00:22:44 rbm (roberto@slxwy.dorms.usu.edu) has joined #openacs 00:22:52 hi there 00:22:54 anyone around? 00:22:58 * rbm looks around for porters 00:23:05 hmmm 00:59:26 tdxdave (tdxdave@ip-204-97-175-41.dsl.logical.net) has joined #OpenACS 01:02:21 hello 01:03:15 hi 01:04:13 txdave are u working on a port? 01:04:31 yes, static pages. I ran into a problem with the permission system so I took a break. 01:05:18 hmm... too slow or api problems in the core? 01:07:35 I am getting an error message: [11/Jul/2001:15:44:59][1106.4101][-conn0-] Error: Ns_PgExec: result status: 7 message: ERROR: triggered data change violation on relation "acs_object_context_index" 01:08:40 Its in a call to acs_permission__grant_permission 01:08:48 oh yah... that was an ugly one... integrity violations in triggers. any chance 01:09:02 So i have to take some time to understand what it is trying to do and why. 01:09:03 of a solution any time soon... is this a prevalent problem 01:09:15 no help from the bboard? 01:09:45 I havem't tried yet. Every time I post to the bboard, its an easy solution. I haven't searched yet either though. 01:11:30 what do you think of the explosion that just happened? 01:11:51 what? I should watch the news huh? 01:17:48 tdxdave has quit (I'm too lame to make a quit message) 01:18:24 markd2 (markd@r-41.185.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 01:24:04 tdxdave (dave@ip-204-97-175-41.dsl.logical.net) has joined #openacs 01:26:01 perhaps we should change the topic back? 01:26:10 (i would, but I can't figure it out...) 01:26:43 i think aaron has to do it since we're not moderators, but i'm pretty clueless about iirc 01:27:06 AaronSw has changed the topic to: OpenACS Developers 01:27:13 woohoo go aaron 01:27:22 markd2 has changed the topic to: OpenACS Developers. 01:27:34 I think /topic new-topic will do it 01:27:39 I just use my gui :-) 01:27:43 AaronSw has changed the topic to: Welcome OpenACS Developers - http://openacs.org/ 01:27:53 Yes, just /topic new-topic 01:28:20 aha. Ok so I was just too lazy to figure it out. 01:28:24 oh... learn something new every day... than the grave,, and maybe you still learn... 01:28:31 morbid 01:28:40 you learn to get along with the worms 01:28:42 so what does loggy do 01:28:50 It logs the chat. 01:29:03 loggy, help 01:30:13 loggy is rather verbose isn't (s)he 01:31:15 Yeah, that's the longest message 01:31:16 loggy is as loggy does 01:32:19 hmm... can we get loggy to chase his own tail:) 01:32:46 heh 01:32:54 I've seen dualing bots before 01:32:59 each one responding to what the other one 'says' 01:35:45 is the openacs4 core stable? 01:36:17 define stable 01:36:51 it is good to start development on. But it is not well-tested. 01:36:58 There is still some porting to be done. 01:38:38 could i start a site with it today? or is it stable enough to build a new module on top of? 01:39:24 stable = for site means no mysterious problems that cause outages and unacceptable performance (ie loss of users) , for development means solvable problems and workarounds 01:39:42 I think it is. I don't think the interfaces will change. 01:39:57 Check the status page for the modules you need to hook into. 01:40:27 i won't be hooking into anything except the core... thats really all i'm concerned about at the moment 01:41:07 Well check the "packages" then that make up the core. 01:42:36 things like your own problem with permissions are what concerns me, not porting status per say 01:43:37 I am not sure whose fault that is. I would say the core is not tested yet. I have only tested the parts the pertain to the modules I am porting. 01:44:13 rbm: do you have an opinion on the status of the core? 01:48:42 wow 01:49:13 rbm: yes it is amazing :) but can you develop a site with it? 01:50:32 shagster (mkovach@207.166.201.55) has joined #openacs 01:50:45 no, I mean, all of a sudden people started talking 01:51:32 If you're going to develop something serious, I'd wait until the Beta is out 01:53:30 sigh... acs-java will be out by then 01:53:32 you turn your back and we start talking 01:53:48 doing long distance chat and phone to australia 01:54:02 markd2 has quit (Bork) 01:55:11 deadman: you should use net2phone. I called Italy the other day for 1 cent a minute with excellent quality. 01:55:15 Too bad it only runs on Windows 01:55:28 s/should/could/ 01:55:50 Also called Brazil for 9cents/minute, vs the usual 58. 02:05:52 I guess I have a "shut up" effect on the channel 02:07:18 hmm.. there calling me ... they pay the bills and my fee. so their problem imo 02:09:39 hehhe 02:13:23 GEM (mcmullan@MULTICS.MIT.EDU) has joined #openacs 02:19:14 wb GEM 02:32:46 byr 02:32:48 bye 02:32:51 tdxdave has quit () 05:44:53 anyone around? 05:45:01 need some help with porting blob queries 06:45:17 * rbm goes shower then to bed 08:03:28 deadman has quit (Ping timeout for deadman[CBL-kthangavelu-a.hs.earthlink.net]) 08:09:56 deadman (ender@CBL-kthangavelu-a.hs.earthlink.net) has joined #openacs 10:28:37 ola (ola@as3-1-3.mal.s.bonet.se) has joined #openacs 10:41:27 deadman has quit (Ping timeout for deadman[CBL-kthangavelu-a.hs.earthlink.net]) 10:45:25 deadman (ender@CBL-kthangavelu-a.hs.earthlink.net) has joined #openacs 10:58:45 deadman has quit (Ping timeout for deadman[CBL-kthangavelu-a.hs.earthlink.net]) 11:02:46 deadman (ender@CBL-kthangavelu-a.hs.earthlink.net) has joined #openacs 11:23:10 ola has quit (ircII EPIC4-1.0 -- Are we there yet?) 11:28:53 shagster has quit (Read error to shagster[207.166.201.55]: Connection reset by peer) 11:34:53 markd2 (markd2@r-41.122.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 12:30:37 bbaquiran (bpb@202.8.232.81) has joined #openacs 12:31:01 hello 12:32:16 hi 12:32:56 good evening 12:46:25 tdxdave (dave@mail.perb.state.ny.us) has joined #openacs 13:27:30 shagster (mkovach@207.166.201.55) has joined #openacs 13:47:13 shagster has quit (Read error to shagster[207.166.201.55]: Connection reset by peer) 14:03:50 bbaquiran has quit (Client Exiting) 14:28:12 morning all 14:33:13 rbm: hi 14:34:30 DanW comes through again. 14:42:15 hi tdxdave 14:42:55 tdxdave: you should make an announcement about ns_xmlrpc in the bboards. You may get more people to pitch in that way (witch coding, documentation, etc) 14:43:06 The drawback is that you'll get more feature requests too :) 14:43:08 Thanks, thats a good idea. 14:43:31 I already have a bunch of ideas. I think with a couple of checks I can make it work without OpenACS 14:43:36 Tell them you have CVS and SDM and ask for bugs/patchs/requests to be posted there 14:43:45 cool 14:43:47 of course, then it probably belongs to OpenNSD. 14:43:59 It does in the first place 14:46:43 Do you mean built-in or at opennsd.org? 14:46:51 at opennsd 14:53:15 is anything happening over there? 14:54:39 seems most people at the project are too busy with some other project ;) 14:54:48 (openacs) 14:55:12 Thats what I thought. Eventually when they need it they'll be back. 15:10:54 heheh 15:14:41 gotta reload the data model due to testing changes in acs-objects and content-repository 15:15:17 hmm 15:15:20 is there a way to automate the loading? Do I don't have to hit next and enter my email everyt time? 15:15:39 I don't know 15:15:56 good answer. Perhaps I should make one. 15:16:14 * rbm thinks so too :) 15:16:47 gee thanks. 15:16:50 :) 15:20:43 if I put a file called say 'temp.sql' in an sql directory, will it be loaded? 15:23:27 yep 15:23:50 I though so. The package loader ignores the info.xml files and loas everything in the directory 15:29:27 oops I forgot to take out the offending code... 15:30:44 ola (ola@as3-1-3.mal.s.bonet.se) has joined #openacs 15:30:58 hi ola 15:31:14 hi dave! 15:31:44 how's the porting going? 15:32:01 not bad, I needed help from DanW 15:32:53 I just spent 5 hours figuring out DocBook... 15:33:04 thats cool! 15:33:08 That must be fun. 15:33:31 Do I have tendinitis because I never remember to use trab-completion? 15:33:34 tab that is? 15:33:45 * markd2 has uncompleted trabs 15:36:01 I think i'll write a small howto on installing DocBook 15:37:00 parse error at or near "fefault" -- oops 15:45:47 shagster (mkovach@207.166.201.55) has joined #openacs 15:50:25 psgml mode for emacs must be a gift from above! 15:50:42 I'll have to check that out. 15:50:49 after you write the howto 15:51:12 vinod (vinod@d154.dial-3.cmb.ma.ultra.net) has joined #openacs 15:51:14 :-) 15:51:30 ola: I agree. psgml is a gift 15:51:43 ola: What's so hard about installing DocBook? 15:51:59 -c -e specially! 15:52:19 c e that is 15:52:31 huh? 15:52:49 Where I had a bad time was figuring out HOW to run the darn thing. Not really installing it. At least on Debian it's very easy 15:52:50 where did the catital c go? 15:54:16 C 15:54:20 markd2 has quit (Ping timeout for markd2[r-41.122.alltel.net]) 15:54:44 Well, the rpms for RH were lousy when trying to write DocBook XML so 15:54:54 Ah, I see. 15:55:00 I went with the source. 15:55:23 You grabbed the RPMs from sources.redhat.com (or whatever)? 15:55:42 * rbm hands apt-get to all in the channel 15:55:49 from rpmfind.net 15:55:54 argh 15:56:18 I looked at Debian 15:56:37 it seems quite nice! 15:57:54 http://sources.redhat.com/docbook-tools/ 15:58:18 Debian, like psgml, is a gift from above :-) 15:58:32 been there, done that:-) 15:58:46 markd2 (markd2@r-41.122.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 15:59:19 Is there any advantage to writing DocBook in XML rather than SGML? 15:59:22 But I feel I'm just starting to know RH...:-) 15:59:37 ola: That's the best time to switch to Debian :-) 16:00:02 rbm: not that I know of exept that its "the future" 16:00:11 As the distributions become LSB-compliant, which distribution you run makes less and less difference functionality-wise. 16:01:11 I _could not_ believe that the LSB standardized on RPM tho. 16:01:27 rbm: actually I'll by a new server next week so I might just go with Debian. 16:01:55 IMHO, with the APT patch to work with RPM's, APT should become the standard front-end to package management systems on GNU/Linux 16:02:55 Then nobody would mess with "rpm -i blahfoo" or "dpkg -i blahfoo". Everyone would just type "apt-get install blahfoo" 16:03:21 somewhere it said the kernel compilation was easier too - what do you say? 16:03:36 What was easier? 16:03:46 kernel compilation on Debian? 16:03:46 shagster has quit (Read error to shagster[207.166.201.55]: Connection reset by peer) 16:04:19 That should be pretty much the same, as long as you have the right -dev packages installed (and Debian makes it easier to have then installed) 16:04:19 the whole recompile process... 16:04:37 rbm: yes on Debian 16:05:13 Ok. I need to pass a function a boolean. 16:05:23 I passed ''f'' but it called it unknown 16:05:39 Should I just make a boolean variable and set it to false then pass that? 16:06:51 tdxdave: passing f should work if the recipient is of type boolean 16:07:00 Should I put it in ''? 16:07:07 single quotes that is 16:07:41 rbm: are your sources for the openacs documentation available somewhere? 16:07:53 I'd like a good example. 16:08:49 ola: Yes. In our CVS at sourceforge 16:09:04 rbm: thanks! 16:09:08 ola: Beware that I'm no DocBook expert and our docs could use DocBook improvements 16:09:20 (and many other types of improvements :-)) 16:09:26 nope f without quotes doesn't work. 16:09:29 :-) 16:09:37 tdxdave: Hang on 16:10:32 according to the docs TRUE and FALSE are the best way to do it. 16:11:05 tdxdave: look: 16:11:06 foobar=# select booltest(false); 16:11:06 NOTICE: You passed in f 16:11:07 NOTICE: bar now contains f 16:11:25 foobar=# select booltest('f'); 16:11:25 NOTICE: You passed in f 16:11:26 NOTICE: bar now contains f 16:11:36 hmmmm 16:11:48 TRUE and FALSE are the best way, I agree. But passing a string should work 16:11:59 foobar=# CREATE FUNCTION booltest(boolean) RETURNS varchar AS ' 16:11:59 foobar'# BEGIN 16:11:59 foobar'# RAISE NOTICE ''You passed %'',1 16:11:59 foobar=# CREATE FUNCTION booltest(boolean) RETURNS varchar AS ' 16:11:59 foobar'# DECLARE 16:12:00 foobar'# foo ALIAS FOR $1; 16:12:01 foobar'# bar boolean; 16:12:04 foobar'# BEGIN 16:12:06 foobar'# RAISE NOTICE ''You passed in % '',foo; 16:12:07 foobar'# bar := foo; 16:12:10 foobar'# RAISE NOTICE ''bar now contains % '',bar; 16:12:12 foobar'# return ''dang''; 16:12:14 foobar'# end; 16:12:15 I think it is because pl/pgsql cannot determine the type so it can't find the function 16:12:16 foobar'# ' language 'plpgsql'; 16:12:18 oops. Forget the first 3 lines 16:12:52 tdxdave: what function are you trying to port? Let me look at it 16:13:17 I am hacking a new version of acs_object__new and content_item__new for static pages 16:13:39 and I take one parameter is of type boolean 16:13:53 I was just messing with content_item__new last night. 16:14:02 aha. 16:14:09 form-procs.tcl is HUGE in CMS. 1200+ lines 16:14:14 1500+ actually 16:14:18 I need to set security_inherit_p to F 16:14:36 tdxdave: Have you read the "ACS 4 Permissions Tediously Explained" doc? 16:14:41 the CMS is a big application 16:14:48 No but I suspect I shall very soon. 16:15:05 It is a postgresql foreign key bug thingy 16:15:12 oh 16:15:29 Ok, everybody stop talking about things more fun than my homework! Otherwise I'll never get it done ;-) 16:15:48 aha. It now knows its a boolean, but it still can't find the function. must be my fault. 16:16:29 haha. that is why I am trying to get credit for working on OpenACS. 16:20:18 ?? 16:20:26 oh :) 16:20:40 Empire State College gives you credit for learning experience. 16:20:59 really? I should look into that too. Maybe they'll give me credit here ;) 16:21:12 www.esc.edu 16:21:47 but don;t go there now... do your homework :) 16:22:07 yeah, I should 16:23:47 Disconnected from irc.openprojects.net (Connection reset by peer) 16:23:47 Attempting to reconnect 16:24:02 loggy (openacs-lo@v123-1.ARSDigita.seg.NET) has joined #openacs 16:24:04 topic is: Welcome OpenACS Developers - http://openacs.org/ 16:24:04 Users on #openacs: loggy deadman markd2 @AaronSw 16:24:34 vinod (vinod@d154.dial-3.cmb.ma.ultra.net) has joined #openacs 16:30:52 vinod has left channel 16:35:18 ola (ola@as3-1-3.mal.s.bonet.se) has joined #openacs 16:36:52 tdxdave (dave@mail.perb.state.ny.us) has joined #openacs 16:39:01 rbm (roberto@slxwy.dorms.usu.edu) has joined #openacs 16:39:06 loggy: stop 16:39:26 * loggy is already logging 16:39:38 I was disconnected for some reason 16:40:05 maybe openprojects server issues 16:40:24 roberto, do you mean loggy, off? 16:40:28 Logging turned off 16:40:32 Logging turned on 16:40:32 loggy, on 16:40:56 AaronSw: I thought that would stop him from sending me that annoying message when I connect 16:41:16 ahh, yes, i better tell him to shut up on that one... 16:41:19 I later noticed that this would stop logging, so I send a /m loggy start (before you send "loggy, off") 16:41:29 s/send/sent/ 16:41:52 ahh, i see 16:43:41 loggy (openacs-lo@v123-1.ARSDigita.seg.NET) has joined #openacs 16:43:43 topic is: Welcome OpenACS Developers - http://openacs.org/ 16:43:43 Users on #openacs: loggy rbm tdxdave ola deadman markd2 @AaronSw 16:43:48 that 'ought to stop the annoying message 16:44:06 AaronSw has changed the topic to: Welcome OpenACS Developers - http://openacs.org/ - This channel is publicly logged! 16:45:18 That's odd.. where'd NickServ/ChanServ go to? 16:45:32 maybe they eloped 16:45:41 :-) 16:45:57 I wonder where chatbots go on their honeymoon... 16:49:07 Why is this channel logged? 16:49:13 ChanServ has changed the topic to: 16:49:15 Someone asked me to log it... 16:49:45 OK, that was my fault. 16:49:55 I feel sort of... constrained, when things are being logged publically. 16:50:08 Prefixing lines with # prevents logging 16:50:12 and you can turn loggy off. 16:50:30 heh 16:54:30 rbm, if you have better ways to do things, please suggest them 16:55:13 AaronSw: I just don't see much the point of logging. 16:55:41 It is logged just in case someone imparts a useful bit of wisdom. 16:55:47 AaronSw: Therefore, I've never looked into logging IRC solutions, and can't suggest any, except for "no logging" 16:56:00 well then feel free to say loggy, off 16:56:14 Perhaps we could have a way to log useful information. 16:56:22 such as ... 16:56:26 tdxdave: That'd be a better way 16:56:30 hint: log this 16:56:44 or something like: loggy: log past 4 lines 16:57:11 You'll have to talk to loggy's author for that one... 16:57:17 he's not on right now. 16:57:20 What's it written on? 16:57:23 Perl. 16:57:29 http://cvs.ilrt.org/cvsweb/redland/logger/ 16:58:22 I'm working on a bot that we'll use to control our Quake 3 server from. In python 16:58:31 Has there been log-worthy information exchanged? 16:59:18 AaronSw has changed the topic to: Welcome OpenACS Developers - http://openacs.org/ 16:59:27 worthy is in the eye of the beholder 16:59:34 good point 16:59:50 i mean if you guys are bothered, turn him on only when you want him 16:59:57 he's just a tool 17:00:25 poory loggy 17:00:37 sniff sniff 17:23:50 markd2 has quit (Bork) 18:00:05 Cool. it works. well, at least I am getting a different error message anyway. 18:03:38 shagster (mkovach@207.166.201.55) has joined #openacs 18:05:01 dumb question: what is the best way to make a patch to send to Dan. Where should I put the files? 18:15:03 markd2 (markd2@r-41.63.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 18:17:34 another dumb question: should a content_revision inherit security from the content_item? 18:29:09 I'd think so 18:29:15 but i haven't done a huge amount with the CR 18:32:10 after thinking about it, I agree. 18:37:20 GEM (mcmullan@MULTICS.MIT.EDU) has joined #openacs 18:44:42 rbm_ (roberto@slxwy.dorms.usu.edu) has joined #openacs 18:46:41 rbm has quit (Ping timeout for rbm[slxwy.dorms.usu.edu]) 18:47:00 GEM: did you get my news last night about libxml2? 18:51:53 markd2 has quit (bbiab) 18:59:40 libxml2 2.3.1 is in debian testing. It compiles nsxml just fine (with libxml2 and libxml2-dev) 19:11:23 markd2 (markd2@r-41.69.alltel.net) has joined #openacs 19:38:46 moo 19:39:01 * AaronSw has his Darwin system moo 19:39:17 (__) 19:39:18 (oo) 19:39:18 /------\/ 19:39:18 / | || 19:39:18 * /\---/\ 19:39:18 ~~ ~~ 19:39:20 ...."Have you mooed today?"... 19:39:33 moo 19:39:35 moo I saw 19:39:37 say 19:39:52 Darwin with apt? 19:39:56 Yep 19:40:01 Mac OS X, to be truthful 19:40:12 That's news to me 19:40:18 when did X get APT? 19:40:29 Beats me, I just used fink to grab it. 19:40:36 what's fink? 19:40:52 fink is like a Mac OS X package manager system 19:40:54 fink.sf.net 19:41:10 so what role does APT play in that? 19:41:22 Well, I used it to download APT, so i could make it moo. 19:41:27 Not sure why it's there... 19:41:34 that's all you use apt for? 19:41:53 is fink based on dpkg? 19:41:58 yeah 19:42:13 apt doesn't seem to know of many mac os x pkgs so it's not too good for much else 19:44:41 I think I found a content-repository bug 19:44:50 yeah for fink being based on dpkg or for apt only doing moo? 19:45:09 bith 19:45:12 err both 19:45:43 That's cool 19:50:56 how should I address a bug in the content repository? send Dan a patch? 19:51:56 tdxdave: Post it to the SDM (so it can be documented) and send an e-mail to Dan about it 19:52:34 Dang it. I need to incorporate Pascal's patch-a-bug patch to SDM 19:55:28 For OpenACS 4? I didn't know we were calling them 'bugs' yet. Ok. 19:56:03 kinda ironic huh? 19:57:39 Yeah 19:58:20 there are two fields marked as varchar, but they are text. Will postgresql convert them? 19:58:34 Maybe. I'm not sure. 19:59:12 ok. 19:59:24 Well, I'll submit it and Dan can look at it. 19:59:44 Where should I make the patch from, the package directory or openacs directory? 20:02:00 probably th openacs dyr 20:02:03 s/dyr/dir/ 20:02:07 ok 20:04:22 rbm: Did you do anything special with in sgml to make it appear on a grey background? 20:05:02 also, did you use LDP DSSSL? 20:05:42 questions, questions... 20:05:45 ola: That's the only special thing I did. The LDP DSSSL does that grey thingy 20:05:45 :-) 20:05:48 (I think) 20:06:16 I used the LDP DSSSL mostly because I like it the way it does TOCs 20:06:34 I like it better too. 20:06:43 vinod (vinod@d17.dial-4.cmb.ma.ultra.net) has joined #openacs 20:07:05 For technical docs, that is. 20:07:11 right. 20:07:58 wb Vinod 20:08:28 rbm:I tried ldp.dsl right now and it won't yield a grey table...:-( 20:08:53 hey rbm! 20:09:53 ola: It won't? Are you following the jade command specified in the LDP-Author-Guide-HOWTO? 20:10:44 rbm: yup, the xml one 20:12:00 maybe I can edit the dsssl stylesheet somehow. 20:17:14 rbm: does the CMS use the 'text' storage method at all? Or is it all 'file'? 20:17:47