00:35:07 [GlobalNotice] Hi all: ajh mentions that there are 9 days left until Ottawa Linux Symposium this year and spaces remain.... ( http://www.linuxsymposium.org ).... this is not a trade show but more of an intense technical/social get-together. andrew describes it as "a technology centered marketing-free grass roots event". it's a pure community event. if you're interested, you should probably book in the next couple of days, so take a look. thanks. 00:37:54 MadDucks (user66@c1536889-a.cheyne1.wy.home.com) has joined #openacs 00:38:15 kkennedy (kkennedy@dsl-64-192-97-37.telocity.com) has joined #openacs 00:42:21 rbm__ (roberto@slxwy.dorms.usu.edu) has joined #openacs 00:43:36 Hey Roberto 00:44:00 rbm_ has quit (Ping timeout for rbm_[slxwy.dorms.usu.edu]) 00:51:02 Disconnected from irc.openprojects.net (ERROR :Closing Link: loggy[v123-1.ARSDigita.seg.NET] by benford.openprojects.net (Ping timeout for loggy[v123-1.ARSDigita.seg.NET])) 00:51:02 Attempting to reconnect 00:51:10 loggy (openacs-lo@v123-1.ARSDigita.seg.NET) has joined #openacs 00:51:10 topic is: Welcome to the OpenACS helpline. http://openacs.org 00:51:10 Users on #openacs: loggy rbm__ kkennedy MadDucks shagster AaronSw GEM 00:51:10 This channel is logged: http://www.blogspace.com/openacs/chatlogs/ 01:49:28 vinod (vinod@d171.dial-8.cmb.ma.ultra.net) has joined #openacs 01:56:02 Grax (grax@cx447399-d.omhaw1.ne.home.com) has joined #openacs 02:19:17 kkennedy has quit (Read error to kkennedy[dsl-64-192-97-37.telocity.com]: Connection reset by peer) 02:19:20 kkennedy (kkennedy@dsl-64-192-97-37.telocity.com) has joined #openacs 02:23:27 gilbertw (gilwong@adsl-63-197-20-211.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) has joined #openacs 03:02:42 tdxdave (tdxdave@ip-204-97-175-41.dsl.logical.net) has joined #OpenACS 03:02:51 Hi everyone. 03:04:08 hi dave! 03:06:07 hi 03:08:48 what's new? 03:09:21 Working on my house. I couldn't port all day because SSHD is not started with the new version I installed. (its working now.) 03:10:10 what are you doing to the house? 03:10:48 OT: Everything. I was doing a little work, and now I have to run two new electrical lines back to the circuit panel. 03:11:11 wow - sounds impressive 03:11:38 the extent of my home improvement skills is pluggin in the stereo 03:12:03 There are three wires, its not too bad. Just don't touch both of them at the same time! 03:12:20 is that the voice of experience? 03:12:32 No haven't tried it myself yet. 03:12:36 haha 03:15:02 i'm doing some client work - they're using 'lasso' which is a PITA to debug 03:15:51 I considered trying it a long time ago before I read "the book". 03:18:16 and if lasso isn't bad enough, you have to work with a braindead database, filemaker pro 03:18:33 OH goody! 03:18:50 Actually I need to hack together a soution for accessing a remote filemaker databse related to this move. 03:21:34 Gotta go. Good night (morning) (afternoon) 03:21:37 tdxdave has quit (I'm too lame to make a quit message) 03:38:29 kkennedy has quit (I'm too lame to make a quit message) 03:57:29 just saw an ad for arsdigita on TV! 03:57:51 it was on WGBH - the PBS station here in Boston 03:58:15 not really an ad, but a 'this program was brought to you by aD' with a pic of their logo on the screen 04:02:25 heh, cool 04:04:14 'makers of e-business solutions' 04:05:13 think it would be more effective with a picture of alex :) 04:05:26 i think so 04:05:35 ArsDigita: The company with cute dogs 04:05:46 * AaronSw wonders if they fired Alex too... 04:05:49 haha - see, we should be in marketing 04:06:04 oh - that would be cruel 04:06:29 hopefully, he bargained for a good severance package 04:07:27 :-) 04:50:40 gilbertw has quit () 05:05:55 vinod has quit (goodnight!) 05:44:44 Grax has quit ([x]chat) 05:45:23 abbaJ (jabba@user-33qs21m.dsl.mindspring.com) has joined #openacs 05:49:27 abbaJ has quit (Client Exiting) 05:49:32 abbaJ (jabba@user-33qs21m.dsl.mindspring.com) has joined #openacs 05:50:09 abbaJ has quit (Client Exiting) 05:50:15 abbaJ (jabba@user-33qs21m.dsl.mindspring.com) has joined #openacs 05:51:15 abbaJ has quit (Read error to abbaJ[user-33qs21m.dsl.mindspring.com]: EOF from client) 05:51:35 abbaJ (jabba@user-33qs21m.dsl.mindspring.com) has joined #openacs 06:50:05 PascalS (PascalS@mgz-167-121.pc.fgg.eur.nl) has joined #openacs 06:50:18 g'morning 06:58:08 morning 06:58:20 PascalS: I need to get rolling your patches for the SDM! 07:00:11 which do you mean? 07:00:18 All of them :-) 07:00:25 HOLY COW! 1 AM! 07:00:29 ah 07:00:33 you are roberto 07:00:41 Yep 07:00:46 rbm__ is now known as rbm 07:00:51 is the nick roberto taken or something? 07:01:00 I keep getting disconnected from opn 07:01:04 It's 9am here 07:01:12 No, I use rbm because those are my initials. 07:01:15 PascalS: Where are you at? 07:01:34 I was going to ask you about those patches, if you were doing it or if I should do it :) 07:01:39 The Netherlands 07:01:41 Ah 07:01:51 Do you have commit rights to the 3.x tree? 07:01:57 Nope 07:02:04 Hmmm. We should get you setup with that. 07:02:19 I'll check if I have those patches at hand, brb 07:02:48 k 07:02:50 Yes, I have them online (I'm at work now) 07:03:28 IIRC it's a sql file and all the others, the're not diffs, just the entire files. 07:05:30 Can you send them all to me please? 07:05:52 email is simplest for me. Here they come. 07:06:26 cool 07:07:54 Hmm 07:08:26 I was mistaken. It is a diff agains the May 8 CVS tree 07:08:37 Lemme check if everything is in there. 07:11:14 roberto, everything seems to be in the patch file 07:11:30 k. I need to go to bed. Send me what you got and I'll get it committed ASAP 07:11:31 I can send you the entire fileset if you want to have them 07:11:42 sure 07:11:54 They'll be in your mail shortly. 07:12:03 g'night! 07:12:15 Ok . thanks! and sorry about the time I took to get this in. 07:12:31 I really like your patches, it's just been too busy here. 07:12:32 The important thing is it gets in :) 07:12:36 Oh yes. 07:12:38 we're all busy :) 07:12:46 heh ;-) 07:12:49 I should have done it myselfs 07:12:52 -s 07:12:53 So what do you do there? 07:13:21 I started working two weeks ago at the Erasmus Univeristy Rotterdam. 07:13:30 For a project called Generation R 07:13:38 Hmm. I should really go to bed instead of starting a new conversation. Are you going to be around here now? 07:13:40 Ah, cool! 07:13:52 A population study, tracking 10.000 kids from 10th week pregnancy 07:13:59 I need to do ALL the software 07:14:09 Wow. 07:14:22 I'm doing a similar software, but for special education kids 07:14:29 My boss would be very interested in your work. 07:14:40 Is that going to be open source/free software? 07:14:41 I am going to convince them we need oacs 4 with workflow for the logistics of the project 07:15:12 They already have Ingres here, but I am not writing something from scratch 07:15:18 for the logistics 07:15:27 abbaJ has quit (farmer.openprojects.net forward.openprojects.net) 07:15:28 wasted effort IMO 07:15:35 sure 07:15:49 Well, g'night for real now. Talk to you in about 6 hours :-) 07:16:00 Okay. 07:16:03 I'll be here 07:16:11 Leaving in about 8 hours 07:16:14 later 07:16:14 g'night 07:18:40 abbaJ (jabba@user-33qs21m.dsl.mindspring.com) has joined #openacs 07:39:40 djg (dirk@pD9001D86.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #openacs 09:26:35 ola (ola@as3-1-3.mal.s.bonet.se) has joined #openacs 09:28:25 hola ola 09:54:27 djg is? 09:58:34 PascalS has left channel 10:05:27 Disconnected from irc.openprojects.net (Connection reset by peer) 10:05:27 Attempting to reconnect 10:05:38 loggy_1 (openacs-lo@v123-1.ARSDigita.seg.NET) has joined #openacs 10:05:38 topic is: Welcome to the OpenACS helpline. http://openacs.org 10:05:38 Users on #openacs: loggy_1 PascalS ola djg GEM AaronSw shagster MadDucks rbm loggy abbaJ 10:05:38 This channel is logged: http://www.blogspace.com/openacs/chatlogs/ 10:06:39 loggy has quit (Ping timeout for loggy[v123-1.ARSDigita.seg.NET]) 10:06:40 MadDucks has quit (Ping timeout for MadDucks[c1536889-a.cheyne1.wy.home.com]) 10:09:06 MadDucks (user66@c1536889-a.cheyne1.wy.home.com) has joined #openacs 10:10:03 hallo? 10:10:09 hello 10:10:12 hi 10:10:18 djg is? 10:10:18 i'm dirk rfom the munich arsdigita office 10:10:23 ah 10:11:23 one of the arsdigitans that are still using acs 4 tcl 10:11:38 Ah, that's why you're here. 10:11:43 yes 10:11:56 Are you guys going to switch to openacs 4? 10:12:11 yes we already have switched 10:12:14 (assuming there will be upgrade scripts) 10:12:25 Wonderful :) 10:12:54 You are just maintaining existing sites? 10:13:07 no, we are actually developing new stuff 10:13:14 ShareNet that is 10:13:18 the knowledge library 10:13:40 ?should that make sense? 10:13:49 well 10:13:55 i am a programmer ;) 10:13:59 The customer already has ACS/Tcl? 10:14:03 Me too. 10:14:04 yes for >2 years 10:14:30 Good enough reason to do new stuff in Tcl :) 10:14:36 yeah 10:15:05 Will that be proprietary or contributed? 10:15:28 contributed 10:15:39 ola has quit (Ping timeout for ola[as3-1-3.mal.s.bonet.se]) 10:15:39 cool? 10:15:41 siemens wants their software to be available. 10:15:44 i mean ! 10:16:07 quite a change 10:16:16 after they wanted their software to be closed 10:16:51 what made them change? 10:17:06 their application manager likes the idea of open source 10:17:14 me too :) 10:17:26 I still need to convince some people here at the University 10:17:31 and open source/free software is a safe bet 10:17:59 they want external ppl to contribute to their software to 10:18:01 too 10:18:05 or actually they hope for that;) 10:18:16 IMO, if you're not going to sell it - just give it away. 10:18:34 probably we'll be doing it 10:18:44 i think i will open up a site myself with the library 10:18:58 always wanted to use the old lib, but siemens prevented us from doing so 10:19:25 I'm not too familiar with the ACS library modules. 10:19:31 w8 10:19:38 i'm trying to find the presentation 10:19:42 Will this be the KM? 10:19:46 imho the library will be the killer module 10:19:52 :) 10:20:12 I meant knowledge module, but killer module is fine too 10:21:36 yesyes 10:21:41 have u seen the wimpy? 10:21:45 no 10:22:02 is it on openacs.org? 10:22:08 no it is still on arsdigita.com 10:22:17 takes a second to find it 10:23:03 http://www.arsdigita.com/wp/display/22289/ 10:26:58 can you tell me what is going on in the openacs community right now? 10:27:05 i saw a lot of "heated" discussions... 10:27:18 just a sec 10:27:55 sharenet is kool 10:28:43 with that we can make an out-of-the-box everthing.com 10:28:46 yeah really is 10:28:52 yes granted you have oracle;) 10:28:59 b/c some poor soul will have to port it to postgres 10:29:09 don't worry, if need be - i will 10:29:21 I can definitely use it for my project 10:29:38 the discussions are indeed quite hot. 10:29:44 okay 10:58:16 shagster has quit (Ping timeout for shagster[web1.alal.com]) 10:58:33 shagster (mkovach@web1.alal.com) has joined #openacs 11:26:11 ola (ola@as3-1-3.mal.s.bonet.se) has joined #openacs 11:49:44 rbm_ (roberto@slxwy.dorms.usu.edu) has joined #openacs 11:51:01 rbm has quit (Ping timeout for rbm[slxwy.dorms.usu.edu]) 11:55:49 roberto, you don't sleep enough, naughty boy! 11:58:20 til (yann@62.116.25.202) has joined #openacs 11:58:27 til? 11:58:55 hi 11:59:00 aus berlin? 11:59:04 dirk hier 11:59:14 hey, hallo ;-) 11:59:18 jetzt wien 11:59:25 ah 12:12:10 Dirk (or anyone) do you have exp. with workflow? 12:12:18 no 12:12:20 durn 12:12:25 i looked at it for some pitch 12:12:28 but that was it 12:12:54 I haven't look at all the code yet, but it's main deficit seems to be lack of docs. 12:13:01 ;) 12:13:22 in what way is it over engineered? 12:13:22 well to me it looked like a lot of functionality that needs a lot of polishing to become a proper toolkit/api 12:13:38 a lot of brilliant yet loose ends 12:13:51 that are lousily knit together - if you get my picture 12:13:55 that was my iumpression 12:13:57 hmm. doesn't sound good :( 12:14:11 but dont let my opinion scare you off 12:14:25 b/c i got that after looking a few days at it 12:14:25 the UI is also seriously lacking in information 12:14:34 but many other ppl seem to have ditched it too 12:15:03 yeah, the boards seem awfully quiet lately. 13:27:43 markd2 (markd2@r-41.23.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 14:19:21 rbm_ is now known as rbm 14:19:24 morning all 14:19:32 hiya 14:19:45 afternoon, you mean 14:24:58 hi all 14:25:16 deep of night 14:25:40 Roberto, those patches I sent you were stale. 14:27:41 if you put them in the microwave for 10 seconds, they soften up 14:28:09 ehrm, you'd have to write them to cd first, or some thing 14:28:28 ever seen a cd that's been in a microwave? 14:28:34 DONT TRY IT! 14:28:39 pretty sparks 14:28:42 yah 14:28:42 nice smell 14:28:50 what happens? 14:29:04 the sparks form a very nice pattern on the disc. 14:29:26 but you only microwave for less that 2 seconds or something horrific happens 14:29:43 saw it on a website somewhere 14:29:43 u know what you're speaking about? 14:30:15 PascalS: stale? 14:30:28 like, older than latest version 14:30:41 stale 14:30:42 adj 1: showing deterioration from age; "stale bread" [ant: {fresh}] 14:31:02 Had to go dict the word. /me adds a new word to his vocabulary :) 14:31:09 ah. 14:31:20 ur n0t n4t1v3 th3n? 14:31:22 So you have a new version? Send it over this way :-) 14:31:42 nope. I'm from Brazil. I'm a CS student in the U.S. 14:32:03 yes, just mailed it. Should be the latest version. it's dated april 24, which should be correct. 14:32:11 Excellent. Thanks 14:32:38 wait a sec 14:33:20 markd2 has quit (Bork) 14:33:35 yes, that is the latest version, as far as i can see 14:34:03 do you have time to fold them into your changes? 14:34:36 I'd like to get my changes in too, but don't know if I'll have time 14:34:40 (today that is) 14:35:50 I don't have time today either. Want to get general-comments 4.x done 14:36:56 PascalS: i think we are working on this 14:37:00 have to dbl check tho 14:37:12 For the microwave CD: http://www.hamjudo.com/notes/cdrom.html and http://www.hamjudo.com/notes/cd.jpg 14:37:35 cool, neh? 14:38:03 well 14:38:33 dirk, GC-porting-to-PG-and-using-CR-for-attachments? 14:38:54 * rbm goes eat breakfast 14:39:02 no, we are not porting 14:39:13 but we are changing the module pretty heavily i think 14:39:13 * PascalS wishes rbm 'eet smakelijk' 14:39:23 sorry, i forgot u r on pg 14:39:33 :) 14:39:41 what are you changing? 14:39:47 http://tclwebtest.sourceforge.net/ 14:39:52 i dunno 14:39:56 i know the goal 14:40:01 but not the current state 14:40:07 so i cannot tell you about the deltas 14:40:51 ehrm, whats tclwebtest got to do with general-comments? 14:42:07 nuthin 14:42:12 but it looks good 14:42:14 ;) 14:42:16 ah, okay. 14:43:16 lemme look at it quickly 14:44:17 well, some basic stuff will be added: page rating 14:44:21 feedback options 14:44:32 gc will be parametrized 14:44:41 comments will be indexed 14:45:06 have you guys started? 14:45:39 dont know if anyone else is working on gc 14:46:10 are you working on gc-openacs? or plain old acs 14:46:44 dunno either 14:46:51 i was originally assigned to doing this 14:46:57 but then assigned to some other stuff 14:47:04 but i guess on gc-openacs 14:47:13 no, actually i am sure. on gc-openacs 14:47:51 hmmm. probly my mistake to let Dan mark it 'ported' 'with some things left to do' 14:48:32 well i can find the guy which is working on it and put you folks together 14:48:45 good plan. 14:48:53 let me look 14:56:37 bbaquiran (bpb@202.8.232.32) has joined #openacs 14:57:11 evening all 14:58:22 markd2 (markd2@r-41.23.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 15:11:02 later y'all 15:11:08 'night 15:11:17 be back when I'm home 15:12:43 PascalS has left channel 15:14:39 * rbm is back 15:27:24 zzzirk_slc (lzirkel@166.70.157.42) has joined #openacs 15:43:56 djg has quit ([BX] bb bbba bbbba bbbitchx bitchx!!!) 15:44:05 bbaquiran has quit (Client Exiting) 15:52:12 shagster has quit (Read error to shagster[web1.alal.com]: Connection reset by peer) 16:05:25 moo zzzirk 16:07:19 moo rbm 16:07:44 glad to see someone else from UT aroud here :) 16:07:53 hehehe 16:10:31 Now you go get Michael here. NOW! :-) 16:18:58 ola has quit (ircII EPIC4-1.0 -- Are we there yet?) 16:22:43 rbm_ (roberto@slxwy.dorms.usu.edu) has joined #openacs 16:22:53 gilbertw (gilwong@palrel2.hp.com) has joined #openacs 16:23:29 *sighs* 16:24:00 rbm has quit (Ping timeout for rbm[slxwy.dorms.usu.edu]) 16:27:45 rbm_ is now known as rbm 16:30:46 If I could ever get Michael to do something on something other than his own timetable I'd be a miracle worker... ;-) 16:33:13 Is that so? 16:33:21 zzzirk_slc: BTW, I moved. 16:33:42 I know I saw you mentioned that. Still in USU housing? 16:33:58 Grax (grax@cx447399-d.omhaw1.ne.home.com) has joined #openacs 16:34:35 zzzirk_slc: Yeah. But in a different apt. Juliane is now RA, so we don't pay rent :-) 16:35:05 Wahoo! That's nice. Isn't she done with school basically? 16:35:43 Okay, I just got PG7.1.2 on my laptop along with OpenACS nightly snapshots and AOLserver 3.3+ad13... Anything else I need for OpenACS? 16:36:09 I'm gonna try and get it setup on my laptop so I can use it for a test environment and also so maybe I can find a package and start porting it. 16:36:25 check openacs.org/4 and look at the porting resources page. It has links to everything (including install doc) 16:37:32 markd2 has quit (Bork) 16:38:42 I thought YOU were the docs... ;-) 16:39:23 Not for 4.x. 16:39:36 I thought you knew everything though... 16:39:55 Hah! I wish! 16:40:14 Ah c'mon, don't sell yourself short... 16:40:34 Anyway, I'll check that out. I've got to go home early to take my wife to the doctor and I'm gonna try and get my laptop all setup... 16:41:12 cool 16:41:26 So do you still use a dvorak keyboard setup at all? 16:41:33 I know you'll like it. Then you'll want to port a simple package. Then another, and another! 16:41:40 Oh yes. Love my dvorak. 16:41:57 Do you have an actual dvorak or do you just have use a keyboard map? 16:42:13 I'm thinking of trying to learn it and I'm just trying to figure out the best way to do it. 16:42:27 I did finally remap my CTRL key to switch it with the CAPS LOCK. 16:42:35 Just a map. I have an ergo kbd tho. Then I bought labels and stick them on the kbd. Pure dvorak kbds are $100+! Too much for me. 16:43:01 zzzirk_slc: The first week is very painful. I'd do it only if you have time in your hands (like a vacation). 16:43:09 Yeah, that's the truth... 16:43:17 It's painful because you can't type well, and it's frustrating. 16:43:25 But don't be discouraged. It pays off. 16:44:05 I don't know, I've thought about it after my next project is done... I'm thinking of changing my keyboard at work and at home and on my laptop all at the same time. And keep a handy dandy keyboard layout with me... How much for the labels? 16:59:50 They were like $15 I think 17:01:02 Where'd you get them? 17:02:40 hooleon.com 17:04:38 hooleon? Never heard of that... 17:05:54 Yikes! They want $22 for them... 17:07:53 Oh really? 17:08:12 You could print the layout and stick the labels yourself :-) 17:08:41 Oh, but your keyboard is regular eh? it's not an ergo. If so, then you can just flip the keys. 17:13:07 No, it's a MS natural... 17:13:27 I tried flipping keys with one keyboard and found that certain keys were made differently... ARG!!! 17:13:34 Then there is my laptop... 17:14:05 I think I'm just gonna stick with my concept of keeping a keyboard layout printed out and carry it with me. 17:18:00 I tried that. But for learning it was too painful. 17:18:15 After I already knew the layout, then it became clear 17:18:25 I think that typing ls is already pretty painful with DVORAK... ;-) 17:18:44 What's going on? No e-mail for the past 10 seconds??? 17:19:11 ls == p; 17:21:43 rbm_ (roberto@slxwy.dorms.usu.edu) has joined #openacs 17:22:37 Dang it 17:22:37