02:08:13 loggy has joined #openacs 02:08:13 topic is: Welcome to the OpenACS Helpline | http://www.openacs.org/ 02:08:13 Users on #openacs: loggy rzolf davb ola shagster AaronSw rbm Psychephylax chump 02:08:13 This channel is logged: http://www.blogspace.com/openacs/chatlogs/ and blogged: http://www.thedesignexperience.org/openacs/ircblog 02:09:10 abbaJ has joined #openacs 02:09:47 rzolf has quit 05:40:45 rbm has quit 05:40:46 rbm has joined #openacs 06:33:55 davb has quit 06:54:36 rzolf has joined #openacs 07:13:41 rzolf has quit 08:45:16 jerryasher has joined #openacs 08:45:35 Hey ola, are you around? 08:51:11 yes, hi. 08:51:32 Was that you ten minutes ago poking around my blog module? 08:51:41 I'm looking at your blog. nice! 08:52:07 Yeah, I was just finishing debugging it, and you came through. 08:52:58 The plan for tomorrow is to build some templates for it and then to package it up. 08:53:16 cool. 08:53:26 Did you hear Tony Blair's speech today? 08:53:44 no. what did he say? 08:54:09 I've never really heard him speak before. Just the usual views in the U.S. that he 08:54:13 was pretty good friends with Bill. 08:54:27 But today he gave one of the best speeches I've ever heard 08:54:50 Good not just for its content (on the WTC attacks), but just a 08:55:06 wonderfully spoken speech. 08:55:20 I've been trying to find a link to a video of it but cannot. 08:55:46 you mean that lovely Oxford english...?:-) 08:56:01 Yes, that was certainly part of it, but not all of it. 08:56:21 GWB for instance speaks neither like a Texan, nor like a Yalie. 08:56:43 I always think GWB speaks like, a, uh, minister. 08:57:18 But the content and tenor of Blairs speech was right on the mark. 08:58:31 well, somethings going to happen soon, I just hope they don't overreact. 08:59:03 That was sort of what Blair was saying.... 08:59:26 I found a about two minutes of it over on MSNBC using Windows Media Player, but 08:59:49 the ten minutes or so I heard was great. A very good mix of 09:00:17 suggesting what should and should not be done, and why.... 09:00:26 (uh, as far as I was concerned.) 09:00:35 Anyway, certainly much much better than "wanted dead or alive" 09:02:33 Well, I gotta go and get up in 4 hours to take my girls to school, so I'll say goodnight. 09:02:46 And thanks for taking a look at the blogs. 09:02:50 bye. 09:02:59 I guess I'll hear it on the news today. I like the things I have herad lately from GWB, and US officials. try to make as many friends throughout the world as possible before action. 09:03:04 bye. 09:03:19 jerryasher has quit 10:55:42 ola has quit 10:56:33 ola has joined #openacs 11:37:19 rbm has quit 11:37:31 rbm has joined #openacs 11:37:47 shagster has quit 11:39:58 shagster has joined #openacs 12:35:43 davb has joined #OpenACS 12:39:42 good morning, davb. 13:16:24 markd2 has joined #openacs 13:18:15 Good morning/afternoon,etc 13:21:55 * markd2 waves 13:39:45 argh! 13:39:56 * markd2 unwaves 13:40:02 heh 13:40:19 The modifications I made to the CR have to be redone. No big deal. 13:42:25 heh 13:42:35 * markd2 is getting scolded by some wrens 13:42:47 there's two birds out here that are giving me and the cat the what-for 13:42:56 You are working outside? 13:43:12 * davb needs 802.11b and a new laptop with a working keyboard 13:43:35 yeah. We've got a nice little screene-enclosed porch 13:44:24 Neat. 13:44:35 * davb adds screened-porch to the list... 13:44:55 gah 13:45:01 I don't want to go to work 13:45:16 yes you do. 13:45:47 work is good 13:45:54 just think "infect the boss.. infect the boss" 13:46:00 Not with a slave driver who gets me sick for a boss :( 13:46:04 hmmm 13:46:07 Good idea mark 13:46:20 * Psychephylax searches for his bags of germinating germs 13:46:23 * markd2 suggests anthrax-leprosy-mu 13:46:29 hmmmmmm 13:46:50 * Psychephylax gives up his search for germinating germs and invests his efforts into obtaining anthrax 13:47:24 I think CD now has their albums 13:47:55 har har har 13:47:58 No cookie for you! 13:48:05 no cookie for me :-( 13:48:09 * Psychephylax is the cookie nazi 13:48:21 That seinfeld episode was on last night 13:49:04 ping dslreports.com 13:49:06 arg 13:49:26 25.987 ms 13:49:38 interesting 13:50:01 their site is down though 13:50:03 I broke it 13:50:39 * ola needs a new laptop (and wonders if dell's any good) 13:50:52 inspiron 400 in particular.. 13:50:58 inspiron 4000 in particular.. 13:51:33 yah 13:51:36 Dell makes good laptops 13:51:47 most enterprises use dell 13:51:48 they do? 13:51:52 cool 13:51:53 yah 13:52:11 I know of at least 2 corporations and 1 university :) 13:52:26 Symbol, Cablevision and my school all use Dell laptops and/or workstations 13:52:35 I know a couple folks with them - they're generally liked 13:52:41 save for one guy that has a lemon 13:52:41 yeah 13:53:17 i want a laptop but I'm poor 13:53:22 It would be nice to run Linux without problems 13:54:07 one of my classmates I think had a dell (possibly an ibm) and he ran Suse on it 13:54:10 any local Linux Users Groups around you? 13:54:28 they're generally a good source about what machines run which distributions well 13:54:36 heh 13:54:48 * markd2 is a big LUG fan 13:54:56 LUG? 13:54:59 a LUG-nut, as you might say 13:55:01 Linux Users Group 13:55:02 markd2: probably, i'll check. 13:55:03 Ah 13:55:07 choo! 13:55:10 moo? 13:55:20 how now brown cow 13:55:29 Mooooooooo!!! 13:55:39 Damn it 13:55:42 mü 13:55:45 I want my timestamps 13:56:07 I sent a roll of them to you in the past! didn't you get them then? 13:56:25 lemme guess, you used them all up next week 13:56:43 uh huh 13:57:56 :( 13:57:56 it time stamps your messages but not mine 14:00:58 Get a titanium! 14:04:08 TiBooks rule(tm) 14:04:25 hmmm? 14:04:34 or an IBM 14:04:58 of course, neither one of them is cheap 14:04:59 that would be awesome but sounds kind of expensive. 14:05:05 heh 14:05:34 * davb needs to run CAT5 to the porch... 14:06:17 off to work 14:06:24 happy infecting 14:29:00 * ola trips over CAT5 almost every time he's heading for the living room:-( 14:29:09 Apartment? 14:29:15 yes. 14:31:08 you live in a house? 14:31:27 Yeah. We bought it in June. All the network is in one room so far. 14:31:43 that's right - you've got the sprawling estate somewhere 14:31:50 haha! 14:32:00 davb's dude ranch 14:32:20 Not quite. Our neighbor has the rest of our backyard. Of course, someone else's house is in his. Interesting setup. 14:32:24 * ola looks up sprawling 14:32:42 OK Who wants to port the NEWS package? 14:32:46 :) 14:33:05 * davb thinks about doing it to avoid working on static-pages 14:33:34 ola: sprawling estate - large house on a big piece of land 14:33:50 shouldn't we use ETP instead of news? 14:34:11 markd2: ok. thanks! 14:34:13 mmm.. Eat This Page.... 14:34:43 I just read Luke's message on that subject. He said the news package is good because visitors can suggest items. ETP doesn't have that kind of function. 14:35:43 I hadn't thought of that. 14:36:09 Maybe like he said someone eventually will build a generic user-generated content module. 14:41:55 well 14:41:58 I have arrived at work 14:42:01 * davb discovers he needs two more internet connected machines for the kids... 14:42:17 If I need to back up my development files 14:42:25 do you guys recommend making a package out of it 14:42:40 it being my package files in /packages/snmp 14:42:47 or just moving the files to a different place 14:45:14 mmm...time for some coffee and a few of those chocolate balls I made yesterday... 14:45:29 heh 14:48:12 Do one of each. 14:49:29 one coffee and one chocolate ball.. ok. that will do. 14:49:33 heh 14:50:30 * davb thinks there should be a fine for sending unsubscribe messages to a list. 14:51:10 Thing is, in mutt I can see all the list instructions in the header. Outlook could offer those as hyperlinks in the message. 14:52:42 that would imply that MS would want to support existing internet conventions 15:01:17 heh 15:10:40 if you pass an empty string as the regexp to the tcl regexp command will it match everything? 15:12:05 * davb checks the docs 15:24:40 hmmm 15:24:50 db_string is an SQL bridge 15:25:04 but it says it returns the first column of the reult of the SQL query 15:25:07 what if it's an insert? 15:25:18 query != insert 15:25:26 so it should complain at you 15:26:10 ok 15:26:16 so how do I do inserts and updates? 15:26:22 db_dml 15:27:01 db_dml me_want_cookie "insert into blah (id, date, hoover) values (cookiesequence.nextval, sysdate, :some_bind_variable)" 15:27:04 or something like that 15:30:36 what's DML stand for 15:32:26 ok, I got a question: http://openacs.org/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=0002r2&topic_id=12&topic=OpenACS%204%2e0%20Design 15:32:39 data modeling langauge 15:32:40 look down right above Deletes the test user and group 15:32:43 e.g. insert and update 15:32:45 ah 15:33:13 He creates a new relation_id and creates a new relation 15:33:21 Can I use db_dml for that? 15:36:06 you can use db_exec_plsql for doing plsql procedure calls 15:36:11 there's a whole page on the db_* calls 15:36:25 go to /doc, 'kernel documentaton', then 'database api' 15:36:26 where at 15:36:30 k 15:40:18 interesting 15:41:44 so if i have $variable 15:41:55 I can use it in the db_dml like this :variable 15:41:58 very cool! 15:41:58 yep 15:45:14 I have a databases midterm tomorrow 15:45:35 So I wanna thank you for passing on some of the l33t Or4cl3 knowledge on me 15:49:09 sure thing 15:59:13 * Psychephylax gives Mark a cookie 16:00:14 I gotta figure out how to break this pl/sql procedure into a smaller piece 16:00:35 I don't need the first 2 blocks for creating a new group and user I just need to take 2 existing ones and create a relation between them 16:01:27 aha 16:09:19 it does not appear to have a db_exec_plsql 16:09:29 maybe it's db_execplsql 16:10:15 no 16:10:18 you have it right 16:10:29 but you have to explicitly search for it 16:10:47 so my call would be: 16:10:54 (bear with me while i type it out) 16:11:40 db_exec_plsql add_to_group "declare 16:11:47 v_rel_id : integer 16:11:50 begin 16:12:07 v_rel_id := membership_rel : new ( 16:12:21 object_id_one => $group_id, 16:12:31 object_id_two => $person_id 16:12:33 ); 16:12:35 end; 16:12:44 something like that, yeah 16:12:49 " 16:12:56 don't know if you need the ';' at the end of the end 16:13:04 ok 16:13:08 well, I'm gonna try tat 16:13:13 let's hope I don't break many things 16:14:49 it is going to expand the $group_id and $person_id right? 16:14:53 or do I have to bind them? 16:15:29 since you have it in double-quotes, the variables will get expanded 16:15:44 Psychephylax: it will expand them, but it is safer to use bind variables. 16:15:46 ok 16:15:52 k 16:15:57 i'll try to bind them 16:16:13 so it would be single quotes if i"m binding? 16:16:19 doesn't matter 16:16:28 you can use binds with double quotes or curly braces 16:16:56 ok 16:17:13 Does whitespace get ignored? 16:17:20 yep 16:17:24 ok good 16:17:25 unless it's in a ' string' 16:17:30 cuz I like making my things look purty 16:18:45 so if I'm binding object_id_one => $blah becomes object_id_one => :blah 16:18:58 and on the end I add a bind paramenter? 16:19:06 yep 16:19:18 if it's just variables, you don't need any special parameters 16:19:27 it'll pick up the value of $blah from the calling environment 16:19:52 oh so I can do just :blah and it will search for a $blah 16:20:15 yep 16:20:49 Wow, that McMaster University I talked about yesterday has absolutely no information about their academdic progeams on their web site. 16:21:07 heh 16:21:08 What's McMonster University? 16:21:09 McMaster 16:21:10 er, McMaster 16:21:26 * markd2 thanks Thigh McMaster 16:21:28 sounds more like McMonster to me if they have no info o the webpage 16:21:37 mmmm 16:21:39 McDonalds 16:23:19 doh 16:24:05 invalid positional variable `:', valid values start with 1 16:24:06 while executing 16:24:08 "ns_ora dml nsdb0 { 16:24:40 stupid ; 16:24:56 hmmm 16:25:25 doh ; wsn't it 16:26:34 This is my code: 16:26:36 db_exec_plsql add_to_group " 16:26:36 16:26:36 declare 16:26:36 v_rel_id : integer; 16:26:37 begin 16:26:39 v_rel_id := membership_rel.new( 16:26:41 object_id_one => :group_id, 16:26:43 object_id_two => :user_id 16:26:45 ) 16:26:47 end; 16:26:49 /" 16:26:56 it craps out on the object_id_two => :user_id from my understanding of the error message 16:27:26 you don't need the "/" either 16:27:31 oh 16:27:33 that's a sqlplusism 16:27:41 "execute the sql that's in the buffer" 16:27:47 it's in the sql files though 16:28:30 right - since the sql files are consumed by.... 16:28:32 sqlplus! 16:28:42 oh 16:28:50 * Psychephylax is a n00b!!! 16:28:54 heh 16:29:05 is this right? v_rel_id : integer 16:29:23 no 16:29:23 lol 16:29:25 <--dummy 16:29:53 Psychephylax => dummy; 16:29:57 :) 16:30:46 Or like mr pascal would do it 16:30:53 Psychephylax := dummy; 16:31:17 muahaha 16:31:20 oracle errors 16:31:20 ! 16:31:24 aha, see I am not an oracle expert. 16:31:49 it's saying something about an end 16:32:09 Encountered the symbol "END" when expecting one of the following: 16:32:30 The symbol ";" was substituted for "END" to continue. 16:32:37 you probably need a semicolon after the membership_rel.new function 16:33:07 jeez you're a genius! 16:33:12 * Psychephylax gives Mark a cookie 16:33:43 YES!!!!! 16:33:46 It works! 16:33:48 Eureka! 16:35:14 woo hoo!! 16:36:10 indeedy! 16:37:06 now I can add lusers 16:53:08 one coffee and one chocolate ball.. ok. that will do. 16:53:17 sorry 16:53:37 what a tease 16:53:43 hehh 16:54:55 wow, poor site design on the javascript menu: http://www.abit.com.tw/ 16:55:04 Hah 16:55:07 chocolate balls 16:55:13 I want rumballs instead 16:55:15 much tastier 16:56:00 God I'm dumb 16:56:07 I can't even remember what the letter before W is 16:56:26 T sounds about right 16:57:20 U 16:57:28 oh 16:57:29 heh 16:57:36 Oracle problems 16:57:59 V 16:58:11 ok:-) 16:58:17 forgivable :-) 16:58:31 thanks. 16:58:47 wow I was way off 16:58:57 so " allow for variable expansion 16:59:00 but ' do not? 17:01:31 I know " does. I don't use ' ' quotes in tcl 17:01:36 so I can't ocmment 17:01:39 or comment either 17:01:53 ok then how would I do a query 17:02:02 Because Oracle is complaining when I do a = Manager 17:02:07 it wants a = 'Manager' 17:03:42 I think I can do '$blah' 17:03:45 * Psychephylax tests his theory out 17:05:03 doh 17:05:18 it expands in the console properly but doesn't in the script 17:05:34 the single quotes in oracle are in a different world than the quotes in tcl 17:05:50 so yeah, in that case '$blah' does expand the variable 17:05:57 if you don't want variable expansion, use curly braces 17:06:09 i do want variable expansion 17:06:31 I want the query to be dependent on $user_type which stores either Manager or Supervisor 17:06:35 in that case single quotes inside of your double-quoted string 17:06:40 I did 17:06:48 sounds like you're golden 17:06:49 "db_string group_id "select group_id from groups where group_name = '$user_type'"" 17:07:25 presuming the real command doesn't have double-quotes aound it, that should be ok 17:07:32 e.g. db_string instead of "db_string 17:07:41 I don't have " around db_string 17:07:44 Or just use :user_type and the bind variable will quote it for you. 17:07:44 I have [ ] 17:07:45 ok 17:07:55 oh good idea dave 17:07:57 the paste into IRC had "db_string 17:08:23 yeah 17:08:27 that was from the error message 17:08:37 Dave, it didn't work for the same reason :( 17:08:55 this is the command I'm using: 17:08:58 set group_id [db_string group_id "select group_id from groups where group_name = :user_type"] 17:09:11 really? Weird. Did it log the actual query string after it was expaneded? 17:09:17 I have tried '$user_type' instead of :user_type and plain old $user_type 17:09:20 and it bombs 17:09:41 I think it is a different error. '$user_type' or :user_type should be OK. 17:09:53 this is the error with the string above: 17:09:55 "db_string group_id "select group_id from groups where group_name = :user_type"" 17:10:07 Selection did not return a value, and no default was provided 17:10:07 while executing 17:10:29 What is the contents of $user_type 17:10:37 no it's not :) 17:10:42 oh 17:10:43 doh 17:10:46 * Psychephylax misreads 17:10:54 user_type is either Manager or Supervisor 17:11:24 No I mean what is it when you run that query. Put in a ns_log notice "$user_type" to see what is really is or turn VERBOSE on in the db pools. 17:11:30 if I leave everything off and try $user_type the query gets expanded to the right thing but oracle expects ' ' around the keyword to look for 17:12:39 I guess I could try doing this set user_type '$user_type' 17:13:09 that will just return '$user_type' to the database. 17:13:28 why 17:13:46 isn't it going to expand it to this: set user_type 'Manager' 17:13:54 and then the user_type should contain 'Manager' 17:14:01 instead of Manager? 17:14:47 Oh maybe. Anyway you are confusing me. 17:15:10 brb 17:15:11