40:25 Or rather, would you pay? 02:40:36 Ok for future reference. To cut and paste from emacs to another X app use M-w in emacs and the 3rd mouse button in the other app to paste. 02:40:36 if I had the power, sure! 02:40:40 but I'm just an intern 02:41:16 Ok, so here's the problem and a possible solution as well, since i had some time to find a way to solve the problem 02:45:35 this better be good... 02:46:18 Heh 02:46:27 I was typing in a query for Jerry 02:47:41 email is 30 years old -- i've had an email address for 23 years. This IRC/AIM stuff is weird. 02:48:17 nonsense 02:48:20 AIM is easy 02:48:25 IRC is a bit harder but easy too ;) 02:49:03 http://www.devwebpro.com/2001/0810.html 02:49:16 argh. gotta restart chump again. 02:49:32 chump has joined #openacs 02:49:37 http://www.devwebpro.com/2001/0810.html 02:49:37 E: http://www.devwebpro.com/2001/0810.html from davb 02:49:44 E:|Perl One-Liners 02:49:44 titled item E 02:51:38 when does it show up on the blog? 02:51:57 now 02:52:10 heh. It runs every minute or so. 02:55:18 Hmmm. Looks like another guy wrote the MP3 Jukebox software I was writing 02:55:24 But he did it in Perl with MySQL 02:56:30 What are you using? 02:56:45 davb: I'm using all C software 02:58:05 mpg123 as player, LCDD to talk to the LCD, IRMP3 to control everything. 02:58:16 davb - how's that oneliner? i remain curious 02:58:20 Sounds good. 02:58:41 rbm are you looking at route66? 02:58:46 I wrote a C module for IRMP3 that saves the last song/list played and where in the song it was last played (so that when I reboot it restarts from the same point) 02:58:50 adler: Yes. 02:58:53 I didn;t try it, It is similar to the one I used before that works on all the files in a directory. 02:59:03 rbm: neat 02:59:15 IRMP3 is actually very nice C code. 02:59:44 My module started as a very small thing (100 lines) but I kept adding features, and it grew to > 500 lines of C code. 02:59:52 i'll wait till theey embed an interpreted lang ;) 03:00:10 adler: Who and what for? 03:01:04 Now a car MP3 player would be an application where MySQL would fit very well. It's so critical that it requires all the power of MySQL. 03:01:18 rbm: whatcha got? (I'm just adding noise...) seriously - is it necessary to implement in C? 03:02:00 adler: IRMP3 is all C. Therefore I had to write the module in C. 03:02:56 til has quit 03:03:01 til has joined #openacs 03:03:05 I didn't try to do anything in Perl or Python because my jukebox is a tiny P100 with 50 Mb of RAM. 03:03:58 that would do it. 03:04:14 How will that do on playback. Is it fast enough? 03:04:15 rbm - have any pictures? 03:04:23 davb: It does it very well. 03:04:32 rbm: it seems that aD created some templates for DocBook XML creation 03:04:34 http://www.brasileiro.net/roberto/jukebox/ 03:04:34 F: http://www.brasileiro.net/roberto/jukebox/ from rbm 03:04:42 unfortunately, they no longer appear to be available 03:04:43 F:|rbm's JukeBox Pages 03:04:43 titled item F 03:04:48 It needs some updating 03:06:39 This is interesting ->> http://www.brasileiro.net/roberto/jukebox/images/wiring-db9.jpg 03:06:58 nice screenshouts :) 03:07:25 Yeah, I need to fix that (screenshouts) :-) 03:08:00 I have a small ReiserFS partition, the only that's mounted RW. All others are mounted RO. 03:09:29 It's very nice to have all that music in the car. But searching is a pain, and that's what is attracting me to that guy's setup 03:09:52 It's not really a pain, but it's not nice. 03:10:03 i caught wiff of it off of the slashdot page, but really have no familiarity with that stuff. 03:10:32 Whatever you do, DO NOT use the OSS drivers. ALSA sounds 1000s of times better. 03:11:20 I'm more likely to pick up a nomad.. any thoughts on portables? 03:11:26 $$$$ 03:11:33 That's what I didn't have. 03:11:52 s/didn't/don't/ 03:12:24 does anybody have any idea why there are so many trolling racists on slashdot? 03:12:46 talli: Because 99% of /.'ers are complete idiots 03:12:55 yup! 03:12:59 talli: you should browse at +2 03:13:01 i guess so. it's really upsetting at times 03:13:02 minimum. 03:13:06 is that how you do it? 03:13:22 yeah. slashdot becomes far less nauseating at +2 and above. 03:13:24 all right 03:13:58 I almost never look at the posts anymore. They are mostly a complete waste of time to read. 03:14:13 yes, they are sometimes 03:14:41 does anyone understand why mozilla is taking so long to come out with 1.0? The latest build seems pretty good to me... 03:14:44 but i must admit i submitted a story that got published to slashdot one time and some of the repsonses were *really* interesting 03:14:49 HOLY CRAP! 03:14:51 this seems like a marketing blunder of the highest order. 03:15:12 mozilla 0.9.5 crapped out on me already today 03:15:13 The Nomad costs $399! I built my MP3 Jukebox for $150 and it's much more expandadle with a much better interface 03:15:19 rbm: what happened? 03:15:26 talli any suggestions on how to fill in that gap I have for Statistical Information? 03:15:36 (but it's much larger in size too) 03:15:39 iut's very similar to the entry above for Modem Statistics 03:15:40 umm... run an excel spreadsheet? 03:15:55 http://www.thinkgeek.com/stuff/electronics/5784.shtml 03:15:55 G: http://www.thinkgeek.com/stuff/electronics/5784.shtml from docwolf 03:16:02 $150 for the nomad $60 for 128MB flash (so cheap) 03:16:09 this is better than the nomad (as far as pre-built players go) 03:16:13 it's always good to simply say, "it's the same thing as above, and here's why" 03:16:16 I am using 0.9.5 on Win98 and Debian. 03:16:22 Is that the 20 Gb Nomad? 03:16:46 20 Gb Nomad: http://www.americas.creative.com/shopcart/welcome.asp?SKU=126 03:16:49 32mb 03:16:54 i'm using 0.9.5 on win2k... no crashes.. ever. I also disable pop-ups, etc.. so maybe that helps 03:16:57 What's the flash for? 03:17:22 ok 03:17:31 I guess I will try the "It's the same as above routine" 03:17:37 adler: That URL you posted is not for the nomad. 03:17:49 personally, i like tiny toys. the 128mb is for a decent ammount of memory in my pocket. 03:18:04 what url? 03:18:29 adler: Yes, but I wanted something for my car, so I wouldn't have to carry my CDs around everywhere. 03:18:32 docwolfs? 03:18:33 are mp3s really that great? 03:18:43 Oh, it was docwolf who posted it. 03:18:54 talli: MP3s aren't. Music is :) 03:19:06 true enough. 03:19:15 i guess if you could hack something into your car, that would be cool 03:19:36 rbm: did you get that note about the aD docbook templates? 03:20:02 talli: what note? 03:20:02 talli- moreover, it's nice to dream of a world where we can access music on demand, not via plastic discs 03:20:05 they have the docbook primer up (which we should snag) but apparently have taken down the xml templates 03:20:35 rbm: i mentioned something above about aD and their docbook templates, which would be really nice to reuse. 03:20:55 adler: that's true. but i simply am to lazy to rip all my music to mp3 03:20:56 talli on the bboards? 03:21:15 http://developer.arsdigita.com/doc/eng-standards.html 03:21:15 H: http://developer.arsdigita.com/doc/eng-standards.html from talli 03:21:17 It's almost a full-time job to keep up with openacs posts these days 03:21:20 Which rocks :) 03:21:30 H: aD Documentation stuff 03:21:30 commented item H 03:21:41 H: In particular, pay attention to DocBook primer 03:21:41 commented item H 03:21:51 H: but they've taken down the XML templates 03:21:51 commented item H 03:22:06 WOW! Attacks to the USU network dropped by 90% after Sep. 11th 03:22:08 H: then again, they're probably somewhere in the documentation 03:22:08 commented item H 03:22:25 * rbm starts wgetting 03:22:27 tailil - that would take some dedication-- but consider the labor of n people schlepping n^2 discs. in the network, labor is conserved 03:23:37 Our computer services folks moved all USU DNS to Linux boxen, and also have a snort box scanning everything, and inserting traffic into PostgreSQL 03:23:52 the math is wrong, but the conservation is correct 03:23:58 that's true. 03:24:20 but i never used napster because i didn't trust anyone else's computer, nor did i dare let them access my computer 03:24:30 and i was just too fucking lazy to download napster 03:25:43 what if I were to give you an ftp account to 1000 of my CD's? 03:26:03 adler: That would make me interesting :) 03:26:09 heh 03:26:15 i am logging all of this & sending it to the RIAA 03:26:34 tonight i propose the piracy package-- aka the 'fair-use' package 03:26:42 But I only download music that I already payed for, but either lost the CD, or it got scratched, or I'm lazy to rip. 03:26:52 right. 03:27:15 no sarcasm intended there... 03:28:04 heh 03:28:07 http://www.campchaos.com/cartoons/napsterbad/napsterbad_56k.html 03:28:08 I: http://www.campchaos.com/cartoons/napsterbad/napsterbad_56k.html from docwolf 03:28:58 I've done some simple mp3 sharing via apache. it would be great to hack something uses the permissioning of OACS to provide to the comunity... 03:28:59 YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 03:29:01 it works. 03:29:07 I fixed static_page__delete. 03:29:14 * rbm taps davb on the back 03:29:32 I also broke it... three days ago. 03:29:56 As long as you fix it, that's part of the process :) 03:30:19 but I learned how content_items, content_revisions, etc work in the process. 03:30:24 rbm: hows that roadmap coming along? 03:31:20 adler: L 03:31:22 s/L/?/ 03:32:26 the docs roadmap...? 03:32:39 adler: oh. working on it. 03:33:31 humor me- what is it going to provide, generally speaking.. 03:33:40 adler: That's a secret 03:33:41 :) 03:33:58 secrets can be fun.. 03:34:08 adler: Basically what we need to work on for documentation, by priority, assignments, tools, etc. 03:34:20 * Spork is back 03:34:48 * jerryasher So Spork do what I said, take the antibiotics for 10 days, and it should no longer sting when you pee 03:34:53 I: hahahaha! 03:34:53 commented item I 03:35:01 hahah 03:35:44 Hmmmm. 03:35:49 rbm - i talked with vinod about some ways to improved the 'brief' install docs and decided I'm interested to help out where I can... 03:35:54 How do I tell wget to only mirror under a certain directory? 03:36:16 adler: Good. I've been swamped with some stuff 03:37:13 i just did that hang on.... 03:37:37 Heh 03:38:11 -np 03:38:15 no parent. 03:38:23 Otherwise it searches UP and down. 03:38:33 http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/cn/20011025/tc/msn_com_shuts_out_non-microsoft_browsers_1.html 03:38:33 J: http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/cn/20011025/tc/msn_com_shuts_out_non-microsoft_browsers_1.html from Spork 03:38:42 J:| Bill Gates thinks he owns the world 03:38:43 titled item J 03:39:01 J: Bill gates deserves a kick in the ass for blocking other legit browsers from accessing MSN.com 03:39:01 commented item J 03:39:04 M$'s excuse that it locks browsers out because of lack of standards-compliance is such a piece of crap! 03:39:07 J: Spork thinks Bills Gates does not own the world. 03:39:08 commented item J 03:39:15 Eh? 03:39:24 adler has left #openacs 03:39:25 it is my belief that MS is about to be taken to task financially. 03:39:27 adler has joined #openacs 03:39:29 J: 03:39:29 http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/cn/20011025/tc/msn_com_shuts_out_non-microsoft_browsers_1.html 03:39:30 Bill Gates thinks he owns the world 03:39:31 (Spork) Bill gates deserves a kick in the ass for blocking other legit browsers from accessing MSN.com 03:39:32 (davb) Spork thinks Bills Gates does not own the world. 03:39:40 Who wants to visit MSN.com?? 03:39:45 Not I 03:39:46 Okay, enough playing with chump. 03:40:32 talli still with the living? 03:40:43 yeah, but about to go to the other side 03:40:44 has anyone used newegg.com? 03:40:46 what's up? 03:40:46 Ah 03:40:49 yes I have 03:40:52 newegg.com ROCKS! 03:41:01 the price is right... 03:41:02 have a quick question for you 03:41:06 someone at work said they are very good. 03:41:26 talli has quit 03:41:31 talking about prices...lol...One reason why CV should continue my employment is that my salary is by bah! 03:41:38 why he leave like that :( 03:41:46 Dave, I pushed newegg.com on you before 03:41:53 You sure "work" wasn't "irc" 03:41:54 lol 03:42:07 i just picked up a ibm 60gxp 03:42:10 adler newegg.com is really good 03:42:12 wow. newegg looks cheap 03:42:35 yeah, their prices are supercheap, they ship FedEx and the stuff usually arrives in 2-3 days even cross country 03:42:44 and they have good ratings everywhere 03:43:00 I turn to them first thing when looking for hardware and willing to wait a few days 03:43:39 mom's getting linux and she's none the wiser :) 03:43:42 may i ask an ignorant motherboard question? 03:43:46 nope, guy at work ALSO endorsed newegg 03:43:47 hahahaha 03:43:48 heh 03:43:53 Mozilla mail is not bad. 03:44:10 Go ahead. 03:44:18 My mom came by a while back and pointed at my screen and said "Unix?" 03:44:22 yeah, I've plenthy of ignorant answers.. 03:44:35 lol 03:44:37 Me too 03:44:56 Spork: Wow. Your mom is pretty smart. 03:45:01 har har 03:45:06 My mom wouldn't have even looked at the screen. 03:45:13 She's a technophobic. 03:45:21 lol 03:45:52 I'm thinking what OS to torture her with....Windows XP or BSD/Linux 03:45:57 i'm looking for an ATX motherboard that fits in a small ATX case 03:46:04 ok 03:46:18 you need to find out what ATX sizes your case fits 03:46:29 I think the ratings are: microATX, baby ATX, ATX 03:46:46 Some cases will fit all 3, some will only fit micro and baby and some will only fit micro 03:47:09 let me ask you a question 03:47:21 is this for an athlon processor and what speed? 03:48:01 i'm guessing an athlon 03:48:05 ok 03:48:09 any idea on the speed? 03:48:14 Who's buying me an Athlon? 03:48:16 but heat is an issue... I know VIA makes a really cool-running chip 03:48:38 hey, i already bought you an athlon ;-) 03:48:42 Its time for me to go. 03:48:43 under 1.4 you can get away with a 350 or 300W P/S if you get 1.4 or 1.8 I strongly recommend a 400W P/S 03:48:47 ok, good night dave 03:48:57 * rbm kicks davb :) 03:49:03 davb has quit 03:49:10 Also, I like roomy cases so if you can afford and fit a full sized ATX one, go for it 03:49:13 Wow. I have a powerful kick. 03:49:16 lol 03:50:09 nice roomy cases = lots of space to work with without getting cables in the way and there's lots of space to move air 03:50:15 i wish i could... but the problem is i have a space issue. 03:50:22 (this machine isn't for me...) 03:50:32 ok, then step down and see if a BabyATX one will work 03:50:47 cool. thanks! 03:50:51 have you checked out http://www.slota.com or http://www.socketa.com 03:50:52 Nobody knows the answer for my wget question? 03:51:03 wget? Widget? Midget? 03:51:24 http://www.socketa.com 03:51:24 K: http://www.socketa.com from Spork 03:51:44 K:| The definitive source for Athlon motherboard information 03:51:44 titled item K 03:52:00 K: Reviews, comparisons, benchmarks, motherboard search engine 03:52:00 commented item K 03:52:10 nope. 03:52:27 also check out http://www.aceshardware.com and http://www.tomshardware.com 03:52:35 they provide nice reviews and up to date news ;) 03:52:45 sweet. thanks. 03:52:55 ever try that low-power VIA as an alternative? 03:53:22 me? 03:53:28 nah, I haven't built a computer in 2 years 03:53:32 Maybe next year 03:53:58 I've got my eye on a Athlon MP setup :) 03:54:18 probably will be a 1.8Ghz Athlon MP setup by the time I'm ready 03:54:46 i still use an Athlon 550 for my daily computing and an Athlon 750 to play games 03:55:33 it's amazing how fast even cheap garbage-dump machines have gotten 03:55:56 garbage-dump? 03:56:21 yeah. like the kind you find in the back of computer shopper 03:56:24 catch yall later 03:56:30 ok nite nite 03:56:36 oh 03:56:37 heh 03:56:43 adler has quit 03:56:43 I dunno, I have a moral dilemma 03:57:04 Do I buy a notebook from Dell or do I go spend 1500$ on a top of the line screamer with "the works" 03:57:38 I dunno, I build for fun....I really don't need another computer yet 03:57:47 I don't even have a spot to plug it in 03:58:05 I already run 3 + a lot of accessories from one single jack 03:59:54 Can someone say "Fire hazard"? 04:00:08 Fire Hazard! 04:00:13 indeed! 04:06:10 arg 04:06:20 I need to figure out 1 more reason why CV should keep 04:06:21 me 04:07:03 Is Cheap labor a bad thing to write? 04:08:19 yeah 04:08:29 Well, then why would someone want to keep me 04:08:35 "A good bang for the buck" 04:08:47 Any alternative representations? 04:10:49 "Will work for food" 04:14:52 How about this 04:15:02 Retraining someone would be more expensive than to keep me 04:15:10 how do I write that in "professional" terms 04:16:21 The costs of retraining a new employee would add a significant overhead, both financially as time-wise. 04:16:45 hmm. Take the "both" out and replace "as" with "and" 04:17:47 and you could add ", giving that possibility a prohibitive cost" 04:18:06 Check this out: 04:18:13 -Benefits 04:18:25 -Benefits 04:18:31 -Retraining a replacement would cause unnecessary overhead financially 04:18:37 and time-wise 04:18:55 -Cost effectiveness 04:21:54 any ideas? 04:29:48 Wooooohooooooooo! 04:29:51 I got it! 04:29:53 lol 04:29:55 * Spork gets all happy 04:30:09 Roberto you still awake? 04:30:16 you'll like this one 04:30:44 -Unique knowledge of OpenACS internal structure(yeah right, I still don't know what's doing what) but it's true to some extent! hahaha 04:36:35 *sigh* 04:36:37 now it's beddy time 04:36:40 g'nite everyone 05:43:16 vinod has joined #openacs 06:13:37 hazmat has joined #openacs 06:39:42 til has quit 07:30:40 chump has quit 07:36:44 chump has joined #openacs 07:55:27 hazmat has quit 07:58:00 chump has quit 08:45:41 vinod has quit 09:25:46 chump has joined #openacs 09:28:48 chump has quit 09:53:23 docwolf has quit 11:08:09 shagster has quit 13:01:51 * Spork wakes up 13:06:18 shagster has joined #openacs 13:10:18 davb has joined #openacs 13:14:50 hey dave 13:14:55 Howdy 13:15:03 i better start getting ready for work :) 13:15:25 "Donuts! Is there anything to do?" 13:15:33 "It takes two to lie, one to line and one to listen!" 13:15:43 "mmmmm, invisible cola" 13:15:52 "You're out of order! The whole DAMN SYSTEM IS OUT OF ORDER!" 13:16:03 "Booooring" 13:16:07 :) 13:17:32 what was that? 13:17:45 ummm 13:17:59 You WANT THE TRUTH? YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!! 13:18:03 heh 13:18:19 Actually those were little blurbs homer simpson said at one point in time 13:18:31 And someone conveniently stuffed them into a song 13:19:27 Cool. 13:20:48 Don't mind me :) i'm just a nut trying to make it in this eeeeVIl world 13:21:13 darn, chump didn't make it back again... 13:21:24 kill him 13:21:32 chump has joined #openacs 13:21:40 Hi chimp 13:21:41 no its the stupid DSL. 13:21:50 cable is bettah :) 13:21:54 It went down twice last night after 11 or so. 13:22:25 SDSL is better if you don't like to share. Usually it has been very reliable. Just the last couple of days have been bad. 13:22:35 oh well 13:22:36 anyways 13:22:41 I gotta go take a shower :) 13:22:43 Maybe if I'm lucky these guys will go out of business too and send me another refund. 13:22:45 and then drive to work 13:23:01 bbl when at work 13:23:06 * Spork detaches 13:23:14 I'll have lotsa questions :) 13:23:16 bbl 13:29:55 * AaronSw disconnects 13:30:59 * AaronSw reconnects 13:32:13 nkd has joined #openacs 13:34:24 nkd has left #openacs 13:34:31 * AaronSw disconnects 13:51:56 davb is now known as davb|meeting 14:02:02 * AaronSw reconnects 14:03:44 markd2 has joined #openacs 14:17:37 ola has joined #openacs 14:24:33 davb|meeting is now known as davb 14:24:40 Hi ola, markd2 14:24:50 greetings 14:25:45 howdy 14:32:44 * AaronSw disconnects 14:37:00 nkd has joined #openacs 14:37:49 hi nkd. 14:38:12 hi dave 14:38:38 have you checked out the forums (rlocke reply to your message) 14:38:57 Does anyone know how to debug an error in a web page as reported by IE? It says syntax error line 2. 14:39:15 nkd: I think I saw that. Is he right about the error in the serach doc? 14:39:32 I am pretty sure content_revision cannot be a subtype of a content_item. 14:39:39 i 'm not sure if the error is in the docs 14:39:46 I wrote that after Dan's suggestion 14:39:51 Oh. I didn't read it anyway. 14:40:14 maybe we should try it and see what comes up. static-pages could be the test for that 14:40:17 yet. that is my next step. 14:40:33 ok I will be online 14:40:42 cool. 14:41:00 I have finally have some time to work on finishing the workflow package 14:41:14 i can't wait to try to integrate it with some packages 14:41:15 :) 14:42:37 That should be interesting. I would like to use it with ETP to allow visitor submission of content that is then sent to a site admin for approval. 14:42:54 yes, that would be good 14:42:58 markd2 has quit 14:43:54 back 14:44:00 hey spork 14:44:16 hey 14:44:25 hiya spork 14:44:38 Spork: notes about rational rose 14:44:41 hey dave 14:44:46 oh yeah 14:44:57 My experience with it: confusing, interesting 14:45:03 useful eventually 14:45:06 code generation 14:45:26 no code generation 14:45:35 just for them (students) to learn the basics 14:45:39 have you got any links 14:46:10 FOr rational rose? 14:46:13 yeap 14:46:14 Not really 14:46:19 ok 14:46:29 I don't remember the book I was using 14:46:30 hang on 14:47:10 UML Explained by Kendall Scott, Addison-Wesley, 14:47:11 2001. 14:47:18 thanks 14:49:12 that's the book for UML 14:49:17 not directly tied in with RR 14:49:32 Nick :) 14:49:39 http://odl-skopje.etf.ukim.edu.mk/uml-help/ 14:49:39 A: http://odl-skopje.etf.ukim.edu.mk/uml-help/ from Spork 14:49:48 A:| UML Tutoral in 7 Days 14:49:48 titled item A 14:49:55 A: Pretty good when you're just starting out 14:49:55 commented item A 14:50:26 i have schash book and it looks good 14:51:07 unable to locate server, that's strange. Is it working for you? 14:51:48 no 14:51:54 it's not working but it did before 14:52:17 ok, i'll check later 14:53:21 yay! 14:53:32 You have been chosen as an alternate to interview with 14:53:33 Citigroup/Salomon Smith Barney on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 14:53:33 at the Career Center. 14:54:13 Argh. 14:54:20 Yahoo store is screwing me again. 14:54:38 Wait. Maybe I can figure it out. 14:55:38 the bad thing about porting (the latest version of) an already ported package is that you still need to check previously ported queries. 14:56:09 ...if they were affected by the changes 15:00:02 fun. 15:00:09 :) 15:05:50 important lesson: don't test your drop script in your developement directory!! 15:06:16 There needs to be, uninstall from the database, but DON"T delete all the files option. 15:07:08 I almost did that again... 15:08:25 I think I need to have a seperate checkout for every package I am working on. 15:09:09 odd 15:09:15 not even loading pages 15:18:31 Dave get this 15:18:41 my boss did not like that 3rd thing either 15:18:59 He thought I played "word association" and threw buzzwords down 15:27:14 ok 15:27:30 I just put ns_log statements every 10 lines or so all the way to the end 15:27:41 up to ad_return_template and it still does not return 15:28:32 aha 15:28:38 probably needs an adp page to match 15:42:49 anyone alive? 15:42:56 :) 15:43:02 hi. 15:43:04 I have a tcl script 15:43:08 spork, isn't that what we did?? 15:43:08 how can I execute it? 15:43:18 no not really 15:43:26 I actually did most of the things 15:43:35 Well, yes thats true. 15:43:44 Spork a standalone script? or for aolserver? 15:43:51 standalone tcl script 15:44:08 i will be exec'ing it later in an aol server script though 15:44:15 tclsh scriptname I think. 15:44:16 need to test it out first though 15:44:29 and what if it takes arguments? 15:44:44 tclsh scriptname arguments 15:45:40 ok thanks 15:45:41 that works 15:47:37 . 15:47:38 0. 15:47:45 oops 15:47:53 iced tea spilled on the keyboard :) 15:48:26 ouch 15:51:29 what's wrong with this: set ping [exec qping.tcl $modem_ip $cmts_ip] 15:52:00 aha 15:52:26 no not it 15:53:33 exec takes a list doesn't it? 15:54:00 no 15:54:18 My example says "set d [exec date]" 15:55:34 ok 15:55:48 i'm trying to run a tcl script 15:55:54 in aol server 15:56:26 the script is in a qping.tcl 15:56:30 right. 15:56:38 how do I fire it off? 15:57:03 [exec tclsh qping.tcl $modem_up $cmts_ip] 15:57:12 that's what I did 15:57:20 couldn't read file "qping.tcl": no such file or directory 15:57:28 You left out the tclsh 15:57:50 qping.tcl is not executable 15:58:11 set ping [exec tclsh8.3 qping.tcl $modem_ip $cmts_ip] 15:58:13 that's what I have 15:58:29 couldn't read file "qping.tcl": no such file or directory 15:58:30 while executing 15:58:31 "exec tclsh8.3 qping.tcl $modem_ip $cmts_ip" 15:58:45 oh. it can't find the file. 15:58:47 hmmm 15:58:53 file is in the same dir 15:59:08 put in the path. its probably execing from the aolserver/bin directory 15:59:31 not the directory the tcl page is in. 15:59:33 thanks 15:59:49 np. 16:01:22 hmmm 16:01:28 lindex var position 16:01:45 its indexed starting at 0 16:02:19 right 16:02:32 so if i have this: Ping results: 10.158.134.27 9 9 9 9 9 167.206.252.201 2 2 2 2 2 16:02:43 Ping results: @ping@ 16:02:54 And I'm trying to separate that 16:03:03 how do I grab the 9's 16:03:27 is that a list or just a big string? 16:03:38 he's lappending so I'm guessing a list 16:03:43 lrange $var 1 6 16:04:04 I think that makes a new list. 16:04:16 here's the script 16:04:17 foreach ip $argv { 16:04:18 set pings {} 16:04:18 for {set i 0 } { $i <5 } { incr i } { 16:04:18 set pr [Tnm::icmp -timeout 1 -retries 1 echo $ip] 16:04:18 set rtt [lindex $pr 1] 16:04:19 lappend pings $rtt 16:04:21 } 16:04:23 puts "$ip $pings" 16:04:25 } 16:04:32 btw 16:04:42 I got selected for an interview with salomon smith barney =) 16:04:53 cool. good luck. 16:04:57 thanks 16:05:14 in 4 days 16:05:34 so what does that script return? 16:05:37 a string or a list 16:05:44 excuse me for my ignorance: whos salomon smith barney? 16:05:50 lol 16:06:16 --> http://www.salomonsmithbarney.com/ 16:06:37 a list. 16:07:00 ok 16:07:01 it returns a string. 16:07:04 sorry. 16:07:06 heh ok 16:07:11 can I make it return a list instead? 16:07:14 the list is expanded. 16:07:22 Yes. 16:07:26 ok 16:07:38 wait, i don't think so... 16:07:54 ok, how about converting it to a list? 16:08:03 can that be done? 16:08:17 Maybe. its putting the output. But if you put it as {$ip {$pings}} or something like that 16:08:47 then do set var [list $var_from_external_script] it should work. 16:08:53 Did I lose you there? 16:08:56 a bit 16:08:58 hang on 16:09:13 Actually thats a nested list. A list with IP and a list of pings. 16:09:44 didn't understand much beside that the site offers financial services. 16:09:59 that's what it is 16:10:00 lol 16:10:04 Except they're not a .gone 16:10:08 remember. the output of the script is leaving tcl and going to stout 16:11:17 aha 16:11:39 so you have to parse it inside aolserver. 16:12:48 {{10.158.134.27 {11 9 9 9 9}} {167.206.252.201 {2 2 2 2 2}}} 16:12:49 lol 16:14:21 right. that is a list of nested lists each set of {} is a list. the elements are seperated by a space. 16:14:42 right 16:14:46 hang on 16:14:47 you have two lists with a string and a list in each. 16:14:49 k 16:15:40 aha! 16:17:08 ok I got a question for you 16:17:21 It is possible to have an arbitrary size list 16:17:25 ok 16:17:30 this is what I want to avoid 16:17:37 hardcoding the number of pings 16:17:42 right now it's 5 pings 16:18:02 if the qping.tcl changes to use 15 pings 16:18:07 ok. right. You can do llength [list $list of pings] 16:18:14 aha 16:18:15 ok 16:18:21 So it is possible 16:18:25 That's all I wanted to know 16:18:31 or just foreach $list_of_pings { do something with the pings } 16:18:34 Right now I'm prototyping so it's not the important part 16:18:38 talli has joined #openacs 16:18:42 Hi talli 16:18:42 Hi Talli. 16:18:46 hey guys 16:18:47 beat ya! :)~ 16:18:50 I think content_folder__delete is broken. 16:19:01 hi talli 16:19:18 hey nkd 16:19:23 It tried to unregister the content type before it deletes the items from content_type_folder_map 16:19:56 talli, my boss did not like it at all 16:20:06 davb have you tried to change static-pages w.r.t guidelines? 16:20:07 he thought I did not understand what I had to do 16:20:19 weird 16:20:20 why not? 16:20:34 No. I am using my own guidelines right now :) I am trying to get the drop script to work correctly. 16:20:39 He said I just threw a bunch of buzzwords together and put no thought to it 16:20:40 he didn't like the outline or the content? 16:20:45 content 16:21:08 Actually content_folder__unregister_content_type is supposed to delete the entries in content_type_folder_map itself 16:21:08 ok, let me know when you get started 16:21:14 sure. 16:21:16 well, you did, didn't you? 16:21:30 no I did those things 16:21:46 oh, ok 16:22:00 well, he may want to have more detail on each line 16:22:08 or he's an ass. which is always a possibility 16:22:15 I'm going with the latter option 16:22:26 I think my english skills are just beyond his abilities 16:22:36 heh 16:22:49 Get ready for that interview at Smith Barney, I say. 16:23:44 I hear that 16:24:48 is rbm here this morning? 16:25:31 aha. static_page needs to be a subtype of content_revision (I thought it was). 16:25:46 read the guidelines 16:25:47 ? 16:26:12 davb: reading the guidelines? 16:26:47 No I meant for content_folder__delete to work. 16:27:11 actually the problem is its not unregistering the fact that a static_folder can contain other folders. 16:28:42 guidelines say: "In most of the cases, choosing the object type is straightforward. However, if your object type uses the content repository then you should make sure that 16:28:43 your object type is a subclass of the "content_revision" class. You should also make sure all content is created using that subclass, rather than simply 16:28:43 create content with the "content_revision" type. " 16:29:07 It is. 16:29:22 The problem is with the drop script. Content_folder__delete is broken. 16:29:34 It assumes that a content_folder will not contain other folders. 16:30:05 it only deletes items in the cr_folder_type_map that are content_revision or subtypes of content_revision. content_folder is a subtype of content_item. 16:30:06 contact Dan 16:30:07 ok 16:30:16 now, this might be a dumb question =) 16:30:22 how do I store all my stuff in Oracle now 16:30:34 yes. Sorry to throw all that out. Just thinking outloud(or in IRC at least) 16:30:43 i think I wrote a pl/sql procedure to do it 16:30:46 np 16:30:48 use it. 16:30:54 how? lol 16:31:09 can you take a look at it? 16:31:21 i don't even know if it does what I think it does =) 16:31:30 like this: db_exec_plsql "PEFORM spork_item.new('properties of spork item')" 16:31:30 * Spork has no confidence in anything aside sleep 16:31:48 wait leave out the perform, thats for postgresql. 16:32:39 The syntax is a little different. If you want to capture the id of the new item you need to select it into a variable or something. 16:32:50 hmmm 16:32:55 Dave, can you take a look? 16:33:02 sure /msg me 16:33:10 i'll e-mail it's very long 16:33:13 k 16:34:56 email address? 16:36:19 dave@thedesignexperience.org 16:38:14 sent 16:41:27 Syntax error: EOF in backquote substitution 16:41:55 Spork: looks ok to me. It creates an object and stuff the data in the table. 16:42:06 that's pretty much all I need! 16:42:11 So how do I use it? lol 16:42:18 db_exec_plsql "snmp_incident.new(var1,var2,var3,var4) ? 16:42:20 you might have to set permissions on the acs_object, 16:42:31 Spork: yes 16:42:36 well, if it craps out i guess we'll see 16:42:40 ok here goes nothing then 16:42:41 hehe 16:42:42 Look at some of vinod's code. 16:42:46 i did 16:42:50 that's where I stole that from =) 16:43:22 There is probablay atcl proc that calls the function. So that its not hard-coded in the tcl paages. 16:43:40 how do I do that? 16:43:42 oh 16:44:05 you mean like proc store {var 1} { call to pl/sql} 16:44:06 ? 16:44:38 yeah. 16:44:47 that is the ACS style. 16:44:51 how is that any more efficient? 16:45:34 its not. just abstracted. The TCL pages don't have to change if the underlying API changes. 16:46:02 The tcl page developed needs no knowledge of the database structure. 16:46:09 s/developed/developer 16:49:42 [GlobalNotice] Hi all. It's worth noting that, schedules permitting, we'll be attempting to cut over to the new code on Saturday. (all times OPN standard, UTC) 16:49:59 hmmmm. 16:50:48 weird. 16:52:09 ls 16:52:11 oops 16:53:01 dave.txt needs.txt to.adp to.tcl help.jpg me.sql 16:53:25 here's a question for you 16:53:32 but I will ask you after lunch 16:53:51 ok 16:54:14 bbl 16:54:33 away 16:54:35 lunch 16:55:42 hmmm. 16:56:30 adler has joined #openacs 16:56:36 cheers 16:56:45 hello adler 16:57:13 hey davb - erase those pesky newlines? 16:57:47 that was you, right? 16:59:36 Hallo Halloo! 16:59:56 Aaron, an RSS 1.0 question... 17:03:32 heh. yes thanks. 17:05:16 * jerryasher which one of these IRC switches activates Aaron's vibra-bed? 17:05:35 try /msg AaronSw it might make his client beep 17:06:09 * jerryasher wow. davb must be psychic or something, better be careful what I think around him 17:06:40 No way. 17:07:24 * davb wishes for create or replace function, etc... in postgresql soon! 17:08:27 lethedrinker has joined #openacs 17:09:09 Does anyone know what the "bitch seat" is? (I just found out, no it didn't hurt) 17:09:19 Thank you NPR! 17:10:36 yeah.. the middle back seat... 17:10:47 or whereever we can find your mother! 17:10:55 woah! 17:11:14 * adler snickers 17:11:19 Ha ha. Listen, you haven't seen my mom. She's safe from all attacks (unfortunately) 17:11:38 But yeah, I've had a bike for 15 years, and just learned a new word. 17:12:02 They're talking to some feminist biker and how she came to love biker culture 17:12:09 just when you thought it was safe to join a channel, they start bringing up moms... 17:12:39 jerry- it's the leather, right? 17:13:24 Uh no, I guess I'd rather not get into it too much, but um, 17:13:50 well i'm just going to drop it. 17:13:57 don't go offtopic on my account 17:14:28 Nope, not at all. I just thought that little factoid was interesting at the moment. 17:14:49 Still, where's that AaronSw? Anyone hear know RSS? 17:15:10 a little. I know where to find out anyway... 17:16:38 In RSS 0.91, are subelements of 17:16:52 yes. 17:16:53 In RSS 1.0, are both: 17:17:16 subelements of which is a subelement of 17:17:17 AND 17:18:05 is a toplevel element by itself 17:18:27 yes it appears so. 17:18:42 Actually a correction: 17:18:56 In RSS 0.91, is a subelement of 17:19:17 Well Aaron says that 1.0 is completely backward compatible with 0.91 17:19:35 but I don't see how that works with 0.91 17:19:37 Or did he say the tools all work with both? 17:20:40 I got the impression (erroneous?) that a lot of work went into 1.0 to make it 17:20:56 compatible such that a 1.0 stream fed to a 0.91 processor would work 17:21:15 since, presumably, the 0.91 processor would ignore what it didn't understand, and 17:21:25 the left over bit would be a 0.91 stream. 17:22:16 4. Design Goals 17:22:16 The RSS 1.0 design goal is an XML-based lightweight multipurpose extensible metadata description and syndication format. Backward compatibility with RSS 0.9 is a goal for ease of adoption by 17:22:24 existing syndicated content producers. 17:23:37 jerryasher: .91 and .9 are different 17:24:38 Right....? 17:25:21 nevermind 17:25:58 jerryasher: I am looking, It appears you are correct. the goal is backward compatability, but ther are different. in that items is outside of channel in 1.0 17:26:22 I suspect most parsers just grab all the elements called item whevere they appear. 17:26:38 nkd has left #openacs 17:31:13 Wow, uptime.openacs.org has 1000 users 17:31:55 anyone know how DanW's tree_sortkeys work? Should the top element have '' as the sortkey or 00? 17:32:23 Umm, I believe it is 00, I think 17:32:38 How is that for being sure :) 17:32:40 Ok, so my trigger is broken. again. or differently at least. 17:33:09 you are correct: 17:33:09 0 | acs_object | | t | \ 17:33:09 | 2001-10-26 12:49:30-04 | | 2001-10-26 12:49:30-04 | \ 17:33:09 | | /00 17:33:23 the top acs_object itself has /00 17:33:55 I was right, watch out for flying pigs :) 17:34:13 heh 17:35:53 markd2 has joined #openacs 17:37:24 hidly ho neighborinos 17:37:33 bork 17:37:42 bark! 17:37:48 ltns mark 17:37:53 * Spork gives mark a cookie 17:38:10 mmmm... cookies 17:40:12 lethedrinker has left #openacs 17:43:07 I got preselected for an interview with Salomon Smith Barney 17:43:09 :) 17:46:13 So, those are Barney's first names 17:46:22 lol 17:46:30 kinda pretentious for a purple dinosaur 17:48:07 Spork: does SSB have an IRC channel where you can ask for help? 17:48:16 lol 17:48:24 help for what? 17:48:46 * AaronSw reconnects 17:52:19 jerryasher, 1.0 is backwards comaptible with 0.9 not 0.91 17:52:23 sorry if I misspoke 17:53:01 Ah, okay. 17:53:18 You may not have mispoke, I probably misheard. 17:53:29 * jerryasher 20,000 lines, flush.... 17:53:35 * jerryasher kidding 17:54:06 What then of RSS and userland stuff? 17:54:21 If I try to feed dave winer a 1.0 feed what do you think will happen? 17:54:46 Radio Userland can read 1.0 feeds I believe. 17:54:59 hey jerry 17:55:16 hi Spork (I'm curious as to what your major is) 17:56:16 So in RSS 1.0, what is the relationship between and 17:56:44 Supports RSS 0.90 or greater, 1.0 or greater for input 17:56:57 Oh! Where do you see that? 17:57:16 http://radio.userland.com 17:57:24 and answering my own question, it appears they are linked via the 17:58:08 Hmm, I see that, I'm not sure what that means.... 17:58:37 adler has quit 17:58:42 what do you supposed " 1.0 or greater..." means 17:59:09 jerryasher: thats a different format. Radio supports RSS and scripting news format. 17:59:32 for example. scripting.com still syndicates in scriptingnews format. I have no idea why. 17:59:54 jerry my major as in college? 18:00:07 Spork: no your major malfunction :) 18:00:18 oh that 18:00:21 well, that's obvious 18:00:27 it starts with a b 18:00:30 ands with an s 18:00:46 and has what Microsoft just released 18:00:58 a BS major 18:01:00 bturds? 18:01:59 I see. There are tons of folks doing CS going BS these days. 18:02:18 It's interesting. Used to be all the software folks were coming out of physics 18:02:19 my majors are Computer Science and Applied Math 18:03:43 Interesting. Tnx. 18:04:21 Okay, well I guess I will try to develop a proc that spits out either 0.91 or 1.0 RSS. 18:04:34 and offer a choice to the user? 18:04:37 * AaronSw disconnects 18:04:39 perhaps determining 0.91 or 1.0 at random, is best. 18:04:43 * AaronSw reconnects 18:05:04 They are both pretty easy to generate. 18:05:09 you are creating it right? Not bringing it in. 18:05:34 Yes, at first I was thinking of this in terms of a bboard def, but I reading the 18:05:51 RSS 1.0 spec and how it might apply to job postings, etc., I think I'll just make it 18:06:06 an rss def that you feed a list of items to, and some channel info, and it spits out 18:06:21 I am planning on an OpenACS 4 package to offer RSS generation services. 18:06:24 the feed. and then folks can hook that into a registered proc or .vuh file if that's 18:06:28 what oacs 4 is using. 18:06:53 What's the status? 18:07:05 Its in my head so far. 18:07:11 Down a little far on the list right now. 18:07:46 Okay, well maybe I'll give you the proc above [rss_out [channel] [item-list]] and you can 18:07:54 turn it into an oacs 4 service or some such.... 18:07:58 Cool. 18:08:09 here's a question 18:08:19 i'm gonna go code for a while and listen to science friday. 18:08:35 Can one pl/sql function insert numbers into multiple tables? 18:09:06 Talli: any plans yet on how to organize people developing new packages? I am talking about services on the new openacs.org 18:09:21 Sure why not? I can do anything you tell it to ;) 18:09:27 hold on. we're having a musea discussion about that right now 18:09:40 so i can answer that question in an hour or so 18:09:49 maybe jerryasher is right... I am psycho^Hic 18:10:10 * markd2 hands davb a 't' 18:10:49 heh 18:10:55 lol 18:11:06 davb is now known as davtb 18:11:48 so can one pl/sql function update multiple tables? 18:11:55 Yeah sure: 18:11:56 my guess is yes 18:11:56 TB, or not TB... is that congestion? 18:12:02 begin 18:12:05 consumption be done? of corpse! 18:12:11 update blah set x=tar; 18:12:21 update foo set y=bar; 18:12:24 end; 18:12:30 davtb is now known as davb 18:12:57 ok 18:13:00 a few more questions 18:13:32 can a pl/sql function take this as an argument {{list for a} {list for b}} 18:13:49 don't think so. 18:14:04 hmmm 18:14:06 * davb points to markd2 18:14:33 * Spork waves a cookie 18:14:54 You can do this though: 18:15:03 wait no, you can't. 18:15:05 do this: 18:15:09 in tcl: 18:15:15 foreach item $a { 18:15:25 db_exec_plsql yourfunction 18:15:27 } 18:15:45 there's a pl_list package in the acs4 code base I think 18:15:51 which can do the list things 18:15:56 neat. 18:16:36 hmmm 18:16:40 ok 18:16:46 well, this is my current problem 18:17:01 I have 35 variables that my adp/tcl page has 18:17:19 out of those 35 I have 26 that go to table 1 18:17:23 5 to table 2 18:17:28 5 to table 3 18:17:35 and whatever is left to table 4 18:18:09 Should I write a proc to take {{tab1 vars} {tab2 vars} {tab3 vars} {tab4 vars}} { 18:18:09 ok 18:18:24 then call a pl/sql function that inserts stuff into table1 18:18:31 another one to insert stuff into table2 18:18:34 and so forth? 18:19:13 also, the catch here is that it could be more than 5 for table 2 and 3 and 4 18:19:17 I'd probably do 4 different procs 18:19:22 one for each table 18:19:25 ok 18:19:30 that way you don't have to cram everythting into one call 18:19:33 then pull it all back apart 18:19:36 right 18:19:51 * Spork goes at it 18:20:23 so I have a function called new 18:20:29 that does the 1st table 18:20:34 can I call the rest anything I please? 18:21:19 sure 18:24:39 ok 18:24:42 what about this 18:24:46 nap time for the old man 18:24:48 markd2 has quit 18:24:51 doh 18:25:14 heh 18:25:19 oh well 18:25:23 i'll just bug you :P 18:25:29 Can I have this though 18:25:51 table1 stores a ping_id which is used as a key in the ping table 18:26:20 ah 18:26:51 question: Are oracle functions executed as transactions? 18:27:00 don;t know. Postgresql are. 18:27:00 eg. If it fails half way does it roll back? 18:27:25 do you want it to be a transaction? 18:27:35 yeah 18:27:42 I see. you want to have all 4 inside a big transaction? 18:27:48 yup 18:28:17 db_transaction I think 18:28:21 ok 18:28:22 thanks 18:28:34 I think you can put the calls inside that. 18:30:41 correct 18:31:41 ok I got a question 18:31:50 db_exec_plsql should return an incident id 18:32:07 so would it be set incident_id [db_exec_plsql....] 18:33:33 I'm not sure... 18:34:12 hmm 18:34:34 also, how do I make something into a sequence? 18:35:18 hmmmmmmmmm 18:35:48 create sequence blah_id_seq; 18:36:17 in tcl or oracle? 18:36:19 insert into blahs blah_id values(nextval(blah_id_seq)) 18:36:23 oracle. 18:36:25 ok 18:36:43 I think thats right. 18:38:36 hmmm 18:42:18 so in my *-create.sql I have to create those sequences? 18:42:26 yes. 18:42:36 wait for what? 18:42:52 your ids all come from acs_objects right? 18:43:02 This part is messing me up 18:43:07 here's what I'm trying to do 18:43:18 I have these types of info 18:44:35 snmp_vars, cm_ping_list, cmts_ping_list and attached_devices_list 18:44:53 all of them have some number of variables incapsulated in them 18:45:09 i want to call a proc to take all those as one whole 18:45:48 the snmp_vars will have a unique ID I guess that's coming from acs-Objects 18:46:10 right. 18:46:22 then, cm_ping_list and cmts_ping_list and attached_devices_list need a key to know they're attached to a specific query 18:46:48 Ok then you need one sequence. right? and each query has 3 parts? 18:46:56 4 parts 18:47:00 ok. 18:47:10 main part, 2 ping tables and devices attached 18:47:17 how many rows in cm_ping_list for eacsh query? 18:47:25 I think you need a query_map table. 18:47:26 5 but can be any 18:47:37 or something. 18:47:52 create table cm_pings ( 18:48:02 incident_id integer 18:48:13 ping_val integer 18:48:15 ) 18:48:21 yeah a query table. with a unique id. then insert into cm_pings (ping_seq, query_id, etc...) 18:48:40 right 18:48:41 into into cmts_pings (cmts_seq, query_id) 18:48:56 do you really need ids for each ping? 18:48:56 foreach (ping_in_list) 18:48:58 insert into 18:49:02 or just a fk? 18:49:10 fk I guess 18:49:25 Unless you need to identify an individual ping. 18:49:32 no 18:49:36 I am definitely not the expert here. 18:49:49 you're helping me 18:49:52 that's all that matters 18:50:12 Ok. query table should have what? query_id, user_who_ran_query_id, query_time, etc...? 18:50:22 pretty much 18:50:37 oh yeah modem_id... otherwise its pointless :) 18:50:53 right 18:52:23 do I even need a pl/sql function to insert pings? 18:54:35 no, its just good style. To abstract it in case the data model ever changes. Just you can just use a tcl proc to abstract it, or just write the query right in. 18:55:12 I vote for write the queries in, then take em out later if you have to. easier to test. 18:55:33 ok 18:57:35 whoa 18:58:25 my table like doesn't exist 18:58:35 that will slow you down... 18:58:55 HOST_NODE_MAP 18:58:55 IMAGES 18:58:55 JAVA$CLASS$MD5$TABLE 18:59:11 whats that? 18:59:18 my missing "INCIDENTS" table 18:59:23 aha. 18:59:36 did you call it something else like snmp_incidents? 18:59:46 good point 18:59:48 :) 19:01:08 hmm 19:01:45 so I Don't need to have cm_ping_id and cmts_ping id or I do? 19:01:51 in the query table that is 19:01:57 chump has quit 19:02:17 no. 19:02:24 just the query_id in the other table. 19:02:37 ok 19:03:09 gotta alter my table then 19:03:13 just a foreign_key constraint (query_id references snmp_queries) or whatver. 19:03:21 ok 19:04:59 chump has joined #openacs 19:05:34 how do I remove a not null in oracle? 19:05:50 no idea. 19:06:00 heh 19:06:18 drop constrainst constraint_name on table_name? 19:06:29 unless its part of alter table. 19:07:08 I only see alter table tablename add tablename constraintname definition 19:07:18 no drop constraint 19:07:21 in postgresql 19:09:10 hmm 19:17:29 anyone know how to use the tree_level function in OACS4? 19:18:02 do references cascadE? 19:19:37 no idea. in fact thinking about it is giving me a headache 19:19:38 :) 19:20:24 yes. I figured it out. 19:20:39 good job 19:20:40 :) 19:21:46 ok 19:21:49 I got my tables made 19:22:07 cool. 19:24:24 yeah 19:24:28 now what do I do with them :/ 19:25:13 put stuff in. 19:26:05 lol 19:26:10 easier said than done 19:27:05 cool drop script is done! 19:29:22 ok 19:29:26 I got some questions for you 19:29:31 mutt 19:29:33 oops 19:29:38 heh 19:29:46 I am no mutt! 19:29:48 * Spork bites dave 19:30:11 k 19:30:15 ok 19:30:22 I have a bunch of variables 19:30:27 var1 var2 var3 19:30:38 I'm writing the proc to do the db transaction 19:30:46 Should I be passing a list of those or one by one? 19:30:49 or it doesn't matter? 19:32:05 nkd has joined #openacs 19:33:23 to the proc? 19:33:42 use a list and then take them apart in the proc before you call db_transaction I think. 19:33:47 hi nkd. 19:33:56 nah 19:34:01 I finally finished the drop-script and fixing my screw ups. 19:34:05 it's more work to edit if one thing changes 19:34:40 send a list. That way you can do foreach list_of_pings or whatever in case the number of pings changes. 19:34:41 ok question 19:34:43 ok not. 19:34:55 right, for pings that makes sense for regular vars not yet 19:34:59 so now I really am going to work on search for static pages. 19:35:05 dave 19:35:14 oh yeah. you can just send string list string string stirng etc... 19:35:18 hi davb 19:35:20 hi guys 19:35:25 when I call snmp_incidents.new(--) 19:35:37 the new function has some things it fills form openacs 19:35:43 and some it should take as params 19:35:49 how does it know which one is a parameter? 19:35:51 ok davb, i will be online. 19:36:25 huh? 19:36:34 bind variables?? 19:38:12 you still have my create script? 19:38:38 uh no.. i deleted it. you can send it again. 19:38:49 :/ 19:39:20 sent 19:39:54 nkd this is correct: "However, if your object type uses the content repository then you 19:39:54 should make sure that your object type is a subclass of the 19:39:54 "content_revision" class. You should also make sure all content is 19:39:54 created using that subclass, rather than simply create content with 19:39:54 the "content_revision" type. 19:40:25 but I think this is incorrect: Whenever you call content_item__new, call it with 19:40:25 'content_revision' as the item_subtype and 'your_content_type' as 19:40:25 the content_type. 19:42:03 well we will have to ask about that, but I think he's right 19:42:12 s/ask/ask Dan 19:42:30 Ok. 19:42:30 * talli is back 19:42:42 All I know is static_pages is working now. 19:42:49 :) 19:42:53 :) 19:42:59 Dave, get the mail? 19:43:08 hi talli 19:43:17 davb: are you intersted in helping to build the new openacs.org? if so, we would be happy to incorporate your elbow grease 19:43:21 hi talli 19:43:34 talli: uh sure...I don't have anything else to do... 19:43:54 nkd: i spoke with davehill and luke, and we need to do some data migration before we can provide you with those scripts 19:44:03 butt it shouldn't be hard once we've moved that stuff 19:44:05 talli: Sure. I don't mind helping out. Will you need the category stuff I am working on for it? 19:44:16 np, let me know when you are ready 19:44:23 davb: great. this may be a cool opportunity to push ETP in a couple of new directions if you are intersted 19:44:36 great. 19:44:43 i think we definitely can use categories for ETP, and maybe build some new templates too. 19:44:49 talli: got my message earlier about wf 19:44:50 Cool. 19:45:08 I really have to finish up static_pages so I can hand it off to Don to assign to someone else. :) 19:45:09 Luke also mentioned he's been doing a lot of thinking about photos and ETP as well and has some cool ideas for that 19:45:22 nkd: yeah, i got your message and responded to it with some lines 19:45:24 did you see that? 19:45:29 nope 19:45:43 maybe it was after i left 19:46:22 is it possible to copy stuff out of an IRC window? 19:46:39 sure 19:46:43 how? 19:46:53 copy/paste :) 19:46:55 my highlight doesn't persist 19:47:13 ok, now it works :) 19:49:00 its a UNIX copy. it copies when you highlight (took me a while to figure it out) 19:49:00 lol 19:49:00 Dave get the email yet? 19:49:00 Now I try to do that all over in Windows and go "how come it didn;t copy?) 19:49:00 probably. 19:49:00 I do the same thing 19:49:00 exactly what happened to me :) 19:49:00 Dave...look at the package 19:49:00 ok. what am I looking for? 19:49:00 look at the bottom at the body 19:49:08 my understanding is that incident_id is generated from acs_Objects 19:49:17 yes. you do acs_object__new 19:49:18 most other variables I have to supply myself 19:49:37 how does it know to stick them into the right spots? 19:50:03 I just call snmp_incident.new( mac_address,incident_date,comments,problem_id,cm_ip,cmts_ip) for example? 19:50:04 like this snmp_incident.new( :tclvarname=>parameter_name, etc) 19:50:11 oh 19:50:39 they are named. You can leave out the default ones or put them in any order. Although I am pretty sure it works if you do it the other way without names also. 19:51:11 is it :$mac_address 19:51:12 see how you call acs_object.new in your function. Same thing. 19:51:15 or just :mac_address 19:51:38 :mac_address for bind variables. 19:51:46 what are bind variables? 19:51:50 I don't have any i don't think 19:52:01 Just use them and don't worry about it. 19:52:06 thats what I do. 19:52:22 I still don't foloow 19:52:44 :mac_address is a bind variable that gets its value from the tcl variablae mac_address 19:53:00 the Oracle driver quotes it and makes sure its safe to insert into the db. 19:53:17 ok 19:53:29 how about me getting sysdate into one of the columns? 19:53:53 snmp_incident.new( 19:54:12 snmp_incident.new( 19:54:19 :mac_address => mac_address, 19:54:26 :incident_date => sysdate 19:54:28 ); 19:54:28 ? 19:55:58 sysdate() i think 19:56:07 you got it backwards though 19:56:16 ? 19:56:20 sysdate() => incident_date, 19:56:24 ah 19:56:40 what happened to : 19:58:52 davb has quit 20:00:39 davb has joined #openacs 20:00:43 wb 20:04:17 ok I don't get it 20:04:27 book explains it not well 20:07:22 so the thing on the left is the destination and the one on the right is the source? 20:09:11 no idea. 20:09:23 heh 20:09:33 What about locking tables and stuff am I going to have to do this? 20:09:45 Vinods stuff is just way over my head 20:13:56 vinod has joined #openacs 20:14:15 hi vinod 20:14:28 hey nkd! 20:14:46 spork, what were you saying? :) 20:15:44 Spork: woah! Oracle takes care of that MVCC 20:15:48 hi vinod. 20:15:54 I finally fixed static-pages. 20:16:00 cool! 20:16:04 You were right, but I had a bunch more bugs in there. 20:16:20 those bugs like to hang out in groups :-) 20:17:38 * rbm belches 20:17:46 So vinod, I hear you want to take over maintenance on the static-pages package :) 20:18:52 * davb hopes this rumor spreads... 20:19:10 just sent mail to Don :) 20:19:13 uhh... yeah... sure... send all email about that to my new email address 20:19:19 billg@microsoft.com 20:19:57 * vinod dives into the internet to intercept nkd's message 20:20:05 :) 20:20:55 can I bug you a bit vinod? 20:21:39 sure, gotta run in a bit, but I'll try 20:22:02 how do I stuff variables into my database? 20:22:10 that's my "broad" question 20:22:54 I have a pl/sql proc that does it 20:23:01 I just wanna know how to i run it 20:23:28 what have you tried? 20:24:00 I was thinking along the lines of this: 20:24:03 snmp_incident.new( 20:24:08 mac_address => mac_address, 20:24:14 sysdate() => incident_date, 20:24:19 comments => comments, 20:24:20 .... 20:24:22 ); 20:25:08 almost... except it should be: parm => value (so incident_date => sysdate) 20:25:18 s/parm/param 20:26:03 also comments => :comments 20:26:22 how do you figure? 20:26:30 nkd: right 20:26:52 docwolf has joined #openacs 20:26:58 hi docwolf 20:26:58 hi docwolf 20:27:04 Spork: figure what? the :comments part? 20:27:04 Hi Everybody! 20:27:08 So them mac_Address should be mac_address => :mac_address 20:27:09 ? 20:27:14 hey docwolf 20:27:18 hey docwolf 20:27:18 Spork: correct 20:27:21 spork:right 20:27:22 ok 20:28:58 so why would you use $var sometimes? 20:29:11 bind variables are better 20:29:19 * ola wonders if there exists a file where he can read the boot messages. 20:29:33 if you used $comments, it would work, but like nkd says, bind variables are better 20:29:46 ok 20:30:00 ola: /var/log/messages? 20:30:05 vinod 20:30:13 chump: http://philip.greenspun.com/teaching/manuals/db-api/ 20:30:14 Not understood: http://philip.greenspun.com/teaching/manuals/db-api/ 20:30:33 chump: http://philip.greenspun.com/teaching/manuals/db-api/ 20:30:33 Not understood: http://philip.greenspun.com/teaching/manuals/db-api/ 20:30:35 nkd just type the URL starting with http 20:30:35 now, if I have incident_id which is calculated from acs_objects I don't need to pass that in to the call right? 20:30:43 sorry 20:30:48 http://philip.greenspun.com/teaching/manuals/db-api/ 20:30:48 B: http://philip.greenspun.com/teaching/manuals/db-api/ from nkd 20:30:56 np for me. 20:31:23 B:|Brief Introduction to Database Access using AOLServer and the ACS 20:31:23 titled item B 20:31:57 Spork: correct. 20:32:06 Now I understand: "because Oracle will parse the query before interpolating the variables). " 20:32:13 graszew has joined #openacs 20:32:32 if you call acs_object.new() without providing an object_id, it will generate one and return it to you. 20:32:33 k 20:32:36 WHY is that sentence not anywhere in the aD docs?? 20:32:49 davb: thanks! 20:32:52 * davb goes home. 20:32:54 ola np 20:33:56 bye dave 20:34:34 vinod, how do I catch the incident_id it generated for me? 20:34:45 davb has quit 20:34:46 set id = snmp_incident.new(...)? 20:35:04 you're doing this from tcl, right? 20:35:09 yeah 20:35:12 set id [snmp ... 20:35:12 ok 20:35:26 right..my mistake nkd :) 20:35:32 np 20:35:51 set id [db_exec_plsql blah ":1 = snmp_incident.new()"] 20:36:10 not sure if :1 is needed 20:36:27 nkd: thought it was, but i'm not certain 20:36:43 ok 20:36:46 i'll try it both ways 20:37:29 try this it will work: set id [db_exec_plsql blah ":snmp_incident.new()"] 20:37:42 s/:snmp_incident.new/snmp_incident.new 20:40:15 adler has joined #openacs 20:41:18 are xql files supposed to go in the www dir? 20:41:31 some of them yes 20:41:33 they're sql queries 20:42:03 which ones belong in the www dir? 20:42:07 xql files in the www directory include sql queries that are needed by the tcl pages 20:43:08 ok 20:43:18 nkd/vinod: 20:43:20 set incident_id [db_exec_plsql insert_info " 20:43:20 snmp_incident.new( 20:43:40 Spork has quit 20:43:54 hehe 20:44:20 Psychephylax has joined #openacs 20:44:26 back 20:44:26 looks like spork was bugged off 20:45:33 set incident_id [db_exec_plsql insert_info " 20:45:33 snmp_incident.new( 20:45:33 mac_address => :mac_address, 20:45:33 incident_date=>sysdate() 20:45:33 comments => :comments, 20:45:33 problem_id => :problem_id, 20:45:35 cm_ip =>:cm_ip, 20:45:37 cmts_ip=>:cmts_ip, 20:45:39 cmts_dns=>:cmts_dns, 20:45:41 cmts_ds_if=>:cmts_ds_if, 20:45:43 cmts_us_if=>:cmts_dns, 20:45:45 cmts_rcv_pwr=>:cmts_rcv_pwr, 20:45:47 cm_status=>:cm_status, 20:45:49 cm_up_percent=>:cm_up_percent, 20:45:51 cm_conn_dev=>:cm_conn_dev, 20:45:53 cm_uptime=>:cm_uptime, 20:45:55 cm_hw_sw_ver=>:cm_hw_sw_ver, 20:45:57 cm_dhcp_server=>:cm_dhcp_server, 20:45:59 cm_tftp_server=>:cm_tftp_server, 20:46:01 cm_rcv_freq=>:cm_rcv_freq, 20:46:03 cm_c_to_n_ratio=>:cm_c_to_n_ratio, 20:46:05 cm_max_ds=>:cm_max_ds, 20:46:07 cm_us_freq=>:cm_us_freq, 20:46:09 cm_trans_pwr=>:cm_trans_pwr, 20:46:11 cm_max_us_band=>:cm_max_us_band, 20:46:13 cm_max_us_burst=>:cm_max_us_burst 20:46:15 ); 20:46:17 "]how's that? 20:47:51 change 'sysdate()' to 'sysdate' and put a comma after it. otherwise looks ok 20:48:08 ok 20:48:27 I could even leave it off 20:48:28 right? 20:48:51 leave what off? 20:48:51 only if your table assigns a default value 20:48:55 it does 20:48:57 of sysdate 20:48:58 :) 20:49:07 ok, you can leave it out 20:50:13 ok 20:50:23 and where is the cgi-bin equivalent in aolserver? 20:50:35 Psychephylax: you set that up on the nsd.tcl file 20:50:43 i don't think so 20:50:44 just like on A-pachy 20:50:49 ah ok 20:50:49 s/pachy/patchy/ 20:53:16 vinod 20:53:33 you know if the ns_execplsql thing is a transaction or not? 20:53:49 you don't need a cgi-bin directory 20:54:03 just put it in a tcl page and visit it 20:56:39 Psychephylax: i think everything within a pl/sql proc is inside a transaction. if you want multiple db_exec_plsql's to be in 1 transaction, you need to surround it with db_transaction (I think!) 20:57:04 right 21:00:13 oh boy! 21:00:28 ora8.c:3930:ora_tcl_command: error in `OCIStmtExecute ()': ORA-00900: invalid SQL statement 21:01:10 Psychephylax: send it by email. I'll take a look. 21:01:21 send what? lol 21:01:56 whatever you are trying to submit to oracle 21:02:23 the sql query, db_exec_plsql statement 21:06:01 ok 21:06:05 what's the email address? 21:08:38 just reply to the poem I have sent you last night 21:11:04 docwolf has quit 21:12:36 ok 21:12:55 sent 21:13:21 got it 21:17:28 ok 21:18:10 same problem 21:19:19 have you removed this: incident_date => sysdate() 21:19:26 if not it needs a comma 21:19:26 yeah 21:19:59 did you set the variables? 21:20:15 e.g. comments,problem_id,... 21:20:42 yeah 21:20:54 let me see something 21:25:45 ok try this: 21:26:12 i think it should be [] and no spaces 21:26:15 begin :1 := snmp.... ; end; 21:26:31 where? 21:26:53 set incident_id [db_exec_plsql insert_info " 21:27:12 begin :1 = snmp_incident.new(...); end;"] 21:28:18 I think it should be := 21:28:24 ora8.c:3568:ora_tcl_command: error in `OCIStmtExecute ()': ORA-06550: line 1, column 10: 21:28:24 PLS-00103: Encountered the symbol "=" when expecting one of the following: 21:28:26 := . ( @ % ; indicator 21:28:42 right 21:28:45 oh 21:28:47 wait, no end either 21:28:57 adler has quit 21:30:13 ora8.c:3568:ora_tcl_command: error in `OCIStmtExecute ()': ORA-06550: line 1, column 13: 21:30:14 PLS-00905: object MYOPENACS.SNMP_INCIDENT is invalid 21:33:11 * Psychephylax is confused 21:33:19 give me a sec 21:33:24 lol ok 21:33:30 one mississippi 21:33:32 time is up! 21:33:34 ding ding ding 21:33:43 this is an error in snmp_incident 21:34:42 ok 21:34:46 * Psychephylax loads that up into emacs 21:34:57 hmmm 21:37:10 aha 21:37:11 I know 21:37:21 I think I didn't rerun the creation scripts 21:41:24 sure 21:41:27 I'm working on this 21:41:34 my create/drop is messed up again 21:41:37 with the changes I made 21:47:52 ok 21:47:54 fixed 21:47:55 but no 21:48:25 what's the problem? 21:48:43 ora8.c:3568:ora_tcl_command: error in `OCIStmtExecute ()': ORA-06502: PL/SQL: numeric or value error: character to number conversion error 21:49:04 i must have something that's whacky :) 21:49:31 count 10 missisipis :) 21:50:07 heh 21:50:11 got a question 21:50:20 if incident_id is calculated from acs_objects 21:50:26 is the default still "NULL"? 21:50:28 this doesn't look very good: object_id => incident_id, 21:50:36 yes 21:50:40 remove that line 21:51:22 well, what's that doing? 21:51:30 which? 21:51:43 the one you told me to remove 21:51:56 I was under the impression that it took the stuff and assigned it the id of the object 21:52:54 acs_object.new will create your object and return the object_id. Then you store it in v_content_id which is returned and stored into incident_id (in the tcl page). 21:53:02 oh 21:53:06 so I don't need the line 21:53:11 no 21:53:46 ? 21:56:26 what type of an error is this so I have something to look for 21:56:40 which? 21:57:36 the one that I'm getting now 21:57:47 character to number conversion error? 21:58:15 do you still get that? (have you removed the line and reload) 21:58:30 which line? 21:58:44 the object_id => incident_id, one? 21:58:52 object_id => incident_id 21:59:02 i commented it out with -- 21:59:26 try removing it 21:59:27 vinod has quit 21:59:35 ok 21:59:42 and reload 22:00:01 reload:drop/create 22:00:34 yup, did that 22:00:39 still get the error :/ 22:00:43 is it working now? 22:01:01 no 22:01:04 same exact error 22:01:25 could you send me your table definition 22:01:38 i'll send you the whole file and the page 22:01:48 ok, that's better 22:03:47 sent 22:05:17 you forgot to remove the space 22:05:28 s/remove/insert 22:06:49 where? 22:07:09 :=acs_object.new 22:07:28 oh 22:07:33 I moved the part on the right 22:07:34 hehe 22:08:09 but that's not the problem :/ 22:08:18 I'm thinking it might have to do with one of these 22:08:28 where I have number (10) 22:08:34 does that account for real numbers 22:08:44 and also, what happens if the number I insert is longer than 10 22:09:49 I don't think that's it but try to remove the insert so that you can isolate the problem 22:10:10 remove insert? 22:10:27 from snmp_incident 22:11:11 oh 22:11:47 I'm commenting it out :P 22:13:07 question 22:13:16 yes 22:13:17 do I have to restart Aolserver for the affect to take place? 22:13:28 no 22:13:32 just making sure 22:13:38 ok, I'm still getting the same problem 22:13:42 with insert commented out 22:14:01 just drop/create after you change snmp_incident 22:14:18 i did that... 22:15:33 i wish mark was here 22:15:37 he's the oracle guru 22:16:24 bah 22:16:39 hang on 22:18:36 hello? 22:18:43 who's there? 22:18:47 not I 22:18:52 me either 22:19:01 * Psychephylax hides in a floppy drive 22:19:24 nkd ? 22:19:30 here 22:19:40 BitchX msg flood protection kicked in 22:19:44 I got 3 lines and that's it 22:19:50 oh 22:20:35 I opened a query so you can try again if you want 22:21:20 got it 22:21:22 ? 22:21:26 got what? 22:21:31 nope :( 22:21:49 just e-mail it then 22:23:32 ? 22:23:35 * Psychephylax pokes nkd 22:23:51 here 22:24:02 You gonna e-mail it? 22:24:15 or just describe to me where the problem is 22:24:30 sending email 22:24:33 talli has quit 22:24:37 nkd has quit 22:24:52 nkd_ has joined #openacs 22:25:02 wb 22:25:31 sending email 22:25:52 NKD has joined #OpenACS 22:25:57 ok 22:26:03 Dont take my nick please nkd_ 22:26:08 I hate having to kick your ass 22:26:09 kthx 22:26:11 NKD has left #OpenACS 22:26:17 ? 22:26:50 did I miss something? 22:26:58 who's that 22:26:59 ? 22:27:07 apparently nkd was a nick that was registered 22:27:12 heh 22:27:15 what's that 22:27:15 ? 22:27:18 ok, how do i register a nick 22:27:30 You can register a nick with nickserv. /msg nickserv help 22:27:40 brb 22:27:43 nkd_ has left #openacs 22:28:02 My nick, for example, is registered. I need to provide a password everytime I connect to be able to use it. 22:28:11 k 22:28:16 If somebody takes it while I'm gone, when I come back, I can kick that person out. 22:28:17 I know about *servs 22:28:21 we have them on DalNet 22:28:24 k2pts has joined #openacs 22:28:33 nkd 22:28:35 still no file 22:28:43 haven't send it yet 22:28:45 oh 22:28:46 heh 22:29:05 oh 22:29:09 stupid blockage 22:34:08 any ideas? 22:36:34 * Psychephylax wonders if everyone went to a party without him 22:37:08 * rbm hasn't been to a party in a long time. 22:37:27 we should have one =) 22:37:42 k2pts you still with the living? 22:39:26 oh ok 22:43:06 heh 22:43:23 k2pts has left #openacs 22:43:45 k2pts has joined #openacs 22:44:48 hazmat has joined #openacs 22:44:59 hi hazmat 22:45:01 hi 22:45:10 hi folks 22:49:04 :) http://www.orafaq.com/error/ora-01722.htm 22:49:38 hmm 22:56:02 i think it's something to do with date maybe 22:56:19 oh crap 22:58:10 I bet you it's something like where I Have: set problem_id "1" should be set problem_id 1 22:59:40 not that's not it 23:02:12 ola has quit 23:04:15 hmm 23:04:17 maybe this is it 23:04:48 which? 23:07:14 i think one of my vars is not setting anymore and I don't know why 23:08:54 i'm going home shorty just fiddling with this now 23:08:55 talli has joined #openacs 23:08:59 hi talli 23:09:09 hey. just looking for vinod. 23:09:16 now i go away. bye bye 23:09:21 talli has quit 23:13:53 I'm not going to break my head over this on a friday night 23:13:55 I'm going home 23:14:07 I'm one of the few people left anyways 23:14:28 see ya guys later 23:14:37 * Psychephylax looks forward to sitting in traffic 23:15:52 bye Psychephylax 23:21:44 hazmat has quit 23:21:51 k2pts has left #openacs 23:29:33 graszew has quit 23:46:18 davb has joined #OpenACS 23:55:20 Wow: A live feed of: UCF Volleyball vs. Georgia St. AIM UCFKnightsports 23:55:25 I love the internet! 23:56:33 heh 23:57:58 crap. I can't find any streaming music. What good is bandwidth if you can't use it. 23:58:28 Of course, noone supports Linux. I need a windows box to use the players. 23:58:35 Or just buy more CDs.